Barkley Annoucment at 1pm,(4PM EST)

[KCClybun]

I agree. People have been worried about the Browns selecting a QB, or trading up to get one, but I started looking at his stats last week and his stats and Joe Flacco's were almost exactly the same.

This is what they both looked like this season, up to right before last week's games (since McCoy is out with the concussion for the most recent game):

McCoy - 265/463 - 2,733 yards - 57.2% - 5.90 avg - 14 TD - 11 INT - 5 fumbles - 74.6 rating

Flacco - 263/465 - 3,122 yards - 57.3% - 6.71 avg - 15 TD - 9 INT - 9 fumbles - 80.0 rating

Flacco's are a little better (except for McCoy's 16 TOs vs Flacco's 18), until you look at the talent level difference around the two of them. McCoy has NO help, while Flacco has an offense that's been built around him with Pro Bowl talent at WR, RB, and OL. I'm not so sure that the Browns are thinking QB anymore.

I've been trying to explain this exact point to people all the year; they've lost like, two or three guys on a normally outstanding offensive line (and their right tackle has been benched a couple times). They have no wide receivers or tight ends capable of creating seperation. The only weapon they have is Peyton Hillis, who has been disgruntled all season. You stop Hillis, you shut down that whole offense.

They've got bigger issues than Colt McCoy. It's impossible to evaluate how well Colt is or isn't doing when he's got nothing around him.

[CRobi21]

I just tried to jump off the bridge in my area.

Its 10 ft. in height.

I now have two sprained ankles.

[Operations]

What I compliment the Shanahan avatar people on is their comparative (to many posters) emotional stability, good sense and judgment, and general intelligence.

No offense to you, Jumbo, but I have a suggestion for you. You very often make sarcastic and condescending comments that are essentially calling the posters on this forum stupid. You do this a lot. I am sure that I am not the only person who has noticed this. (And no, putting a smiley face after an insult doesn't negate it.)

I advise that you tone back your aggressiveness toward the posters.

Remember the forum users are the "customers" here. You should show a bit more respect and less condescension.

I know you have The Power here, and you will do with it what you will. But please look at yourself honestly and consider this advice.

[HailSkins83]

It is yet to be seen whether or not the new rookie pay scales have ANY impact on draft order value... Until we see a frenzy of trades full of 3 or 4 first rounders I'm skeptical that it will have as much of an impact as the "experts" think.

[KDawg]

Kdawg

Tool or not, I love ya bro. BUT there are logical possibilities & illogical/stupid/Maddenesque possibilities. 95% of ES went & will continue to go the later route.

Well, I love you too ya big lug.

Kdawg, you have a tendency that when classic message board nuttiness in all it's myriad forms is being dissed by we old and grizzled vets, to appear to assume that you and perhaps some of your favorite posters are also swept up in that net of indictment. In the case of you at least, nothing could be further from the truth. You're a real gem.

I was always told that growing up.

We indict (mock really) the excessive, and there's a lot of that (big shocking contention in this venue), and even then only the excessive of certain unappealing qualities as identified. It's pretty simple.

Which, I agree with. Too many overly emotional folk here. And for the record, I didn't think I was swept up in your stormy waters (I'm trying to sound smart to match wits with you ) but, I do enjoy a good football discussion, and I know a lot of others do as well. Perhaps my view is tainted because I spend most of my time in collegiate QB conversation in only a couple threads and not in the majority with the rest of the tinfoil hat wearers

[TK]

:point2sky:point2skySo have you guys figured out that Free Agency is before the Draft this year?

And have you figured out Drew Brees will be a FA? :stir:

[skinsfan07]

I agree. People have been worried about the Browns selecting a QB, or trading up to get one, but I started looking at his stats last week and his stats and Joe Flacco's were almost exactly the same.

This is what they both looked like this season, up to right before last week's games (since McCoy is out with the concussion for the most recent game):

McCoy - 265/463 - 2,733 yards - 57.2% - 5.90 avg - 14 TD - 11 INT - 5 fumbles - 74.6 rating

Flacco - 263/465 - 3,122 yards - 57.3% - 6.71 avg - 15 TD - 9 INT - 9 fumbles - 80.0 rating

Flacco's are a little better (except for McCoy's 16 TOs vs Flacco's 18), until you look at the talent level difference around the two of them. McCoy has NO help, while Flacco has an offense that's been built around him with Pro Bowl talent at WR, RB, and OL. I'm not so sure that the Browns are thinking QB anymore.

Exactly. The Browns will not take RG3. They NEED PLAYMAKERS at better skill positions other than QB. You can't tell me that if the Browns draft Richardson, or Blackmon, they won't be much much better. Plus don't they have 2 first round picks? Yea they'll stock up on weapons for Colt instead of giving up on him already.

[Chump Bailey]

:point2sky:point2skySo have you guys figured out that Free Agency is before the Draft this year?

And have you figured out Drew Brees will be a FA? :stir:

Getting Brees would be freaking insane. Never considered it a possiblity with his attachment to Peyton and the community.

[Jumbo]

No offense to you, Jumbo, but I have a suggestion for you. You very often make sarcastic and condescending comments that are essentially calling the posters on this forum stupid. You do this a lot. I am sure that I am not the only person who has noticed this. (And no, putting a smiley face after an insult doesn't negate it.)

I advise that you tone back your aggressiveness toward the posters.

Remember the forum users are the "customers" here. You should show a bit more respect and less condescension.

I know you have The Power here, and you will do with it what you will. But please look at yourself honestly and consider this advice.

How enlightening.

I am well aware of my actions and my surroundings. How simple-minded of you to imply otherwise. Now not liking what I do is fine on your part. The rest was gratuitous tripe serving your own inner personal miffedness (I made that up ) and it hardly offered anything insightful.

I honestly look at myself everyday.

Others honestly evaluate me too, personally and professionally, and even in my various volunteer capacities. My presence seems desirable in all areas so far, objectively speaking.

I call 'em as I see 'em.

Next time you have something like this to initiate, follow the relevant procedures described in rule 18 to avoid getting banned.

And we don't have "customers", nor are ES staff paid employees. But you may want to start your own board where that's how it works.

Now back to topic.

<had to add: since you have three bans previously from three different mods, and the last one wrote "this guy is a real dick" I'd suggest you worry about yourself on ES---really>

[TK]

No offense to you, Jumbo, but I have a suggestion for you. You very often make sarcastic and condescending comments that are essentially calling the posters on this forum stupid. You do this a lot. I am sure that I am not the only person who has noticed this. (And no, putting a smiley face after an insult doesn't negate it.)

I advise that you tone back your aggressiveness toward the posters.

Remember the forum users are the "customers" here. You should show a bit more respect and less condescension.

I know you have The Power here, and you will do with it what you will. But please look at yourself honestly and consider this advice.

This establishment has always had a policy of calling stupid things stupid. We will never call a stupid idea a butter knife, because to call something it is not, is, well, just stupid.

[jflow78]

....You very often make sarcastic and condescending comments that are essentially calling the posters on this forum stupid. You do this a lot. I am sure that I am not the only person who has noticed this.......

I too have noticed that he often calls stupid posters on this forum stupid.

[Thinking Skins]

if that's the case...then so be it. You have to play the cards you're dealt.

And if indeed its the case. Then you need to start thinking of something other than QB in the 1st round. Might I suggestion OL or CB? Both are big needs. OR....trading back again if you can.

I wouldn't elevate CB to as high a need as OL. I don't think Wilson/Hall/etc are great, but our OL has been horrendous for ages. And I'd even put WR as a more dire need than CB. I just don't see good CBs being as effective to this team as a good WR. Thats not to say that having somebody who can catch picks and cover isn't important, but I wouldn't rank it as the highest need.

As always though, if we can't get a QB, I'm for trading down and getting more picks.

[GhostofSparta]

And have you figured out Drew Brees will be a FA? :stir:

You are a cruel, cruel man, TK. :twitch:

[Jumbo]

I too have noticed that he often calls stupid posters on this forum stupid.

What really pisses me off is when I call myself on being stupid. I'd like to complain to me but I know what an ass I am and I'd just end up smacking me. Then the phone calls would get made and those guys would come again and then it's that stupid jump suit and bad food for weeks.

[VinnyIsThatYou?]

This board is going into meltdown mode if RGIII goes back to school.

I for one will enjoy laughing at the unavoidable meltdown and the "NOW WE HAVE TO LOSE FOR SURE!" threads.

I kind of hope he doesn't declare. I don't want to see the Redskins trade up with the amount of assets lavarleap has been talking about.

[Thinking Skins]

He's right. Go look at the QBs on the teams the last 20 years...most are Elite. Mike and Mike went through every super bowl winner and 90% had Elite QBs.

yeah, but many are considered elite BECAUSE they won that game. Prime example - Troy Aikman on any other team is not an ELITE QB. He's a good QB who put up good numbers. But add 3 rings to his belt and he becomes an elite QB. Now consider Trent Green, or Philip Rivers, or McNabb three QBs who have nice resumes of making the playoffs consistently. All are considered on that next tier of all time QBs because they never won the big one but if any had, they'd be right there in that picture. Its the same thing that was said about Drew Brees before he won. Its the same thing that was said about Manning before he won. Its the same thing that was said about Aaron Rodgers before he won.

Its a chicken and egg argument. Mike and Mike are saying that only elite QBs win SuperBowls, but I'd disagree and say that most QBs who win QBs gain elite status for doing so.

[TK]

You are a cruel, cruel man, TK. :twitch:

Moi?

I've been waiting to see the media pick up on it for weeks now. You know as soon as they do, they'll link him to us. They'll be wrong, but they will link him to us out of habit.

[Thinking Skins]

If all these guys really are goiong back to school, it may be in our best interest to trade back for picks in 2013, to have ammo to trade up next yr if we need to.

I definitely agree with this. Its what the Pats seem to do every year. Its what Cleveland did last year. If the opportunity presents itself, I'd jump on it.

[VinnyIsThatYou?]

I wouldn't elevate CB to as high a need as OL. I don't think Wilson/Hall/etc are great, but our OL has been horrendous for ages. And I'd even put WR as a more dire need than CB. I just don't see good CBs being as effective to this team as a good WR. Thats not to say that having somebody who can catch picks and cover isn't important, but I wouldn't rank it as the highest need.

As always though, if we can't get a QB, I'm for trading down and getting more picks.

Agree with you there. It would be great to do what we did last year if our QB plans fall through. It should be an even better draft b/c we're starting with more picks, too. I think this is a more sound strategy than trading a lot of assets to move up. Where are the Redskins if they bring in RG3 and surround him with a bunk o-line, zero playmakers, and OK runningbacks (with a good, not elite, defense). Not sure how that gets us anywhere. All the good offenses in the league have an elite QB along with elite playmakers. We don't have any playmakers, and if we're trading multiple current and future picks away, we don't have a good way to acquire playmakers.

[NewCliche21]

What I compliment the Shanahan avatar people on is their comparative (to many posters) emotional stability, good sense and judgment, and general intelligence.

Per RGIII---don't absolutely count on it. Love is a powerful thing, for one.

:point2sky:point2skySo have you guys figured out that Free Agency is before the Draft this year?

And have you figured out Drew Brees will be a FA? :stir:

Okay, so trying to avoid the net/95% of ES tags: You're saying that RGIII is a free agent? Right?

Perfect. World not shattered. Thanks for that, and you can't spell "Thanks" without "TK"

[RFKFedEx]

I'm so happy he's staying. Now we'll have to draft responsibly yet again next year. That tempting shortcut to trade up for the dream QB we weren't going to get with our pick is now closed.

[authentic]

Not sure if it means backup plan to trade up, or backup plan if we can't land RG3.

hopefully back up plan if we can't land RG3. The possibilites are endless. Not even gonna try to speculate.

[jflow78]

What really pisses me off is when I call myself on being stupid. I'd like to complain to me but I know what an ass I am and I'd just end up smacking me. Then the phone calls would get made and those guys would come again and then it's that stupid jump suit and bad food for weeks.

I have to say, I don't know why I've read so many posts complaining about the mods, since the season started. You guys are REALLY lenient and I don't think I've ever seen one of you just hammer someone because you were in a bad mood. It normally seems like you let things get near the edge of total insanity, and then you bring out the bans.

Speaking from personal experience, you guys are very kind, so I think most of us appreciate that. Of course, I'm the kind that when I'm called out for being an idiot my response is, "tee hee, I know. My bad".

Anyway, thanks for the work Mods.

[Boy1Der]

I kind of hope he doesn't declare. I don't want to see the Redskins trade up with the amount of assets lavarleap has been talking about.

If we want to win we need to get a franchise QB ask the Giants if it was a mistake to trade up for Eli or ask Green Bay if it was a mistake to trade up and get Rodgers. The same goes for Jay Cutler who took the Bears to the NFC Championship last year.

I am actually happy that Barkley stayed in school because my biggest fear was that the Redskins would draft him. With the trend of recent USC QBs I think he will be a bust. Palmer was the best QB to come out of USC and he never won a playoff game while Sanchez has to be coddled in New York.

[Destructis]

Even Favre didn't get drafted by GB. He was Falcon' date=' and Holmgren having a savvy eye on other team backups, grabbed him from Atlanta like the way he plucked Hasslebeck from another bench.[/quote']

To be fair, Holmgren was GB's HC when Hassleback was there. When he went to Seattle, he already knew about him. He also knew that Hassleback already knew the offense he was installing in Seattle. So it wasn't like he was keeping an eye on other teams back ups then. Holmgren wanted to draft Favre when he was at GB, Atlanta snagged him first.