The Gun Control Debate Thread

[Larry]

8 hours ago, mistertim said:

I think one of the issues here is how do you define "assault guns"?

 

Any AR platform (AR actually stands for Armalite, the first manufacturer of the platform, not Assault Rifle)? Any semi-auto rifle? Any rifle? Just high cap magazines? Too often people throw out the assault weapon tag without actually being able to define what they mean by it.

My proposal is "any semiauto weapon with a changeable magazine". 
 

Now, I have to admit. I'm aware that wording like that, would ban most semiauto pistols. And I would feel kinda bad if that happened. Among other reasons, because I've long thought that if I ever buy a gun, that's what it would be. 
 

But on the other hand, I'm not sure how you allow people to own, say, the M1911. But not say, a semiauto version of the Uzi. (I assume they exist). 

[GoCommiesGo]

After thinking about this, I don't think you will ever see an outright ban on a specific type of firearm. But, you can make the process of ownership more structured. 

 

1) 28 Day waiting period for all types of firearms

2) Require a safety class be taken prior to purchase, class completed through a local sheriff / police office 

3) Background check for all types of firearms with the ability to do live interviews if the a flag is thrown somewhere 

 

It doesn't restrict ownership of weapons but it does make the individual interact with other people during the process in a live setting and reduces the ability to same day purchase and use. I used to deer hunt when I was younger, I vividly remember having to take the hunters safety course to get my license. The fact that I could go down and buy a shotgun or rifle today and walk out with it is kind of crazy.  I live in Maryland. 

 

Quote

Purchasing a Long Gun

To purchase a long gun, you need a Government Issued photo ID. We can sell long guns to Maryland residents and residents of the following states: Pennsylvania, Delaware, Virginia & West Virginia. If your government issued photo ID does not have your current address on it, we will require a document issued by a state or government agency showing your current address.

 Purchasing a long gun requires simple background check. In most cases you can take your firearm home the same day.

 

In theory I could take my government issue PIV card, and my pay stub down to the store and they would give me a gun after running a simple background check. I don't even need to bring my drivers license. 

[ixcuincle]

 

[TheGreatBuzz]

3 hours ago, Larry said:

My proposal is "any semiauto weapon with a changeable magazine". 
 

Now, I have to admit. I'm aware that wording like that, would ban most semiauto pistols. And I would feel kinda bad if that happened. Among other reasons, because I've long thought that if I ever buy a gun, that's what it would be. 
 

But on the other hand, I'm not sure how you allow people to own, say, the M1911. But not say, a semiauto version of the Uzi. (I assume they exist). 

 

One thing they could do is update the legal definition of a pistol.  Under current law, this is technically a pistol:

 

 

[tshile]

I wonder if you can appease second amendment concerned by only requiring insurance for semiautomatic weapons. Pump/bolt/revolver? No need for insurance. 
 

we do that with FFL’s and things like machine guns and grenade launchers and other “more dangerous” weapons. So it’s not like there isn’t a precedent for applying different requirements to different things. 

And I wonder by sheer virtue of people owning guns they don’t really need or want outside of one day on a whim deciding they’re gonna buy that one cause it’s neat and they don’t have one like it, and the fact that people hate paying insurance, if you’d see a massive change in %’s of certain classes of weapons in homes. 
 

like maybe pump/bolt/revolver would take the lead cause they don’t require insurance. 
 

Which means you’ve drastically changed the makeup of the class of weapons floating around the country. Could help. 

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

4 hours ago, Larry said:

My proposal is "any semiauto weapon with a changeable magazine". 
 

Now, I have to admit. I'm aware that wording like that, would ban most semiauto pistols. And I would feel kinda bad if that happened. Among other reasons, because I've long thought that if I ever buy a gun, that's what it would be. 
 

But on the other hand, I'm not sure how you allow people to own, say, the M1911. But not say, a semiauto version of the Uzi. (I assume they exist). 

 

My Colt 45 1911 holds 8+1, a semi-automatic uzi pistol (this is how the classify them) has a 20-25 round magazine.  Big difference.  And no, my handgun should not be banned.

 

4 minutes ago, tshile said:

I wonder if you can appease second amendment concerned by only requiring insurance for semiautomatic weapons. Pump/bolt/revolver? No need for insurance. 
 

we do that with FFL’s and things like machine guns and grenade launchers and other “more dangerous” weapons. So it’s not like there isn’t a precedent for applying different requirements to different things. 

And I wonder by sheer virtue of people owning guns they don’t really need or want outside of one day on a whim deciding they’re gonna buy that one cause it’s neat and they don’t have one like it, and the fact that people hate paying insurance, if you’d see a massive change in %’s of certain classes of weapons in homes. 
 

like maybe pump/bolt/revolver would take the lead cause they don’t require insurance. 
 

Which means you’ve drastically changed the makeup of the class of weapons floating around the country. Could help. 

 

I (and anyone else) absolutely should not have to pay insurance for owning a semi-automatic handgun.  

[tshile]

27 minutes ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

I (and anyone else) absolutely should not have to pay insurance for owning a semi-automatic handgun.  

Well sure, you’re allowed to have your own opinion. 
 

doesn’t mean that’s the way it will or should be. 
 

Price of freedom, right?

[Llevron]

3 hours ago, ixcuincle said:

 

Wow

 

isnt this the same guy that was telling Green to shut up and dribble a few weeks ago? So surprised to hear this from him. 

20 minutes ago, tshile said:

Price of freedom, right?

 Indeed. 

[CjSuAvE22]

On 5/25/2022 at 3:21 PM, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

 

 

They serve a purpose, whether you disagree with that purpose or not.  As I pointed out to Renegade, federal law requires background checks for all firearms sold at a gun dealer.  The gun show/online sales loophole needs to be addressed.

The only thing these items serve os death Whatever need you mentioned for these weapons a small handgun can suffice, We don’t need to compensate for smaller size appendages with large size guns they are doing more harm than good right now.

[Dan T.]

Warren Burger, a GOP nominated Supreme Court Justice, talks about the massive fraud around the 2nd Amendment:

 

 

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

25 minutes ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

The only thing these items serve os death Whatever need you mentioned for these weapons a small handgun can suffice, We don’t need to compensate for smaller size appendages with large size guns they are doing more harm than good right now.

 

Ah, the good ole "small dick people own big guns to compensate" labeling.  I was merely pointing out that they are useful, if not more useful for home defense depending on the individuals situation and how their living space is set-up.  For me, my 12 gauge was great when I lived in an apartment and it was the only gun I owned when we built our house in our current neighborhood and moved in.

 

Once my daughter was around 2 years old, the shotgun went into a gun safe.  My assault rifles have trigger locks on them and are also in a gun safe.  The ammo for all my shotguns and rifles is stored in a separate location.  My wife's handgun is stored in a small biometric gun safe beside her side of the bed.  Two of my handguns are stored in a biometric gun safe on my side of the bed.  Right now, our handguns are being used for home protection, not any shotguns or rifles.

 

I was not trying to discredit you saying that handguns can't suffice in home protection, just pointing out that assault rifles are very viable and in some circumstances a better option than a shotgun or handgun.  Where I live, it's a cookie cutter neighborhood, houses are very close together.  A .223/5.56 caliber assault rifle is not a good choice because there is a really good chance that when fired, depending on the angle, it would would penetrate my walls and the neighbors walls and put them at risk of injury/death.  

 

If I lived out in the country (which we have 7.5 acres we are going to build a house on when we retire), without any neighbors close by at all, that's a different story, as it would also serve another purpose, coyotes and other vermin.  

Edited May 27, 2022 by Dont Taze Me Bro

[spjunkies]

 

 

[bcl05]

 

[Ball Security]

When you lose Lee Greenwood to the cause…

[Ball Security]

16 minutes ago, bcl05 said:

 

I watched a cashier with limited mental capabilities handcuffed and perp walked out of a Wal-Mart for selling beer to an underage informant for the VA ABC.

 

What happens to the dildos that sell guns to the underage?

[Dan T.]

 

[Redskins Diehard]

10 hours ago, Larry said:

 

Now, I have to admit. I'm aware that wording like that, would ban most semiauto pistols. And I would feel kinda bad if that happened. Among other reasons, because I've long thought that if I ever buy a gun, that's what it would be. 

This can be addressed through muzzle velocity and barrel length. 

 

Handgun regulations should be revisited also.  But to regulate the weapons commonly used in these situations it's muzzle velocity and external magazines. That's how you differentiate between a traditional hunting rifle, a handgun, and the weapons used in these crimes. 

 

Nobody under age 21 and require a FFL stamp. (In addition to background checks) 

[China]

Woman fatally shoots man who fired rifle into crowd during party in West Virginia

 

A woman fatally shot a man who was firing an AR-15-style rifle into a crowd of people that had gathered for a party in West Virginia, authorities said.

 

According to a news release from the Charleston Police Department, Dennis Butler, 37, of Charleston, was found at around 10:45 p.m. EDT Wednesday with multiple gunshot wounds, WSAZ-TV reported.

 

Butler was killed after he took out the rifle and began shooting at people attending a birthday-graduation party in Charleston, according to The Associated Press.

 

 

Click on the link for the full article

[mistertim]

5 hours ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

 

Ah, the good ole "small dick people own big guns to compensate" labeling.  I was merely pointing out that they are useful, if not more useful for home defense depending on the individuals situation and how their living space is set-up.  For me, my 12 gauge was great when I lived in an apartment and it was the only gun I owned when we built our house in our current neighborhood and moved in.

 

Once my daughter was around 2 years old, the shotgun went into a gun safe.  My assault rifles have trigger locks on them and are also in a gun safe.  The ammo for all my shotguns and rifles is stored in a separate location.  My wife's handgun is stored in a small biometric gun safe beside her side of the bed.  Two of my handguns are stored in a biometric gun safe on my side of the bed.  Right now, our handguns are being used for home protection, not any shotguns or rifles.

 

I was not trying to discredit you saying that handguns can't suffice in home protection, just pointing out that assault rifles are very viable and in some circumstances a better option than a shotgun or handgun.  Where I live, it's a cookie cutter neighborhood, houses are very close together.  A .223/5.56 caliber assault rifle is not a good choice because there is a really good chance that when fired, depending on the angle, it would would penetrate my walls and the neighbors walls and put them at risk of injury/death.  

 

If I lived out in the country (which we have 7.5 acres we are going to build a house on when we retire), without any neighbors close by at all, that's a different story, as it would also serve another purpose, coyotes and other vermin.  

 

I can't imagine using a rifle for home protection, unless maybe it was a SBR and I was shooting subsonic rounds. I've owned rifles, shotguns, and pistols and I really never even considered a rifle as anything more than something that was fun to shoot at the range. For coyotes and other vermin, do you really need an AR with a 30 round magazine? That's more .22 LR bolt action territory.

[Redskins Diehard]

24 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I can't imagine using a rifle for home protection, unless maybe it was a SBR and I was shooting subsonic rounds. I've owned rifles, shotguns, and pistols and I really never even considered a rifle as anything more than something that was fun to shoot at the range. For coyotes and other vermin, do you really need an AR with a 30 round magazine? That's more .22 LR bolt action territory.

I'm with you. If you're defending your home out beyond about 20 yards I'm not sure how much actual "defense" is going on at that point. 

 

Good old shotgun is probably best for defense.  Much more forgiving in limited visibility and high stress as far as accuracy is concerned. Also not nearly the concern for rounds traveling through walls etc. 

[Dont Taze Me Bro]

51 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I can't imagine using a rifle for home protection, unless maybe it was a SBR and I was shooting subsonic rounds. I've owned rifles, shotguns, and pistols and I really never even considered a rifle as anything more than something that was fun to shoot at the range. For coyotes and other vermin, do you really need an AR with a 30 round magazine? That's more .22 LR bolt action territory.

Might as well.  I have a .22LR caliber assault rifle.  I’d most likely use that tbh.  

[TheGreatBuzz]

3 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

I can't imagine using a rifle for home protection, unless maybe it was a SBR and I was shooting subsonic rounds. I've owned rifles, shotguns, and pistols and I really never even considered a rifle as anything more than something that was fun to shoot at the range. For coyotes and other vermin, do you really need an AR with a 30 round magazine? That's more .22 LR bolt action territory.

 

.22 on a coyote is cruel.

[mistertim]

3 hours ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

 

.22 on a coyote is cruel.

 

Yeah for a coyote you'd want something bigger. I was mostly thinking about smaller varmints. But I think the bigger point is why would anyone need a 30 round mag for varmints or coyotes? 

[TheGreatBuzz]

47 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Yeah for a coyote you'd want something bigger. I was mostly thinking about smaller varmints. But I think the bigger point is why would anyone need a 30 round mag for varmints or coyotes? 

 

They're fast and you might need that many shots when you're that drunk.

[China]

Students nationwide walk out of classes to protest inaction on guns by government

 

Outraged by the inaction of lawmakers on gun violence, students across the country held walkouts on Thursday in the wake of a brutal massacre in Uvalde, Texas, where 19 children and two teachers were gunned down at an elementary school. 

 

From Meridian High School in Virginia to El Camino Real Charter High School in California, students across the country took part in walkouts to demand gun control measures, according to social media reports and local news outlets. 

 

Meanwhile in Rhode Island, students from several schools in Providence laid down for three minutes outside the Rhode Island State House, according to a tweet from state Sen. Tiara Mack (D). 

 

At Oxford High School in Michigan, over 100 students walked out of class on Thursday, the Detroit Free Press reported. The school was the site of its own deadly shooting on Nov. 30, where four students were killed. 

 

In Buffalo, Minn., students at Buffalo High School took part in another walkout on Thursday, WCCO, a local CBS affiliate, reported. 

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

Kids are still young, naive and not yet disillusioned