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The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

BRAVEONAWARPATH

By BRAVEONAWARPATH
in The Tailgate

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No Excuses

No Excuses

Posted
Posted
In theory I like what you are saying, but I have the same concerns as Fight4RGIII - shouldn't we be suspicious if OKC would rather have Beal than Harden? Why not just take Beal ourselves?

If the motivation for trading Harden for Beal from OKC's end is purely financial, I suppose I can understand. I just don't get why we would want to trade Beal instead of taking him for ourselves if he's supposed to be better than Harden, talent-wise.

If it was a matter of talent, then OKC would keep Harden. The only SG's who had a better PER than Harden were Wade, Kobe and Ginobili. Now PER can be a useless stat for some positions, but it's a fairly good indicator for SG's.

James Harden is a TERRIFIC player. I'm going to be ecstatic if we trade for him and I'll likely revise my opinion of that horrendous Okafor and Ariza trade. This team badly needs a scorer and shooter like Harden.

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TaylorPickSix

TaylorPickSix

Posted
Posted
If it was a matter of talent, then OKC would keep Harden. The only SG's who had a better PER than Harden were Wade, Kobe and Ginobili. Now PER can be a useless stat for some positions, but it's a fairly good indicator for SG's.

James Harden is a TERRIFIC player. I'm going to be ecstatic if we trade for him and I'll likely revise my opinion of that horrendous Okafor and Ariza trade. This team badly needs a scorer and shooter like Harden.

That's true. I'm not sure what his actual stats were and I'm too lazy to look at the moment, but he seemed absolutely deadly from beyond the arc during the playoffs. I know he hit a couple cold streaks in the finals.

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No Excuses

No Excuses

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Posted
That's true. I'm not sure what his actual stats were and I'm too lazy to look at the moment, but he seemed absolutely deadly from beyond the arc during the playoffs. I know he hit a couple cold streaks in the finals.

I think his finals performance dropped his stock a bit, and he may have even soured on the OKC brass.

This is interesting to me because I think this potentially might be the best deal OKC can get for him. It's not a given that another team in next years top 3 will have such a glaring need for a clear #2 option.

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Mr Awesome

Mr Awesome

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Anyone going to that draft party tomorrow? I thought it looked kinda cool...will probably head there after work for a drink or two....check out the cheerleaders, etc. Not too excited about our potential pick though.

All this draft talk and no one is going? For shame Wizard fans...for shame :(

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Mr Awesome

Mr Awesome

Posted
Posted (edited)
As I said, I have VIP tickets. And I STILL have one extra one. It's become depressing trying to give this **** away. If anyone is interested, PM me.

How much do you want for it and what do you get with it? *fingers crossed it involves sexual activity with a Wiz cheerleader to be!* :fingersx:

Edited by Mr Awesome
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G.A.C.O.L.B.

G.A.C.O.L.B.

Posted
Posted
How much do you want for it and what do you get with it? *fingers crossed it involves sexual activity with a Wiz cheerleader to be!* :fingersx:

I don't want **** for it. I'm just trying to find someone to ride with (or meet me there). I've had multiple people take it and then fake on me hours later. Free food, free drink and you get to hobnob with ex-players and other local celebs.

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Mr Awesome

Mr Awesome

Posted
Posted (edited)
I don't want **** for it. I'm just trying to find someone to ride with (or meet me there). I've had multiple people take it and then fake on me hours later. Free food, free drink and you get to hobnob with ex-players and other local celebs.

I'm down like Charlie Brown. I can meet you there after work.

Edited by Mr Awesome
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Going Commando

Going Commando

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Posted
You give Harden a max deal, he's 27/28 when it expires. Harden is every bit as good of a ball-handler as GInobili. He can do EVERYTHING the same as him. Now, I will give you that he's not as good of a defender, but on the offensive end there isn't much of a difference.
That's crazy talk. The guy who can't go right is as good a ball handler as one of the absolute best in the business? You've lost perspective on Harden RA. You aren't seeing his flaws.
And FWIW, in this current CBA, James Harden is a max-contract type of player.
Harden is a third option sixth man on a good team coming off a year where he averaged 17 PPG. What screams max contract about that to you? You are wildly overrating him.

The only time a team signs a player to a max type deal and doesn't almost immediately regret it is when that player is a Superstar wing or a perennial All Star scoring big. Harden is neither of those things and never will be. Sign a guy to a max deal who isn't worth it and it ruins your franchise for years.

Speaking of Joe Johnson, there isn't a chance in hell I'm taking JJ over Harden right now. One is on the decline, and the other is on the upswing. Also, I'd be willing to revisit this when Harden reaches his prime....but, I have ZERO doubt that he'll be 10x the better player than JJ when comparing careers.

Harden has a very long way to go before he reaches JJ's level. JJ is a six time All Star, has been the go to guy on his team, has had multiple 20+ PPG seasons and has been a hair away from multiple 20/5/5 seasons, and is a high quality defender against every perimeter position.

Harden's upside isn't as high as you think RA. He's a below average athlete for his position, which limits him. He'll become a better defender and probably become a better ball handler in time, but other than that, he's not going to get a whole lot better than he is now. And one thing is for sure, he'll never be in a better position than he is right now, playing third fiddle to two great young offensive players in OKC.

---------- Post added June-28th-2012 at 12:37 PM ----------

As I said, I have VIP tickets. And I STILL have one extra one. It's become depressing trying to give this **** away. If anyone is interested, PM me.

It's times like this I wish I lived in the D.C. area. I would have probably be interested in going but I knew I could never make it up there from down here.

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Lombardi's_kid_brother

Lombardi's_kid_brother

Posted
Posted (edited)

The Thunder are clearly looking to sell high on Harden. If you can turn a player that you are probably losing next year anyway into a top 4 pick in a loaded draft...well....bully for you.

The thing for the Thunder is they don't have to worry about all the things the Wizards are worrying about. Who cares if MKG can't shoot? Who cares if Barnes is a bit of a head case? They are going to be asking supremely talented players to be the 4th or 5th guy on a Championship Level team. The Wizards would need MKG to make five all star teams. The Thunder would need him to annoy Kobe or Wayne over a seven game series. Which one of those has the better chance of occurring?

Edited by Lombardi's_kid_brother
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WhoRUSupposed2Be

WhoRUSupposed2Be

Posted
Posted
From Chad Ford, via BF:

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2012/6/28/3123241/nba-mock-draft-2012-chad-ford-wizards#comments

If possible and if the b-ball Gods are on our side, the Wizards will trade the #3/#32 with Charlotte for the #2. They would then trade the #2 (plus filler) to OKC for Harden.

This would be the absolute best-case scenario tonight, and one that would (and should) leave Wizards fans VERY happy.

Whatttttt? Are you serious?

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Hersh

Hersh

Posted
Posted (edited)
With any NBA draft, anything in the top 5 should be star players, especially at 3. At 6 and 11, there should be growing pains. Example: Luck and Griffin are projected immediate starters and stars. Tannehill at 8 has questions and may not even start.

Unfortunately that's not how the NBA works. If it did, the Wizards wouldn't be in the lottery still. In the NBA, it's rare that more than a couple of players in any draft become all-star level players.

I'm going to start to temper my excitement about getting Beal, let alone Harden. I'm gonna start thinking worst case scenario and we trade our #3 pick for Metta World Peace thus anything better than that with the Wizards tonight and I'm happy.

Edited by Hersh
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Rocky21

Rocky21

Posted
Posted

if Beal is off the board, the Wizards have talked to teams about moving down to Nos. 5, 7, 8 or 9.

The Sacramento Kings, Golden State Warriors, Toronto Raptors and Detroit Pistons hold the 5, 7, 8 and 9 selections. My best guess (and I stress guess here) is that the Wizards would probably look to include Andray Blatche in any trade-down scenario.

If we trade the # 3 pick for a later pick and Andre Blatche we have lost our ****ing minds!

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Hersh

Hersh

Posted
Posted
I don't want **** for it. I'm just trying to find someone to ride with (or meet me there). I've had multiple people take it and then fake on me hours later. Free food, free drink and you get to hobnob with ex-players and other local celebs.

I would be there in a heartbeat but I'm down in Raleigh, NC. Any of you guys in the DC area need to be all over this offer.

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Going Commando

Going Commando

Posted
Posted

Gearing up for two years of mid to late seed playoff runs with Wall + Harden +Ariza + Okafor + Nene does not get me excited. That's our offseason?

All we've succeeded in doing is going from terrible with potential to thoroughly and permanently mediocre until we have to deconstruct our roster all over again in a few years.

I liked a question I saw a fan pose in an article on BF: WWOKCD? What would OKC do? That's the question we should ask ourselves with personnel moves because they provide the model for building sustainable contention. OKC would not do this. They'd be using us to do the opposite of this.

Also, did it occur to anyone that a trade for Harden would mean a trade without an extension because we couldn't afford to trade for him following an extension with our cap room? Or is OKC supposed to take back Emeka Okafor's deal in this? Next season we can't afford to max him out either because we have no cap room. What an untenable risk to take on when we're gifted with the third pick in a loaded class.

I don't want us to always be helping to build winners in other cities. Minny and New Orleans are enough for me.

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Going Commando

Going Commando

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Posted

If we trade three and some young players for Harden let's take stock on the offseason:

--We had the single most valuable expiring contract in the NBA

--We had the third overall pick in a loaded class

And we would have come away with James Harden, Emeka Okafor, and Trevor Ariza out of that--all with only one to two years of team control for each.

Is no one else in agreement that's a horrible offseason? Our expectations can't be that bottom barrel.

We'd have had four straight seasons of top 6 picks and the only sustainable thing we took away from it all was John Wall and Jan Vesely. That's pathetic.

---------- Post added June-28th-2012 at 01:03 PM ----------

Or Charlotte isn't confident that he'll sign an extension with them

Perhaps. But then how is their situation different from ours?

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