GHH laid totally bare with his fanhood on the line: Why it's best for our team to lose out the rest of the 2011 season.

[MumboSauce]

I won't judge..you are entitled to feel how you feel. I don't agree with it however. If the team does end up losing the rest of the way, so be it. That does work out in our favor in the QB sweepstakes. But I certainly won't hope for it.. it isn't in me, regardless of what "may" happen, for the better, for years to come to ever wish this team to lose any game. You can wish and hope for losing the rest of the way out all you want, doesn't mean it will happen..then what are you left with? rooting against your team.

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

Here's something to make everyone happy:

Aaron Rodgers was actually the 24th overall pick. Which is the one right before we took Jason Campbell.

And the one 15 picks after the Redskins selected Carlos Rogers in the same draft. :doh:

They used the first pick on Rogers because they chose not to re-sign Smoot, creating a vacancy at starting CB. :doh:

They almost got it right. The pick of the draft was Rodgers. Not Rogers.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

..... Aaron was drafted 124, ......

Hot darn it! Aaron Rodgers went #124! Your telling me we could of had him in the 4th round! A round we took Manuel fricking White in!

'K, now I'm officialy pissed! :mad:

Hail.

[McD5]

One person starts a "Thank God We Lost To San Francisco" thread, and now all hell breaks loose.

Hail.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

They almost got it right. The pick of the draft was Rodgers. Not Rogers.

I wonder if they could petition the league for Rodgers and just blame a miscommunication.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

One person starts a "Thank God We Lost To San Francisco" thread, and now all hell breaks loose.

Hail.

*Chuckles and raises a knowing glass to McD.

Hail.

[Henry]

lol, id like a serious answer tho. i think everyone (goddamn i hope so) knows that we need a franchise QB and the 1st round is where that guy will be found, but since we need to win 9 games this season to deem is successful, id just like to hear the other sides answer to our QB woes.

some of us think the worse we do, the less we'll have to mortgage for our franchise guy. the guys who think the wins are more important, whats the solution for the QB?

Serious answer?

Figure it out in the offseason.

Just because you haven't personally haven't figured it out doesn't mean it can't be done. The whole purpose of spectator sports is to watch your team win. Some of you have so convoluted your logic that losing means winning. It doesn't work that way.

Andrew Luck could die in a fire tomorrow or decide he doesn't want to play here even if we can draft him. Matt Ryan could suffer a season-ending injury, only to see his backup come in and win a superbowl for the Falcons, and then Ryan gets released or becomes trade bait. Maybe Phillip Rivers gets in trouble for dog fighting and gets kicked off the Chargers making him available. A seventh round pick could be the next Great Franchise QB and lead us to 3 or 4 superbowl wins.

There are SO many things that can and do happen that change the landscape of an offseason every year, that to root for losses based on something you think might happen does not make the sound logic you think it does. That's why we watch sports, because nobody knows what's going to happen. It's not just any given Sunday. As has been pointed out many times in this thread, it's any given draft pick, any given free agent, any given trade as well.

You go ahead and root for losses and hope that somehow we fenagle a way to land Luck or whoever. I'll root for wins and hope that somehow we land the next Rogers or Brady or Brees or Vick. Both are just as likely to happen, but I get to benefit from the actual reason of watching my team play: Rooting them on to victory.

[MrJL]

lol, id like a serious answer tho. i think everyone (goddamn i hope so) knows that we need a franchise QB and the 1st round is where that guy will be found, but since we need to win 9 games this season to deem is successful, id just like to hear the other sides answer to our QB woes.

some of us think the worse we do, the less we'll have to mortgage for our franchise guy. the guys who think the wins are more important, whats the solution for the QB?

if you trust your coach then you let him develop the QB he wants.

If you don't turst your coach then no QB will ever be good enough to get your team to the Super Bowl

[Henry]

Do you guys realize we are now 38-61-2 lifetime against the Dallas Cowboys? 62-91-4 against the Giants?

We used to OWN the Eagles but now we're only 78-70-6 against them.

We play them each one more time this season. Do you REALLY want those records to all get worse, just for draft positioning that may or may not actually help us?

I've seen the Lions held up in this thread as an example of what we should aspire to be. Well, that's a team that went 0-16 a few years back. No matter what they do from here on out. No matter how many games they win with their shiny new QB, they will always be the first team to ever go 0-16. Nothing they do will ever erase that.

Sports isn't all about The Future. It's also about history. About making history. And some history I don't want this team to make.

If we lose out, a nice high draft pick is the consolation prize, and I will happily accept it. A consolation prize not something I root for. That makes as much sense to me as jumping for joy because I got the plastic pink ring I always wanted while some other kid walks off with the trophy.

[TK]

You ever travel? Look me up when your in Texas pal

Hi there.

With 6 user notes already, you're now done being the first part of your name.

[GSF]

Hoping your football team loses all it's games so it can get a higher draft pick is just unmanly and lame.

[Henry]

You enjoy that way too much, TK.

[TK]

You enjoy that way too much, TK.

Not really. But from time to time you just get tired of cleaning up after & dealing with certain problems. And a big part of doing it that way, is so that other problems see it, recognize it, & keep their heads down. But they never do.

Fish. Barrell. Ka-Pow!

[terrifNick21]

Hi there.

With 6 user notes already, you're now done being the first part of your name.

:rotflmao:

[Rufus T Firefly]

Serious answer?

Figure it out in the offseason.

Just because you haven't personally haven't figured it out doesn't mean it can't be done. The whole purpose of spectator sports is to watch your team win. Some of you have so convoluted your logic that losing means winning. It doesn't work that way.

Andrew Luck could die in a fire tomorrow or decide he doesn't want to play here even if we can draft him. Matt Ryan could suffer a season-ending injury, only to see his backup come in and win a superbowl for the Falcons, and then Ryan gets released or becomes trade bait. Maybe Phillip Rivers gets in trouble for dog fighting and gets kicked off the Chargers making him available. A seventh round pick could be the next Great Franchise QB and lead us to 3 or 4 superbowl wins.

There are SO many things that can and do happen that change the landscape of an offseason every year, that to root for losses based on something you think might happen does not make the sound logic you think it does. That's why we watch sports, because nobody knows what's going to happen. It's not just any given Sunday. As has been pointed out many times in this thread, it's any given draft pick, any given free agent, any given trade as well.

You go ahead and root for losses and hope that somehow we fenagle a way to land Luck or whoever. I'll root for wins and hope that somehow we land the next Rogers or Brady or Brees or Vick. Both are just as likely to happen, but I get to benefit from the actual reason of watching my team play: Rooting them on to victory.

You can build your team around lesser talent because you're worried about fires or are banking on Chris Redman becoming a franchise QB if you like. Myself, I would build mine around acquiring greater talent.

I have a hunch my team would end up better.

[Enter Apotheosis]

here lets do this, for all the lets win 9 games crowd.

we go 9-7, miss the playoffs. everyone is ecstatic because we "learned how to win". awesome. rah rah, im super stoked. we end up drafting in the 19th spot.

how do we get a top QB in this draft drafting 19th?

If you need to get up in the draft to get a top QB then you do approximately what the Falcons did to get Julio Jones (two firsts, a second, and two fourths). That would hurt but if we have a team that is capable of going 9-7 in its current state and we need a QB to truly go over the top then it's a price I think anyone here would be willing to pay (assuming they thought it was for the right guy). Hell, that scenario wouldn't necessarily even be as bad as it sounds given that we already have a spare 4th and have shown a propensity for acquiring additional picks by trading back when necessary.

At this point, I think building momentum and winning an extra three or four games to get to at least .500 is worth more to this franchise than the extra picks.

[88Comrade2000]

NEVER. I want us to win as much as we can. With players going down to injury; let the young guys play. It will benefit us in the long run. I will never root for this team to suck for luck or anyone. You play to win and when the season is over; then you see what your needs will be in 2012. This team is tracking for a Top 10 pick anyway; so we should still find a good franchise QB.

Actually, it will not shock me if the Colts decide they want Luck; they trade Peyton and it wouldn't shock me to see the Skins in that discussion. I wouldn't be for that but it's a typical Skins move.

[brandymac27]

NEVER. I want us to win as much as we can. With players going down to injury; let the young guys play. It will benefit us in the long run. I will never root for this team to suck for luck or anyone. You play to win and when the season is over; then you see what your needs will be in 2012. This team is tracking for a Top 10 pick anyway; so we should still find a good franchise QB.

Actually, it will not shock me if the Colts decide they want Luck; they trade Peyton and it wouldn't shock me to see the Skins in that discussion. I wouldn't be for that but it's a typical Skins move.

You know, this is the first time I actually considered the Colts trying to trade Peyton and us being in on it. I would be against this too, but I wonder how others feel about it?

[KCClybun]

here lets do this, for all the lets win 9 games crowd.

we go 9-7, miss the playoffs. everyone is ecstatic because we "learned how to win". awesome. rah rah, im super stoked. we end up drafting in the 19th spot.

how do we get a top QB in this draft drafting 19th?

You do what Mike did in 2006 after the Broncos went 13-3 and to the AFC Championship game; you trade up. We have ammo to trade up since we have extra picks in the later rounds, and we don't lose most of our draft doing it.

You do realize that there aren't going to be that many teams that are super duper eager to draft quarterbacks, right? Right now, the two worse teams in the league at the Dolphins and the Colts. I'd venture a guess they both want a crack at Andrew Luck.

Who else needs a quarterback after that, that didn't already take one in the 2011 NFL Draft? Even if the Jags suck as hardcore as it seems they will for the rest of the season, they're more likely to hire a new, offensive minded head coach than they are to replace Blaine Gabbert after one season. The Rams have Sam Bradford. Panthers drafted Newton. The Vikings like Ponder. The Cardinals spent a buttload of money on Kolb. The Browns will probably stick with Colt McCoy. The Broncos will probably roll with Tebow.

Right now, I see three teams that will probably take a quarterback; Colts, Dolphins, and Seahawks. Knowing how friggin' wacky the NFC West is at the moment, who knows where the hell the Seahawks are going to finish for sure. Way the Colts and Dolphins are headed, they're going to be drafting one and two, so that's Luck and the second ranked quarterback probably off the board in the first two picks.

At any rate, knowing Mike and the way he drafts, the guy everyone probably pegs him to take won't be the guy we're actually targeting. We were connected to pretty much every quarterback in the 2011 Draft at one point. Then, at the 11th hour, all the sudden, we were "trying like crazy" to move up and draft Gabbert. That made the Jags panic so bad that they were trying to jump over us to get to Gabbert, until he fell to us, and we pretty much took them to the house and turned that one move down into a 12 player draft class.

So I'm not going to be crying and going nuts over our draft position, because the run on quarterbacks this year makes it all the more likely that the guy we want will potentially fall to us next year. Seriously, looking around the league; how many teams right now are really, really uncertain at the quarterback position.

And that's to say nothing of free agency, if some team out there is willing to put a bid in for a guy like Kyle Orton or McNabb (if he doesn't take the hint and retire).

The "we need to lose to get a top flight quarterback" crowd show a keen lack of awareness of what's going on around the rest of the league and how it's beginning to shape the draft. The way it's shaking out now, unless one of these young quarterbacks REALLY bombs out, we're going to have ample opportunity to draft our guy.

[TSO]

I have no problem with what you are saying from an intellectual point of view, but for me, football is meant to be an emotional release and complex escapism. So, there's only one way I could buy into what you're selling. That's not too watch and walk away. Being a realist is meant for other aspects of my life... football is about the impossible and dreaming and screaming for the home team and buying a box of Cracker Jacks because ya gotta have heart and ya can't ever quit.

I respect what you're saying and what you've been pretty consistant about since before preseason and I can even acknowledge a degree of truth and logic to it, but it ain't for me. For the reason I pointed out and for the reason that the draft doesn't make you an instant winner. Look how many busts... look at how high Heath Shuler brought us or Akili Smith, David Carr, or Ryan Leaf brought their teams.

You may be right, but sports isn't about right. It's about passion, miracles, and vicarious thrills and supporting your guys. It's an area of our lives where we get to be irrational and stupid. Blind homerism is laudable.

So, I'll root for the guys to win because otherwise there's no game.

Was about to reply than I saw this. No need for me to add anything, really, but I will add this.

Everything GHH says here, while understandable, simply assumes one gigantic thing: that the franchise QB is guaranteed if we were to lose out. Furthermore, it is an absolute slap in the face to all the veterans on this team to basically be told to sit down on the bench and wait a year. Even worse, it encourages a losing culture. The players will practice to lose. The players will play in games to lose. What incentive would they have to give their everything on every down when they know this is all just for next year? Any guy who's not a rookie will think his roster spot is worthless, and thus, allow himself to sign off, ceasing to believe in the team as it relates to him. Heck, the rookies will witness a coach showing absolutely no loyalty, and as they grow they'll tell each other how quickly they'll be shunned simply for the sake of youth later on. They'll have no reason to give their all to the team, since they know they'll be discarded no matter how hard they work for nothing more than age. The rookies will think they deserve playing time just because they're rookies... they don't have to practice or do crap during the week. The draftees will see this as well and assume the same next year.

My God, the damage it would do to building a winning culture and winning locker room would be infinitely greater than any positive that could come from gaining a better draft spot to take the franchise QB with that's not guaranteed to do a thing.

No, GHH. You go all in with a team that has a bunch of weaknesses and hope you win every game. You teach every guy on the team to fight no matter how bad things are. You tell them it's not their job to assess the team and play based off of that. You tell them their job is what their job is, and that's it. Focus on each play in practice, each snap in the film room, each play during the games, and work your way into a bigger role on the team. Make plays. You keep that message strong throughout the entire team no matter what, win or lose. This will prepare the players better than anything you're suggesting for the future. This will make them strong and willing to fight through adversity. Those who can't or won't will be sniffed out and discarded. Success usually comes from failure, so you keep at it. This is where champions are made, through perserverance during the difficult times. You do not willingly quit. Would you want a franchise QB to come into a situation where losers rule the locker room? Coaches and players who believe quitting is ok every now and then?

[pimpumd]

You can build your team around lesser talent because you're worried about fires or are banking on Chris Redman becoming a franchise QB if you like. Myself, I would build mine around acquiring greater talent.

I have a hunch my team would end up better.

Wow. What a crap post. Did you even read what Henry said, or did you just type the first thing you thought sounded like a witty retort?

But, since you wrote it I'll comment. Why would Henry's team (you know, the one he roots for to actually win games) be less talented than your team (the team you root for to lose games)? Because you want your team to lose annually, have an early first round pick each year, and try to create a roster full of "greater talent?"

Teams like the Steelers, Packers, and Patriots do the opposite of what you suggest yet somehow manage to field very talented rosters year after year despite having to pick in the latter part of each round in the draft. I guess according to you those teams are "built around lesser talent" (just like Henry's team) and you could surely build a better roster with your strategy of losing to "acquire greater talent." You should get in touch with those front offices and tell them you've come up with a better approach.

[bedlamVR]

:rotflmao: Poor Danny. He's trying so hard but his reputation just goes before him.

The Green Bay analogy is a bad one as they'd both come off consistent success with Favre when they drafted Rodgers (1 losing season in 13/ 6 divisional titles/ 10 playoff trips/ 2 SB's, winning one); and could afford to build the pieces whilst their future Hall of Famer tied them over.

Whilst we're rebuilding as we go, we don't have that luxury of putting everything in place whilst still being competitive with a great QB already here.

And although you don't need a great QB to win the whole thing, you sure as heck do for consistent, sustained success.

Hail.

They are a bad one why ? Because they did not loose out to try and get the top draft pick to take the shiny new QB . They used a first round pick and took their QB talent when they could they didn't sell the farm just used their pick where it fell .

The Patriots, when they selected Brady they were coming off an 8-8 season - they had Drew Bledsoe who was a top QB for them back then .

The Saints got their franchise QB on the open market, Vick was acquired off the open market, Kurt Warner was brought in to the Cardinals as a back up whos days were long past done, The 49ers got Steve Young for a 2nd and 4th while riding high with Joe Montana, The texans got Schuab for 2 2nd round picks and a swap of firsts (8th for 10th) ....

The Broncos selected Cutler by using their 3rd round pick to trade up following a 13-3 season ...

There are plenty of ways to get your franchise QB without hoping we loose from here on in .

Finally could you imagine the massively intense scrutiny someone like Luck would be under the chances of burning out would be huge if a team won the "suck for luck sweepstakes" every loss, every pick, every check down pass, every 3rd and short, every sub 400 yard 3TD game would be a disaster ...

[KCClybun]

They are a bad one why ? Because they did not loose out to try and get the top draft pick to take the shiny new QB . They used a first round pick and took their QB talent when they could they didn't sell the farm just used their pick where it fell .

The Patriots, when they selected Brady they were coming off an 8-8 season - they had Drew Bledsoe who was a top QB for them back then .

The Saints got their franchise QB on the open market, Vick was acquired off the open market, Kurt Warner was brought in to the Cardinals as a back up whos days were long past done, The 49ers got Steve Young for a 2nd and 4th while riding high with Joe Montana, The texans got Schuab for 2 2nd round picks and a swap of firsts (8th for 10th) ....

The Broncos selected Cutler by using their 3rd round pick to trade up following a 13-3 season ...

There are plenty of ways to get your franchise QB without hoping we loose from here on in .

Finally could you imagine the massively intense scrutiny someone like Luck would be under the chances of burning out would be huge if a team won the "suck for luck sweepstakes" every loss, every pick, every check down pass, every 3rd and short, every sub 400 yard 3TD game would be a disaster...

It is easier for people to ignore what you're saying than accept that having a decent season might be a good thing, AND we could get a solid quarterback.

What I see is a lot of "Well YEAH, that worked there, but that could never work HERE!" by people who have convinced themselves that they only way we will get better is to suck, because they've convinced themselves we're already going to suck, and this is their bizarre way of coping with that.

And what you're saying about Luck is the thing that worries about him. I think he has the skillset to be a very good quarterback. But I feel like he will never live up to the hype of being "THE BEST PROSPECT EVER!", and that ultimately will be the knock on him his entire career unless he wins a Super Bowl. And it's not hard to think that kind of pressure will eat the guy alive.

[Enter Apotheosis]

What I see is a lot of "Well YEAH, that worked there, but that could never work HERE!" by people who have convinced themselves that they only way we will get better is to suck, because they've convinced themselves we're already going to suck, and this is their bizarre way of coping with that.

Incidentally, drafting a QB high is what has never worked HERE in the modern era. We traded for Jurgenson and Kilmer, Theismann was a fourth round pick, Schroeder was a third round pick, Williams was a free agent, Rypien was a sixth round pick, Johnson was a free agent, Brunell was a free agent, and Collins was a free agent. Those are the only QBs that have even gotten us into the playoffs since the early 40s.

[Jumbo]

Hi there.

With 6 user notes already, you're now done being the first part of your name.

I just warned him a month ago that the next time he crapped in the pool he'd be catapulted.

He channeled his inner lemming one time too many.

And no, you never "try to definitely lose now so you can maybe win later" in the NFL. I respect several of the posters taking that position, but the position itself is retarded IMO and contrary to everything I relate to in sports or the rest of life.