brandymac27 Posted July 25, 2011 Author Share Posted July 25, 2011 Some outright steal it with fraudulent books and such, but this is one of the reasons, I think, that the prosperity gospel has become so popular with these types. If you're preaching such things, then naturally you need to model for the congregation, which doesn't bat an eye, because they're next, right? Yeah, that's a good point. But like the post below, there are people believing this garbage, and it's just sad to me that someone who is supposed to be a representative of God can mislead people and get away with it. We had one of those swindler kinds at my old church. He was a fat tub o' lard...couldn't stop talking about money, either. The congregation found out he was dirty and kicked him out. All the little old ladies were distraught. They bought his BS hook, line and sinker. Of course they bought into it. These are people we assume we can trust. That's what makes what they do horrible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Well you know, Jesus He Knows Me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s0crates Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Jesus entered the temple area and drove out all those engaged in selling and buying there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves.And he said to them, "It is written: 'My house shall be a house of prayer,' but you are making it a den of thieves." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 One of the HOF TV-angelists Some good pics here http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&cp=22&gs_id=p&xhr=t&q=televangelist+cartoons&nord=1&biw=1440&bih=785&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&ion=1&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I did in my college days. But that was only because I was recording a bunch of them for footage to use in my video project blasting religion and the corruption surrounding it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I used :google: Is this the dude...Mike Murdock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardi gras skin Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 So basically, these "donations" are really feeding these peoples bank accounts? Sickening. I'm not opposed to preachers making some money for their service, but making so much money you're riding around in Limos everyday, etc is just wrong IMO. A good minister is going make some really stupid business decisions. He isn't going to suck up to the big tithers. He isn't going to choose "production value" over the character of the people involved in presenting the good news. He's going to choose to sit with the one person who's alone rather mingle with the many well-adjusted people who are having a good time. He isn't going to shy away from confrontation and he won't be a bully when its time to confront. For all these reasons and more, I think its best for a pastor to just be poor. He and his family need to be skilled scavengers, knowing how to live frugally without becoming embittered. $5 bang bang shrimp date night at Bone Fish on Wednesdays. Kids eat free on Tuesdays at Tony Roma's and there's a delicious $15 steak dinner that you and your wife can share. Groupon, Chewpon, Living Social, Baltimore Restore, various consignment shops, Aldi's, craigslist. There are a myriad ways to enjoy good things on a fraction of the cost, liberating the minister from the need for a big paycheck. Whenever a new minister (usually a church planter) comes into our area this is the thing we spend the most time talking about. They usually feel good about scrimping now, but sometime around year 7 they start to feel entitled to make as much money as the rest of the people in their congregation. They may be right, but its a suckers entitlement. I haven't seen a minister make a big bump in pay and remain as happy as he was when he first started out. edit: And yeah. Televangelists are the most grotesque imitations of ministers I've ever seen. Like you Brandy, I've been really impressed with the first half of a sermon I heard. Very well thought out, inspiring, and on point. And then, sometimes you can't put your finger on the moment it happened, the sermon flips to a self promotion video. Somehow, the first half of the sermon creates an imperative for you to send them as much money as you can. They use the bible to swindle people. That's low. I understand Jesus' rage when he confronted the money changers. I don't know what I'd do if met one of these guys. I'm sure it would be embarrassing for my wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllWorldSkinFan Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 My favorite is Creflo Dollar. I keep praying that I can send his ministry more money to increase my own prosperity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointyfootball Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Anytime I see one of those televangelists, I either think of Steve martin, or this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kck3TbiI1QQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I've seen these guys occasionally...my wife and I flipped one of them on randomly one morning, and the guy was in a "trance" of some sort because God was putting a number in his brain, and it was something like $30,000, and he needed people to help get them there, or some garbage. We couldn't believe anyone would fall for this crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointyfootball Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 A good minister is going make some really stupid business decisions. He isn't going to suck up to the big tithers. He isn't going to choose "production value" over the character of the people involved in presenting the good news. He's going to choose to sit with the one person who's alone rather mingle with the many well-adjusted people who are having a good time. He isn't going to shy away from confrontation and he won't be a bully when its time to confront.For all these reasons and more, I think its best for a pastor to just be poor. He and his family need to be skilled scavengers, knowing how to live frugally without becoming embittered. $5 bang bang shrimp date night at Bone Fish on Wednesdays. Kids eat free on Tuesdays at Tony Roma's and there's a delicious $15 steak dinner that you and your wife can share. Groupon, Chewpon, Living Social, Baltimore Restore, various consignment shops, Aldi's, craigslist. There are a myriad ways to enjoy good things on a fraction of the cost, liberating the minister from the need for a big paycheck. While I despise clergy living high-off-the-hog, I also don't think they, and their family, should have to live at a level close to poverty. There is enough pressure on families of pastors, that financial stress needn't be added. It is a job and they should have some financial security (including retirement), although I do think a "good" pastor is not ever going to be rich. It is the responsibility of the congregation to provide for his/her salary so that they can focus on their work with the congregation/ministries. My grandfather was a pastor and my BIL is as well. Both of them were/are excellent at their job IMO. They never bought a new car or house, went on fancy vacations, and often times had second jobs to help provide for their families. With my BIL, especially, it was a 24/7 job, in which he was expected to drop everything to answer a phone call, make hospital visits, talk to troubled teen, etc., and he normally did all of this, and more because he loved his work, but I know at times he was frustrated b/c some congregations didn't care about how stressful it was for him and his family financially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardi gras skin Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Yeah, I used to think the same thing. But the upside of making less money than most everyone else in your church is pretty attractive. I'm free to make decisions based on ideals rather than a mixture of self interest. And I can speak with a higher degree of credibility when it comes to self-sacrifice that I couldn't manage if I were paid very well. And it helps that I can find a half dozen jobs in the area making the same amount of money if I really tick someone off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD0506 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 But doesn't God deserve the best? Doesn't God deserve to have the very best? Shouldn't God have a gold Bentley with upholstery made from baby seals, with HD flatscreens around the hot tub in the back? Yes he should! And he said I could drive it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Anyone stupid enough to give them money deserves to be ripped off like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I was flipping channels once and I saw Jerry Falwell praying for......a parking lot. I thought God how far from the scriptures has this guy gotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Damn Brandy, you just now figured out that televenanglism is a scam? Better late then never, i guess. As long as you didn't send any money... It's amazing what these people can get away with. They represent the absolute lowest of the low. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'Em84 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I saw Jan Crouch once as a kid. I had nightmares for a week...never really watched TV evangelists after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointyfootball Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Anyone stupid enough to give them money deserves to be ripped off like that. Unfortunately, I agree. People shouldn't give ANY money to any organization unless they feel confident that they know where the money will be used and are comfortable with that usage. My church's board annually releases the budget and where funds are used. Charities advertise what % of money they take in is used for the administrative costs. True they can still scam it, but much less likely than one of these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeknows Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 2ESWRtaHNU8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 I thought Jim Bakker was the king of all these guys back in the day. EDIT: I think he still owes the IRS millions, but somehow has adopted a few kids since he got out of jail. How is this possible ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techboy Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Another factor that's important to remember is that nationwide broadcasting, especially on television, is expensive. Generally, these people pay their stations, not the other way around, and that takes a lot of money. That is probably how the INSP owner is so rich. That leads even the good ones, I suspect, to focus more on money than they should, and it also attracts quite a few of the less honorable types, as one would expect. This is, of course, hardly a new phenomenon, as the moneychanger story cited earlier makes clear. Television is especially bad. The only television personality I can think of that doesn't seem to have been effected by this is Billy Graham, and I'm not even sure he's really a TV personality per se. I'm sure there are a few others, but I don't know who they are off the top of my head. My favorite is Creflo Dollar. I keep praying that I can send his ministry more money to increase my own prosperity. Creflo Dollar Jr. is another offender, and what's funny about it (in a sick way) is that even his name screams scam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 My favorite is Dr. Jack Van Impe. He's so happy that the End of Times is near. It's amazing how he can take any scrap of news and relate it as a sign of the return of Christ. Oh, and by the way, don't forget to buy his DVD(s). Ba7jGqRTKQU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techboy Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 My favorite is Dr. Jack Van Impe. Well, to be fair, I think of Jack Van Impe as in a different category. I watch him occasionally, mostly because he makes me laugh, but I don't recall him really hammering the money angle. I could be wrong, though. He practices what I call "Newspaper eschatology"... he'll literally open a newspaper and try to tie it to end times prophecy... He's been going at it for years now, and doesn't seem at all phased by continually being wrong. He seems sincere, at least to me, though. *EDIT* I just realized why I've been seeing him for years... he's based in Michigan, and my grandparents live in his home town. That's where I first saw him on TV years ago, and I'll bet that he was broadcasting locally. But hey, you've got to give it up to him. He's an Ig Nobel Laureate in Astrophysics: ASTROPHYSICSDr. Jack and Rexella Van Impe of Jack Van Impe Ministries, Rochester Hills, Michigan, for their discovery that black holes fulfill all the technical requirements to be the location of Hell. [REFERENCE: The March 31, 2001 television and Internet broadcast of the "Jack Van Impe Presents" program. (at about the 12 minute mark). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Creflo Dollar Jr. is another offender, and what's funny about it (in a sick way) is that even his name screams scam. A man named Creflo Dollar has to live in a nice house. Google Images brought this up... On a completely unrelated note, I'm changing careers. God has given me a vision Techboy....I just need to set up a 1-800 number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 My favorite is Dr. Jack Van Impe.He's so happy that the End of Times is near. It's amazing how he can take any scrap of news and relate it as a sign of the return of Christ. Oh, and by the way, don't forget to buy his DVD(s). [YOUTUBE]B] I like Jack Van Impe. The man is like Denzel Washington in the Book of Eli, where he has the bible pretty much memorized. He also talks about things like the New World Order and Bilderberg Group, two subjects I find interesting. He doesn't beg for money or promise that you will be healed of your affliction if you give him money. He writes books and makes dvds which he sells on his show to fund his operations. There is nothing wrong with creating a product that some find value with and selling it. He recently pulled his show from TBN because of a feud with Paul Crouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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