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The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

BRAVEONAWARPATH

By BRAVEONAWARPATH
in The Tailgate

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StillUnknown

StillUnknown

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

We're in an alternate timeline. It really was supposed to be Cavs/Wizards in the conf. finals.

 

in my alternate timeline, we are the Warriors

 

its frightening to think about how many of their players could have very easily been Wizards

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Kosher Ham

Kosher Ham

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10 minutes ago, StillUnknown said:

 

in my alternate timeline, we are the Warriors

 

its frightening to think about how many of their players could have very easily been Wizards

 

Bullets have traded away or let go of so many players over the years that went on to be Champions. Same thing the Clippers used to do. 

Amazingly both are relevant teams in spite of that. 

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BRAVEONAWARPATH

BRAVEONAWARPATH

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Posted (edited)

 

 

From league sources close to the situation, Wall wants to see a bigger picture plan on where the franchise is headed before committing for longer. The Wizards won 49 games this season and advanced to the conference semifinals for the third time in four years

Edited by BRAVEONAWARPATH
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Llevron

Llevron

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Do they front load contracts in the NBA like they do in the NFL? 

 

If so signing a guy like Wall that we KNOW we want no matter what now to get some of the money out of the way when......other players......become available later in 2018 is a smart move. 

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StillUnknown

StillUnknown

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3 minutes ago, Llevron said:

Do they front load contracts in the NBA like they do in the NFL? 

 

If so signing a guy like Wall that we KNOW we want no matter what now to get some of the money out of the way when......other players......become available later in 2018 is a smart move. 

 

not really, its relatively evenly split over the years with slight raises every year to reflect what is usually a growing salary cap

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bearrock

bearrock

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13 minutes ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said:
 

From league sources close to the situation, Wall wants to see a bigger picture plan on where the franchise is headed before committing for longer. The Wizards won 49 games this season and advanced to the conference semifinals for the third time in four years

 

Code word for "I wanna make sure Ernie is gone before I commit."

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Going Commando

Going Commando

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Llevron said:

Do they front load contracts in the NBA like they do in the NFL? 

 

If so signing a guy like Wall that we KNOW we want no matter what now to get some of the money out of the way when......other players......become available later in 2018 is a smart move. 

 

Still had the right answer, just wanted to expand on it a little.  The NBA isn't like the NFL because the max contracts are set to a scale.  You can't front load them, and the annual raises are set at either 4.5% or 7.5% depending on the situation.  Year one of the deal is set at either 25, 30, or 35% of whatever the cap ends up being for that season, and the raises kick in to determine the subsequent years.  The way you determine that 25/30/35 % is by the number of years of veterancy the player has when the contract begins.  If it's less than 7 = 25%, from 7 to 9 = 30%, 10 or more = 35%.

 

The reason the Wizards want to sign John to an extension this summer is because he just made an All NBA team and thus he's now eligible for the designated veteran player extension (DPE).  That's six years and a 35% max.  If the Wizards waited until the next summer or the summer of 2019 to try and extend him, Wall could lose his eligibility for the DPE by not making an All NBA team in the prior season.  Wall hits free agency in 2019 with only 9 years of veterancy, meaning we could only offer him a 5 year 30% max contract.  Other teams could offer him 4 years and 30%, so our advantage of being able to offer him 6 and 35% becomes significantly less.

 

That's why we want to get the extension done now.  It wouldn't kick in until his current contract is done.  And it would mean Wall's first 15 seasons were with the Wizards, it would basically lock him up for the rest of his career.  There is absolutely no doubt on our end--we know we want him to be our guy for the remainder of his career.  And I think Wall ultimately signs the extension because turning it down could mean he loses a staggering amount of money, even if he continues playing well and commands a max contract on the open market.  The DPE contract that John signs this summer could end up being for 250 million dollars!  Just ballparking, but a 5 year 30% max deal could be for like 70 million dollars less.  A 4 year 30% max with 4.5% raises (the most he could command from other teams) could be for like 150 million less.  Only an insane person would walk away from that.  Especially if he doesn't have a fat shoe deal and a ton of endorsements to supplement his earnings.

Edited by stevemcqueen1
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Going Commando

Going Commando

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4 hours ago, bearrock said:

 

Code word for "I wanna make sure Ernie is gone before I commit."

 

I don't think that's what he means.  Wall isn't really the type to get people fired.  I think what he wants is for the team to come to him with a plan to go after Paul George or DeMarcus Cousins.

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bearrock

bearrock

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4 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I don't think that's what he means.  Wall isn't really the type to get people fired.  I think what he wants is for the team to come to him with a plan to go after Paul George or DeMarcus Cousins.

I think you're right (moreso on Cousins than George).  But I can dream right? :806:

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The Sisko

The Sisko

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Posted
4 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

...And I think Wall ultimately signs the extension because turning it down could mean he loses a staggering amount of money, even if he continues playing well and commands a max contract on the open market...Only an insane person would walk away from that.  Especially if he doesn't have a fat shoe deal and a ton of endorsements to supplement his earnings.

No. I think in recent years top players feel that possibly losing an extra $20 million bucks or so to avoid spending your entire post NBA career in the broadcast booth taking hits on the air for not having any rings is a worthwhile tradeoff. I think that's a lot of the dynamic behind player built super teams. Wall has made 85 mill on his current contract. At that point a few more or less million here or there isn't going to make him or break him.

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Gamebreaker

Gamebreaker

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I think it's obvious Wall wants his boy Cousins playing with him. I think he'd prefer D.C., but with the wack bench that Ernie brought last offseason, and the difficulty this franchise has had bringing in quality FAs, I don't think he'd be opposed to joining Demarcus somewhere else. 

 

He's dead serious that he won't sign an extension here if he doesn't believe the organization can build a contending roster. This should be, if there has ever been, a big flashy, glowing billboard to Ted that Ernie needs to be replaced. 

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Going Commando

Going Commando

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27 minutes ago, The Sisko said:

No. I think in recent years top players feel that possibly losing an extra $20 million bucks or so to avoid spending your entire post NBA career in the broadcast booth taking hits on the air for not having any rings is a worthwhile tradeoff. I think that's a lot of the dynamic behind player built super teams. Wall has made 85 mill on his current contract. At that point a few more or less million here or there isn't going to make him or break him.

 

It's not just a few million less.  If Wall turned down a DPE contract to sign a 4 year 30% max with 4.5 raises, you're probably talking about walking away from 130 million dollars.

 

Let's do the math.  Say 2019 has a 109 million dollar cap.  That's the current projection.  If it holds:

 

A max deal from another team would pay out 32.7 +  34.2 + 35.7 + 37.3 = 139.9 million

 

A DPE contract from us would pay out 38.2 + 41 + 44.1 + 47.5 + 51 + 54.8 = 276.6 million

 

Dwight Howard walked away from about 30 million dollars to leave the Lakers for the Rockets.  That ended up being a disaster for him.  Nobody else has walked away from anywhere close to that amount of money before.

 

This could be Wall's only shot at a DPE too.  If he gets hurt and misses an All NBA team next year, then it's off the table next summer.  Likewise for his final season under contract.  There are all sorts of other bad things beyond his control that could happen too.  The bubble fueled by the potentially disastrous TV deal that ESPN and TNT signed with the NBA could burst and the cap could stop growing or even decline.

 

Wall is also the only star player without a shoe deal and he doesn't have any other major endorsement deals like most of his peers.  He doesn't have the spare earnings outside of his NBA contract.

 

If we offer him the DPE, he's going to sign it.

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The Sisko

The Sisko

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

4 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

It's not just a few million less.  If Wall turned down a DPE contract to sign a 4 year 30% max with 4.5 raises, you're probably talking about walking away from 130 million dollars.

 

Let's do the math.  Say 2019 has a 109 million dollar cap.  That's the current projection.  If it holds:

 

A max deal from another team would pay out 32.7 +  34.2 + 35.7 + 37.3 = 139.9 million

 

A DPE contract from us would pay out 38.2 + 41 + 44.1 + 47.5 + 51 + 54.8 = 276.6 million...

 

...If we offer him the DPE, he's going to sign it.

I don't disagree with you that he probably would. Yes almost $140 mill is a hell of a lot of cheddar to leave on the table. However, if he can't set himself and his entire family up for life with the $85 mill he has now plus the $140 mill he'd get for the smaller contract plus whatever "crumbs" he might earn afterwards, he's doin' it rong. And yes, I am taking the taxes, agent's cut, etc. into account. So let's say he takes the smaller contract. What could the guy who took the extra $$ buy that he couldn't? And even if there is something the other guy can buy that Wall can't, having a ring would be a big equalizer. Among these guys, everybody's got $$ but only a select few have a ring.

 

 

 

Edited by The Sisko
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Destino

Destino

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8 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Wall doesn't strike me as the type to want to go and form a super team. I think he legitimately wants to build something here in D.C. But its not like I know the guy personally so who knows...

He's one player away from building one here.  He just needs to talk Ted into firing Ernie and Paul George into signing with the Wizards. 

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TheItalianStallion

TheItalianStallion

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I hope Mahinmi can stay healthy this coming year and we don't have to ride Gortat so hard during the early part of the year. I'm still holding out some hope that Gortat's struggles late in the season and into the playoffs were just a product of being worn down after all the minutes he played early on rather than him starting an irreversible decline.

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Burgold

Burgold

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So, going into "what if" land... What if the Wiz didn't tank a year ago and stink. What if they didn't play like it was a filler year that didn't matter on the hopes of signing Durant? If Durant had seen these Wizards with Wall, Beal, and Porter would he have considered us over Golden State? The Eastern Finals could have been the hometown series with Durant coming home and James repping Cleveland.

 

Okay, maybe it still wouldn't have happened, but if they hadn't thrown out the year with all those one year contracts and the knowledge that it was just a garbage year no one cared about... who knows? The Wiz after this playoffs are certainly more attractive to free agents than last year when they couldn't seduce anybody and lost out on every name they chased.

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