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Tax Bill

LadySkinsFan

By LadySkinsFan
in The Tailgate

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Fresh8686

Fresh8686

Posted
Posted

Just read that a possible reason Murkowkski will vote for the tax bill, is because of some juicy arctic wildlife legislation hidden in the bill that opens up the region to oil and gas drilling. 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/18/politics/lisa-murkowski-tax-reform-arctic-drilling/index.html

 

And man... so tired of the narrative that a corporate tax cut will automatically spur further investment and expansion. When you already have money to spend and invest, what motivates a company is the OPPORTUNITY to make more money at an advantageous rate or through gaining a competitive edge that mitigates the risk to enough of a degree. Being given money does not create that opportunity in and of itself unless you were hurting for money in the first place and needed the help to get past hurdles to expansion. That is not the case at all for successful companies and the people who run them that become these political donors. Who it is the case for are poor people. They will not sit on that money, they'll spend and invest it, because their the ones in actual scarcity and are consequently motivated by its pressure. For them the opportunity for things they want to buy and invest in are available, but the access or financial leverage to reach it is not, after the cost of living takes it toll. 

 

These people are doing **** backwards. 

 

 

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Fergasun

Fergasun

Posted
Posted

This plan sucks for the poor and middle class -- of course the GOP House passed it. 

 

Not enough outrage over this at the moment -- chatter at my work is "this thing isn't going to pass".... so many groups are against it and the GOP can just point fingers and say "special interests". 

 

 

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HOF44

HOF44

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, Fergasun said:

This plan sucks for the poor and middle class -- of course the GOP House passed it. 

 

Not enough outrage over this at the moment -- chatter at my work is "this thing isn't going to pass".... so many groups are against it and the GOP can just point fingers and say "special interests". 

 

 

I hear that a lot too.  It's almost like the election all over again.  "Trump will NEVER be elected!" Then looked what happened.  I think the tax bill could end up the same way.  

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tshile

tshile

Posted
Posted (edited)

Well it comes at a time where people are concerned about thanksgiving, black friday, and christmas.

 

Which, like it or not, those rules this part of the calendar along with football.

 

Add to it, taxes are incredibly complicated and changes to taxes even moreso. It's been hard for me to figure out what the net/net of this is for me and I'd like to think I generally have a clue when it comes to my taxes - Far, far, from an expert but I know what my AGI is, what my deductions are, and I get most of the impact to me. I don't think majority of the population falls into that category, and if you're surfing 'regular' news you can find someone somewhere saying you will be better and someone somewhere saying you'll be worse off.

 

So, i'm not surprised people are shrugging this one off.

 

(this is the main reason I hate the current tax system - it's so hard to get the truth of what a change will do for you, much less the whole system)

 

 

Edited by tshile
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ExoDus84

ExoDus84

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

Trump's Tax Plan for Trump:

 

✔ Lower marginal rate for top tax bracket

✔ Eliminate Estate Tax

✔ Eliminate Alternative Minimum Tax

✔ Drastically expand tax benefits for pass-through entities

 

He's 4 for 4, AKA the corruption Superfecta.

 

If a few Republicans actually had a ****ing soul, they'd push back on this. The orange blob is just fat ball of corruption, and nobody in that party seems to care.

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PleaseBlitz

PleaseBlitz

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, ExoDus84 said:

 

If a few Republicans actually had a ****ing soul, they'd push back on this. The orange blob is just fat ball of corruption, and nobody in that party seems to care.

 

What I think will be interesting will be Trump's reaction if the Senate bill has to be amended to get the votes, and they remove the provisions that strip out the EMT or the Estate Tax.  Those are the 2 provisions that will most impact Trump's personal wealth, so it will be interesting to see if they are a red line for him.  In other words, is he willing to just scrap the whole thing if he doesn't get the things that benefit him, personally, the most.  

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The Evil Genius

The Evil Genius

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, tshile said:

 

Add to it, taxes are incredibly complicated and changes to taxes even moreso. It's been hard for me to figure out what the net/net of this is for me and I'd like to think I generally have a clue when it comes to my taxes - Far, far, from an expert but I know what my AGI is, what my deductions are, and I get most of the impact to me. I don't think majority of the population falls into that category, and if you're surfing 'regular' news you can find someone somewhere saying you will be better and someone somewhere saying you'll be worse off.

 

So, i'm not surprised people are shrugging this one off.

 

(this is the main reason I hate the current tax system - it's so hard to get the truth of what a change will do for you, much less the whole system)

 

 

 

I suspect it's because the GOP has been very vague on the actual details of the "cuts" because they know it's only helping the 1%.

 

It's a "were going to dry **** you and you'll ask for more" type of bill for their people's. Unfortunately, when all the details come out (after it's passed of course) we will all see how bad it really is.

 

From what I can tell. It hurts almost anyone who itemizes and claims the state income tax deduction as well.

 

Edit.. obviously below the high middle class range.

Edited by The Evil Genius
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PleaseBlitz

PleaseBlitz

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, tshile said:

on the flip side it probably helps middle to upper-middle class people with no kids.

 

 

It appears that the cut off is $100,000/yr.  If you make more than that you end up ok in terms of the amount of federal taxes you pay (if you get healthcare through your employer and you don't live in a high tax state and you are not currently a graduate student).  If you make less than that, you get screwed pretty good. 

 

If you make less than $100,000, don't get healthcare through your employer, and live in NY or CA, you should flee the country.

 

The above only looks at the amount of taxes you pay.  What everyone seems to forget is that this tax bill is also going to be the impetus for adding $1.5 TRILLION to the deficit and/or/probably both dramatically slashing federal programs and significantly curtailing infrastructure investment and a kajillion other things that will dramatically lower your quality of life, even if you make $100k per year so your annual personal tax bill goes down somewhat (but aren't so overwhelmingly wealthy that literally nothing can harm you).  

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tshile

tshile

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

As long as they don't itemize their mortgage interest, student loan interest, and live in a high state income tax state.

and those things are higher than 24k.

and their mortgage is less than $1 mil (or is it 500k? maybe it depends on which bill you're looking at?)

also, medical expenses. But that has to be > 10% of your income to claim it I believe?

 

Yes, medical expenses must exceed 10% of your AGI to claim a deduction

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/changes-to-itemized-deduction-for-medical-expenses

and that's referring to the ones you came out of pocket for, that weren't reimbursed or otherwise covered.

 

 

Edited by tshile
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tshile

tshile

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

It appears that the cut off is $100,000/yr.  If you make more than that you end up ok in terms of the amount of federal taxes you pay (if you get healthcare through your employer and you don't live in a high tax state and you are not currently a graduate student).  If you make less than that, you get screwed pretty good. 

 

or you have kids - i believe two adults with 2 kids or more gets screwed because you lose exemptions after 1 kid?

and you lose the dependent care deduction. people with kids or taking care of a family member get screwed there

 

 

also, i believe anyone with a mortgage originated prior to the change would not lose their interest? wasn't that part of the deal at some point? 

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The Evil Genius

The Evil Genius

Posted
Posted (edited)

I live in California and the wife and I paid a little more than 9k in state income tax last year. Add another 10k in property taxes, 15k in mortgage interest..and any charity deductions...and I suspect we are really ****ed under this new bill. 

 

The only reason to eliminate the state income tax deduction is to punish "liberal" states.

Edited by The Evil Genius
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