Ron78

The (only!) official ES all things Kirk Cousins should we shouldn't we off-season thread.

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Just now, PartyPosse said:

Dunno man. Titans won 11+ games in 4 of 5 seasons and always made it to at least round 2 (including bye weeks)

 

im just stating that some coaches can figure it out by year 3 and some can't. Fisher is one of those that fits into both.

 

His last couple of years at Tennessee he was just over matched.

 

He totally lost himself at St Louis and was on a farewell tour in LA.  He and Shanny are similar cats.

 

Grumpy last-generation coaches.

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3 hours ago, Bang said:

Lesson 1 about watching sports: the athlete interview is the most useless waste of time anywhere.

99.9999% of the time it's nothing but one cliché after another.

At the risk of being a self promoting hog..   this year we have had so much fun on the Bang Radio Hour listening to Bill bellichick say absolutely nothing to reporters again and again and again. 
Bow to the master. (and then credit offense, defense, special teams, water boys, equipment managers, bus drivers, stadium custodians....)

One of my favorite clips we have of him is just before the last Super Bowl he was in.. the CBS(?) guy grabbed him for a pregame word and asked him 2 quick questions .. Bill gave the exact same nothing answer VERBATIM to both questions, within about 20 seconds. Exact same words.  What a scoop!

Back to you, Jim!

 

~Bang

 

I disagree, most people aren't calculated enough to hide true feelings on serious matters that involve emotions.

 

If it's something a person doesn't care about, sure, not much is going to be taken from it. 

Edited by wit33

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13 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

I disagree, most players aren't savvy enough to hide true feelings on serious matters that involve emotions.

 

 

Just sounds like you're saying athletes are idiots.

Edited by Vanguard

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4 minutes ago, Vanguard said:

 

Just sounds like you're saying athletes are idiots.

 

Totally not my intention. Thanks for pointing it out. 

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55 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

I disagree, most people aren't calculated enough to hide true feelings on serious matters that involve emotions.

 

If it's something a person doesn't care about, sure, not much is going to be taken from it. 

and yet, there they are, in front of cameras and microphones doing it all the time.

even after games, in a time when really, they should be left alone, most of them are completely able to sit and give pat nothing answers. 

the ones that don't get badgered and make headlines.

 

~Bang

 

 

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15 minutes ago, elkabong82 said:

wrong thread nfcbeast

 

Sorry..trying to find the right place to express my feelings after about twenty beers a few shots and a couple left handed smokes..

Go chiefs!!

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14 minutes ago, Nfcbeasts4721 said:

Sorry..trying to find the right place to express my feelings after about twenty beers a few shots and a couple left handed smokes..

Go chiefs!!

Maybe rehab?

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Correct me if I am wrong, but with Kirk being a Pro Bowl alternate, and either Matt Ryan or Aaron Rodgers going to the Super Bowl, Kirk will be going to his first Pro Bowl! I wonder if that will have any impact on how much money he demands.

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43 minutes ago, SeanTheHitmanTaylor said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but with Kirk being a Pro Bowl alternate, and either Matt Ryan or Aaron Rodgers going to the Super Bowl, Kirk will be going to his first Pro Bowl! I wonder if that will have any impact on how much money he demands.

It shouldn't.

 

But I believe there are 3 alternates at QB. Stafford probably wouldn't go with his finger injury, but I don't know if Cousins or Wilson would get the first spot.

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It's the pro bowl who cares...

Pro bowl hasn't ment **** since the eighties..not meaning to sound like a Debbie Downer but I prefer not to see any redskin in the pro bowl..on account of how the voting goes..not so much preventing injury...

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Nah, Pro Bowl is relatively meaningless nowadays. All Pro is a different story, but I don't think Kirk is even sniffing that to be honest.

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I'll weigh in.

 

The Redskins need to resign Kirk.  Based on our available cap and the ever increasing salary cap, Kirk is fully capable of taking this team deep into the playoffs.  If we had just the 15th ranked defense instead of 29th, this isn't a discussion. 

 

On the other hand to provide a bit of criticism where I hope to see additional growth, Kirk is very robotic and scripted.  He takes his drop back very stiff and follows the playbook "by the book".  This is fine to an extent as Kirk is a good QB and plays at a high level, but if he can extend plays and improvise that will take his game to the next level.

 

Hail....(Lets sign Kirk....and Eric Berry.....)

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48 minutes ago, H-O-G said:

On the other hand to provide a bit of criticism where I hope to see additional growth, Kirk is very robotic and scripted.  He takes his drop back very stiff and follows the playbook "by the book".  This is fine to an extent as Kirk is a good QB and plays at a high level, but if he can extend plays and improvise that will take his game to the next level.

 

Hail....(Lets sign Kirk....and Eric Berry.....)

This is true, but it's not always a negative.  For example, in the Packers game today, there were quite a few plays Aaron Rodgers missed that Kirk would have hit.

 

This play came to mind: http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2017011501/2016/POST19/packers@cowboys#menu=gameinfo|contentId%3A0ap3000000774662&tab=videos

 

Rodgers eventually hit the guy, but the guy was basically uncovered from the moment the ball was snapped.  Rodgers took forever to come off his first read and only barely hit him after scrambling for a bit.  If Kirk comes off that first read quickly and hits this guy early, it adds an extra 10 yards to this play.

 

I also think Rodgers is a little more scattershot with his accuracy than Kirk, although maybe it's the degree of difficulty when doing these sandlot style plays.  Kirk gets grilled for inaccuracy by Cian Fahey, but Rodgers was missing more than his share of open guys in today's game.

 

I think Rodgers' ability to go off script is a huge advantage over Kirk's skillset in the redzone, but between the 20s I think Kirk's approach is more effective than Rodgers' when you take into account the negative plays it can often lead to (more sacks).  I think one thing that Kirk could easily implement from Rodgers' game is the ability to rush to the line and get a quick play off while the other team is subbing - even a guy who isn't the best at sandlot football could at least recognize those situations and take advantage.

Edited by ncr2h

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57 minutes ago, H-O-G said:

I'll weigh in.

 

The Redskins need to resign Kirk.  Based on our available cap and the ever increasing salary cap, Kirk is fully capable of taking this team deep into the playoffs.  If we had just the 15th ranked defense instead of 29th, this isn't a discussion. 

 

On the other hand to provide a bit of criticism where I hope to see additional growth, Kirk is very robotic and scripted.  He takes his drop back very stiff and follows the playbook "by the book".  This is fine to an extent as Kirk is a good QB and plays at a high level, but if he can extend plays and improvise that will take his game to the next level.

 

Hail....(Lets sign Kirk....and Eric Berry.....)

 

Tom Brady is more robotic than Kirk. Kirk is still learning. Brady yells at his players if they are not where he wants them as he is letting go of the ball in 2 seconds. Brady will look left right and throw in middle or right left and then right or middle again, etc. - very robotic like. I noticed that couple of years ago. This is why Brady throws 5+ yards at a time but moves the chains and eats up the clock. It is very methodical. 

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@zskins @ncr2h How much did you drink tonight that we are actually putting Kirk in the company of these two. Not even close.  Rogers makes the game look so easy, like the oldest kid on the block in a streetball game, and Brady is like when an adult is all time QB and wants to get everyone involved in the game. Men amongst boys. To me, M. Ryan and Kirk is a better comparison... they can do great things with great talent and a good scheme in place, but they won't do it alone.

 

That is okay... I would like to see a deal get done. Four teams left all have long established guys, 3 of 4 have a lot of years in same system. Still crazy to me a guy like Kirk might pull 25 mill a year based on "market value," but it is what it is at this point. Just get the deal done and give the team an put after three seasons just in case he can't take the next step.

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5 minutes ago, TheCoach22 said:

@zskins @ncr2h How much did you drink tonight that we are actually putting Kirk in the company of these two. Not even close.  Rogers makes the game look so easy, like the oldest kid on the block in a streetball game, and Brady is like when an adult is all time QB and wants to get everyone involved in the game. Men amongst boys. To me, M. Ryan and Kirk is a better comparison... they can do great things with great talent and a good scheme in place, but they won't do it alone.

 

That is okay... I would like to see a deal get done. Four teams left all have long established guys, 3 of 4 have a lot of years in same system. Still crazy to me a guy like Kirk might pull 25 mill a year based on "market value," but it is what it is at this point. Just get the deal done and give the team an put after three seasons just in case he can't take the next step.

 

Ha ha! Not putting Kirk up there with Tom. Just comparing some of the mechanics. There is nothing wrong with that. ;)

Would you not want Kirk be like Tom? I think every QB wants to be like him and probably studies what he does. :)

 

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Just now, zskins said:

 

Ha ha! Not putting Kirk up there with Tom. Just comparing some of the mechanics. There is nothing wrong with that. ;)

Would you not want Kirk be like Tom? I think every QB wants to be like him and probably studies what he does. :)

 

Well, Kirk has more potential to mirror Brady's game versus Rogers. He doesn't have the natural arm talent Aaron does, obviously. I hope Cuz was watching closely every moment of these playoffs because there are things he could learn (quick counts, hard counts, sneaks to steal first downs, recognition at the line, etc.

 

He is more mobile than Brady, less assertive. Damn it... now you've got me doing it! 

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4 hours ago, ncr2h said:

This is true, but it's not always a negative.  For example, in the Packers game today, there were quite a few plays Aaron Rodgers missed that Kirk would have hit.

 

This play came to mind: http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2017011501/2016/POST19/packers@cowboys#menu=gameinfo|contentId%3A0ap3000000774662&tab=videos

 

Rodgers eventually hit the guy, but the guy was basically uncovered from the moment the ball was snapped.  Rodgers took forever to come off his first read and only barely hit him after scrambling for a bit.  If Kirk comes off that first read quickly and hits this guy early, it adds an extra 10 yards to this play.

 

I also think Rodgers is a little more scattershot with his accuracy than Kirk, although maybe it's the degree of difficulty when doing these sandlot style plays.  Kirk gets grilled for inaccuracy by Cian Fahey, but Rodgers was missing more than his share of open guys in today's game.

 

I think Rodgers' ability to go off script is a huge advantage over Kirk's skillset in the redzone, but between the 20s I think Kirk's approach is more effective than Rodgers' when you take into account the negative plays it can often lead to (more sacks).  I think one thing that Kirk could easily implement from Rodgers' game is the ability to rush to the line and get a quick play off while the other team is subbing - even a guy who isn't the best at sandlot football could at least recognize those situations and take advantage.

Actually Rodgers missed a few wide open receivers by throwing long.  His INT in fact if he throws a better ball that is at least a 30 yard catch if not a TD and the boys never have a chance even to get close.  Against the boys, KC had more yards passing that Rodgers, but he sucked in the redzone compared to him.  Hell if Hopkins hits his two field goals which were shorter than what Cosby made we win that game.

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Haha. We're literally talking about how Kirk Cousins would be getting things done better on the field than Aaron Rodgers. You guys are completely delusional. Kirk isn't even on the same continent as Rodgers and Brady, guys (despite his apparent worship of Rodgers which is interesting because out of the current batch of elite QBs playing Rodgers is the one he's LEAST like). Those two are future HOF QBs and a couple of the best to ever play. 

 

stop-the-insanity-susan-powter.jpg

Edited by mistertim
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 Cousins isn't close to Rodgers, its not close.

 Not a diss on Cousins, he just hasn't played long enough to really know what he can/can't do. Let him mature into the position and do a comparison in 3 years.

 

 One thing I see, Rodgers makes things happen, makes some absolutely ridiculous throws for completions, and has the experience because he's been in that same situation so many times its almost business as usual for him. When we see KC moving safeties with his eyes, taking sacks instead of putting the ball up for grabs, and getting on his players for something they're not doing, then you can start doing some mirror projects.

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Nice article here showing all the various ways this could play out:

 

http://www.fredericknewspost.com/sports/level/professional/here-are-seven-ways-the-redskins-cousins-contract-negotiations-could/article_253104e7-d6cf-57c5-9f2e-d22bfcd3dde7.html

 

Tops among the Washington Redskins’ offseason priorities is resolving the contract situation of quarterback Kirk Cousins, who’s due to become an unrestricted free agent this spring.

By all accounts, the Redskins intend to bring Cousins back for the 2017 season, whether by brokering a long-term contract or, if need be, using the NFL’s franchise tag to force his return for one more season. Other scenarios could be in play, too.

To recap, Cousins played his fifth season in Washington (and his second as the Redskins’ starting quarterback) under the NFL franchise tag in 2016, which guaranteed a $19.953 million annual salary. Cousins started all 16 games for a second consecutive season and broke the Redskins’ single-season passing record of 4,166 yards, which he set the previous year, by throwing for 4,917. He finished with 25 touchdown passes and 12 interceptions while leading the Redskins to their first back-to-back winning seasons in 20 years.

 

But unlike 2015, when Cousins played his best down the stretch of the season (finishing with 29 touchdown passes and 11 interceptions), he played poorly in two late-season games, against Carolina and the New York Giants, that were crucial to the team’s playoff hopes. Largely as a result, the Redskins missed the playoffs with an 8-7-1 record.

Nonetheless, Cousins is a good fit for the Redskins’ offense. He is sturdy, starting all 32 regular season games since being named the starter. Though Cousins will be 29 when the 2017 NFL season opens, coach Jay Gruden believes he is still improving. And the Redskins have few appealing alternatives, with the 2017 draft class and free agent crop regarded as thin on quality quarterbacks.

Here’s a look at the various scenarios in play regarding Cousins’s future, followed by a comment on the probability of each:

 

(see link for the scenarios):

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