RandyHolt Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Part of being a kicker is not injuring yourself while kicking. If he cannot kickoff another week I want to see someone else tried. Hocker works for me. I know coaching changes are rare but I am not sure how much more worse our teams can get if a change is made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RemoveSnyder Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Too bad the FSU kicker is only a sophomore :-/ LOL Redshirt Soph, is eligible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 We gave up on Gano waaaay too soon. Swishy is another story. He had plenty of time to wet the bed and he did it a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter_R Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 We gave up on Gano waaaay too soon. Swishy is another story. He had plenty of time to wet the bed and he did it a lot.Gano: 36 games. 59/80 fg. 74%. Gave up on him too soon. Forbath: 27 games. 39/45 fg. 87%. Get that bum out of here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mastdark81 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 At the end of the day every year we are going to bring someone in to attempt to replace Forbath because he is not good on kickoffs. People underplay this importance but with our poor special teams coverage it is imperative that we have a guy to make touchbacks. Id rather have an iffy fg kicker on this team than a poor kickoff guy. This is 7 points we are giving up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurgeh Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Forbath isn't the problem on special teams, he's above average on FG accuracy. And so what if he can't consistently kick it into the endzone on kick-offs? The ball still shouldn't come back down the length of the field. Before the rule change teams would return kick-offs and you expected your ST to tackle them inside the 20, or at worst before the 30. It should be no different now. Many of the players we picked up over the offseason have good reputations as ST players built up over more than a few seasons. If the ST play is bad this year, it's down to the coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 The punt return for TD..... from what I saw it looked like Merriweather took a bad angle and got outside of his assigned lane. This could be due to lack of being able to practice with the ST unit. Anyone who watched the coaches show w/ Gruden saw that Cooley and Gruden were talking about special teamers being assigned lanes and if one person misses their assignment, a good returner will exploit it everytime. Im hoping its just lack of ST reps for Merriweather in the last month that caused this to happen. And forbath? God... maybe we can give a roster spot to the guy we cut in preseason for insurance? Meriweather shouldn't be doing returns. One thing about Danny Smith is that we had dedicated special teams guys. I don't know why Meri was in there, and I don't know how much the injuries are forcing our normal teams guys to play extra roles, but I'd like to see stuff like Morris said about the RBs - where if a player is winded, then we've got somebody else to go in there. And maybe we need something like Kotwica going up to the guys beforehand and reminding them of their responsibilities before each play (what are there like 15 a game?) Forbath isn't the problem on special teams, he's above average on FG accuracy. And so what if he can't consistently kick it into the endzone on kick-offs? The ball still shouldn't come back down the length of the field. Before the rule change teams would return kick-offs and you expected your ST to tackle them inside the 20, or at worst before the 30. It should be no different now. Many of the players we picked up over the offseason have good reputations as ST players built up over more than a few seasons. If the ST play is bad this year, it's down to the coaches. Part of me wonders how much of the problems with this year (and last year) are based on players (a) getting used to new coaches and ( getting used to a lot of different players at their side. Like, If I'm a guy who knows that Robinson is less likely to stay in his lane, then maybe I can just go to him and remind him beforehand and say, "hey, remember ...". But I wonder if its like an offensive line where the chemistry between the players matters more than we're giving credit for. Gano: 36 games. 59/80 fg. 74%. Gave up on him too soon. Forbath: 27 games. 39/45 fg. 87%. Get that bum out of here. Gano was a good kicker here and the problem with him was that it was getting blocked too much. I don't really blame Gano for that, particularly because we have that same problem with Forbath. People are saying that Forbath's kicks are too low like they said that about Gano's. Funny Carolina doesn't have that problem. I think the problem (as often as we say this) is our OL, even on teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I don't get why this is a mystery. Special teams players generally come from the mid to bottom half of your roster. And this is an organization that last put a priority on depth across the roster in the late 80s. For about ten years, I've argued that the Skins roster from 1 to 22 is typically in the top 10 in the league, but from 22 to 45, it is in the bottom five. This is not an accident; it's been an organizational philosophy. This is why everytime a LB gets a hangnail, we seem to go on a six-game losing streak. This may not be the case any longer, but I still think the bottom half of the roster is an issue. Hence, we have bad special teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefeweiss Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 A few thoughts on special teams. First off, I think that people are right that our special teams are not that good because we don't have a lot of quality depth. I hope this is starting to turn around, because it seems like the management is making this a higher priority, but for now we have to work with what we have. If we can't punt, can't cover punts, and can't make a field goal, why not go for it on fourth down? If we can't cover kick offs, why not try some surprise onsides kicks? If we do have to punt or try a field goal, why not do some fakes? There is pretty solid evidence that teams should go for it more than they do on fourth down. The main reason you don't see it is that coaches are risk averse. Most of the evidence says that you should go for it on fourth and one every time, unless you are backed up inside your own 20. Surprise onside kicks have several benefits. The first is that our team would be pretty likely to get the ball back, especially the first few times, from a surprise onside kick. Teams don't recover that many, but most onsides kicks happen at the end of the game when the other team is expecting it. The recovery rate is much better in situations, such as the opening kickoff, when the other team isn't looking for it. The next benefit is that once other teams start to think that you might do a surprise onsides kick, they have to account for it when they line up for every kick off. Having some hands team players close to the ball and moving guys up means that the other team isn't able to block as effectively for a return. The last benefit is that your team gets practice in recovering onsides kicks, which could come in handy at the end of the game. The benefits of fake punts and field goals are the same. It's tough for the other team to watch for the fake and try to block the kick at the same time. It's hard to watch for the fake and set up the return at the same time. You may occasionally convert one and hold on to the ball, although you have a better chance if you just go for it and run a normal play. I'm not really that familiar with how teams do returns and whether there are any kinds of tricks that a team can pull on a return, but I think that one of the questions to ask is not whether that play worked, but whether it set up the next play. That's how offense and defense work and I think that special teams can work the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Bay Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 I just don't get it: I'm reading some posts here that say we should keep Forbath. I disagree. We've never been able to get him to do kickoffs into the end zone (and he's not doing kickoffs at all now), and he can't kick field goals with accuracy (the main reason he's on this team) because he's injured. He's a liability! Was Zach Hocker more of a liability than this? I thought their play in the pre-season was about equal. I think Forbath has issues with leg strength, but I don't understand the philosophy of him not being accurate. He hit 18 in a row up until this past miss and he's got a career percentage of 86.7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roanoker Posted September 24, 2014 Share Posted September 24, 2014 Different year same old ****ty ST play. Geez, KOs, punts, extra points, etc, shouldn't have fans biting their fingernails. Excuses are just that, excuses. Grudes needs to kick ass and take names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morrison J Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Matt Prater cut by Denver. Just the guy we need. Massive boot on kick offs. Time to make a move? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemocystem Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Yeah...signing Matt Prater needs to happen MEOW! reality is...If he gets busted again (as Denver is so scurred about), I'm sure we can always sign Kai, or Hocker again! Amirite??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Maybe we are still recovering from Mike having no eye at all for special teams. Forbath's kickoffs does force us into more coverage duties than other teams. Other teams 10 guys on kickoffs could be worse than ours but we rarely see them forced to make tackles. So we don't even know. Kicker aside teams is largely just that, all about the team and thus the scheme. Eventually the finger needs to be pointed at coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Denver just didnt want to be stuck with his contract. I'd say grab him if Forbath has no hope of ever kicking into the end zone. It's already likely cost us a win this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bishop Hammer Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 This thread makes me wish John Potter had beatout Kai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I'm gonna call out Roberts as being less than average last couple weeks. Kickoff returns less than 20, not made single defender miss since I don't know when and the fair catch vs NY was about the only good setup for return I seem all season. This teams is horrific and not unreasonable to say it cost us definetely 1 game. Such a joke. With that, tress way should make pro bowl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinWill Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Yeah...signing Matt Prater needs to happen MEOW! reality is...If he gets busted again (as Denver is so scurred about), I'm sure we can always sign Kai, or Hocker again! Amirite??? This needs to be given serious consideration as Prater would solve our Kicker problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradboyd80 Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 When is he due back? I can't remember how long his suspension was. 4 games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinWill Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Next week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradboyd80 Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 In that case, yep; add me to the list of supporters. Get that guy in here right meow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinWill Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 This is a glaring problem and needs to be addressed ASAP. I'm tired of seeing line drive kicks to the corner of the end zone that will eventually go out of bounds and cost us field position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihateusernames Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 i would sign matt prater as soon as possible and send kai forbath packing. one signing can lift that entire special teams unit to respectibility because his kicks go out of the endzone. as a kicker, hes probably better than forbath too...kai, like the redskins in general, is not reliable in clutch situations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonez3 Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 Sometimes it's a castoff like this that anchors special teams for years. Seriously, How long has Suisham held it down for Pitt? Unless its injury related or psych, get prater here!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morrison J Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 If we're interested then I reckon we're facing some competition from the Lions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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