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WaPo: Multiple injuries reported in ‘active shooter situation’ near Planned Parenthood in Colorado Springs

mistertim

By mistertim
in The Tailgate

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twa

twa

Posted
Posted

Wait, so which is it?  You said end of segmentation, but now you say conception because you were trying to "allow some leeway?"

 

 

 

Obviously both if ya can read....the latter indisputable.

 

It always entertains me how the godly anti-abortionists suddenly "embrace science" when it comes to the definition of life.

 

I embrace science all the time :)  , but then I'm neither godly nor strictly anti-abortion

 

I just want a good reason for killing ,seems a rather reasoned and civilized position.

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DogofWar1

DogofWar1

Posted
Posted

Obviously both if ya can read....the latter indisputable.

 

So fertilization then.

 

Fair enough, you should probably start calling prosecutors about in vitro fertilization then, they probably kill dozens if not hundreds of twa people per day.

 

You live in Texas, they'd probably buy it.

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mistertim

mistertim

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Just gonna creep back in here real quick to drop this in:
 
WaPo - Before Colorado shooting, a trail of allegations of violence against women.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/before-colorado-shooting-a-long-history-of-violence-against-women/2015/12/01/7f494c86-987b-11e5-8917-653b65c809eb_story.html?hpid=hp_rhp-top-table-main_coloshooter-1115pm%3Ahomepage%2Fstory
 

Before his arrest for last week’s shooting at a Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado Springs, Robert Lewis Dear had on several occasions been accused of erupting in bursts of violence, particularly toward women. At least two of his three ex-wives have accused him of physical abuse, according to court records. And in 1992, Dear was arrested and accused of sexual violence and rape.

 
 
Some stuff about his religious "beliefs" and thoughts on abortion:
 

But in a 1993 divorce affidavit cited by the Post and Courier and the New York Times, Micheau described Dear as a man who was extremely religious and used religion at times to justify abusive behavior. At the same time, he was deeply sinful, she said, describing him as a serial philanderer and gambler.

“He claims to be a Christian and is extremely evangelistic but does not follow the Bible in his actions,” Micheau said in the affidavit. “He says that as long as he believes he will be saved, he can do whatever he pleases. He is obsessed with the world coming to an end.”


Dear’s peculiar behavior and pursuit of women appeared to extend online. An e-mail address confirmed as Dear’s by two people close to him was linked to a flurry of message-board postings on Cannabis.com. The posts are mainly political and religious rants, with several focused on death, hell and the end of the world.

One post read: “WAKE UP SINNERS U CANT SAVE YOURSELF U WILL DIE AN WORMS SHALL EAT YOUR FLESH.” Another said: “aids , hurricanes, we are in the end times.”

One person who had discussed politics with Dear said he had often praised those who attacked abortion clinics as “heroes.”

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PokerPacker

PokerPacker

Posted
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I embrace science all the time :)  , but then I'm neither godly nor strictly anti-abortion

 

I just want a good reason for killing ,seems a rather reasoned and civilized position.

Didn't mean for that to be directed at you per se. It's just something I've observed over the years whenever the abortion debate crops up.

As for it's actual relevance to the issue, well the thing is, there are many definitions of life and of personhood, and it's a lot more complicated than just conception. If it were such a simple task, there probably wouldn't be so much disagreement on the subject.

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twa

twa

Posted
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As for it's actual relevance to the issue, well the thing is, there are many definitions of life and of personhood, and it's a lot more complicated than just conception. If it were such a simple task, there probably wouldn't be so much disagreement on the subject.

 

certainly is a different matter if ya go from life to personhood or soul .

 

The question of life becomes plain if ya were speaking of a different species 

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Zguy28

Zguy28

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Nope.   You are presupposing the answer.   You have defined "human life" in the manner in which you want to define it, in order to achieve the result that you desire.   There is life in some form, that is undeniable.  That a "human being" exists at 14 days is not scientifically provable.  It is a philosophical question.  

I agree with Predicto. Here is one of the most concise and well written arguments from a philosophical standpoint in favor of life.

 

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/abortion-and-presidential-politics

It seems to me that amidst all the arguments pro and con about the abortion issue, there are two central questions which are determinative:

 

(1) Do human beings possess intrinsic moral value?

 

(2) Is the developing fetus a human being?

 

Think about that first question: Do human beings have intrinsic moral value? Something has intrinsic value if it is an end in itself, rather than a means to some end. Things which are valuable merely as means to some end have only extrinsic value. For example, money has no intrinsic value, in and of itself. Rather it has extrinsic value insofar as it's a useful means of commerce for human beings and so is valuable to us for the ends it helps us achieve. But in and of itself it's intrinsically worthless. It's just paper.

 

Now the question is, are human beings like that? Or are they intrinsically valuable?

 

 

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@DCGoldPants

@DCGoldPants

Posted
Posted

Clerical Error Blamed For Planned Parenthood Attack Suspect Gender Mix-Up

 

A clerical error is to blame for suspected Planned Parenthood shooter Robert L. Dear being listed as a woman on his Colorado voter registration form, officials said Tuesday, a detail that fueled speculation he may have identified as transgender.
After the shooting at a Colorado Springs Planned Parenthood last week that left three people dead and nine others injured, the error on the form prompted questions about Dear’s gender identity.
Most notably, Sen. Ted Cruz referred to a report about Dear being a “transgendered leftist activist.”
The error happened in October 2014, after Dear moved from South Carolina to Hartsel, Colorado. Following the move, Dear visited a DMV office in El Paso County to transfer his driver’s license, Chief Deputy Clerk and Recorder Ryan Parsell told BuzzFeed News. Whoever filled out Dear’s driver’s license form mistakenly checked the box identifying him as female, rather than male. The form was then given back to Dear to verify, but he apparently didn’t catch the mistake and signed off on the form, Parsell added.
On Oct. 30, 2014, Dear visited a DMV office in Salida, Colorado, and corrected the mistake on his driver’s license.

 

 
 
More from link.
 
The man charged with killing three people at a Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado Springs, Colorado, has targeted the agency before, his ex-wife said Tuesday.
 
Robert Lewis Dear, 57, could face the death penalty if he's convicted in Friday's attack, in which a police officer and two civilians were killed during a siege lasting five hours. Law enforcement officials told NBC News that after he was arrested, Dear talked about "no more baby parts" in reference to Planned Parenthood.
 
Dear appears to have been opposed to the reproductive health agency for decades. Barbara Mescher Michaux, who was married to Dear from 1985 to 1993, said Tuesday that Dear once put glue in the locks of a Planned Parenthood clinic near where they were living at the time — and "that was over 20 years ago when he did that," she said.
 
Mescher Michaux, who lives in South Carolina with her current husband, said Tuesday she was convinced that Dear specifically targeted the Colorado clinic last week.
 
"For him to plan this and go there, he meant to go there," she said. "There is no doubt in my mind."

 

 
 
More from link.
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Elessar78

Elessar78

Posted
Posted

So a genetically distinct bundle of cells is human, according to TWA. Cancer is genetically distinct from its host. Perhaps we should let it be? Is surgical removal of a tumor an abortion? So is a molar pregnancy. So is an ectopic pregnancy.

These are absurd examples (of course) to point out the obvious fact that nothing is as simple as TWA makes it out to be.

Dog is right on.

 

They care about it before it takes it's first breath, but as they get older and less cute they care less and less about it. 

 

Before it's born, it's everyone's problem. After—you're on your own, kid. No preschool, no child care, no maternity/paternity leave, no health care, no nutrition programs, no education if we can help it. 

 

We want you to be born, but we don't want to raise you. 

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skinsmarydu

skinsmarydu

Posted
Posted

They care about it before it takes it's first breath, but as they get older and less cute they care less and less about it. 

 

Before it's born, it's everyone's problem. After—you're on your own, kid. No preschool, no child care, no maternity/paternity leave, no health care, no nutrition programs, no education if we can help it. 

 

We want you to be born, but we don't want to raise you. 

And the second you turn 17, we'll be all over your high school, that taught you nothing, trying to recruit you.  Don't forget that part.

At least here, that's what I know.  Teachers are babysitters for the ones that get Mustangs for their 16th birthday, and police for those that don't.

One of my best friends is a teacher at a local high school, and never answers my questions about "how's it going with the job?"  She never says a word.  That means, to me, that she wishes she was waiting tables again.

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Major Harris

Major Harris

Posted
Posted

They care about it before it takes it's first breath, but as they get older and less cute they care less and less about it. 

 

Before it's born, it's everyone's problem. After—you're on your own, kid. No preschool, no child care, no maternity/paternity leave, no health care, no nutrition programs, no education if we can help it. 

 

We want you to be born, but we don't want to raise you. 

 

 

bs, this thread went this route yesterday, read back thru.

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skinsmarydu

skinsmarydu

Posted
Posted

killing them is really doing them a favor....and environmentally friendly.

 

 

we can even recycle now

I'm looking for that George Carlin bit...on why we have cemeteries.  RECYCLE, NOW!///...it was about 25 years ago, so I might be mingling things, but either way, the man was a genius on stupid. :wub:

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Elessar78

Elessar78

Posted
Posted

Agreed. Like I mentioned earlier, alot of people were super quick to jump in and fix the refugee process that by all accounts, wasn't broken. Here were are again talking about another person going on a killing spree with a gun and still no action by lawmakers. I'm not convinced anything will come of this. If the lawmakers weren't willing to act after Sandy Hook, there's not much that will change their minds now.

 

I think term limits would've allowed lawmakers to act on their conscience after Sandy Hook. At least I'm optimistic they would have. 

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No Excuses

No Excuses

Posted
Posted

I must've missed the lecture on the science being quoted by twa during my bachelors and PhD classes in Biology. Or perhaps these are not entirely questions of Biology but of Philosophy.  :)

 

Can't argue the science so go after the poster..... :D

 

It's difficult to argue against made up science for sure.

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