zoony Posted August 22, 2011 Author Share Posted August 22, 2011 No I'm not satisfied with that. But I'm also not ranting and raving and insulting people just because I'm miffed in the second week of preseason. Picking game up equals insult. Mmmkay. Dude makes more than you or I will ever sniff in our entire lifetime. I think he can handle a fan calling him out for ****ty play. Though its interesting to me that so many fans cannot. Homers are the absolute worst thing about message boards and team sites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dukes and Skins Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I know he's had the injury bug but I believe Okung will prove to be the better player in the long run.I'm not impressed with Trent either. Also entirely dependent on scheme as well Brave, Okung is a great fit for what they ran in Seattle, not sure how he'll do now in the ZBS, while Trent was the better ZBS fit for us. I've been critical of Trent, but I'm also confident that he'll be a very successful bookend T for us for a long time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoDeep81 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I dont know about the discussion, but I certainly agree with the thread title.. At this point, Trent needs to pick it up, period.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sekhmet187 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Picking game up equals insult. Mmmkay. Dude makes more than you or I will ever sniff in our entire lifetime. I think he can handle a fan calling him out for ****ty play. Though its interesting to me that so many fans cannot. Homers are the absolute worst thing about message boards and team sites. I'm far from a homer, but I'm not surprised you lump everyone who disagrees with you into some big ball without knowing anything about them. You can say whatever you want, but drop all that "if you don't want to hear this blah blah leave" or "homers are the worst" stuff out of your messages since they're clearly just veiled shots at other posters. THAT is what I meant about insults, not the stuff you said about Trent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Also entirely dependent on scheme as well Brave, Okung is a great fit for what they ran in Seattle, not sure how he'll do now in the ZBS, while Trent was the better ZBS fit for us. I've been critical of Trent, but I'm also confident that he'll be a very successful bookend T for us for a long time How do you define "successful?" Because for me when you are the 4th overall pick, "successful" means being absolutely dominant at your position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dukes and Skins Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 How do you define "successful?" a consistent pro bowl caliber player who we dont have to worry about at LT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 a consistent pro bowl caliber player who we dont have to worry about at LT You have more confidence in him than I do because I don't see it. I hope I'm wrong..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dukes and Skins Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 You have more confidence in him than I do because I don't see it.I hope I'm wrong..... I mean I see it already, if he didnt have a desire to be good why would he come in down 12 pounds? In practices he was looking very good. Yes he had a bad game against the Colts but against the Steelers he had a good game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sekhmet187 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 How do you define "successful?"Because for me when you are the 4th overall pick, "successful" means being absolutely dominant at your position. Well technically if you look at the last few batch of 4th overall picks: 2009 - Aaron Curry 2008 - Darren McFadden 2007 - Gaines Adams 2006 - D'Brickashaw Ferguson 2005 - Cedric Benson 2004 - Philip Rivers 2003 - Dewayne Robertson 2002 - Mike Williams (The Bills lineman who came to Washington) 2001 - Justin Smith 2000 - Peter Warrick 1999 - Edgerrin James 1998 - Charles Woodson 1997 - Peter Boulware 1996 - Jonathan Ogden Not exactly a big list of whos who, but there are a few great players like Woodson and Ogden, but other than that you're looking at guys like Justin Smith or Ferguson, who are going to be solid. Now, you could just say its just bad use of draft picks on how many misses are here, but just thought I'd throw it out there that you can't always expect perennial pro-bowlers in the top 5 of a draft... Not saying Trent should just be a so-so guy, but if hes even just a solid starter for 10+ seasons, he'll be one of the better 4th overall picks in the last 20 seasons haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I mean I see it already, if he didnt have a desire to be good why would he come in down 12 pounds? In practices he was looking very good. Yes he had a bad game against the Colts but against the Steelers he had a good game. The weight lost is great but until he's consistent I'm still somewhat skeptical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dukes and Skins Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 The weight lost is great but until he's consistent I'm still somewhat skeptical. And I understand theres nothing wrong with the skepticism bud I just feel confident that he'll be someone we dont have to worry about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONAWARPATH Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Well technically if you look at the last few batch of 4th overall picks:2009 - Aaron Curry 2008 - Darren McFadden 2007 - Gaines Adams 2006 - D'Brickashaw Ferguson 2005 - Cedric Benson 2004 - Philip Rivers 2003 - Dewayne Robertson 2002 - Mike Williams (The Bills lineman who came to Washington) 2001 - Justin Smith 2000 - Peter Warrick 1999 - Edgerrin James 1998 - Charles Woodson 1997 - Peter Boulware 1996 - Jonathan Ogden That list doesn't make me feel very good. Edit: After looking at it a second time, that list isn't too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Exactly. And we aren't talking about one bad game, like samuels had against jared Allen. We are talking about a sub_par rookie year characterized by an unwillingness to put in the proper preperation (shannys words), repeated struggling against good passrushers, a no show offseason.... And now, we get to watch practice squad callups make him look straight stupid in his sophmore preseason. I guess some of you are content with that from your 4th overall pick. I'm expecting more, much more. He has all the physical tools and then some. He is running out of excuses (though not ballwashers, still has plenty of those) and he needs to pick his game up. He is one of the most highly compensated members of the 2011 Redskins and its time he started playing like it. We're also talking about a guy who Mike Shanahan and all his teammates have said is night and day different than the guy who ended last season, who all of his teammates say they have no beef with him for not showing up for offseason workouts, who dropped weight in the offseason and showed to camp in shape, who Mike Shanahan says has been performing and playing like a a pro, and had a pretty damn good game against the Steelers. He's also a guy who in the post game interview seemed completely embarrassed by his performance, not at all flippant or lacking in professionalism. If London Fletcher or Lorenzo Alexander or Chris Cooley don't have a problem with Trent not showing up for workouts, why the hell should we? If Mike says he's doing all the right things NOW, why continue to kvetch about what he did or didn't do in the past? Clearly he was not happy with his performance. I'll agree with you; he needs to become a lot more consistent, and if he's going to shut down (or at least temporarily tame) elite pass rushers, he shouldn't struggle against back-ups. Is it worthy of a "EFF YOU TRENT WILLIAMS, YOU HAD BETTER GET BETTER OR ELSE!" thread? No. Now if you'll excuse me, I have this bucket and sponge. I'm going to go wash Trent's balls now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Chris Samuels was light years ahead of where Trent is at this same point in their careers. Trent has much more natural ability then Chris had I think a lot of us had concerns about Forester (oline coach) when he was hired last season. His results have been "meh" thus far just like at every spot he has been as o-line coach (Baltimore and SF prior to coming here) My early prediction: If the o-line is "meh" all year long, in particular Trent, Shanahan makes an o-line coach change. I want to say Forester was his 3rd choice (behind Dennison and the guy who went to Seattle) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike21 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Dude gave up 11 sacks as a rookie I believe, which is a lot. He hasn't looked markedly improved at all so far in the preseason. I'm not saying that he is going to suck this year. But from draft day to today I think many of us can agree that we want/expect more. I agree with Zoony that he needs to pick it up soon because the fanbase won't have patience for a #4 player who doesn't produce......especially if the tag is because he doesn't work hard enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeKnowsBest Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I saw him interviewed by KJ after the game and he was pretty embarrassed about it. I think he'll be fine. At least it's happening during preseason.Meanwhile, glad we didn't draft Okung. He's injured again. With a performance like that, what's the difference? C'mon Trent. You're better than this! Silverback it up, man! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedlamVR Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 The OP is a massive over reaction to a poor game - and I love the comment along the lines of the stinking homers are the worst thing on this site . By stinking homers you are referring to anyone who disagrees with you - and the worst thing about this board is everyone goes to the "Hitler in Nazi Germany" defense when ever their opinion is threatened . It is supposed to be a discussion board where opinions are shared and debated - if the first response of your arguement is "straw man" or "jock sniffing homer" then maybe you are not looking for a debate . Going back the the gist of what you were saying - Trent did have a bad game . That said Freeny is the kind of speed rusher he struggles against (most LTs have had problems with Freeny in the past) . Chick has been impressing coaches in Indy and that kind of shows when he gets extended play with the starters . Fans get too hung up in where people were selected in the draft . The draft is no assessment of talent . Either a player has a good work attitude and a is a good player or he isnt - Is fletcher a good/outstanding player or a good player for an undrafted FA ? I can see Trent having a rough sophmore season, especially with no offseason - ( the player run camp socials don't count) but making improvements ... I think I would rather have Williams than any other OLT in the NFCE right now ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herb mul-key Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 i'm thinking rocky will get cut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Fans get too hung up in where people were selected in the draft . The draft is no assessment of talent . Either a player has a good work attitude and a is a good player or he isnt - Is fletcher a good/outstanding player or a good player for an undrafted FA? That's what I'm saying. I see a lot of "we drafted Trent #4, he should be this sort of player". We drafted him 4th overall because we went 4-12 and ended up getting the fourth selection overall, not because we moved up in the draft to get the guy. Chris Samuels retired, we needed a left tackle, Trent was more athletic and had more upside than Okung, on top of being a better fit for our scheme. Where a guy is selected in the draft is more indicative of where a team is before they draft a player than what the talent of the player is. Carolina didn't draft Cam Newton because Cam was the best player in the draft, nor does drafting Ryan Kerrigan 16th overall mean he's the 16th best player in the draft. You draft the best available player at the position of need you have, and everyone's draft board is completely and utterly different from everyone elses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s0crates Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Well I agree with zoony. Not only did Trent look bad against Indy, but he looked bad last year. Statistically, he was one of the worst starting LT's in the league last season. Maybe he should get a pass in his rookie season if he improves, but judging by last week he is not improving. Trent Williams is doing okay, but he is not living up to expectations or his own potential. So far, he has not been worth the draft pick or the contract. I think he can still be good, because he has great coaches and the physical tools, but he needs to step his game up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polywog999 Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I would not be surprised if they don't flip-flop Trent and Brown by game four. Trent Williams = purple cow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Lets not forget Trent Williams missed a nice chunk of games last year, which you never want from a rookie since you are hoping that will be their main time to learn and get game experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chump Bailey Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 I think Zoony's correct to be concerned about him. His feet are troublesome to me. He seems stiff and not nimble at all. I just don't see this elite athlete in Trent. A LT in the NFC has to play better than that. Maybe it's just one game. I hope so. ---------- Post added August-22nd-2011 at 06:26 AM ---------- Chris Samuels was light years ahead of where Trent is at this same point in their careers. Trent has much more natural ability then Chris hadI think a lot of us had concerns about Forester (oline coach) when he was hired last season. His results have been "meh" thus far just like at every spot he has been as o-line coach (Baltimore and SF prior to coming here) My early prediction: If the o-line is "meh" all year long, in particular Trent, Shanahan makes an o-line coach change. I want to say Forester was his 3rd choice (behind Dennison and the guy who went to Seattle) I hope he gets better as the season progresses. Right now though I'd say Brian Bulaga and Rodger Saffold are playing better than Trent. I am happy with what I see from Willie Smith and Locklear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 Trent Williams = purple cow. You think Trent is the factor which is going to make us remarkable? He needs to play much better than he did against the Colts for sure and he will. Whether he goes on to be the calibre of player he should be given his ability is another question - he can be as good as he wants to be and is prepared to work for. ---------- Post added August-22nd-2011 at 06:35 AM ---------- I think Zoony's correct to be concerned about him. His feet are troublesome to me. He seems stiff and not nimble at all. I just don't see this elite athlete in Trent. Disagree with this - his feet are fine and he is as athletic as advertised IMO - we have seen lots of examples of him making very good blocks in space and moving very well to lead runs or get out on screens. His issue is one of concentration and intensity IMO. The answer to his perfomance are between his own ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 22, 2011 Share Posted August 22, 2011 ...Disagree with this - his feet are fine and he is as athletic as advertised IMO - we have seen lots of examples of him making very good blocks in space and moving very well to lead runs or get out on screens. His issue is one of concentration and intensity IMO. The answer to his perfomance are between his own ears.I'm not so sure of this. His combination of size and speed can be deceptive. I don't see the reactions and agility needed to pass protect. And those nagging injuries can be a sign that he is being overpowered too often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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