Charleston Gazette Mail:Clay official loses job over racist Facebook post about Michelle Obama

[Renegade7]

Let it out America.  I know you've been holding back, I need to know what I'm dealing with.

[Elessar78]

54 minutes ago, MisterPinstripe said:

How does not being nasty, attacking people, and showing love not hate, equate to forgetting? That's part of the problem with what we are seeing from both sides. You can disagree, you can condemn something you think is wrong, without trashing or attacking people. 

 

Who here has ever seen someone respond to and open their ears to hate? I certainly havent, it doesn't matter how right you are or think you are. If you respond to someone in a kind way, people will take notice. People are more likely to listen. No one listens when they are attacked and trashed and demeaned. 

Part of the problem with society is this mindset. Well, they were mean or hateful so that now makes it okay for me to be that way. Responding in a loving and kind way is way more likely to make people listen. No one's mind are going to be changed, no hearts changed, by trashing one another. All that does is build the divide, us against them, etc.

 

Someone says hateful things? Heap kindness upon them. This thought that responding kindly means you can't condemn or disagree with whatever was said is so out of whack. 

 

But people like to attack back, it makes us feel better, it's easier. And that's one of the reasons we are where we are.

Convenient to be the attack dog until the shoe is on the other foot then become the Christians they purport to be 

[Major Harris]

6 hours ago, LD0506 said:

Are you going to even try and tell me or anyone that's not exactly what got voted in and voted for? G'head, I dare ya, Bannon was one of the very first hires of "the best people" made by the new...............whatever the hell this is

You and the rest can feign ignorance or upset or heart murmurs all ya want, this is yours, own it.

I really think you missed his point amidst your rage. 

10 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

West Virginia is just hopelessly adrift right now.

 

Yeah,  racist comments about Michelle Obama,  that's a wv thing.  Great work detective

[twa]

27 minutes ago, The Sisko said:

 

So yeah, a lot of us are distraught, not because our person didn't win but in part because it means a lot of people we know and trusted weren't worthy of it. That's a lot more devastating a loss than just an election.

 

That is a odd attitude from someone that voted for him.....more games?

27 minutes ago, The Sisko said:

 

So yeah, a lot of us are distraught, not because our person didn't win but in part because it means a lot of people we know and trusted weren't worthy of it. That's a lot more devastating a loss than just an election.

 

That is a odd attitude from someone that voted for him.....more games?

[MisterPinstripe]

39 minutes ago, Elessar78 said:

Convenient to be the attack dog until the shoe is on the other foot then become the Christians they purport to be 

For clarification, is this directed to me or commenting on the issue in general?

[The Sisko]

59 minutes ago, twa said:

That is a odd attitude from someone that voted for him.....more games?

1

Don't make me come over there....

[Elessar78]

47 minutes ago, MisterPinstripe said:

For clarification, is this directed to me or commenting on the issue in general?

Not directed at you. I made it a point not use that pronoun.

[AsburySkinsFan]

1 hour ago, Elessar78 said:

Convenient to be the attack dog until the shoe is on the other foot then become the Christians they purport to be 

My thoughts exactly. I know there are lot who are genuine, but there is no shortage of folks who are conveniently amnesiac when it comes to their party. And the surrogates know full well what they are doing. I simply refuse to be part of their ruse. They need to be called out and I will not pretend that it didn't happen.

People are telling us to be nice and not point these things out but in my mind that is appeasement by neglect.

[zoony]

3 hours ago, The Sisko said:

That would hold true if this were any normal election. Dump was a candidate like none other in our lifetimes. He's a demagogue that stokes the fires of racial hatred. At best he's coy about courting the support of hate groups and at worst, he actively supports them. There were a number of options one could take outside of voting for Dump or Hillary. However only ~400K fewer people chose against Dump than picked a perfectly acceptable, normal candidate in RMoney. After that election and any other election before it, I didn't look at the rural people that I work with any differently, regardless of the outcome. However this time around the issue wasn't as many have said, that others see them as racist for voting for Dump. It's worse. Dump voters were willing to sell my family and me, gay people, Jews, etc. down the river for whatever reason they found to vote for him. That's a level of moral bankruptcy that means I can't trust you and I just don't respect you anymore.

"Meh, the risk is minimal. Nothing's going to happen." Maybe, maybe not. However, what would you think of me if the candidate running was actively supporting or being coy about some characteristic that meant your kid could be at risk? You wouldn't care whether I was racist or not, only that I was willing to risk your kid's wellbeing, and it wouldn't matter much to you how small I thought the risk is.

When I was a kid, my grandmother used to warn me not to trust white kids because she said that when in a group with other kids that meant me harm they might not stand up for me or if someone did something that could get us in trouble, they'd use me as the fall guy. I always told her that her thinking was outdated. After all, my friends were cool. They weren't like that. Well, it turns out that in more general terms she was right after all. I won't be going hunting or golfing with any of the folks I know from rural areas. I've been invited a few times and have considered it but now I'd be genuinely worried that I might end up like this guy.

So yeah, a lot of us are distraught, not because our person didn't win but in part because it means a lot of people we know and trusted weren't worthy of it. That's a lot more devastating a loss than just an election.

That sucks you feel that way.  for the record, Sisko, you can come hang with me anytime and play a round of golf

[MisterPinstripe]

1 hour ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

My thoughts exactly. I know there are lot who are genuine, but there is no shortage of folks who are conveniently amnesiac when it comes to their party. And the surrogates know full well what they are doing. I simply refuse to be part of their ruse. They need to be called out and I will not pretend that it didn't happen.

People are telling us to be nice and not point these things out but in my mind that is appeasement by neglect.

What's wrong with not attacking people and trashing people? It is possible to point out issues and condemn issues without doing that. I never said don't point out things, people just seem to think that the only way to point things out is with anger and hate and attacking. That's not actually the case.

[Major Harris]

6 hours ago, zoony said:

That sucks you feel that way.  for the record, Sisko, you can come hang with me anytime and play a round of golf

 

 

Just don't go into the woods alone to look for your lost ball.  Take a friend with u.

[AsburySkinsFan]

6 hours ago, MisterPinstripe said:

What's wrong with not attacking people and trashing people? It is possible to point out issues and condemn issues without doing that. I never said don't point out things, people just seem to think that the only way to point things out is with anger and hate and attacking. That's not actually the case.

So attack racism and white supremacy without naming Bannon? 

[MisterPinstripe]

1 hour ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

So attack racism and white supremacy without naming Bannon? 

My point isnt saying ignore pointing out when people are wrong, or out of line, or being nasty, or just point to the issues themselves. What I am saying is you can condemn racism, condemn white supremacy, condemn the specific people that you think are acting that way, without trashing people. We don't have to throw hate at one another and attack one another to condemn evil things, to condemn the actions of people.

Have you ever seen someone respond and listen when hate is being spewed at them? When people are attacking them? Or is it more likely they might listen if we treat other people with kindness? This of course doesn't insure that they will change or listen, but should we let other peoples hate change how we act as well? Arent we then bringing ourselves to their level?

And again, none of this means don't condemn all of this stuff or stand up against it. What keeps coming up again and again seems to be that we think if we respond in kindness and love to hate that we are somehow condoning it. Its easier to respond to hate with hate, its harder to respond to hate with love, we don't get that satisfaction right away.

And this even goes beyond the big stuff like racism and white supremacy. Just read through this thread and see all of the attacking, the snide comments, the passive aggressive comments, the us against them mentalities. We are never going to come together when we treat each other this way, we are never going to change minds when we attack people. Im sure at this point I am probably rambling so I will stop here with this.

 

How many minds and hearts have been changed by attacking and trashing people? How many minds and hearts have been changed by showing mercy, and kindness, and love to someone? And I wish I didn't have to keep saying this, but the last part doesn't mean you ignore or overlook the evil and nastiness of those people.

 

And at this point I am talking in circles so Ill just stop with this post.

[AsburySkinsFan]

29 minutes ago, MisterPinstripe said:

My point isnt saying ignore pointing out when people are wrong, or out of line, or being nasty, or just point to the issues themselves. What I am saying is you can condemn racism, condemn white supremacy, condemn the specific people that you think are acting that way, without trashing people. We don't have to throw hate at one another and attack one another to condemn evil things, to condemn the actions of people.

Have you ever seen someone respond and listen when hate is being spewed at them? When people are attacking them? Or is it more likely they might listen if we treat other people with kindness? This of course doesn't insure that they will change or listen, but should we let other peoples hate change how we act as well? Arent we then bringing ourselves to their level?

And again, none of this means don't condemn all of this stuff or stand up against it. What keeps coming up again and again seems to be that we think if we respond in kindness and love to hate that we are somehow condoning it. Its easier to respond to hate with hate, its harder to respond to hate with love, we don't get that satisfaction right away.

And this even goes beyond the big stuff like racism and white supremacy. Just read through this thread and see all of the attacking, the snide comments, the passive aggressive comments, the us against them mentalities. We are never going to come together when we treat each other this way, we are never going to change minds when we attack people. Im sure at this point I am probably rambling so I will stop here with this.

 

How many minds and hearts have been changed by attacking and trashing people? How many minds and hearts have been changed by showing mercy, and kindness, and love to someone? And I wish I didn't have to keep saying this, but the last part doesn't mean you ignore or overlook the evil and nastiness of those people.

 

And at this point I am talking in circles so Ill just stop with this post.

 I imagine a good number of people on this thread and elsewhere in this country feel like they themselves were voted against in this election. Whether they were voted against because of their gender, their nationality, their race, or their sexuality.

You seem surprised that people would act like this is an us against them type of situation and that we should look beyond these things. But the reality is that many people feel that this is a us against them situation. For as long as I can remember those on the right have condemned the word liberal to the point where now it is a word that is dripping with contempt  and all other manner of disparaging connotations.

You talk about these high ideals of coming together in unity in taking the highroad when every single turn they're disparaged, lied about, or just flat out ignored. You know it doesn't get ignored? Throwing a rock through somebody's window. To me that's what I feel releasing this anger feels like, shattering those glass houses that they defended for so long.  People are truly pissed off and watching the names coming out in this transition just pisses us off even more.  

We have the megaphone of white supremacists with the ear of the president elect, we have renowned climate change deniers heading up or EPA, we have troglodytes who been scurrying around the underbelly of American politics being discussed as our Secretary of State and Attorney General. And you want us to take the highroad. 

Sorry but for me in this time I choose to put a rock through their window. I don't care if they listen to what I have to say, I want their shame on display.

[nonniey]

12 hours ago, MisterPinstripe said:

What's wrong with not attacking people and trashing people? It is possible to point out issues and condemn issues without doing that. I never said don't point out things, people just seem to think that the only way to point things out is with anger and hate and attacking. That's not actually the case.

Funny that Elasser liked your post as he was primarily the target of it.

6 hours ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

So attack racism and white supremacy without naming Bannon? 

How about target him with out attacking everybody including posters on this board like LD did. (Edit my apolgies to Ellasser meant to say LD)

[AsburySkinsFan]

8 minutes ago, nonniey said:

How about target him with out attacking everybody including posters on this board like Elasser did.

Dunno what he said. I normally focus on my own rants.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

11 hours ago, zoony said:

That sucks you feel that way.  for the record, Sisko, you can come hang with me anytime and play a round of golf

 

And ignore that bag of lime in his trunk.....

[MisterPinstripe]

3 hours ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

We have the megaphone of white supremacists with the ear of the president elect, we have renowned climate change deniers heading up or EPA, we have troglodytes who been scurrying around the underbelly of American politics being discussed as our Secretary of State and Attorney General. And you want us to take the highroad. 

Sorry but for me in this time I choose to put a rock through their window. I don't care if they listen to what I have to say, I want their shame on display.

Yes.

And the cycle continues, if no one listens how is anything going to change?

 

[Popeman38]

4 minutes ago, MisterPinstripe said:

Yes.

And the cycle continues, if no one listens how is anything going to change?

 

The problem is the sides don't want the other side to listen, they want capitulation. Our way or the highway. 

[The 12th Commandment]

9 minutes ago, Popeman38 said:

The problem is the sides don't want the other side to listen, they want capitulation. Our way or the highway. 

Only I think the record shows that Obama tried to work with congress over and over and they were very recalcitrant about doing anything at all.  They didn't hide it either, it was a clear statement "we will work to block anything he proposes" type thing.  Is it just the lefty in me that sees that it went down like that?  

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

If anything, this election has put to rest the idea that racism, sexism, and homophobia are just going to naturally disappear from the culture as all the old Baby Boomers die off. It might disappear from YOUR immediate culture, but it's going to be out there prominently in the culture at large for a long, long time.

I don't want to speak in apocalyptic terms, but there is a real problem in America right now in that we seem to be split almost 50/50 culturally and there is no real easy dividing line. We are a city/suburban vs exurban/rural culture right now. And it exists in pretty much every state - with some exceptions like West Virginia that don't really have urban areas in any meaningful sense.

I live in Harris County, Texas - where Houston is located. Obama won the county by like 2,000 votes in 2012. Hillary won it by nearly 200,000 votes. Hillary won comfortably in Harris (Houston), Dallas, Travis (Austin), Bexar (San Antonio) and El Paso counties. Trump won by huge margins (like 80-20) pretty much everywhere else. There probably is going to be a point in the next 20 years when those 5 cities plus the border area flip the state to the Dem column and the rural counties are going to freak the **** out when that happens.

When you and 80 percent of your neighbors vote for something and don't get it, how are you going to respond to that? That's a question for both sides of the political divide. Every election for the foreseeable future is either going to be rural voters ruling urban voters or vice versa.

Cute conservatives think that "federalism" can save us from this, but I don't think so. Dallas County being ruled by West Texas is no better than New York being ruled by the Upper Peninsula of Michigan.

 

[Popeman38]

25 minutes ago, KAOSkins said:

Only I think the record shows that Obama tried to work with congress over and over and they were very recalcitrant about doing anything at all.  They didn't hide it either, it was a clear statement "we will work to block anything he proposes" type thing.  Is it just the lefty in me that sees that it went down like that?  

I was referring to voters mostly. Politicians ride whatever wave they need to ride to stay in power...

[nonniey]

47 minutes ago, KAOSkins said:

Only I think the record shows that Obama tried to work with congress over and over and they were very recalcitrant about doing anything at all.  They didn't hide it either, it was a clear statement "we will work to block anything he proposes" type thing.  Is it just the lefty in me that sees that it went down like that?  

This started on 23 January 2009. Look up what happened that day(reference the Stimulus bill). It also contradicts what you believe the record to be.

Too Bad Obama Didn't Follow His Own Advice

By Tom Bevan - August 13, 2014

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2014/08/13/too_bad_obama_didnt_follow_his_own_advice_123650.html#ixzz4QC9anGoR

......

So much of the president’s current troubles can be traced back to his comment to Eric Cantor, which the president uttered at a meeting held just three days into his first term. The setting was a White House meeting hosted by the freshly inaugurated president and his top economic advisers. Their guests were congressional leaders of both parties and both chambers of Congress—there to discuss the framework of the huge stimulus bill hurtling through the newly installed 111^th Congress.

Despite Obama’s bravado in the meeting, he also expressed openness to the ideas Cantor proposed.  As Carl M. Cannon and I reported in our eBook, “Election 2012: The Battle Begins,” Republican lawmakers left the White House feeling Obama was sincere in his desire to work with them on crafting the legislation.

But it quickly became apparent that this was little more than lip service. Republicans discovered that most of the stimulus bill had already been written behind closed doors by Nancy Pelosi and David Obey, then chairman of the House Appropriations Committee. Obama failed to step in, and almost nothing Republicans suggested to the president was seriously considered by Democrats, let alone incorporated into the legislation.

Republicans felt used by the president, and disrespected by their colleagues on the other side of the aisle. Not a single GOP House lawmaker voted in favor of the stimulus. Whatever political goodwill that existed in the aftermath of the 2008 election was gone less than a week after Obama’s inauguration. The well was poisoned then and there.

Read more: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2014/08/13/too_bad_obama_didnt_follow_his_own_advice_123650.html#ixzz4QCB5t720
 

 

[twa]

LKB the results are from Trump not being loved here and targeted efforts to increase voting in the city.

Change the candidate and the metrics change....just as you change the parties platforms and it changed before when Texas was blue..

Hell I hate Hillary and almost didn't vote.

of course the mass  migration of northern folk to cities here might be a factor as well. ......some people are slow leaners

add

http://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2016/cb16-43.html

The Houston-The Woodlands-Sugar Land and Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington metro areas added about 159,000 and 145,000 residents, respectively — the largest gains of any metro areas in the nation. Two additional Texas metro areas adjacent to each other — Austin-Round Rock and San Antonio-New Braunfels — were each also among the 16 nationwide to gain 50,000 or more people over the period.

These four Texas metro areas collectively added about 412,000 people. Texas as a whole gained about 490,000.

 

 

[nonniey]

3 hours ago, AsburySkinsFan said:

Dunno what he said. I normally focus on my own rants.

Sorry meant LD not Elasser.