Califan007 The Constipated Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 After years of your RG3 bent, I am little concerned with your logic. I don't even know what that means lol... Trotting out a QB, who you hope is your future, with no real contract extension was foolish, when he could have been extended for peanuts, and then released if he failed. Instead the Skins are behind the 8 ball and the bidding will be 9 figures. Give one good reason why Cousins would have signed for "peanuts" with the Redskins when he could have just bided his time and hit the free agency market first? Give one good reason why Cousins' agent wouldn't have seriously advised him to do just that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsailand Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Give one good reason why Cousins would have signed for "peanuts" with the Redskins when he could have just bided his time and hit the free agency market first? Give one good reason why Cousins' agent wouldn't have seriously advised him to do just that? I think he means we could have offered him $35M over three years in October or early November and he would have jumped on it. Maybe. Note: It's sad that some Redskins fans are still sticking to the narrative that Kirk was awful in 2014. He was not. He was average to mediocre, depending on what metrics you judge him by. These fans are too focused on his INTs, and ignore the yards he was racking up. They also ignore the fact that he had only started four games before that season, and that we had no offensive line and no defense and no special teams so he was trying to do everything on his own. The best thing for the Redskins in 2014 would have been to start Kirk for all 15 games after the injury, tell him to dial it back some, don't try to force things, and continue to develop him. We would still have been a bad team, but we could maybe have gotten to six wins. Kirk would have been about a half season ahead in his development, and most importantly, we could have extended him in that offseason in a very team friendly deal. Unfortunately, Dan and Bruce would never have allowed Jay to start Kirk 15 games in 2014, because Jay was brought here to develop a different, inferior, QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I think he means we could have offered him $35M over three years in October or early November and he would have jumped on it. Maybe. He said "before last season" and put "BEFORE" in all-caps lol...so I doubt he meant October or November. Note: It's sad that some Redskins fans are still sticking to the narrative that Kirk was awful in 2014. He was not. He was average to mediocre, depending on what metrics you judge him by. That's not much better lol...but I think those who start to go towards describing him as "awful" are talking about how he seemed to have a defeatist demeanor and attitude to him too often when things started going bad, which at times lead to things going even worse. I don't think it was based simply on looking at game stats. These fans are too focused on his INTs, and ignore the yards he was racking up. They also ignore the fact that he had only started four games before that season, and that we had no offensive line and no defense and no special teams so he was trying to do everything on his own. Trying to do it "all on his own" is not the sign of a good QB. One reason Colt McCoy started getting supporters among both the fans and players is because he understood how to manage the game instead of trying to do it all on his own--and something I've said numerous times, being a "game manager" is not some horrid indictment on a QB. Cousins came to manage the game much better last year and stopped trying to do it all by himself...when he was on a roll I called him a "top notch point guard"--he called himself a "distributor" and often said he knew he didn't have to do it "all on his own". Is it because the roster was suddenly a million times better? No. The best QBs are great game managers. romoSUCKS for the longest time couldn't manage a game to save his life, but boy, he had himself some dynamic plays and lots of yards in those losses, didn't he? lol...He also had more than his share of momentum-sapping and game-losing INTs. The best thing for the Redskins in 2014 would have been to start Kirk for all 15 games after the injury, tell him to dial it back some, don't try to force things, and continue to develop him. We would still have been a bad team, but we could maybe have gotten to six wins. Kirk would have been about a half season ahead in his development, and most importantly, we could have extended him in that offseason in a very team friendly deal. Or lol... The worst thing for the Redskins in 2014 would have been to start Kirk for 15 games after Griffin's injury and have him not show any real improvement. Had that happened--and there is a VERY real possibility that it could have--they would have gone into the offseason even more entrenched in trying to get Griffin back on the field, and Dan undoubtedly pissed that the player who they mortgaged the future for and who set the league on fire a year and a half earlier purposefully had his development stunted for his backup who didn't (or couldn't) prove to be any more effective. Not to mention it would have caused more unnecessary drama if Cousins is looking "average to mediocre" at best while a healthy Griffin (who they invested so much in) sits on the bench--you really think players would have remained silent in that scenario? Leaks galore to the press. Could very well be that being demoted to 3rd string played a roll in Cousins' internal development, and THAT helped calmed him down for 2015. Because I'm positive the coaching staff told Kirk to "dial it back some, don't try to force things" in 2014...didn't seem to help, though. I mean, he got benched in the middle of the Titans game during a bad season. That wasn't Snyder calling Gruden on the sideline telling him to yank him lol...I imagine Gruden became incredibly frustrated seeing the same issues surface with Cousins, just as he became frustrated with Griffin when he saw his issues continuing. And to top it off, we would have had a lower draft pick for our troubles lol... Unfortunately, Dan and Bruce would never have allowed Jay to start Kirk 15 games in 2014, because Jay was brought here to develop a different, inferior, QB. Yet they benched Griffin for Colt stinkin' McCoy?...A few links missing in your chain of logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Some fans should not concern themselves with contracts and the "business" side of the game. Just watch, enjoy the plays, but as far as the money is concerned most fans know very little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Cousins was going into a contract year and the Skins would have been wise to lock him for 3 years (2015-2017), and could have done it for around 10-15m, most of which could have been team friendly. Cousins would have jumped at it. But they couldn't because they were still intent on trying to make RG3 work. They missed the window and now they are stuck. It could end up being the last of the horrible effects from the RG3 debacle. Unless Cousins leaves after 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 If he already asked for a lot more than top 10-12 this offseason, how much more do you think he is going to ask for if he has another great year? He's clearly going to ask for a bazilion jillion dollars and we won't be able to afford that! But someone else surely will! Woe is us! It's too bad that contracts aren't determined by what other players are making and their performances/accomplishments. That would give the team a workable range. For example if Kirk did good he could be paid similar to top 10, if he had a Pro Bowl year he could be paid top 5, and if he took the team to the Superbowl then he could paid like Luck. All of those options the team could afford because the numbers are within a workable range. But no, that's not how things work. Players can just ask for crazy amounts of money, way beyond what anyone else is making and that's that, and there will always be some team to come along and pay that crazy amount. That's why the top paid player at a position always jumps up by tens of millions of dollars. Man we are so screwed! Now, for those who understand how things work. If Kirk asked for $22 million a year (assuming a 35-40% guarantee) that would have been way too high. The assumption is he asked for $20 but we don't know. But if he asked for $22 then it can only go up as high as $2 million more to Luck at $24, and for Kirk to become the top paid QB AND top paid in the NFL, yeah that's going to take a Superbowl. http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/ Kirk repeats 2nd good season, he likely gets paid like Roethlisberger. $21.85 per, $34 guaranteed. Kirk has a Pro-Bowl year, gets us a playoff win, likely paid like Rodgers. $22 per, $50 guaranteed (a bit less than Rodgers guarantee) Kirk takes us to Superbowl, then he gets Luck money. $24 per, $47-50 guaranteed On a yearly basis, that is not a huge difference. Scott is very shrewd in his decisions. When you actually look at the range of the top paid guys and reasonably determine where Kirk can hit based on various performance scenarios, you see his contract's potential escalation isn't not gargantuan. The difference between Roethlisberger and Luck money is $2.15 million per year and $16 million guaranteed. The base is minimal, the guaranteed is a loss of 1 good player, though the cap does increase and several players leaving clears that space up too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 STOP WITH THE WE WON'T BE ABLE TO AFFORD KC NONSENSE. There is no way we let KC walk if he plays well. NO WAY. The cap keeps going up. Something Scott has consistently mentioned in interviews. He knows the only thing he is risking right now is Snyder's dollars. With a large percentage of players on rookie deals in today's NFL, and with the cap going up, Scott knows you could pay KC elite QB money and still build the team he wants around him. Cap hell, cap troubles in general, are pretty damn hard to get into now. You hear otherwise because the owners want salaries to stay down. Skins just want to see a larger sample size. If KC balls out, they will pay him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Cousins was going into a contract year and the Skins would have been wise to lock him for 3 years (2015-2017), and could have done it for around 10-15m, most of which could have been team friendly. Cousins would have jumped at it. But they couldn't because they were still intent on trying to make RG3 work. They missed the window and now they are stuck. It could end up being the last of the horrible effects from the RG3 debacle. Unless Cousins leaves after 2017. What? lol... If you are comfortable giving Cousins $15 mil a year after how he played in 2013 and 2014, then you should be more than fine giving him $25+ mil a year after seeing how he played in 2015 and 2016 (assuming he's just as good if not better next year). As well as, according to your scenario the Skins could have paid Cousins $15 mil/year for 3 years--or $45 mil--and he'd be a free agent in 2018. In comparison, by franchising Cousins we would be paying him $1 mil for 2015, $20 mil this year and $23 mil next year--or $44 mil--and he'd still be a free agent in 2018 lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBass1724 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Some fans should not concern themselves with contracts and the "business" side of the game. Just watch, enjoy the plays, but as far as the money is concerned most fans know very little. Quoted for emphasis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Cousins was going into a contract year and the Skins would have been wise to lock him for 3 years (2015-2017), and could have done it for around 10-15m, most of which could have been team friendly. Cousins would have jumped at it. But they couldn't because they were still intent on trying to make RG3 work. They missed the window and now they are stuck. It could end up being the last of the horrible effects from the RG3 debacle. Unless Cousins leaves after 2017. Read my post above. Now read it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickyJ Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Read my post above. Now read it again. But I need something to be angry about! DeSean is at camp, we don't have QB controversy, and we aren't going to sign Greg Hardy! We don't even have a single malcontent on the roster. This is unacceptable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veryoldschool Posted July 31, 2016 Author Share Posted July 31, 2016 Enough with the contract talk, really enough. Let's enjoy the preseason! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsailand Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Enough with the contract talk, really enough. Let's enjoy the preseason! We are going to be talking contract all season. Especially on Mondays. The more extreme the previous day's result, the more extreme the discussion. Constant hot takes, including from you and from me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJD2 Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 We are going to be talking contract all season. Especially on Mondays. The more extreme the previous day's result, the more extreme the discussion. Constant hot takes, including from you and from me. I have it on good authority however that it won't be a distraction at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedBeast Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 I like good food so sometimes it is steak and other nights it's hamburger. Its a budget. We are fortunate we have the right owner and management team in place to manage it. It will all get worked out. In a few years? QBs will be more expensive and KC will be middle of the pack. The cap aint going down. Everyone is playing with Monopoly (Dans) money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 I can really feel the love in here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 I have it on good authority however that it won't be a distraction at all. Not for the team, no. But it will be a huge "distraction" for the fans. But then we, as a group, are incredibly ****ing dumb and easily distracted. So that's not a surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Not for the team, no. But it will be a huge "distraction" for the fans. But then we, as a group, are incredibly ****ing dumb and easily distracted. So that's not a surprise.Even if we weren't, the media will make sure we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsailand Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 "If you thought Kirk Cousins was corny before, look at this"https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2016/08/01/if-you-thought-kirk-cousins-was-corny-before-look-at-this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 This city has been kicked in the balls so many times at QB that we are literally trying to create issues that probably aren't even there. Just heard a theory on 980 that says that Scott is hoping that Kirk is either great (so he can trade him for 2nd round picks) or sucks (so he can just cut him and look like a genius) this year. Yeah **** the fact that we play in a league nearly completely driven by QB play, right? That is the most illogical pile of horse **** I've heard since 10 was here. Our fans/media are the ****ing worst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 This city has been kicked in the balls so many times at QB that we are literally trying to create issues that probably aren't even there. Just heard a theory on 980 that says that Scott is hoping that Kirk is either great (so he can trade him for 2nd round picks) or sucks (so he can just cut him and look like a genius) this year. Yeah **** the fact that we play in a league nearly completely driven by QB play, right? That is the most illogical pile of horse **** I've heard since 10 was here. Our fans/media are the ****ing worst Whose theory was that? Loverro? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 This city has been kicked in the balls so many times at QB that we are literally trying to create issues that probably aren't even there. Just heard a theory on 980 that says that Scott is hoping that Kirk is either great (so he can trade him for 2nd round picks) or sucks (so he can just cut him and look like a genius) this year. Yeah **** the fact that we play in a league nearly completely driven by QB play, right? That is the most illogical pile of horse **** I've heard since 10 was here. Our fans/media are the ****ing worst The media is so desperate for something to write about, they are now just making **** up, yes even worse than before. These conspiracy theories - all of them - are just plain total and complete bull****! Snyder hates Cousins so he will not pay him. Scot M. actually wants his own QB so he is sabotaging the contract - Jay actually likes Colt McCoy (not sure I have seen this one in print but I am sure someone idiot is thinking it). There was zero reason fro the team of Kirk to agree to a long term deal this year! The benefits of not getting a contract done far outweighed the reasons for getting a long term contract. It was a smart football move and a smart business move. People really need to just let the season play out! Otherwise they will miss what looks to be a really kool season whining and complaining and trying to make **** up that does not exist! Ok, rant over ---- for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Whose theory was that? Loverro? A guy emailed it to Czaban and they spent 30 minutes discussing it. Loverro basically thinks it is all Snyder (because he still loves 10) and that Kirk secretly hates the Skins and is counting the days until he can leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 A guy emailed it to Czaban and they spent 30 minutes discussing it. Loverro basically thinks it is all Snyder (because he still loves 10) and that Kirk secretly hates the Skins and is counting the days until he can leave. I do think Kirk has/had some disdain for Dan, and that's understandable. But I think Dan has done a good job trying to kiss his ass this offseason. As for emails... bare with it for two more weeks or less. We have the HOF game this weekend and it couldn't come soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 A guy emailed it to Czaban and they spent 30 minutes discussing it. Loverro basically thinks it is all Snyder (because he still loves 10) and that Kirk secretly hates the Skins and is counting the days until he can leave. That sounds like Loverro. Always trying to find the conspiracy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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