John Beck v Rex Grossman Preseason 2011. FINAL NUMBERS

[RawBBQSauce]

What? We sat our starter out. Nice to see Beckup get some time to hone his skills.

^This

[mossomo]

While Beck struggled today, I think he showed why the coaches like him. His mobility and footwork in the pockets is impressive

I think his mobility opens up the playbook more and sells the play action better. I'm not sure that wins the coaches. We shall see. .

[Hooper]

I started out a Grossman guy. I think he's better than his rep and played well last year.

I didn't think much of Beck at all. But then I saw him play this preseason and I was way more impressed than I expected. I figured he would win the job because he could do some things Rex couldn't and maybe had more upside. I felt like we would be in decent hands either way.

And then tonight. Beck made a couple great plays... but wow, he also looked pretty lost at times. Like a rookie. He could have thrown multiple picks and he kept staring down receivers. It's just one game and yes, he wasn't playing with all his weapons... but it concerned me.

If he was the starter going into the game, I bet he still is the starter.

But I don't know how long the leash will be.

[GSF]

If this was indeed an open competition, Beck sure hasn't helped himself. On performance alone, there is no contest.

But then you have practices we've not seen, and who they feel fits best. I honestly wouldn't like to say who get's the gig. I guess we'll find out next Monday or Tuesday.

Hail.

You actually have to wait to find out? It's gonna be Rex. It's painfully obvious at this point.

---------- Post added September-2nd-2011 at 05:26 AM ----------

You don't think all QBs are largely dependent upon their supporting cast?

Oh stop with this nonsense. He had his starting oline in there and was playing against Tampa's 2s. Good QBs make their supporting casts better.

[Atlanta Skins Fan]

You actually have to wait to find out? It's gonna be Rex. It's painfully obvious at this point.

Yes.

Beck had one chance to redeem his career, and he **** the bed.

[skins2victory]

Grossman has won fair and square. If this QB competition is fair, he should be named the starter for 9/11. It's that simple.

100% Agreed..... It showed in his play, and in the stats

[MartinC]

Yes.

Beck had one chance to redeem his career, and he **** the bed.

For someone who is clearly very intelligent you do make some very strange statements even allowing for hyperbole. You really think last night was Becks one big chance?

The coaches will make a decision, if it's not been made already, based on all preseason and practice plus how either guy fits into the bigger picture and plan. If Rex starts I hope he tears it up and we win ten plus games - however more realistically Beck starts at some point in the second half of the year through either injury, Rex not playing well or us being out of playoff contention and us wanting to take a look at Beck much like last year when Rex played the last 3 games.

[Chump Bailey]

Grossman has won fair and square. If this QB competition is fair, he should be named the starter for 9/11. It's that simple.

I agree. There are things to like about Beck, but IMO, it's clear Rex is the best choice to run this offense. Beck essentially did nothing for an entire half with the starting OL against Tampa's reserves.

[Gurgeh]

Beck had a poor game last night. Braindx brought up a good point in that neither QB has looked comfortable with the second-string receivers, but Beck at least had the first-string line to help out. I would also say this was the first time we didn't get some explosive running in the first half, I wondered from the first three games if the key to stopping the Redskins this year will be to kill the running game rather than say blitzing the QB.

[Long n Left]

I've sat here for days, biting my tongue (fingers), reading all QB controversy hoopla...great entertainment. One thing that has been obviously clear to me for some time is that Rex Grossman is the better QB, right now.

John Beck has become, especially on this board, the prototypical backup QB that everyone loves when there are questions surrounding the play of your starter, and said backup does not have a large body of work for comparison purposes. Isn't the backup QB always the favorite son in DC? And while Beck is certainly more mobile than Grossman, I see Grossman as the better option, unquestionably, for two simple reasons: confidence and competence.

Rex has loads of confidence in his abilities, and his ability to get the job done. He'll stand in the pocket and take a blast to deliver the big play. He'll also throw a bad interception, or be off on his throws early, but that never seems to get him down, he comes back firing. His mentality seems to be that if I get beat on one play, no worries, I'm gonna come back and make that play next time, or one even better. Beck doesn't seem to have that.

Tonight, especially, but somewhat in the Pitt and B'more games also, Beck seems to get a bit flustered when things aren't going his way. He'll force passes, make poor reads, and just plain be "off." Give me the guy who said publicly taht he believes his team is capable of winning the NFC East.

As for competence, it boils down to one thing, reading defenses. Rex is just better. Rex makes better pre-snap reads, and knows where to go when blitzes and breakdowns occur quicker than Beck. For those lamenting the O-line play tonight, Tampa brought a bunch of blitzes. I think much of the pressure was attributable to poor blitz pick ups by backs and TEs, rather than O-line incompetence. Regardless, Beck looked shaky against those blitzes, and made more poor reads than good throws. Rex, too, faced a number of blitzes in the Ravens game, but either made solid pre-snap reads and got the ball quickly to the right guy, or stood in and took the hit to deliver.

Easy for me to see that Rex is the better option now. There is a reason John Beck has played so little in this league, and it was on display tonight.

That said, I sure hope the Skins find a true "franchise" QB in one of the next two drafts.

[Oldfan]

Don’t be fooled by the difference in the QBRs. One play by Santana Moss accounts for it all.

Against the Ravens, Santana turned defender and knocked down a pass in the corner of the endzone saving Grossman an interception. On the next play, the corner blew an assignment and Grossman threw a TD pass to a wide open Santana.

Had Santana not been able to prevent that one INT, Grossman would have 1 TD and 2 INTs. His QBR would have been 71.8 to Beck's 74.7

The coaches won’t use those stats, so it’s hard to tell how the QBs graded out, but it figures to be close.

[Aireskoi]

I don't believe Beck is reading the defense and making the best play. I think he is throwing to a pre-determined (in his mind) receiver, regardless of coverage. He may pull it down if it's clearly covered, but it looks like on many of his throws (especially deep) he is just dropping back and chucking it. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't his deep passes just 9 routes (straight down the field)? I didn't see him throw the intermediate to deep thing like Rex was able to do.

It seemed like Beck was just launching some early deep ones to let the defense know he would, opening up some the running lanes and lots of the underneath stuff.

I think Rex has a much better grasp of reading defenses and understanding how to attack them. His time in this offense helps, but just his playing time in general should give him the edge. He should have seen it all by now and know how to react to what the defense is giving him.

Beck will improve with playing time, I'm sure. I just don't think he gets a chance unless Rex really screws this up.

[Long n Left]

Don’t be fooled by the difference in the QBRs. One play by Santana Moss accounts for it all.

Against the Ravens, Santana turned defender and knocked down a pass in the corner of the endzone saving Grossman an interception. On the next play, the corner blew an assignment and Grossman threw a TD pass to a wide open Santana.

Had Santana not been able to prevent that one INT, Grossman would have 1 TD and 2 INTs. His QBR would have been 71.8 to Beck's 74.7

The coaches won’t use those stats, so it’s hard to tell how the QBs graded out, but it figures to be close.

Did you choose to forget that prior, Moss had TD pass on a beautiful throw by Rex, but could not secure it when he went to the ground?

[Aireskoi]

Don’t be fooled by the difference in the QBRs. One play by Santana Moss accounts for it all.

Against the Ravens, Santana turned defender and knocked down a pass in the corner of the endzone saving Grossman an interception. On the next play, the corner blew an assignment and Grossman threw a TD pass to a wide open Santana.

Had Santana not been able to prevent that one INT, Grossman would have 1 TD and 2 INTs. His QBR would have been 71.8 to Beck's 74.7

The coaches won’t use those stats, so it’s hard to tell how the QBs graded out, but it figures to be close.

Ifs and buts....we could go all day with that and get nowhere. Beck has been very fortunate not to have a few more picks as well.

[ArmchairRedskin]

It's camp Grossman for me. If we wanna open up with a win against the Giants (and I really really do) Rex gives us the best shot.

[SnyderShrugged]

I'm fine with either given the ZBS and revamped running game in play.

[Oldfan]

Did you choose to forget that prior, Moss had TD pass on a beautiful throw by Rex, but could not secure it when he went to the ground?

Ifs and buts....we could go all day with that and get nowhere. Beck has been very fortunate not to have a few more picks as well.

The point, fellas, is that one play can skew that QBR stat on such a small sample. You won't deny that will you?

[S.T.real,lights,out]

Should be very interesting as to who starts next week! Just watching the guys I feel like Beck would be a better overall leader and i love the fact that hes working/talking to Brees and Rodgers all the time. Really wanna see what he can do with all the starters and against a pretty good D. I hope he gets the start.

But if he doesn't i know Rex will be ok for us

[Aireskoi]

The point, fellas, is that one play can skew that QBR stat on such a small sample. You won't deny that will you?

Only to the extent that you are choosing one play to support your beliefs, you could have choosen a couple of "ifs" from Beck that could have been picks that would have crushed Beck's ratings.

I don't think you can do that either way.

[Chase M]

I feel like I'm going crazy. Where any of you watching the same game I was last night? If so theirs no way in hell I'd ever want Beck to start for my team let alone be a back up. Hell, Clemens looked better than Beck did.

[Oldfan]

Only to the extent that you are choosing one play to support your beliefs, you could have choosen a couple of "ifs" from Beck that could have been picks that would have crushed Beck's ratings.

I don't think you can do that either way.

You are missing the point. I'm not arguing that the QBR is not accurate as it is. I'm demonstrating that one play by a receiver can be the difference on such a small sample. Therefore, the QBR on such a small sample can be deceptive.

The coaches would give Rex a plus on the pass Santana dropped in the endzone and a minus on the pass that he threw to the corner that Moss defended. So, their grading will not be subject to skewed numbers on a small sample.

[TheShredder]

Beck look shell-shocked to me, much of the game. I surmised that he did not take well to being named the starter while Grossman sat, and that possibly this was a late-breaking disclosure to the QBs.

That's just a guess, but if I have it right, we might have seen how a very stressed Beck deals with pressure. He stared down almost every receiver from the snap, made bad reads, bad throws, and hurried a throw into the end zone for an INT, rather than stand in against the rush. Mixed in with these plays were some very outstanding plays: some great passes, and some nimbleness when rushed or on the rollout. Very inconsistent. For me, the bad impressions outweighed the good.

I was surprised by the performance in context (playing against backups), but I did see what I expected to see if Beck were a starter in the regular season. I think Beck is a better QB than he looked tonight, but I never believed he'd hold up under real pressure. IMO, the bad plays tonight were partly the internal pressure of feeling his opportunity slip away.

I think the decision was made a long time ago to start Grossman. However, tonight's game will probably bring fan support together behind Grossman. Fans may not all like Grossman, but pulling for Beck to start is simply not seeing what's happening on the field. Beck's got great tools and nice personal qualities, but he's not NFL starter material. In my opinion.

I like your observation and can understand your logic.

I do not think that Grossman was made the starting QB a long time ago. Tend to believe that it was a true QB competition and that each of them had a fair shot at the title. My judgment is that MS and KS wanted to see if Beck could take the next step and separate himself from what they already knew about Rex. Though Beck has some upside, it looks like he didn't get into a groove and hold it. Does that make sense? It feels like he was rolling and then hit a few bumps and the coaches didn't really get the answers they were looking for. My speculation is that MS and KS wanted to see Beck get a shot, get rolling, and take the next step after getting in a groove. They just might not have seen enough to give Rex the starting job. My instinct from what I've seen is that they already know what Rex is going to do and that if they give Beck the starting job and a short leash, it's win win.

Beck starts week one vs. the Giants and bar a complete collapse he should be given a few games before he is declared and permanently labeled a career NFL backup.

HTTR!

[SWFLSkins]

Don’t be fooled by the difference in the QBRs. One play by Santana Moss accounts for it all.

Against the Ravens, Santana turned defender and knocked down a pass in the corner of the endzone saving Grossman an interception. On the next play, the corner blew an assignment and Grossman threw a TD pass to a wide open Santana.

Had Santana not been able to prevent that one INT, Grossman would have 1 TD and 2 INTs. His QBR would have been 71.8 to Beck's 74.7

The coaches won’t use those stats, so it’s hard to tell how the QBs graded out, but it figures to be close.

Also the Beck INT in the endzone to Niles Paul. Paul turns defender too quick and never plays the ball thrown early by a QB under pressure. The OL did no favors for John Beck in the Bucs game. He however handled it really well and I doubt that shows up in the QB rating.

[MariusVT]

Both know the system and can run it well. I really don't think it matters who starts in the grand scheme of things because the result will likely be the same or very similar in the end.

[SWFLSkins]

I feel like I'm going crazy. Where any of you watching the same game I was last night? If so theirs no way in hell I'd ever want Beck to start for my team let alone be a back up. Hell, Clemens looked better than Beck did.

You need to rewatch the game sans Grossman goggles.

---------- Post added September-2nd-2011 at 08:44 AM ----------

Ifs and buts....we could go all day with that and get nowhere. Beck has been very fortunate not to have a few more picks as well.

The same could be said of Grossman. If he had played behind that line last night he would have more pics as well. Beck or Grossman is going to struggle if the OL plays like the Buc game and not the Steeler game. But at least Beck moves around pressure and has a quicker release. Grossman would be better if he has the time to set up and pick the D apart. But I am afraid that behind the inconsistent offensive line being shown that is not an option.