The 2017 FA Thread - OP Updated with Signings (Sundberg, Galette, VD, Hood re-signed) *** Terrell McClain, Stacy McGee, DJ Swearinger, Terrelle Pryor, Chris Carter, Brian Quick, ZACH BROWN(!!)***

[Est.1974]

12 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I wonder why they'd release him now.

They get 2.5mil cap space back if he's signs elsewhere before the draft.

[Koolblue13]

4 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

This took me a second to interpret lol...

Im hopped up on goofballs and in and out of sleep, because of my back.

4 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

They get 2.5mil cap space back if he's signs elsewhere before the draft.

Makes sense. I'd be happy to bring in on.

[WelshSkinsFan]

Hmm, they lost Poe and yet they still would rather cut this guy to save $2.5 million.  If that doesn't say buyer beware I really don't know what does.

[SkinsTillIDie]

58 minutes ago, WelshSkinsFan said:

Hmm, they lost Poe and yet they still would rather cut this guy to save $2.5 million.  If that doesn't say buyer beware I really don't know what does.

 

I mean, you could say the same thing about Zach Brown. We signed him to a 1-year, $2.5 million deal.

[Morneblade]

2 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

Link?

"In an interview with ESPN 980 earlier this month, new defensive coordinator Greg Manusky said that he views McClain and McGee as “bookends” when the team is in its base 3-4. This, of course, begs the question of who the Redskins will use as a nose tackle, especially with Baker gone."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/apr/5/redskins-didnt-sign-big-name-dt-they-think-they-go/

2 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

Okay lol...my point was, drafting DE and NT is not mutually exclusive. So could move McGee to inside, draft a DE (that's better than Hood), then draft a NT in the 2nd. Then let training camp sort it all out lol...

 

Well, if you want then to perform well you kinda do. For instance, you might move a tackle to guard, but you rarely more a guard to tackle, unless you're in big trouble. Same logic applies. You might be able to more a NT to DT,(in a 4-3) but moving a DE (in a 3-4) to a NT gets you Ziggy Hood.

 

NT is really a singular position, with a unique skill set.

 

And I would not draft a NT until the 3rd at the very earliest in this draft. I'd wait for the 4th round. I just don't see any great NT's in this draft.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

And I would not draft a NT until the 3rd at the very earliest in this draft. I'd wait for the 4th round. I just don't see any great NT's in this draft.

 

You and Koolblue are apparently of like minds...

[Koolblue13]

18 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

You and Koolblue are apparently of like minds...

Well, thats where they are ranked and picked in every mock,so...

[Morneblade]

20 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

You and Koolblue are apparently of like minds...

 

I'm the bot account.

 

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

Well, thats where they are ranked and picked in every mock,so...

 

Yeah, pretty much, at least the "true" NTs.

[WelshSkinsFan]

3 hours ago, SkinsTillIDie said:

 

I mean, you could say the same thing about Zach Brown. We signed him to a 1-year, $2.5 million deal.

Totally different situation, Brown was not cut and had an offer on the table from the Bills but was looking for more and took the 1 year deal with us in the hopes of a bigger payday next year.  Bills also have a lot of options at ILB whilst the Chiefs are cutting a player that fits a position of need so that has to be a red flag.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

2 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Well, thats where they are ranked and picked in every mock,so...

 

See, I actually thought you had some footsballs knowledge that told you this lol...

 

 

By the way, from Swearinger:

 

jungleboi_swaggg #COFFINSEASON TRUST ME!!!! MY DEFENSE WILL TOP 5!!! IT'S A MINDSET YOU GOTTA INSTALL FROM DAY 1!!! YOU GOTTA BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN BE THE BEST!! YOU GOTTA GRIND YOU'RE WAY TO THE TOP!! RESPECT IS NOT GIVEN IT'S EARNED!!!

[Morneblade]

17 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

See, I actually thought you had some footsballs knowledge that told you this lol...

 

 

By the way, from Swearinger:

 

jungleboi_swaggg #COFFINSEASON TRUST ME!!!! MY DEFENSE WILL TOP 5!!! IT'S A MINDSET YOU GOTTA INSTALL FROM DAY 1!!! YOU GOTTA BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN BE THE BEST!! YOU GOTTA GRIND YOU'RE WAY TO THE TOP!! RESPECT IS NOT GIVEN IT'S EARNED!!!

 

How man times has he been voted All Pro?

Besides...

[Peregrine]

On 4/21/2017 at 1:43 PM, skinny21 said:

Hopefully I've made it clear that I'm in the same boat here.  However, just to play Devil's Advocate...

 

Thompson is only signed through this year.  He's a solid 3rd down back, but he's more of the type to make people miss with speed than with vision, subtle cuts, etc.  His hands are solid, though not nearly as soft as someone like McCaffrey.

 

Kelley is a solid back, and given his penchant for limiting the TFLs, he seems to fit our line pretty well.  With that said, I wonder if a back with better vision and burst (particularly one that has the top speed to break the big ones) could 1) produce more for us, and 2) alter the way teams try to stop our offense (the passing attack especially).  Then there's the idea that our depth is questionable at best behind him.  

 

Crowder is great in the slot and a very good returner.  Of course, we don't have a viable option behind him (at wr or returner), and there is a distinct possibility that he gets played on the outside a lot more.  Another area McCaffrey could excel.

 

On paper, we have plenty of weapons on O - Pryor, Doctson, Crowder, Reed, plus 2 solid backs (though neither are really 3 down players) and even Davis.  Of course, Reed and Doctson have their injury concerns, and losing Reed hurts bad.  Doctson, were he injured, can be replaced by Crowder, but then you're short a slot receiver.  

 

Can't have too many weapons, particularly in a league so affected by injury and free agency.

 

 

 

Couple notes -

1.  I didn't go into this post thinking it would be about McCaffrey, but I realized that the argument for him is more compelling (over Cooks/Fournette/etc.) because he can be a weapon (and backup) in so many areas.

 

2.  I was looking at defensive stats the other day, and noticed that improving just .2 or .3 yards per carry would have vaulted our run D to somewhere around the middle of the pack.  Given how atrocious our run D is (and is viewed), this surprised me.  So, given that metric... how much value should we actually place on improving our own rb's ypc?  

To play devils advocate to the devils advocate(angels advocate then?), I think you CAN have too many weapons.  The reality is the NFL is a bit of a zero sum game.  Anytime you improve one position, it WILL be at the expense of another.  But you have to pick and chose which one is more important, and every team has to juggle holes in their roster.  Its not that I dont McCaffrey wouldnt be better than all of our backs, because I think its likely he will.  But I think it will be an improvement not worth the lack of investment in other positions that will most likely be available at 17.  

 

I consider it like as if you had a very simplified race car.  It has two main features, acceleration, and stability, which you can improve to improve your times.  Acceleration is at 90%, stability is at 30%.  You have greatly souped up your cars performance, and thus its track time.  Now, you get the choice of $500, enough to buy one part to improve it.  You can make it faster, making it THE fastest car out there, but because it already is super fast, due to diminishing returns you get 5%, to take you to 95%.  This improves your track time a little.  Or, you can improve your broken springs, which improve stability by 25%, and in the end mean your car is much faster.  

 

In the end, the pick makes our defense much better due to the horrible players we currently have available to start, whereas one is a lesser improvement at a position we place little emphasis on.  

 

For the record, I think the idea of drafting a RB in the back half of the 1st round is a losing proposition 95% of the time.  If you compare the number of great backs drafted in 2-5, compared to those drafted in the back half of the 1st, it just makes no sense to do so.

[Rattlesnake88]

Cant wait for this dude to surprise some fellow Redskins fans. Much needed nastiness added to the back of our defense between him and Sua.

[Est.1974]

6 hours ago, Morneblade said:

"In an interview with ESPN 980 earlier this month, new defensive coordinator Greg Manusky said that he views McClain and McGee as “bookends” when the team is in its base 3-4. This, of course, begs the question of who the Redskins will use as a nose tackle, especially with Baker gone."

 

Yeh have seen that. Regarding my point, why would that prevent McGee kicking inside to play some DT considering most traditional NT are two down players who struggle to play more than 50% of the defensive snaps.

[Momma There Goes That Man]

2 hours ago, Rattlesnake88 said:

Cant wait for this dude to surprise some fellow Redskins fans. Much needed nastiness added to the back of our defense between him and Sua.

 

Admittedly haven't kept up with him in the NFL but I hope he tackles better than that next year for us. 

 

I saw enough shoulder check tackling from Merriweather to last a lifetime 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

36 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

 

Admittedly haven't kept up with him in the NFL but I hope he tackles better than that next year for us. 

 

I saw enough shoulder check tackling from Merriweather to last a lifetime 

 

Can you tackle better than putting the player immediately on the ground? lol...

[Momma There Goes That Man]

21 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

Can you tackle better than putting the player immediately on the ground? lol...

 

Yeah, use your arms with correct tackling form. I don't care that BM knocked someone down hard every 10-15 tackle attempts because of the 8-9 times in between that he missed the tackle or gave up extra yardage because he essentially played with his arms tied behind his back 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

1 hour ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

 

Yeah, use your arms with correct tackling form. I don't care that BM knocked someone down hard every 10-15 tackle attempts because of the 8-9 times in between that he missed the tackle or gave up extra yardage because he essentially played with his arms tied behind his back 

 

I know what you meant lol...I was making a joke on the way you phrased it.

[Morneblade]

6 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

Yeh have seen that. Regarding my point, why would that prevent McGee kicking inside to play some DT considering most traditional NT are two down players who struggle to play more than 50% of the defensive snaps.

 

So, you're asking me, after showing you a quote that says he'll be playing DE, why would that prevent him from going inside to Nose?

 

Ok..........................

[RedskinsInFebruary]

3 hours ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

 

Yeah, use your arms with correct tackling form. I don't care that BM knocked someone down hard every 10-15 tackle attempts because of the 8-9 times in between that he missed the tackle or gave up extra yardage because he essentially played with his arms tied behind his back 

You tend to miss a lot of tackles being suspended as well.

[Rattlesnake88]

Again, proving my point. Lots of negativity on a good signing. I won't add much else on the subject, other than I think he will surprise. Httr

[Est.1974]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

So, you're asking me, after showing you a quote that says he'll be playing DE, why would that prevent him from going inside to Nose?

 

Ok..........................

 

Players can cover more than one position on the line you know. Bit like at WR with Crowder player outside as well as in the slot.

 

Oh wait, you didn't buy that either,

 

Ok................

[skinny21]

I'm assuming the plan was (and still is) for McGee to play DE, but I'm also assuming things are going to be a bit fluid (much like the Crowder situation).  

 

I'm hoping they find a viable option (a better one than those in house), but if he has to make do with what he has, McGee seems like a guy that can anchor well...

[Morneblade]

1 hour ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

Players can cover more than one position on the line you know. Bit like at WR with Crowder player outside as well as in the slot.

 

Oh wait, you didn't buy that either,

 

Ok................

 

Yes, I know, I gave examples of that earlier. But NT is one of those position that you need a special skill set to do. Sure, you can just throw someone in there (see:Ziggy Hood) but you're not going to get good results. So, sure, you can throw McGee in there if you want. Or a Ham Sammich. Just don't expect anything good out of it.

 

And since I already gave you proof to you original assertion being incorrect (McGee was not going to be a NT) you have to resort to "well, he could!"

 

Whatever.

1 hour ago, skinny21 said:

I'm assuming the plan was (and still is) for McGee to play DE, but I'm also assuming things are going to be a bit fluid (much like the Crowder situation).  

 

I'm hoping they find a viable option (a better one than those in house), but if he has to make do with what he has, McGee seems like a guy that can anchor well...

 

He might be able, but I really don't think that would be the smart way to go. It might be a bit of an improvement over Hood, but that's still bad. And honestly, he's never really done much in the league and has injury issues that would be likely compounded as a NT.

 

Now, moving him to DT in a 4-3 makes a lot of sense, as does McClain. But not NT.

 

Edit which brings me back to @UK SKINS FAN '74. Did you mean DT or NT? You've said both. One makes sense (playing DT in our 4-3 looks) and one doesn't (playing NT in our 3-4 looks). Which one of these did you mean?

[Est.1974]

@Morneblade I think McGee will be starting DE, we'll look to add a more traditional NT in the draft hopefully, on latter downs I see us subbing in a more agressive DE for the NT whilst pushing McGee inside as a more mobile tackle option on say third downs.