pft.com bruce Allen won’t let Scot McCloughan talk to media

[Califan007 The Constipated]

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

I agree with your list and also that Jackson is under-valued by some. But don't sleep on Norman. Many of those penalties were on reputation. Also, with any kind of help at all, I believe Norman will be much more disrupted. He was one of what maybe 3 or 4 players on the D that would start on another team?

 

I am hoping they firm up the middle of the D allowing him to be a bit more aggressive.

 

I'm definitely not sleeping on Norman, I think he has been a fantastic pick up so far. I just also think Jackson has been as well. Each has their drawbacks, though, is all I meant...Jackson, it's his injuries. Norman, it's his penalties.

[HTTRDynasty]

3 minutes ago, bh32 said:

C'mon man Shanny and Allen were here together so there drafts are related..yeah drafting a tackle at #5 and then finding out he is a better guard in TC when they could of had Williams..lol such an awesome talent evaluator would not of made that mistake..i dont give a **** if he is the best guard ever. It was a ****ed up pick..Crowder is a good slot receiver but don't act like he is a top wr in the NFL..

 

I'm confused.  I thought we were talking about who had final say during those drafts, which was Shanny.  Otherwise, you should be criticizing Allen just as much as you criticize McCloughan for our oh-so-terrible 2015 and 2016 drafts. 

[bh32]

1 minute ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I'm confused.  I thought we were talking about who had final say during those drafts, which was Shanny.  Otherwise, you should be criticizing Allen just as much as you criticize McCloughan for our oh-so-terrible 2015 and 2016 drafts. 

Who cares who had final say back then? they were both involved at the time of those drafts...Which has produced better players through the Draft and FA than Scot has produced and its not even close..

How do you know Gruden isn't a better talent evaluator than Scot?

[HTTRDynasty]

Just now, bh32 said:

Who cares who had final say back then? they were both involved at the time of those drafts...Which has produced better players through the Draft and FA than Scot has produced and its not even close..

 

Are you serious?

 

How can you criticize Scot for his drafts, in which Allen is involved in the process but Scot has final say on the selections, and not see the hypocrisy in praising Allen for Shanahan's drafts, in which Allen was involved in the process but Shanny had final say on the selections?

 

I feel like I'm being trolled.

[bh32]

Just now, HTTRDynasty said:

 

Are you serious?

 

How can you criticize Scot for his drafts, in which Allen is involved in the process but Scot has final say on the selections, and not see the hypocrisy in praising Allen for Shanahan's drafts, in which Allen was involved in the process but Shanny had final say on the selections?

 

I feel like I'm being trolled.

Because Scot is probably getting fired for his GM duties where as Shanahan was fired for his coaching failures..

[HTTRDynasty]

Just now, bh32 said:

Because Scot is probably getting fired for his GM duties where as Shanahan was fired for his coaching failures..

 

... Okay, you lost me.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

8 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

How am I undervaluing Jackson? 

 

Also, yes I realize the penalties Norman has brought.  I realize the INTs, passes deflected and forced fumbles as well.

 

He has a very unique skillset that can't easily be replaced...that's why he may realistically get $10-$12 mil per year this offseason. He's not a WR about which you can say "(Fill in the blank) can do what Jackson does, only he's younger and cheaper". When the Eagles said "we can replace Jackson's production", they may have come close to matching his yardage and TDs, but that offense was nowhere near as explosive as it was with him, and the other players weren't nearly as productive. There may be 25 WRs or whatever the number is that have had more receptions over the last 3 seasons, but very few of them can change a defensive game plan or open up a game like Jackson can. I remember reading somewhere that although he's had a relatively low number of targets since coming here, he still is ranked #1 in terms of yards per catch and yards per target. His biggest enemy is his health imo...

 

 

[slaga]

Did the Redskins not enlist Scot's scouting services for a year or 2 before he was actually hired as the GM? No one can confirm just how much Scot's scouting reports might have influenced Allen's picks except Allen/Scot and the Redskins' scouting department. I would think how successful those scouting reports would have some impact on the decision to hire Scot as the GM. 

[bh32]

Loosing Scot is not the end of the world is what im saying..Honestly i think he sucks at what he does..His Drafts and FA pickups have been MEH 

[Master Blaster]

4 minutes ago, bh32 said:

Loosing Scot is not the end of the world is what im saying..Honestly i think he sucks at what he does..His Drafts and FA pickups have been MEH 

 

So it's merely coincidence that the first consecutive winning seasons in a decade coincide with Scot somehow being involved in the drafts which landed those players?

[DM72]

1 minute ago, Master Blaster said:

 

So it's merely coincidence that the first consecutive winning seasons in a decade coincide with Scot somehow being involved in the drafts which landed those players?

 

Don't forget, for the 1st time in ages, we had steady QB play for consecutive years. 

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Master Blaster said:

 

So it's merely coincidence that the first consecutive winning seasons in a decade coincide with Scot somehow being involved in the drafts which landed those players?

We got good when our coach named Kirk the starter. 

 

Unfortunately our revamped defense got worse this year.

 

We were not a better "team" this year.

 

Scot is a good GM, but not the messiah some here make him out to be.

[HTTRDynasty]

1 minute ago, Califan007 said:

 

He has a very unique skillset that can't easily be replaced...that's why he may realistically get $10-$12 mil per year this offseason. He's not a WR about which you can say "(Fill in the blank) can do what Jackson does, only he's younger and cheaper". When the Eagles said "we can replace Jackson's production", they may have come close to matching his yardage and TDs, but that offense was nowhere near as explosive as it was with him, and the other players weren't nearly as productive. There may be 25 WRs or whatever the number is that have had more receptions over the last 3 seasons, but very few of them can change a defensive game plan or open up a game like Jackson can. I remember reading somewhere that although he's had a relatively low number of targets since coming here, he still is ranked #1 in terms of yards per catch and yards per target. His biggest enemy is his health imo...

 

 

 

I agree that he has a unique skill-set that can't easily be replaced.  I never said I don't think he is one of our best players.  That doesn't make him a better player than Norman though, which is what we were talking about.

 

There are many more WRs I would take over D Jax than there are CBs I would take over Norman:

 

Julio Jones

Antonio Brown

OBJ

AJ Green

Deandre Hopkins

Mike Evans

TY Hilton

Jordy Nelson

Demariyus Thomas

Dez Bryant

Amari Cooper

Jarvis Landry

Alshon Jeffery

Doug Baldwin

Allen Robinson

Terrelle Pryor

Brandin Cooks

Keenan Allen

 

There might be more, but I can't think of any right now.  The bottom line is the list is a lot more exhaustive for him than it is for Norman.

 

[clskinsfan]

2 hours ago, ixcuincle said:

 

Again the whole narrative that he was a bad GM when he drafted Robert Kelley, Crowder, Scheff and Cravens is ridiculous. He made some mistakes but many of them weren't his fault. Under what circumstances could his drafting be considered mediocre? Do you people honestly forget Bruce Allen's drafts? Or Cerrato? We have a competent guy at GM and suddenly the story is he's a terrible talent evaluator? Get over yourselves people. 

 

So he gets a pass for the horrendous FA signings? And dont drop the Norman signing on me. He fell into the Skins lap. Lets run down the list of his aquisitions:

Tyler Larson (Who)

Ty Nsekhe (great player)

Nick Williams (who)

Stephen Paea

Chris Culliver

Terrence Knighton 

Justin Rogers

Jeron Johnson

Michael Hill

Dashon Goldson (trade)

Junior Galette

Derek Carrier (trade)

Brian De Le puente

Dashaun Phillips

Christine Michael

Pierre Thomas

Willie Jefferson

Cody Booth 

Josh Norman

Vernon Davis

Will Blackmon

Cullen Jenkins

Vinston painter

There are hundreds more transaction like this. Link below. Just change the year.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/transactions/_/name/wsh/year/2016

But most of the rest are rookies being moved on and off of the practice squad. Scott doesnt even have a 10% hit rate on the aquisitions he has made since he has been here. And on top of that he has signed some of these guys to pretty hefty contracts (Culliver, Paea among others). He has hit on 5 players in the draft that are excellent players. But Scherff was a reach. And honestly Allen/Shanahan have had better drafts overall.

 

Overall, his record is not good. You just have to be willing to look past his big name and reputation to see the truth.

 

 

 

[skinfan2k]

Both DJAX and Garcon aren't even in the top 20 in the league at the position.

 

We got good because we have a franchise QB.  This has nothing to do with Scot 

[SkinsPassion4Life]

Just now, clskinsfan said:

 

So he gets a pass for the horrendous FA signings? And dont drop the Norman signing on me. He fell into the Skins lap. Lets run down the list of his aquisitions:

Tyler Larson (Who)

Ty Nsekhe (great player)

Nick Williams (who)

Stephen Paea

Chris Culliver

Terrence Knighton 

Justin Rogers

Jeron Johnson

Michael Hill

Dashon Goldson (trade)

Junior Galette

Derek Carrier (trade)

Brian De Le puente

Dashaun Phillips

Christine Michael

Pierre Thomas

Willie Jefferson

Cody Booth 

Josh Norman

Vernon Davis

Will Blackmon

Cullen Jenkins

Vinston painter

There are hundreds more transaction like this. Link below. Just change the year.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/team/transactions/_/name/wsh/year/2016

But most of the rest are rookies being moved on and off of the practice squad. Scott doesnt even have a 10% hit rate on the aquisitions he has made since he has been here. And on top of that he has signed some of these guys to pretty hefty contracts (Culliver, Paea among others). He has hit on 5 players in the draft that are excellent players. But Scherff was a reach. 

 

Overall, his record is not good. You just have to be willing to look past his big name and reputation to see the truth.

 

 

 

 

I knew there were others besides me who are not impressed with the job GMSM has done.

[Mr. Sinister]

Did this dude really just roll out a list of largely stopgap fa players to try to make a point

[HTTRDynasty]

Just now, skinfan2k said:

Both DJAX and Garcon aren't even in the top 20 in the league at the position.

 

We got good because we have a franchise QB.  This has nothing to do with Scot 

 

We didn't have a franchise QB in 2014?  Or did we have a QB who crapped the bed whenever he got an opportunity to start because he was throwing untimely INTs and worrying for his life behind our inept OL?

4 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Overall, his record is not good. You just have to be willing to look past his big name and reputation to see the truth.

 

 

Have you bothered to take a look at the track record of other GMs when it comes to low cost FA signings and hitting on draft picks?  I'm guessing not, or you would have a different perspective. 

[clskinsfan]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Did this dude really just roll out a list of largely stopgap fa players to try to make a point

 

Yes I did. But Scott signed them and put a horrid defense on the field because of it. He completely neglected that side of the ball. And between that and Kirk's bone headed plays it cost us the playoffs. Meanwhile the Giants hit FA hard last year and it had the opposite effect. I am not advocating going crazy in FA. But adding a piece along the DL and at Safety would have been nice. Instead he signed special teamers to play safety.

 

And let me guess anyone who Scott missed on is considered a "stop gap" player? Was Culliver? How about Paea or Galette?

[Spaceman Spiff]

For what's been largely a **** franchise for about 20 years, the fans on here are pretty cavalier about a guy who seemingly has had a plan and some solid drafts.  

 

 

[ZRagone]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Did this dude really just roll out a list of largely stopgap fa players to try to make a point

 

Of course he did, because every Free Agent signing is supposed to be slam dunk, all-pro, cornerstone product. No team ever grabs a free agent on a stop-gap, year or two, deal meant to simply play a role. That's crazy talk.

 

Will Blackmon is a bum that's a backup that is far from an all-pro. His pickup was completely a bust. It doesn't matter that we found him for an extremely cheap contract, in the middle of the season, where he actually provided some solid play at a position that we were ravaged by injuries, helping us on a playoff run. He didn't become an all-pro player for us, so we should mock that pickup. 

 

And I mean, what the hell was the GM thinking signing Brian De La Puente or John Sullivan in the middle of the season, while our C depth was low, for $350k / $750k. It's like he was just grabbing an extremely cheap vet to provide depth, when we all know every free agent signing should get us an all star.

 

Has Scot had misses in Free Agency? Yes. But he's had some definite hits when the actual context of those contracts and the roles expected for that player to fill is taken into account. 

 

As far as the drafts, I'm LOVING watching people complimenting the 2014 draft, while ripping on 2015 and 2016, as an example of why we should be confident in Bruce. Specifically, they are reaming the 2016 draft while propping up Allen's now...

 

Let's remember what the 2014 draft did for us in year one. Trent Murphy was widely regarded as a bust and a waste of a pick. Moses was basically injured and provided nothing. Long road the bench. Grant was just a guy. Seastrunk was a preseason wonder. Then you had a big "Who?" with Ted Bolser and Zach Hocker. The only one who really did anything was Breeland.

 

Now 3 years later? Sure. Trent put in a very solid season for us. Breeland had a down year after two solid ones. Moses is a starting RT. Long is looking like a quality depth at worst, starting interior guy at best for us. And it's a great example of WHY you have to give drafts some times. But you can't sit here and rag on the 2016 draft after one year, while turning around and promoting the 2014 one as some way of saying we'd be better off with Bruce. 

 

[Genghis Khan]

10 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

 

Yes I did. But Scott signed them and put a horrid defense on the field because of it. He completely neglected that side of the ball. And between that and Kirk's bone headed plays it cost us the playoffs. Meanwhile the Giants hit FA hard last year and it had the opposite effect. I am not advocating going crazy in FA. But adding a piece along the DL and at Safety would have been nice. Instead he signed special teamers to play safety.

 

And let me guess anyone who Scott missed on is considered a "stop gap" player? Was Culliver? How about Paea or Galette?

 

We didn't have the cap space the giants had last year which was over 50 million.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I'm pretty sure we should all expect McCloughan to no longer be with the team in the near future. Not sure why or what happened...I damn well guarantee it wasn't due to jealousy, ego, or the dropping then re-signing of Cullen Jenkins, though lol...

 

- You keep him from representing you in front of the press because you know he won't be there much longer

- You have him do his work away from the combine while you use this time to give more responsibilities to those people who will be there long past the draft

- You fumble around giving reasons for him not being at the combine because, outside of saying "He won't really be here much longer" there's no good explanation you can give

 

 

[Fat Stupid Loser]

Love me some off season.

[BTBIRD 227]

13 minutes ago, bh32 said:

Loosing Scot is not the end of the world is what im saying..Honestly i think he sucks at what he does..His Drafts and FA pickups have been MEH 

 We have 60 million in cap space.I Know Scott is not THE capologist for the skins, but I am sure his input is very important for cap management.

Scott has  two drafts under his belt, you can't  hit on every player in the draft obviously. Scott's free agency is a very conservative approach , most of free agent are malcontents from another team, washed up has beens and or egomaniacs,that think they are gods vessel to bring a NFL team to the promised land. 

Norman, obviously is Scot's largest free agent sighing , the rest of his free agent signings are stop gap measures . The stop gap measures are part of the Capology . The Skins have not enjoyed  a decent  cap number in for ever and a day. Skins need to keep Mccloughan, he does not suck. Hail