daveakl Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Just now, PleaseBlitz said: Do you think that’s it? I know it’s hard for Americans to understand a person actively wanting a religious fundamentalist government, but that is what the majority of middle eastern countries have. As soon as our military left, the country fell in a week, you really think people there don’t want the Taliban? I think a lot do not. But I also get the mentality of keeping your head down and working to get your family out to a better situation. You could make a pretty good argument that about 1/3rd of our elected officials are religious fundamentals. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 1 minute ago, daveakl said: I think a lot do not. But I also get the mentality of keeping your head down and working to get your family out to a better situation. You could make a pretty good argument that about 1/3rd of our elected officials are religious fundamentals. A fair point and I think probably well over 1/3 of our elected officials. I think it’s up for debate, and I don’t think Afghanistan is “governed” or “governable” in the same sense as the US, but I suspect most Afghanis are cool with the Taliban taking over. And I am a ****ing atheist, the Taliban is abhorrent to me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said: A fair point and I think probably well over 1/3 of our elected officials. I think it’s up for debate, and I don’t think Afghanistan is “governed” or “governable” in the same sense as the US, but I suspect most Afghanis are cool with the Taliban taking over. And I am a ****ing atheist, the Taliban is abhorrent to me. I still doubt its "most". Maybe 20~30%? But then say maybe 10~20% are totally opposed to it and willing to die to stop it and the other 50-70% just want to stay alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Afghanistan will be in a civil war within 6 months. Get our people and our stuff out and let them do what they have always done. Just keep a wary eye on who comes and goes. Simple right? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 18 minutes ago, daveakl said: I still doubt its "most". Maybe 20~30%? But then say maybe 10~20% are totally opposed to it and willing to die to stop it and the other 50-70% just want to stay alive. What are you basing that on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 9 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said: Afghanistan will be in a civil war within 6 months. Get our people and our stuff out and let them do what they have always done. Just keep a wary eye on who comes and goes. Simple right? The panjshir stuff is interesting what little we known maybe the government has to fall so the people make something they’ll fight for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveakl Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 9 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said: What are you basing that on? My kids elementary school has a fairly large middle eastern population. Listening to them talk about where they are from / what they have been through. But its also a lot of 1st generation or families that are still working to become Americans so maybe its a distorted view. I dont know to many Taliban sympathizers here tbh. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Thread Unroll 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 35 minutes ago, daveakl said: My kids elementary school has a fairly large middle eastern population. Listening to them talk about where they are from / what they have been through. But its also a lot of 1st generation or families that are still working to become Americans so maybe its a distorted view. I dont know to many Taliban sympathizers here tbh. Lol Yea. I guess i want to hear from people that live in Afghanistan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Some countries are more used to a being a certain way. Having said that, it's not like Afghanistan has a high gun ownership rate in its rural areas if they aren't taliban. Places like Kabul are definitely more progressive then the rural areas. I believe folks in Kabul have said and shown enough they don't want this, but are surrounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 People are really gonna stick with “Biden dealt a bad hand and did the best he could”??? https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/21/politics/us-weapons-arsenal-taliban-afghanistan/index.html destroying those weapons would have been relatively easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redskins59 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 The Northern Alliance is grabbing some territories from the Taliban. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 6 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: People are really gonna stick with “Biden dealt a bad hand and did the best he could”??? https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/21/politics/us-weapons-arsenal-taliban-afghanistan/index.html destroying those weapons would have been relatively easy. Until it was clear that much of the Afghan security forces wouldn't fight back, US couldn't destroy the weapons as that would've crippled the security forces. Once it was clear they wouldn't fight back, it was too late. Though it sucks, apparently the aircrafts and vehicles are relatively old technology. It's not like we should be concerned that they could end up divulging classified intel. And Taliban would likely need foreign help just to maintain and keep them operational in the long term. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 7 hours ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said: People are really gonna stick with “Biden dealt a bad hand and did the best he could”??? https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/21/politics/us-weapons-arsenal-taliban-afghanistan/index.html destroying those weapons would have been relatively easy. dealt a bad hand? Absolutely. Anyone post-Bush gets that out did the best he could? Well. No, with the caveat there’s a ton of info we don’t have because we’re limited to public knowledge. I’m willing to accept the idea the the Biden administration crafted a terrible plan as much as I’m willing to accept they knew this was likely but put the best public face on it to give it the best chance. There is nothing I hate worse than people who obviously have access to a fraction of the information, pretending they have it all and hindsight ridiculing decision making. Which is pretty much standard operating g procedure for the average civilian. See: covid; Or any foreign policy matter; or really anything that requires expertise and actually knowledge with access to privileged information One thing is clear - the least important conversation to be having is the blame game for the current situation. And if you look around, you’ll likely find the people focused on that (not just making a comment, but seemingly only focusing on this aspect) are the same ones with low-information yet strong opinions on the matter. Hell most of them don’t seem to have a grip on more than a fraction of the publicly available information… pretty easy way to evaluate the quality if one’s opinion. 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sisko Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 8 hours ago, Renegade7 said: Places like Kabul are definitely more progressive then the rural areas. I believe folks in Kabul have said and shown enough they don't want this, but are surrounded. Just like living in Atlanta. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 2 hours ago, The Sisko said: Just like living in Atlanta. Taliban is VERY offended to be compared to folks in rural GA 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, tshile said: There is nothing I hate worse than people who obviously have access to a fraction of the information, pretending they have it all and hindsight ridiculing decision making. Yada yada yada. The intelligence was pretty clear according to reports. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/17/us/politics/afghanistan-biden-administration.amp.html Now Biden says he didn’t see it. Edited August 21, 2021 by CousinsCowgirl84 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 (edited) Never mind Edited August 21, 2021 by tshile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Wait, so our intelligence services are good now? I was told in no uncertain terms that they were terrible just last week. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: Wait, so our intelligence services are good now? I was told in no uncertain terms that they were terrible just last week. Knowing when to trust the deep state is very complicated. Edited August 21, 2021 by Corcaigh 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: Wait, so our intelligence services are good now? I was told in no uncertain terms that they were terrible just last week. Terrible and good. But also sort of a pathetic response. On the other hand, I hire a mechanic to work on my car and expect him to know if he can changes the oil he will need to change the oil filter. It is his job. The president has a job too. He should know things. It doesn’t appear that he did, that’s for sure. Edited August 21, 2021 by CousinsCowgirl84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, tshile said: Never mind 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 Remember back in 2018 or so when CC84 used to just randomly post iPhone screencaps of Trumps approval rating? Such good times! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CousinsCowgirl84 Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 1 minute ago, TryTheBeal! said: Remember back in 2018 or so when CC84 used to just randomly post iPhone screencaps of Trumps approval rating? Such good times! Irrelevant. And what exactly were we debating when I posted the screenshots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabbyrwock Posted August 21, 2021 Share Posted August 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, Corcaigh said: Knowing when to trust the deep state if very complicated. Repeat after me: " I will always trust the deep state " Again: " I will always trust the deep state " Carry on citizen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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