CNN.com / MSNBC: Shootings, multiple deaths reported at Fort Hood (MET; Merged)

[SnyderShrugged]

I'm greatly saddened by these events. I have some friends that live there and they were so scared yesterday. Many. many prayers for all who have been impacted personally in this.

[Rocky21]

Man, what is with Virginia Tech and all the ties to violence? Some kind of crazy coincidence I guess.

[Zguy28]

Wow, this is an interesting quote from the brother of one of the surviving victims :

“They shot me! And I’m still here in this country!” Dustin Bono quoted his sister as saying.

Interesting choice of the word "they"

Interesting indeed since the news is reporting that the shooter wanted out of the Army because he has been harassed as a Muslim since 9/11. They are also reporting that some witnesses believe they heard him yelling "God is Great!" in Arabic during the shooting.

[Titaw]

He will be tried in both. Military first then civilian. Oh and the Death Penalty is almost a slam dunk because his act will be considered treason and under the UCMJ (Unifocrm Code of Military Justice) it is punishable by death. Not to mention that if he luck boxes past the death penalty in military court he has to face the Texas court system so, like I said, the death penalty is pretty much a slam dunk.

[SnyderShrugged]

some sobering pictures...

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-beat/Dramatic-Photos-Fort-Hood-Shooting-69319852.html

[SkinsTerps26]

please don't ignore the fact that he has mental issues.

race/beliefs are not the issue here as much as knowing how to properly identify those individuals with mental health issues, this is what this tragedy should be about. just like the vtech shooter.

not defending him in the slightest, but i would hope this doesn't turn into a bashing of islam, and more importantly, muslim americans.

[Heisenberg]

please don't ignore the fact that he has mental issues.

race/beliefs are not the issue here as much as knowing how to properly identify those individuals with mental health issues, this is what this tragedy should be about. just like the vtech shooter.

not defending him in the slightest, but i would hope this doesn't turn into a bashing of islam, and more importantly, muslim americans.

Too late for my cousins that are in the Army. :doh:

I respect the hell out of what they do but it seems that a lot of the people I know in the military seem to think we are in a war against all Muslims.

[renaissance]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091106/ap_on_re_us/us_fort_hood_victim_vignettes

Fort victims had different reasons for enlisting

By CARYN ROUSSEAU and ROBERT IMRIE, Associated Press Writers – 19 mins ago

The 13 people killed when an Army psychiatrist allegedly opened fire on fellow soldiers at Fort Hood, Texas, included a pregnant woman who was preparing to return home, a man who quit a furniture company job to join the military about a year ago, a newlywed who had served in Iraq and a woman who had vowed to take on Osama bin Laden after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. Here is a look at some of the victims.

___

Francheska Velez

Velez, 21, of Chicago, was pregnant and preparing to return home. A friend of Velez's, Sasha Ramos, described her as a fun-loving person who wrote poetry and loved dancing.

"She was like my sister," Ramos, 21, said. "She was the most fun and happy person you could know. She never did anything wrong to anybody."

Family members said Velez had recently returned from deployment in Iraq and had sought a lifelong career in the Army.

"She was a very happy girl and sweet," said her father, Juan Guillermo Velez, his eyes red from crying. "She had the spirit of a child."

Ramos, who also served briefly in the military, couldn't reconcile that her friend was killed in this country — just after leaving a war zone.

"It makes it a lot harder," she said. "This is not something a soldier expects — to have someone in our uniform go start shooting at us."

___

Pfc. Aaron Thomas Nemelka

Nemelka, 19, of the Salt Lake City suburb of West Jordan, Utah, chose to join the Army instead of going on a mission for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, his uncle Christopher Nemelka said.

"As a person, Aaron was as soft and kind and as gentle as they come, a sweetheart," his uncle said. "What I loved about the kid was his independence of thought."

Aaron Nemelka, the youngest of four children, was scheduled to be deployed to Afghanistan in January, his family said in a statement. Nemelka had enlisted in the Army in October 2008, Utah National Guard Lt. Col. Lisa Olsen said.

___

Pfc. Michael Pearson

Pearson, 21, of the Chicago suburb of Bolingbrook, Ill., quit what he figured was a dead-end furniture company job to join the military about a year ago.

"He felt he was in a rut. He wanted to travel, see the world," his mother, Sheryll Pearson, told the Chicago Tribune. "He also wanted an opportunity to serve the country."

At Pearson's family home Friday, a yellow ribbon was tied to a porch light and a sticker stamped with American flags on the front door read, "United we stand."

Neighbor Jessica Koerber, who was with Pearson's parents when they received word Thursday their son had died, described him as a man who clearly loved his family — someone who enjoyed horsing around with his nieces and nephews, and other times playing his guitar.

"That family lost their gem," she told the AP. "He was a great kid, a great guy. ... Mikey was one of a kind."

Sheryll Pearson said she hadn't seen her son for a year because he had been training. She told the Tribune that when she last talked to him on the phone two days ago, they had discussed how he would come home for Christmas.

___

Spc. Jason Dean Hunt

Hunt, 22, of Frederick, Okla., went into the military after graduating from Tipton High School in 2005 and had gotten married just two months ago, his mother, Gale Hunt, said. He had served 3 1/2 years in the Army, including a stint in Iraq.

Gale Hunt said two uniformed soldiers came to her door late Thursday night to notify her of her son's death.

Hunt, known as J.D., was "just kind of a quiet boy and a good kid, very kind," said Kathy Gray, an administrative assistant at Tipton Schools.

His mother said he was family oriented.

"He didn't go in for hunting or sports," Gale Hunt said. "He was a very quiet boy who enjoyed video games."

He had re-enlisted for six years after serving his initial two-year assignment, she said. Jason Hunt was previously stationed at Fort Stewart in Georgia.

___

Sgt. Amy Krueger

Krueger, 29, of Kiel, Wis., joined the Army after the 2001 terrorist attacks and had vowed to take on Osama bin Laden, her mother, Jeri Krueger said.

Amy Krueger arrived at Fort Hood on Tuesday and was scheduled to be sent to Afghanistan in December, the mother told the Herald Times Reporter of Manitowoc.

Jeri Krueger recalled telling her daughter that she could not take on bin Laden by herself.

"Watch me," her daughter replied.

Kiel High School Principal Dario Talerico told The Associated Press that Krueger graduated from the school in 1998 and had spoken at least once to local elementary school students about her career.

"I just remember that Amy was a very good kid, who like most kids in a small town are just looking for what their next step in life was going to be and she chose the military," Talerico said. "Once she got into the military, she really connected with that kind of lifestyle and was really proud to serve her country."

[PiLfan]

This excerpt from the Washington Post article is interesting:

He had been affected by the physical and mental injuries he saw while working as a psychiatrist at Walter Reed for nearly eight years, according to his aunt. "He must have snapped," Noel Hasan said. "They ignored him. It was not hard to know when he was upset.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/11/06/AR2009110600907_4.html?hpid=topnews&sid=ST2009110504565

I know the military frequently has its service members undergo periodic health assessment evaluations, to include an assessment of PTSD, depression, suicidial and homicidal thoughts/feelings, which can typically result from deployment and other experiences that expose them to the gruesome realities of war and its effects (such as treating the severly wounded).

A project I'm working on is looking into the effectiveness of these assessments at the Marine Corps, and our findings are a bit disturbing. As many as half of service members who are required to take these assessments are not taking them timely or taking them at all.

I haven't studied the Army in this project, but I have read where apparently when soldiers do take these assessments, the answers they give that are supposed to be red flags for PTSD and other potential mental health issues are sometimes not appropriately followed-up with by the MTF or medical officer for referral (here's one example: http://ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=39203).

Not saying such an assessment would have prevented yesterday's tragedy, but I hope there's some additional emphasis placed on the importance of these evaluations and having our service members properly treated and cared for.

[Toe Jam]

He was a graduate of William Fleming High School in Roanoke.

Interesting.

He also lived in Southeast Roanoke which is practically right where I grew up.

[Burgundy Burner]

Amy Krueger arrived at Fort Hood on Tuesday and was scheduled to be sent to Afghanistan in December, the mother told the Herald Times Reporter of Manitowoc.

Jeri Krueger recalled telling her daughter that she could not take on bin Laden by herself.

"Watch me," her daughter replied.

[Toe Jam]

So one of the women was pregnant?

Do they count the unborn child as a casualty in the numbers or what?

[Toe Jam]

The shooter also went to Wakefield High School.

Didn't Cho go there as well?

[Destino]

The shooter also went to Wakefield High School.

Didn't Cho go there as well?

He went to Westfield high school in Chantilly.

[Toe Jam]

He went to Westfield high school in Chantilly.

Ah.

[cjcdaman]

The woman who took him down(or at least was the first to open fire on him), attended Hoggard High School here in Wilmington. She worked at the Wrightsville police department for two years.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/07/us/07police.html

What an amazing act of courage! Supposedly, the nutcase had lots of ammunition left and this was from over before she arrived on the scene.

[ljs]

I also just read the female officer shot him 4 times, after she had been hit. wow.

[Ghost of]

Interesting indeed since the news is reporting that the shooter wanted out of the Army because he has been harassed as a Muslim since 9/11.

Which is probably BS. More like in another case of Sudden Jihad Syndrome, someone got more devout (look at his clothing in that surveillance film) like a lot of people did, in a weird response to 9/11, and one of the things you fear from more devout Muslims is an incident like this. Islam is often treated like a nationality by the devout and lots of talk (no matter how the situation gets started) of people "aggressing" against Islam (often, this could mean responding to Islamist violence initially) and otherwise justifying the most vile acts against both 'apostate' Muslims and non-Muslims alike.

A note, after 9/11, Muslims in Philadelphia started to dress more overtly "Muslim" as some kind of show. Again, there was some kind of "awakening" after 9/11, it wasn't just a "pro-American" phenomenon.

BTW, before the cries of "bigot" flood in, I'd ask for the Sudden Nirvana Syndrome incidents that you can document for me. Ideas (ALL ideas) have consequences. Some are positive, some are negative but the treatment of murder, piracy and other violence as a form of sacrament in Islam has an impact on the identity formation of many Muslims, especially as they become more 'in tune' with the venomous form of Wahab spread through the vicious web of Saudi propaganda.

[Mad Mike]

Amy Krueger arrived at Fort Hood on Tuesday and was scheduled to be sent to Afghanistan in December, the mother told the Herald Times Reporter of Manitowoc.

Jeri Krueger recalled telling her daughter that she could not take on bin Laden by herself.

"Watch me," her daughter replied.

Damn. Reading that makes me want to ball my eyes out. I didn't know her but I think I just fell in love with her spirit. RIP.

[twa]

Not saying such an assessment would have prevented yesterday's tragedy, but I hope there's some additional emphasis placed on the importance of these evaluations and having our service members properly treated and cared for.

Good thing since the psych doc was never in combat.

One of the major hangups with that program is the guys afraid of a note in their jacket following them...someone might think they shouldn't be allowed to own weapons or something....but then maybe they are just paranoid.

added

Do you find the idea these guys are being evaluated by people like the shooter disturbing at all?

[Ghost of]

This incident really isn't about the mental care of our soldiers. It fits a lot more in line with the guy who shot up the top of the Empire State Building, the one who shot people at Langley, the guy who shot up the bus taking kids to Hebrew School, the guy who ran people down in UNC, El Al Counter at LAX, the guy who tried to blow up LAX but was caught-----etc etc etc.

The only lesson here is that when a guy says publicly that those that don't convert should be beheaded, he maybe should be removed from the vicinity of authorized weapons, removed from the service and maybe we should stop pretending that certain thoughts or actions do not spring from a coherent ideology, even if they are not the mainstream of that ideology.

[twa]

The only lesson here is that when a guy says publicly that those that don't convert should be beheaded, he maybe should be removed from the vicinity of authorized weapons, removed from the service and maybe we should stop pretending that certain thoughts or actions do not spring from a coherent ideology, even if they are not the mainstream of that ideology.

Indeed....ignorance is bliss for some

[GoSkins561]

Too late for my cousins that are in the Army. :doh:

I respect the hell out of what they do but it seems that a lot of the people I know in the military seem to think we are in a war against all Muslims.

If the majority of Muslims would take a strong stance against the whack jobs this wouldn't be a issue.

Also I think that a lot of extreme traditional practices of some Muslim groups create a gray area. For example the guy that killed his daughter last week because she was becoming to Americanized.

[Oldskool]

This incident really isn't about the mental care of our soldiers. It fits a lot more in line with the guy who shot up the top of the Empire State Building, the one who shot people at Langley, the guy who shot up the bus taking kids to Hebrew School, the guy who ran people down in UNC, El Al Counter at LAX, the guy who tried to blow up LAX but was caught-----etc etc etc.

The only lesson here is that when a guy says publicly that those that don't convert should be beheaded, he maybe should be removed from the vicinity of authorized weapons, removed from the service and maybe we should stop pretending that certain thoughts or actions do not spring from a coherent ideology, even if they are not the mainstream of that ideology.

Quite true and spot on.

The one thing that this guy did "wrong" was not kill himself or end up dying after going on the rampage. I do not envy the position that he will be in when he gets out of the hospital.

[Ghost of]

Also I think that a lot of extreme traditional practices of some Muslim groups create a gray area. For example the guy that killed his daughter last week because she was becoming to Americanized.

Considering just how traditional other cultures are in their attitudes towards women, isn't it interesting that (while it's not sanctioned in the Koran) it's Muslims who kill their wives and daughters at a much greater clip than traditional-minded Christians, Buddhists, Hindus in the West?

There was a spate of Canadian Muslim women mysteriously "drowning" for no reason. There is also the treatment of Christians in predominantly Muslim countries, the lack of freedom expression--even acts like slaughtering all the hogs in Egypt (as they were owned by Coptic Christians, in the main) when the "swine" flu scare first spread.