Bonez3 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, -JB- said: Dude, it’s a great sign when other teams are signing your backups at starter pay (Trent Murphy/Ryan Grant). That’s how you obtain compensatory picks. That wasn't my point, there have been countless posts after the couple signings we had that 'well, there goes another comp'. Silly, many were made after Scandrick signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFi Skins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 I guess he wasn't willing to give a 3-finger discount to stay.... .... too soon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jericho Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 9 minutes ago, Bonez3 said: A team really shouldn't be obtaining comp picks year in and year out. It's more of a sign you aren't resigning quality guys and thats a problem. This happens to be a good (and bad because we're losing this talent) year for us. But its not like thats how you build championships. The Comp pick pool should circulate through various teams through the years. Further, its pretty well documented that NE really hasn't nailed their draft picks in these spots Actually, good team should probably be gaining comp picks every year. If you draft well, simple economics tells you that you can't re-sign everyone. Look at the Redskins. The team doesn't have a ton of cap and saw Long ($7 million), Murphy ($7 million), Cousins ($28 million), and Paul (a couple million). Look at th original contracts for Grant and Breeland (over $15 million combined before voiding) and then possibly Pryor and Galette. That's a ton of money. No team can sustain paying players like that each year. The idea is to re-sign the real difference makers and draft replacements for the others. And if you keep drafting well, you'll keeping losing players via free agency. Cause you won't have the money to sign them all. And you'll net more draft picks to pick players from. Which you develop and hope enough pan out. And the cycle continues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said: Hi all. Just thinking that the Giants must be near the cap limit and they go and unload a expensive D lineman who did not produce last year like he did in the past. Smart. Saved $2m, but taking a $15m cap hit with the trade. Frees up the cap going forward in 2019 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HigSkin Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carex Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 6 minutes ago, Bonez3 said: That wasn't my point, there have been countless posts after the couple signings we had that 'well, there goes another comp'. Silly, many were made after Scandrick signing. considering how against Scandrick people were even if mistaken it makes some sense. But honestly the idea you should be getting comp picks every year seems wrong. Because ever year contracts expire and every year you'll be bringing in new people anyway. So why not accept some will be leaving and get what you can? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 7 minutes ago, Jericho said: Actually, good team should probably be gaining comp picks every year. If you draft well, simple economics tells you that you can't re-sign everyone. Look at the Redskins. The team doesn't have a ton of cap and saw Long ($7 million), Murphy ($7 million), Cousins ($28 million), and Paul (a couple million). Look at th original contracts for Grant and Breeland (over $15 million combined before voiding) and then possibly Pryor and Galette. That's a ton of money. No team can sustain paying players like that each year. The idea is to re-sign the real difference makers and draft replacements for the others. And if you keep drafting well, you'll keeping losing players via free agency. Cause you won't have the money to sign them all. And you'll net more draft picks to pick players from. Which you develop and hope enough pan out. And the cycle continues But that doesn't happen every year because of the variability of draft and needs of that team in FA themselves that year. Teams can't project 4 years down the road that this pick is gonna be a prime comp candidate. It happens, but theres a lot of variability involved and rarely will be a yearly phenomena for teams. I want as many draft picks as possible. Just isn't my focus right now. I hope we do great and anticipate Pryor and even Gallete signing. But right now get me Suh or Hankins. I'll worry bout next years house money later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: Saved $2m, but taking a $15m cap hit with the trade. Frees up the cap going forward in 2019 though. Thats not correct. Tampa takes over his contract. Only 5 million was prorated. It saves the Giants 12.5 million in cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Just now, clskinsfan said: Thats not correct. Tampa takes over his contract. Only 5 million was prorated. It saves the Giants 12.5 million in cap space. Weird, saw a tweet stating differently, but that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 14 minutes ago, -JB- said: Excuse me? Let’s go back in time... https://www.ninersnation.com/2017/3/10/14881166/pierre-garcon-contract-details-49ers-wrs-5-year-deal Below is the breakdown of Garcon’s deal. 2017 cap hit: $6.425 million Base Salary: $3.625 million Prorated Signing Bonus: $2.4 million Per Game Roster Bonus: $250,000 Workout Bonus: $100,000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bonez3 said: But that doesn't happen every year because of the variability of draft. Teams can't project 4 years down the road that this pick is gonna be a prime comp candidate. It happens, but theres a lot of variability involved and rarely will be a yearly phenomena for teams. I want as many draft picks as possible. Just isn't my focus right now. I hope we do great and anticipate Pryor and even Gallete signing. But right now get me Suh or Hankins. I'll worry bout next years house money later You have to trust the process. You can’t be out there in free agency slinging contracts to every single FA. No thanks to Suh. That last sentence of your post scares me. That’s Damn Snyders MO since he got here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 6 minutes ago, clskinsfan said: Thats not correct. Tampa takes over his contract. Only 5 million was prorated. It saves the Giants 12.5 million in cap space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurd Cudins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: Weird, saw a tweet stating differently, but that makes sense. You are right. 6 minutes ago, clskinsfan said: Thats not correct. Tampa takes over his contract. Only 5 million was prorated. It saves the Giants 12.5 million in cap space. You are wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said: Below is the breakdown of Garcon’s deal. 2017 cap hit: $6.425 million Base Salary: $3.625 million Prorated Signing Bonus: $2.4 million Per Game Roster Bonus: $250,000 Workout Bonus: $100,000 Dude, I meant that the Redskins weren’t gonna give him a contract that was gonna pay him 16 million in the first year. You know what the hell I was saying lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 7 minutes ago, -JB- said: You have to trust the process. You can’t be out there in free agency slinging contracts to every single FA. No thanks to Suh. That last sentence of your post scares me. That’s Damn Snyders MO since he got here. I don't even think the Redskins have had more than 1-2 comp picks since Snyder's been here, so not sure how thats 'scary'. The house money is referring to the comp picks we are getting this year for NEXT YEARS draft (a rarity in the Snyder era). But, that is next year and we can't control that for the most part (Meaning we can't control the contracts these players will sign). The process is to build a winner. We need to get better at stopping the run and there is a blue chipper out there (with a motor, guy can run marathons literally) and a top 5 NT. The cap can be manipulated to sign either and we have some early draft picks. That's the process I trust. Can't let past mistakes effect decisions in the present.Hankins and Suh are high value targets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 3 minutes ago, Kurd Cudins said: You are right. You are wrong. I could be. Wouldnt be the first time. But please explain. Tampa takes over the prorated roster bonuses starting next league year correct? Current Contract Year Age Base Salary (Guaranteed) Bonuses Cap Number Cap % Dead Money & Cap Savings Cut (pre-June 1)Cut (post-June 1)Trade (pre-June 1)Trade (post-June 1)RestructureExtension Prorated Roster Workout Other Total $37,000,000 $20,000,000 $4,000,000 $1,000,000 $0 $61,750,000 2017 28 $1,250,000 $1,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $7,250,000 4.3% 2018 29 $11,250,000 $7,750,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $17,500,000 9.9% $22,750,000 ($5,250,000) 2019 30 $13,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $19,500,000 10.3% $10,000,000 $9,500,000 2020 31 $11,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $17,500,000 8.8% $5,000,000 $12,500,000 Edit: Nevermind. I apologize I WAS wrong. Here are the cap numbers with a pre June 1 trade. My fault: Current Contract Year Age Base Salary (Guaranteed) Bonuses Cap Number Cap % Dead Money & Cap Savings Cut (pre-June 1)Cut (post-June 1)Trade (pre-June 1)Trade (post-June 1)RestructureExtension Prorated Roster Workout Other Total $37,000,000 $20,000,000 $4,000,000 $1,000,000 $0 $61,750,000 2017 28 $1,250,000 $1,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $7,250,000 4.3% 2018 29 $11,250,000 $7,750,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $17,500,000 9.9% $15,000,000 $2,500,000 2019 30 $13,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $19,500,000 10.3% $10,000,000 $9,500,000 2020 31 $11,250,000 $5,000,000 $1,000,000 $250,000 $0 $17,500,000 8.8% $5,000,000 $12,500,000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurd Cudins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 That's prorated signing bonus, not roster bonus. They gave him a $20M SB last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Bonez3 said: I don't even think the Redskins have hade more than 1-2 comp picks since Snyder's been here, so not sure how thats 'scary'. The house money is referring to the comp picks we are getting this year (a rarity in the Snyder era). But, that is next year and we can't control that for the most part (Meaning we can't control the contracts these players will sign). The process is to build a winner. We need to get better at stopping the run and there is a blue chipper out there (with a motor, guy can run marathons literally) and a top 5 NT. The cap can be manipulated to sign either and we have some early draft picks. That's the process I trust. Can't let past mistakes effect decisions in the present.Hankins and Suh are high value targets I think that your strategy is wrong. It has been the strategy of the Redskins front office since Dan Snyder took over. It does not work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 14 minutes ago, HigSkin said: Both of these quotes are distressing. I also question just how good Niles Paul and Ryan Grant were at special teams. Our teams have been mostly terrible for their entire tenure. Now, maybe they were great and everyone else sucked, but really how wonderful could they have been given what we've seen on Kotwica's teams. As for starters or vets rejecting ST duty that's just ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 20 minutes ago, -JB- said: I think that your strategy is wrong. It has been the strategy of the Redskins front office since Dan Snyder took over. It does not work. Sounds like those fans that like to cite the Hayneswrth or Deion signings. Forgetting that the past 5 years we were far from aggressive in FA. It hasn't been the 'strategy of Snyder' every year to sign the biggest FA. Fact is, our cap has been managed as good as any teams, if not some of the best in the league. But, you have to focus on now and the need for the team. Can't be scared to sign a big FA if its the right move just because we made mistakes in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrell Green Fan Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 27 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said: What are the giants doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Darrell Green Fan said: What are the giants doing? Probably drafting Chubb, getting a hand up on the competiton... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFi Skins Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Just now, Darrell Green Fan said: What are the giants doing? Clearing future cap space, and most likely signing/drafting Bradley Chubb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HigSkin Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted March 22, 2018 Share Posted March 22, 2018 44 minutes ago, Jericho said: Actually, good team should probably be gaining comp picks every year. If you draft well, simple economics tells you that you can't re-sign everyone. Look at the Redskins. The team doesn't have a ton of cap and saw Long ($7 million), Murphy ($7 million), Cousins ($28 million), and Paul (a couple million). Look at th original contracts for Grant and Breeland (over $15 million combined before voiding) and then possibly Pryor and Galette. That's a ton of money. No team can sustain paying players like that each year. The idea is to re-sign the real difference makers and draft replacements for the others. And if you keep drafting well, you'll keeping losing players via free agency. Cause you won't have the money to sign them all. And you'll net more draft picks to pick players from. Which you develop and hope enough pan out. And the cycle continues No wonder we've been so good over the past 5 years.....Great job, Bruce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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