Michael Wilbon can KMA

[Henry]

I am missing the point. what does it matter if someone has the opinion that you have a great or not so great sports town? how does that affect anything in your daily lives? If Washington is not a great sports town, do your taxes go up? Or do you get free parking at FedEx if it is considered a great sports town?

What is a great sports town anyways? what does a great sports town have that Wilbon claims DC doesnt have that makes people so upset? Rather pointless, if you hate Wilbon then I guess you come here to vent, hope that makes you feel better.

The point isn't whether or not DC is a great sports town. Hell, I don't really care about the Nats, Wizards or Caps much at all. I'm happy to concede I'm no huge sports fan, and if Wilbon thinks a city full of guys like me makes DC a terrible sports town ... well, whatever.

The point is that Wilbon displayed a level of arrogance and disdain that was rude, cruel and not necessary. He made his name in this town and in return he stabs us in the back in an unsolicited attack. Maybe he's right about the level of our fandom. I don't know and I don't really care. It's a subjective thing and he didn't need to go there. I can only assume he did it to sound cool and ingratiate himself to his national audience at our expense.

Well, I hope it was worth it. Mike can look down his nose at someone else from now on. I have better things to do than value his opinion any longer.

[CrypticVillain]

Let me preface this by saying I DESPISE WILBON. Period.

I am a 2nd generational Skins season ticket holder since 1994 and a partial Nats season ticket holder and lifelong DC resident but I will say this....I think I agree with him. If you say DC is a good sports town because a lot of people here follow sports in general then yea sure its great. If you say its good because people of DC/DC area are really into the HOME TOWN TEAMS then no, its a joke of a sports town.

Being a Caps, Skins, Wiz and Nats fan would be the norm if this were Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston etc..... But I am in the minority in following all of the local teams. I'd say for every 1 of me there are 3 people who will be Caps yet Cowboys fans...Skins yet Yankees fans.....Nats yet Lakers fans.....etc....you get my drift. Perhaps all the losing by most every team recently has just killed the passion, and it is what it is....but whatever the reason....I am fine with what Wilbon said even though he died to me the day he crapped on Sean Taylor after he was murdered.

Tell me a city who doesn't have a multitude of people who doesn't root for the Cowboys, Yankees, Lakers(now Heat), Red Wings, Duke, etc... Ever city has that, it's not just the DC area. Shoot, even in Dallas, you have people that are Redskins fans. Some people like to go against the grain....

[Monte51Coleman]

So, Michael Wilbon takes himself too seriously? That's old news.

[Rocky21]

And Wilbon apologizes again: http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php/2012/10/05/mike-wilbon-apologizes-concedes-defeat-that-washington-dc-isnt-the-worst-sports-town/

The karma gods gave him a heart attack almost 2 months to the day that he talked **** about Sean taylor. Maybe he's skeeered.

[Mr. Sinister]

That was great. Wilbon just won't put down the shovel will he? Though Chicago guys are just so tough! lol

I find it ironic, that in that Deadspin piece, he was quoted as saying "As LT said, I like this kind of party." when pretty much everyone that watched a lick of NFL Films knows that it was Mike Singletary who said that.

Considering that he's supposedly a Chicago legend, who I'm sure probably loves to throw all of their historic sports teams in everyones faces, I thought that was pretty funny.

[I_Bleed_B&G]

Wilbon apologizes...

http://www.facebook.com/RealMichaelWilbon

I am quick to tell people in the sports industry when it is necessary to see the errors of their ways, and it's necessary this time to see the errors of mine and apologize for them. This started a few days ago with some comments made to ESPN The Magazine about the Washington, DC sports scene, in which I uttered the words "last" and "terrible" and no matter the context at the time the words were stupid and they offended a great many people in the community in which I've lived for more than 30 years. It was just a dumb thing to say, that I regret.

I've said publicly more than a few times lately that the nature of public discourse these days, especially in the areas of sports and politics, is meaner and dumber than ever…and then I engaged in the very kind of mean-spirited debate I've criticized and come to loathe. For that I owe an even deeper apology. A dear friend and colleague reminded me this morning that when your job is to speak publicly essentially every day of the year, as is the case for both of us, we're going to make assessments of the games and people who play/oversee them that will be flat-out wrong. An apology isn't a sign of weakness; it's the order of the day. And he's absolutely right about that. Instead, as is my way sometime, I dug in and freely engaged in something that should never have existed.

I'd never had any contentiousness with The Post's Dan Steinberg nor ESPN's Bram Weinstein before this. In fact, we've all enjoyed not just professional relationships but really good ones. To whatever extent those are damaged, I apologize.

Although I don’t agree with the things they said about me, their criticism of my comments to the Magazine are totally fair. They did what I’ve done for years and years as a columnist: they righteously skewered a public figure who said something dumb.

Let me be really clear about something: doing my job requires expressing opinions, and sometimes those opinions aren't going to be popular. I'm not in the public relations business. A person who writes a column or leads discussion is, necessarily, expected to be critical. And sometimes those criticisms sting. Backing down on every difficult or sensitive issue isn't acceptable. The challenge for me going forward is to recognize the line that cannot be crossed. I apologize to the people of greater Washington who have made the sports scene, particularly this summer with the success of the Nationals and the promise of RG3, an increasingly exciting place to be and consume sports.

While I'm figuring out how to bring a more civil tone to certain debates, I am going to step away from Twitter and Facebook for a while. If I can't learn how to completely ignore comments I find objectionable, maybe “a while” will have to turn into forever. Until then, I'll accept the heat and to quote my friend Tony Kornheiser, try and do better the next time…

[DCSaints_fan]

I was about to start a thread, but I might as well just continue it in here.

What makes a great sports town anyway? What is the criteria of being a great sports town. I have been in DC my whole life, this is all I know. That is why I quoted this. I don't know about these other cities, so it is really hard to compare my city to them. What makes New York, Chicago, Philly, and Boston so good? Honestly, I think it is just all media hype. It's no coincidence that those cities, along with LA, are considered great sports towns, THEY HAVE THE MOST MEDIA. But DC isn't anything to shake a stick at. So what makes these cities so much better than us?

Thees are the questions that needs to be answered.

I guess it comes down to fan support, and really how people/the local media react to when the team is doing poorly or falls short. Its easy to be called a sports town when the local team has a history of winning championships. But if the team isn't doing that well, thats when push comes to shove.

I would say Boston was a big baseball town, even before the Sox were winning championships. As evidenced how they ran Little out of town for basically one questionable manegerial decision.

Basically, if a city is really into a sport, then management has a relatively short lease to win or GTFO.

In D.C., its like this with the Redskins.

On the other hand, nobody seemed to care when the Caps were doing poorly, or losing in the playoffs. The media in D.C. seems pretty buddy-buddy with the Caps' ownership/management/coaches. Maybe I haven't been paying attention, but I haven't read one article calling for McPhee's job. And he's been pretty lackluster for the last 15 years.

[Bishop Hammer]

He's right, kind of, but you are right too SP. When the teams have been losing for so long, it's really hard to cheer for them. Let's take Cleveland for example, yeah they got the Browns and the dawg pound, but everybody cheers for their Football team. Nobody cares about the Cavs and the Indians when they are not winning. So yes, we do have a lot of transplants, but I just sat in traffic for an hour and a half after the Nats game yesterday. When your teams are losing nobody cars, but when those wins start rolling in, it is on.

Yeah. Laugh and the world laughs with you. When you cry you cry alone.

[spjunkies]

Well, I don't accept your apology Mr. Wilbon. you said what you said and you damn well meant every word of it. I don't wish you any ill will or anything, but I won't shed a tear if you never enter OUR city ever again!

[Kurd Cudins]

I am sorry Michael Wilbon, but I do not accept your apology. You are a racist POS and you hate the city that gave you everything you have. You would be NOTHING without Washington DC.

[zoony]

It's funny to me that Wilbon went there with Steinberg.

Wilbon states opinion, Steinberg questions his opinion, Wilbon insults Steinberg , Steinberg points out hypocrisy, and Wilbon attacks Steinberg for how he dressed at a funeral several years ago

Wilbon has lost his ****. I suspect there might be some mental illness

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

Wilbon has lost his ****. I suspect there might be some mental illness

happens to a lot of them. "good bye mama, good bye papa. Im going to do good, in hollywoooooooood. Hollywooooooooooooooooooooood."

[aszumilo]

And oh yeah, when watching Yankee highlights on ESPN I saw thousands of empty seats in their stadium.

You see empty seats at every stadium in the league, except for Philly, who had 100.8% attendance. You must have seen more empty seats at National's games. They averaged 13000 less a game than the Yankees (43,700 to 30,000). To be fair, their stadium holds 41,506 to the the Yankees 50,291. So on average, there would have been 11,000 empty seats per game to 7,000 empty seats for the Yankees. Even the Brewers averaged more fans per game with a similar sized stadium (41,900) and the Nationals are a tremendously better team. I think the Nationals have a very good shot at winning it all this year. I think it would do wonders for DC sports and maybe Wilbon will change his mind about the sports scene there.

I also live in a town of a transient population. Most people have their favorite teams, from where they came from and there is no chance of changing it. If any of the teams, college or minor league, we have here, win, the fans show up. Lose and they don't. Simple fact of life in cities like DC or Vegas. Don't read to much into what Wilbon said.

Here are the 2012 attendance for all teams.

RK TEAM GMS TOTAL AVG PCT GMS AVG PCT GMS AVG PCT

1 Philadelphia 81 3,565,718 44,021 100.8 81 31,749 72.8 162 37,885 86.9

2 NY Yankees 81 3,542,406 43,733 87.0 81 34,154 82.0 162 38,943 84.7

3 Texas 81 3,460,280 42,719 86.9 80 28,209 66.7 161 35,509 77.6

4 San Francisco 81 3,377,371 41,695 99.5 80 32,889 72.4 161 37,320 85.5

5 LA Dodgers 81 3,324,246 41,040 73.3 80 32,640 74.4 161 36,866 73.8

6 St. Louis 81 3,262,109 40,272 91.6 81 31,436 72.7 162 35,854 82.2

7 LA Angels 81 3,061,770 37,799 83.3 81 30,831 70.2 162 34,315 76.8

8 Boston 81 3,043,003 37,567 101.4 81 31,038 71.8 162 34,303 85.5

9 Detroit 81 3,028,033 37,383 90.6 81 30,539 73.5 162 33,961 82.0

10 Chicago Cubs 81 2,882,756 35,589 86.5 81 32,485 75.2 162 34,037 80.7

11 Milwaukee 81 2,831,385 34,955 83.4 81 30,580 71.3 162 32,767 77.3

12 Minnesota 81 2,776,354 34,275 86.8 80 28,306 66.5 161 31,309 76.3

13 Colorado 81 2,630,458 32,474 64.3 80 32,301 72.0 161 32,388 67.9

14 Washington 79 2,370,794 30,010 72.3 81 33,116 75.6 160 31,582 74.0

15 Atlanta 81 2,420,171 29,878 60.1 81 31,936 75.2 162 30,907 67.0

16 Cincinnati 81 2,347,251 28,978 68.5 81 30,784 71.5 162 29,881 70.0

17 NY Mets 80 2,242,803 28,035 67.1 81 33,720 76.6 161 30,895 72.0

18 Miami 81 2,219,444 27,400 73.2 80 30,986 70.9 161 29,182 71.9

19 Arizona 81 2,177,617 26,884 55.3 81 32,292 72.2 162 29,588 63.4

20 Baltimore 79 2,102,240 26,610 58.6 81 29,549 68.6 160 28,098 63.5

21 San Diego 81 2,123,721 26,218 61.4 81 31,422 69.4 162 28,820 65.5

22 Pittsburgh 80 2,091,918 26,148 68.2 81 31,307 71.7 161 28,744 70.1

23 Toronto 81 2,099,663 25,921 52.6 80 29,075 69.8 161 27,488 60.4

24 Chicago White Sox 81 1,965,955 24,271 59.8 81 29,983 69.7 162 27,127 64.9

25 Kansas City 80 1,739,859 21,748 57.4 81 27,447 64.7 161 24,615 61.3

26 Seattle 81 1,721,920 21,258 44.4 81 28,262 67.0 162 24,760 55.0

27 Oakland 81 1,679,013 20,728 60.6 81 29,978 68.0 162 25,353 64.8

28 Houston 81 1,607,733 19,848 48.5 81 31,119 72.1 162 25,483 60.6

29 Cleveland 81 1,603,596 19,797 45.6 81 28,285 68.2 162 24,041 56.6

30 Tampa Bay 81 1,559,681 19,255 56.5 81 30,403 69.2 162 24,829 63.6

[grego]

You see empty seats at every stadium in the league, except for Philly, who had 100.8% attendance.

thats weird. cuz their home sellout streak ended in early august. (when they were losing. hey, i'm seeing a relationship here between winning and showing up for games. wacky. thought that was only in DC. i digress.....)

[Skins4Life6388]

It's funny to me that Wilbon went there with Steinberg.

Wilbon states opinion, Steinberg questions his opinion, Wilbon insults Steinberg , Steinberg points out hypocrisy, and Wilbon attacks Steinberg for how he dressed at a funeral several years ago

Wilbon has lost his ****. I suspect there might be some mental illness

Steins **** on Wilbon. It was completely awesome.

[Destino]

It's funny to me that Wilbon went there with Steinberg.

Wilbon states opinion, Steinberg questions his opinion, Wilbon insults Steinberg , Steinberg points out hypocrisy, and Wilbon attacks Steinberg for how he dressed at a funeral several years ago

Wilbon has lost his ****. I suspect there might be some mental illness

[scruffylookin]

What I never understand when this subject comes up is why is the fact that there are transplants (carpetbaggers) in the DC area used as a slam on DC sports fans? It's our fault that we have douche bags who live here say oh 35 years and still call another place home and root for those teams? It's like blaming the US if there are people who refuse to assimilate and do not learn to read and write English.

Redskins attendance has always been strong and the other three teams have gotten good to very good attendance when good. And before people use the good attendance only when good against local fans, I remind people to look at Green Bay Packer games in the 70s and 80s then compare Lambeau to the last 20 years. Not only the numbers but also the passion. Look at New England. People talk about Boston being great. Well I remember 10000 or so fans showing up to Patriot games in the early 90s. I have the Skins/Patriots game from 1990 and there was nobody there and those who were there were rooting for the Redskins. The Redskins at their worst never got that bad in attendance. Yet Boston is better? Based on what metric? Football? No way. We got them beat. Baseball? Oh you mean comparing fandom of a 100 year old franchise vs an 8 year old one? Hockey? Again 100 years vs 40? Basketball? Easy to support the team when it's 17 banners to 1.

DC sports bashing is tiresome. Especially from carpet baggers.

[grego]

for anyone who hasnt seen the whole back and forth between steinberg, weinstein and wilbon, this wraps it up nicely.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/05/michael-wilbon-dan-steinberg-espn-dc-fans_n_1942866.html

this last gasp post by wilbon- the last one before he realized what an incredible, pompous ass he'd made of himself- really shows his true colors, and just spells out why people truly have disgust for him:

I've seen increasingly how impressed Dan Steinberg is with himself and his non-column. What I wonder is whether he's smart enough to know that when he takes a shot at Earvin Johnson flying to a celebrity roast at Landsdowne Steinberg also is belittling Don Graham's massive charitable crusade to raise millions of dollars for tuition of D.C. High school children. Don Graham, last I checked, is still Steinberg's boss…or does he think it's the other way around? And when Don asked me to co-host that golf tournament to raise those dollars, I was thrilled to do it. If Dan wants to match Earvin's donation to help a D.C. Kid pay college tuition, it would be welcome. Then again, it's fair to wonder about the judgement of someone who would show up looking like a slovenly bum at a memorial service for the late Mr. Abe Pollin. If you're going to wrap yourself in D.C. Sports patriotism, Dan, have the decency to come to a public service honoring the patriarch of D.C. Sports (while representing The Post, no less) in a professional manner. Then again, I'm sure you'll find some excuse for that, too. You and your tag-team partner, Bram Weinstein, seem to think I'm under some obligation to run my opinions past you, like you're my editors…or even qualified to be that. Anytime, anyplace you want to post and compare resumes or career highlights I'm more than happy to engage. Until then, I'll form my own opinions, popular or not, without seeking your permission.

btw- love how wilbon retreated and said he was misquoted when he said DC was "last" as a sports town. now he says he never said that. right.

epic.

[Warhead36]

What I never understand when this subject comes up is why is the fact that there are transplants (carpetbaggers) in the DC area used as a slam on DC sports fans? It's our fault that we have douche bags who live here say oh 35 years and still call another place home and root for those teams? It's like blaming the US if there are people who refuse to assimilate and do not learn to read and write English.

Redskins attendance has always been strong and the other three teams have gotten good to very good attendance when good. And before people use the good attendance only when good against local fans, I remind people to look at Green Bay Packer games in the 70s and 80s then compare Lambeau to the last 20 years. Not only the numbers but also the passion. Look at New England. People talk about Boston being great. Well I remember 10000 or so fans showing up to Patriot games in the early 90s. I have the Skins/Patriots game from 1990 and there was nobody there and those who were there were rooting for the Redskins. The Redskins at their worst never got that bad in attendance. Yet Boston is better? Based on what metric? Football? No way. We got them beat. Baseball? Oh you mean comparing fandom of a 100 year old franchise vs an 8 year old one? Hockey? Again 100 years vs 40? Basketball? Easy to support the team when it's 17 banners to 1.

DC sports bashing is tiresome. Especially from carpet baggers.

Yeah everyone praises Boston, but I remember a few years ago(pre KG trade)when Celtics fans were chanting MVP for Kobe Bryant, a Laker.

The cities that are "better" than us are only "better" because for the most part their franchises have more history of winning.

I actually think Cleveland is the best sports city in the country. Their passion level per success rate(or lack thereof)is higher then any city.

[isle-hawg]

Wilbon's sports universe centers around basketball despite the fact the NFL is the sport most are interested in USA. And DC is not a basketball town.

I can care less about pro basketball but from my (football) point of view, I agree with his comments. There are a ridiculous number of born and raised DC/MD/VA folks who root for the cow-pukes of all teams, WTF is up with that??? Not like you are seeing many folks born, raised and living in CLE rooting for the Steelers.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

Wilbon's sports universe centers around basketball despite the fact the NFL is the sport most are interested in USA.

no, Wilbon's universe revolves around stars. He actually made his mark at WaPo as the Redskins Beat reporter. he is indifferent towards any sport, but is instead just a star f-er

And DC is not a basketball town.

there is a greater and longer basketball history in this area. WCAC is one of the best HS leagues in America. Morgan Wooten is the only coach to make the basketball HOF without coaching higher than HS bball. The amount of basketball talent to come out of here is staggering. The summer leagues in this area attract top college, high school, and pro players without local ties.

I know the Caps are popular now because of winning, but Georgetown and UMD basketball are still ahead in importance. If UMD/Georgetown played again in basketball, that would be the biggest non-Redskin story in this area. When people say DC is not a bball town, they say it because they think the Wizards and not what many people here play.

There are a ridiculous number of born and raised DC/MD/VA folks who root for the cow-pukes of all teams, WTF is up with that??? Not like you are seeing many folks born, raised and living in CLE rooting for the Steelers.

so because those people are passionate about their teams, that doesnt mean they arent sports fans? Thats a ridiculous statement.

And there is a generation of Redskins fans that root for the Cowboys because of George Preston Marshall.

A lot of people from Pittsburgh moved to DC in the 80s after the factories closed down up there.

This is a very transient area with people from all over the country who come/came here looking for work. There is nothing wrong with that and doesnt make us any less of a sports town.

[CrypticVillain]

there is a greater and longer basketball history in this area. WCAC is one of the best HS leagues in America. Morgan Wooten is the only coach to make the basketball HOF without coaching higher than HS bball. The amount of basketball talent to come out of here is staggering. The summer leagues in this area attract top college, high school, and pro players without local ties.

You would think that all of the times we corrected people in saying that DC is not a basketball town that they would stop saying it. Yet they keep on doing it. :doh:

[isle-hawg]

A lot of people from Pittsburgh moved to DC in the 80s after the factories closed down up there.

This is a very transient area with people from all over the country who come/came here looking for work. There is nothing wrong with that and doesnt make us any less of a sports town.

A sport town that supports the home team was the point I was trying to make. I grew up in the Pittsburgh area in the 70's, loved the Steelers, still root for them every game when not playing against the Redskins this is my home and I choose to support the home team. I am passionate about the Redskins, but notice that many born and raised "locals" are not - actually many are indifferent if not hate the Redskins.

I can somewhat understand as a random off topic data point. I listened to the immaculate reception on radio because it was blacked out in Pittsburgh as was the AFC championship game the Steelers lost to Miami the following week - because neither playoff game was sold out. Those were the last NFL playoff games blacked out (congress took action).

My observations - Pittsburgh was an awful sports town (except for baseball) in the 70's (now best fans ever with 6 SB trophies and a few Stanley Cups and competitive each year). Redskins with the "legendary" season ticket waiting list from being so competitive in 70's 80's not so much now, but perhaps changing with the recent success of the Nats and RG3 and the Redskins. Al Davis coined it right "just win baby".

---------- Post added October-6th-2012 at 07:12 PM ----------

You would think that all of the times we corrected people in saying that DC is not a basketball town that they would stop saying it. Yet they keep on doing it. :doh:

Fair criticism. The point I meant (but failed) to make is DC has not had success with our NBA team, like CHI, LA, BOS, MIA, DAL and therefore hard for the masses of local fans to get behind the team.

[CrypticVillain]

The point I meant (but failed) to make is DC has not had success with our NBA team, like CHI, LA, BOS, MIA, DAL and therefore hard for the masses of local fans to get behind the team.

I hear you, but the Wizards have more support than most teams in the NBA. We have seen how that place can be when you give them something to cheer for.

[spjunkies]

Suck it, Wilbon!