The 2017 FA Thread - OP Updated with Signings (Sundberg, Galette, VD, Hood re-signed) *** Terrell McClain, Stacy McGee, DJ Swearinger, Terrelle Pryor, Chris Carter, Brian Quick, ZACH BROWN(!!)***

[SemperFi Skins]

Market Value for Terelle Pryor

 

• 4 yrs, $45,011,919
• Avg. Salary: $11,252,980

 

Market Value for Eric Berry

 

• 5 yrs, $41,239,673
• Avg. Salary: $8,247,935

[Koolblue13]

After resigning our guys, with the amount of cap space and draft picks we have, there is absolutely no excuse to not rebuild this defense aggressively this offseason.

 

He said it takes three years. Cool. 

[DC9]

46 minutes ago, SemperFi Skins said:

 

Tackling machine, always around the ball, has a lot of speed for being 250lbs.... We need that size at the ILB spots. 2nd rounder in '12 from the Titans. Lead tackler in the NFL.

 

You think Rex turns him loose?

[bobandweave]

Love the enthusiasm but seriously, contend next year? No not yet, presumptuous to even think in this direction right now and pretty insulting to my football knowledge to read that headline.

 

First we have no idea today what's up with the future of the most important player on this team and his contract right now. Until we have clarity there we don't know if next season is a rebuild from scratch with a rookie, or a free agent or a continuation of building what is working for even just one season or multiple seasons. Until your cornerstone is in place you shouldn't talking about building on it. Cousins leaves this off season and this is a complete rebuild, setting us back multiple seasons. Your not contending for anything like that. If Cousins signs for one single season who even knows if this is a one year thing or longer and that's too iffy to be thinking we are going to contend in this league with the best teams out there. It sure isn't our RBs carrying this group or the Defense now. Lose the QB and this is a 3-4 win team at best. I'd take the under on that too.

 

Secondly, we have no idea who is going to be catching the football at receiver from whoever is throwing it to them anyway next year. We also have no idea who our starting RB will be next season. On the receiver front we have Crowder, Doctson (Who knows how serious health issues will be for him and his career going forward) and Grant under contract. Go into a season with just that at receiver and your screwed, not saying Crowder isn't good but he is not a stud WR you see with contending teams.

 

Look at the contenders over the past 30-40 years and what do you see. A stud QB (We have that), a stud WR (we lack that), a stud RB (we lack this), a good/great Defense (we lack this). We lack clarity on every aspect of this team right now. Ignoring and thinking this will all work out in our favor is wishful thinking. Even the best laid plans go screwy. Look at how high we were this year on Doctson and how little he played.

 

Last, you do know that this Defensive group ranks tied for 7th in pass rushing, 21st in interceptions,31st in other teams getting first downs on us, 19th ranked giving up yards to the opposing passer, 22nd ranked at giving up rushing yards on the season to the other guys, 29th ranked at what RBs average yards gained per play at 4.6 yards a tote. This is not the resume of a anything resembling a top ranked Defense or even a Defense that looks like it's can win when the offense isn't working like the Panthers and Broncos our last two Superbowl participants had.

 

And I will leave my disgruntled viewpoints about our Defensive Coordinator and needing to replace him immediately out of this and just say, we need coaching changes as well

 

So in short, none of us has a clue who the starting QB, RB, WR, are going to be and the Defense is bad and we need new coaches. Wonderful. You want to say we are ready to contend next year? No, hell no

 

One of the biggest problems our fan base has had over the past 25 years is not being in touch with reality about this team. We all get way too high when we should be medium and I'm writing this now to try and slow down any one doing that.

 

Championship teams are not built overnight. The Cowboys, the best team in the NFL today did not become championship contenders over night. They built that Offensive line over multiple seasons. They had mixed results, one year up one year down. We are no different.

 

We need multiple seasons to right this ship. We need help everywhere. We aren't contending for anything next year until some things come into focus like who the QB will be, who the WRs will be, who the RB will be and who joins our Defense to fix that mess. We are on the right track, no doubt but these things are fragile so try not to get too excited and forget what this team really is. We are in the mist of a muti year project. We need to be patient, we can't get too high about this team and need to keep our feet firmly on the ground now.

[DC9]

15 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

After resigning our guys, with the amount of cap space and draft picks we have, there is absolutely no excuse to not rebuild this defense aggressively this offseason.

 

He said it takes three years. Cool. 

 

I actually think the perimeter of the defense is alright.

 

The pass rush is good enough, the corners are good enough.

 

What was our biggest problem yesterday?  We couldn't get off the field on 3rd down.  Same thing against the Cowboys.  Same thing most of the season.  That is where the middle of your defense comes in.  Especially on 3rd and 5 plus.

 

Between the draft and FA we really need to add:

 

2 DTs who can start

3 ILBs, at least one who can start

2 Safeties who can start (probably has to come from the draft)

1 OLB who can be your situational pass rusher

4 minutes ago, bobandweave said:

One of the biggest problems our fan base has had over the past 25 years is not being in touch with reality about this team. We all get way too high when we should be medium and I'm writing this now to try and slow down any one doing that. Championship teams are not built overnight. The Cowboys, the best team in the NFL today did not become championship contenders over night. They built that Offensive line over multiple seasons. They had mixed results, one year up one year down. We are no different. We need multiple seasons to right this ship. We need help everywhere. We aren't contending for anything next year until some things come into focus like who the QB will be, who the WRs will be, who the RB will be and who joins our Defense to fix that mess. We are on the right track, no doubt but these things are fragile so try not to get too excited and forget what this team really is. We are in the mist of a muti year project. We need to be patient, we can't get too high about this team.

 

We should be able to contend next year.  It's the third year.  If the right moves are made we can contend.  If we are not contending then you can realistically and legitimately start to question the direction of the team.

 

I understand what you are saying, but we aren't that far away.  We actually aren't.  Obviously you have to make sure that you re-sign Cousins and the rest of the players you need, but we are finally a couple of players away.

 

With cap space and 9 picks...

[SemperFi Skins]

Just now, DC9 said:

 

You think Rex turns him loose?

 

Well, he's playing in place of Reggie Ragland and holding it down. I don't think Rex had it in the plans for him to start. Now he's balling.

[Koolblue13]

6 minutes ago, DC9 said:

 

I actually think the perimeter of the defense is alright.

 

The pass rush is good enough, the corners are good enough.

 

What was our biggest problem yesterday?  We couldn't get off the field on 3rd down.  Same thing against the Cowboys.  Same thing most of the season.  That is where the middle of your defense comes in.  Especially on 3rd and 5 plus.

With cap space and 9 picks...

100% agreement and I've said it for a while. I also don't Even think our line is that bad. Needs one more guy to move the pocket. Has to be in the middle though. 

 

I also think our personnel is fine if our base always had 4 down.

 

ILB is the biggest issue and I honestly don't think it's close. I would like to see Cravens start at SS and move to ILB situationally. He's pretty close to what we saw Buchanan doing all night yesterday. The defense just isn't being called that way.

 

FS is also a huge need and has been for a long time. I'd love to see the first two rounds of the draft be ILB/FS in either order.

[bobandweave]

16 minutes ago, DC9 said:

 

 

Quote

We should be able to contend next year.  It's the third year.  If the right moves are made we can contend.  If we are not contending then you can realistically and legitimately start to question the direction of the team.

 

I understand what you are saying, but we aren't that far away.  We actually aren't.  Obviously you have to make sure that you re-sign Cousins and the rest of the players you need, but we are finally a couple of players away.

 

With cap space and 9 picks...

 

What does the 3rd year have to do with anything? Seriously have we not even learned that quick fixes and expecting immediate results doesn't work for us and is a quick way to disappointment? Third year means nothing to me. I don't get that and question you or anyone believing there is some magical number of years to turn a team from a loser, into a playoff contender. In the short amount of time Scot has been here you see the titanic rising, but be serious. A new head coach will not fix this, TIME fixes this. One draft with 9 picks does not fix this, multiple drafts fixes this. You can not rush that.

 

Lets be clear, the only reason we are in games this season is not because of Garcon, Reed, Fat Rob, Matt Jones, Trent Williams, or anyone else on the offensive side of the ball minus one single dude. Lose Kirk and you set this back years. But even as great as Kirk has been this year he's not able to do it all himself. the Defense sure as hell isn't winning games for us this year, Kirk is.

 

We need a hell of a lot more then just 9 draft picks and some cap money that every team out there has to fix all of this. I believed going into this season that if everything was going well we might likely have a worse record then last season and be on the right track. I still believe that and I believe 100% after seeing this team we are on the right track to becoming respectable again, but any resemblance of self imposed time constraints on how quickly it is turned around is wrong.

 

There is no magic answer to how ever many years it takes to right a ship. Also after trying too many damn coaches over the years have we not learned that coaching itself won't fix this? We have a plan, start with signing the MVP then we can continue that plan. Until then realize the future of this team is seriously in question and anyone thinking otherwise doesn't understand how teams are made up or just how many questions surround us today we need answers to. We need an ILB sure, but lose Kirk and gain an All Pro there and how many games will we win next year? A journey worth taking starts with taking the first step. Until we have that first step locked up then it really won't matter 

[SemperFi Skins]

relax dude, we are a few  games out from a second playoff appearance in 2 years... we are a good team. cowboys defense sucks too... they just have a good offense and hold on to the ball.

 

if it weren't for our redzone woes, we would already have clinched...

[illone]

Defenses can turn it around quickly with the right personnel and system.  See: Gregg Williams 2004.  Since GW and London Fletcher have left, this team has been soft in the middle.  We absolutely need a MLB or ILB (maybe 2) guys that can fly to the football.  Could also use an upgrade a safety.

 

There is no reason to think we CANT contend on defense next year with a few key upgrades.

[Stefanskins]

1 hour ago, SemperFi Skins said:

 

Well, he's playing in place of Reggie Ragland and holding it down. I don't think Rex had it in the plans for him to start. Now he's balling.

 

Plus he's a Tar Heel

[DM72]

If fired, does Rex Ryan counts as a potential FA?

[bobandweave]

48 minutes ago, SemperFi Skins said:

relax dude, we are a few  games out from a second playoff appearance in 2 years... we are a good team. cowboys defense sucks too... they just have a good offense and hold on to the ball.

 

if it weren't for our redzone woes, we would already have clinched...

 

We are a good team? Hell no we aren't jeez people here have the craziest ideas of what is a good team and what's a team being propped up by a single player actually is. Currently we are the Chargers, we are the Saints. Teams held up because of a QB who lacks players every where else. Those aren't good teams, nor are those teams that can contend with the best teams in the game today.

[SemperFi Skins]

Just now, bobandweave said:

 

We are a good team? Hell no we aren't jeez people here have the craziest ideas of what is a good team and what's a team being propped up by a single player actually is. Currently we are the Chargers, we are the Saints. Teams held up because of a QB who lacks players every where else. Those aren't good teams, nor are those teams that can contend with the best teams in the game today.

 

Are you Kirk Cousins? Because every post you make is only about Kirk Cousins and how he IS the Redskins... he's not. I know it's hard to admit, but there is actually a ton of talent on this team. He didn't make Garcon, Jackson, Crowder, Reed, Davis, Williams, Scherff, etc. good players (hint: they are actually good players of who's the qb)

 

Now do I like Kirk Cousins, yes, and he does help this team win but he has a lot of talent that is bailing him out. Take away his security blanket and what are you left with?

 

And you mention Crowder being Just a Guy and not in the top of slot WR's... horse****. He's top 5 slot WR in the league. Not many, if any, I'd take over him.

[Skinsinparadise]

Calais Campbell will be 31 so not ideal from that stand point but as for his profile -- the dude IMO is the poster child for what we need on the D line as evidence yesterday.

 

I am on the Hankins bandwagon myself.  Not bad of a pass rusher but his strength is more in line of being a big body who can stuff the run.  He will be only 25 next season.

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/secret-superstars-2014-giants/

 

PFF from his rookie year.

 

Overall, Hankins’ +9.5 run defense grade for the entire season led all Giants defensive tackles and was +1.5 better than Joseph in one-third the snaps. If you factor in playing time, Hankins had the third-highest grade per run defense snap of any defensive tackle in the entire league. His 10.5 Run Stop Percentage was seventh out of 77 NFL defensive tackles with at least 100 run snaps last season. His pass rush left a lot to be desired (he only had three quarterback pressures the entire season), but he only had three snaps total in 3rd-and-long obvious passing downs. Keep in mind that Joseph himself was never a dominant pass rusher outside his 2011 season.

The Giants front office always drafts with a long-term plan in mind, and certainly they were cognizant of Joseph’s contract year when they selected Hankins. No team likes to lose a 25-year-old durable player in his prime, but paying a hefty price for a run-stopping defensive tackle isn’t a necessity when there’s a potentially better one waiting in the wings. Now that Joseph is gone, Hankins is a projected starter and will no longer have to wait for playing time. If his rookie year is any indication, the Giants will wonder why they were so patient in the first place.

http://www.espn.com/blog/baltimore-ravens/post/_/id/28104/ravens-brandon-williams-ready-to-go-from-outhouse-to-penthouse

 

Brandon Williams is intriguing but wonder if he's too much the traditional NT which some reporters think they are moving away from 28 year old, elite big body run stuffing NT.

Baltimore Ravens nose tackle Brandon Williams had to crack a smile when he heard about the huge deal signed by Philadelphia Eagles defensive tackle Fletcher Cox on Monday night.

While Williams likely won't get close to the $63 million in guaranteed money given to Cox, he will benefit from the rising cost to keep a premium interior defensive linemen if he reaches free agency in 2017. In Williams' case, it will complete one of the most radical changes in lifestyle that you'll ever hear.

In a span of four years, Williams will go from carrying portable toilets to hauling in well over $15 million in guaranteed money. The pending move from the outhouse to the penthouse is not lost on Williams.

TOUGH IN THE MIDDLE

The Ravens' Brandon Williams is one of seven defensive tackles with at least 100 tackles the last two seasons:

PLAYER	TEAM	TACKLES
Damon Harrison	N.Y. Jets	127
Aaron Donald	Rams	117
Ndamukong Suh	Dolphins	114
Bennie Logan	Eagles	113
Linval Joseph	Vikings	103
Marcell Dareus	Bills	100
Brandon Williams	Ravens	100

"It humbles you, for sure," Williams said. "I've come from portable toilets to coming to the highest of highs, and it's like I still remember the portable toilets. Even though it was a fun job and I liked it, I don't want go back there. In order to do whatever I got to do here to keep from going back there, I obviously have to keep on it."

Williams' summer job in college for three years was cleaning and transporting those rented restrooms. It was not unusual for him to do this 12 to 15 hours each day.

Is it as dirty of a job as one would think?

 

 

[bobandweave]

2 hours ago, SemperFi Skins said:

 

Are you Kirk Cousins? Because every post you make is only about Kirk Cousins and how he IS the Redskins... he's not. I know it's hard to admit, but there is actually a ton of talent on this team. He didn't make Garcon, Jackson, Crowder, Reed, Davis, Williams, Scherff, etc. good players (hint: they are actually good players of who's the qb) -

 

Are you a comedian? Seriously you ask me a question am I Kirk as if you don't expect a stupid question thrown your way in return. Now if we can be civil then you and I may be able to converse here in a manner that is beneficial to us both. First off clearly I am not Kirk Cousins, I am a rabid football fan with a great deal of knowledge about this game. Check my posting history, when I bother to type here it's full of nuggets that you won't see in other people's posts and I am a diehard Redskins fan something I believe we both share in common.

 

With that being said you should review what you just said there. We've had Garcon since 2012, was he turning this team into a winner since he got here? Nope. What about Desean, he's been here since 2014. We went 4-12 that season with Desean. Reeds been here since 2013, a year this team went 3-13. Vernon Davis was bounced around the league the past several years and hadn't been productive for anyone since 2013 before this season. Trent has been here since 2010, Kerrigan has been here since 2011, both are amazing talented players but are either enough to get this team into the season long winning column? No of course not.

 

Now no where did I say this team has no talent, it does in some places. That alone does not produce wins. Why? Because without a very good to elite QB in today's NFL you have nothing. With one of those your teams going to be on the winning side more then the losing side, even with a Defense as poor as ours. That's the league we live in today. Make no mistake about it, outside of very little the Defense is very very bad. Yet we are winning despite that.

 

We didn't start winning, for the record we are 10-5-1 over our last 16 games played, until after we saw Cousins turn a corner and became the QB he is today. If you wonder why this team is winning over it's last 16 games then look no further then the QB position. All I have said here about Cousins is everyone needs to understand how vital and important he is to our success here.

 

Review for yourselves why this team went 7 wins with 25 losses the two years prior to Cousins starting for us if guys like Reed, Garcon, Jackson, Kerrigan and others mattered nearly as much as a good to great QB does. He is only in his second year starting, and some here neither appreciate what he has done or even want to sign him long term. It's maddness

 

Our top priority this off season and every off season better be ensuring that the player with the football in his hands more then anyone else on the team is taken care of. No other position out there will improve a team with good play or derail it with poor play like a QB can. We better as a nation demand that the QB position is always squared away and taken care of first. Talking like some LB or DL is going to steer the teams future the same as a QB can and will to me is stupid. Get real and get serious.

 

We are witnessing this first hand and it seems like some of you still don't even comprehend why our teams had such a dramatic turnaround the past two seasons. It's time that you learn to accept that Kirk Cousins is a top QB in this league today. It's not our offensive line, it's not our 30 year old WRs, it's not a third year Slot WR, or even an undrafted running back turning this around. It's most definitely not a Defense playing as poorly as this unit is either. And if you disagree with me then its you I'm talking to, the people who refuse to give Cousins his respect he has already earned who speak about these other positions as if they matter as much as the QB when clearly they don't.

 

Take away Kirk Cousins from this group of players and what do you have? 7 wins 25 losses is what you'd have. Sometimes I wonder if people will ever really understand why this team has been in purgatory for the past 30 years and the way out of that. Its the QB. It's always been the QB. We will go back to 7 and 25 if you don't lock up the QB who's gone 10-5-1 over his past 16 games played. This will be an ultimate and complete failure of epic proportions if the front office doesn't realize this like some of you fans can't seem to grasp about this man.

 

 

 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

@bobandweave

I'm not seeing anyone contest your belief that we need to sign Kirk. I think that's why you are getting this kind of feedback.  We get it - We need Kirk!  Kirk is on the roster and can be forced to stay on the roster next season as well if that's how it plays out.  So while he's a free agent, he's not truly free.  I have no doubts that if Kirk wants to stay here, we'll make it happen.

 

Kirk also needs weapons and a decent defense, which is primarily what this thread is about.  You keep referring to Top 5, but even the Top 5 guys need something around them in order to be Top 5.  We've seen Kirk throw for 450, 3 TD's - no picks and lose.  I think we all understand he's good but him being good or great isn't enough to take this team to the next step.

 

 

[bobandweave]

Actually BFS, I think much of the fan base severally under appreciates Kirk Cousins here and it's one of the worst kept secrets we have as a fan base. On another team the fans would be demanding loudly to get the deal done and lock him up for the next 7-8 years and call it done. Here we as a group have never understood the importance of the QB position in today's game, a wrong historical belief that sways our thinking, a curse to get past, and a whole lot of questions to answer before thinking we will contend next year.

 

I think part of the issue with some of us (no idea how old you are but lets just say I was born in the early 70's when we had our last Franchise QB) and fondly remember seeing year after year of Gibbs 1.0 plug and play QB's where we went to 4 Superbowls with 3 different starting QBs and won 3 of them. In a way I think since that last Superbowl we have been cursed because we incorrectly think that the QB isn't more important as the scheme and game plan is.

 

In my football lifetime only two men have shown me that the QB is less important then the game plan and scheme on a consistent basis. Bill Belichick and Joe Gibbs. Every other head coach and offensive coordinator out there, the QB matters the most. I like Gruden but he is no Belichick and likely never will be. Meaning the QB matters more then his coaching. QB  must be on the top of every fans list.

 

Anyway this is a topic of discussing "contending next year" I thought. First I don't think we have a snowball's chance in hell with this team at even the 3rd place finish next year if we don't have Cousins leading the team. I think with Cousins we always will compete. Second off, there are way way too many questions - QB, WR, RB, DEF - for anyone to seriously think we are in Superbowl discussion next year even if everything bounces right for us in the off season. Last I worry about the fan base getting too high, when we should be level headed about the future. That's always screwed us in the past and will every time we aren't vigilant about our own expectations of the future. I saw someone say some make believe nonsense about "Year three" as if that even remotely matters as if change for change sake is ever good for us or these men are on some make believe clock when they aren't.

 

With the best bounces we are at least 2 off seasons away from really contending for anything anyway.  For now we are just turning the corner of not being a laughingstock push over every week to the league to becoming a challenge. Our time will come IF we build this the right way. The right way is addressing the QB question and putting that past us

[Thirtyfive2seven]

Kirk Cousins - sign long term deal

Pierre Garcon - restructure keep or walk (but replace with...)

Desean Jackson - restructure keep or walk (but replace with who?)

Chris Baker - restructure keep

Junior "Twitter Warrior/Part Time Hero" Gallette - No idea on this one.  he's hurt every year so far.  How can we keep him?

Vernon Davis - he's getting up there in age but still able to produce.  This is a tough call. If you can keep him cost effectively then I say another year wouldn't hurt. He's a good vet leader.

 

The rest can take a hike as they aren't really contributing.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

Obviously the biggest issue is getting Kirk signed.  Le's assume they do that.

 

GMSM TRIED to solve the "Both Garcon and DJax are FAs next year problem by drafting Doctson.  But that didn't work, so now you essentially HAVE to sign one of them, and probably have to go to FA to sign another starting outside receiver.  They cannot go in thinking Mo Harris or Grant can take significant snaps.  That will effect Reed and Crowder's ability to get open. They need speed on the outside somehow.  And they can't trust Doctson. 

 

I think you have to sign Baker.  But he shouldn't have to be the best DL on the team. 

 

Vernon has made himself some money this year.

 

I would just get out of the Junior Gallette business. 

 

You KNOW that Golston is going to be back.

 

I'd target LG, WR on offense, and every position on defense.   If GMSM drafted 8 defensive guys, I really wouldn't care. 

[drowland]

1 hour ago, Thirtyfive2seven said:

Kirk Cousins - sign long term deal

Pierre Garcon - restructure keep or walk (but replace with...)

Desean Jackson - restructure keep or walk (but replace with who?)

Chris Baker - restructure keep

Junior "Twitter Warrior/Part Time Hero" Gallette - No idea on this one.  he's hurt every year so far.  How can we keep him?

Vernon Davis - he's getting up there in age but still able to produce.  This is a tough call. If you can keep him cost effectively then I say another year wouldn't hurt. He's a good vet leader.

 

The rest can take a hike as they aren't really contributing.

 

 

They're UFAs come March so not sure what you can restructure in their contracts.  It's either re-sign, tag or walk.  If they have to choose between Garcon and Jackson, I think you go Garcon.  He's more reliable.  Gruden said a couple weeks ago Jackson is only useful when he's 100%, and that's been an issue the last couple years.  Scot should be able to find a deep threat in the middle rds of the draft.  

[kost203]

6 hours ago, SemperFi Skins said:

 

Well, he's playing in place of Reggie Ragland and holding it down. I don't think Rex had it in the plans for him to start. Now he's balling.

That's because the buffs dline is pretty good. A dline makes everyone look better. They help create issues and the rest ilb,olb, CB and safety's follow suit. 

[Momma There Goes That Man]

8 hours ago, SemperFi Skins said:

 

Sign ILB Zach Brown

I would love this 

[SemperFi Skins]

Bobandweave, nobody is questioning your expertise since you keep talking about it. In fact, most of us have been around football our whole life and are extremely knowledgeable about the game too. My posts were directed towards the pessimistic attitude. We are here talking about ways to improve and add talent to our already talented team. No one is bashing Kirk. You don't make the playoffs and win the East if you're mediocre. Any given Sunday. Let's take a step back and praise the talent we have and the strides we will make to improve. No team is perfect. We can compete any game, any year...

[Warhead36]

We aren't going to go crazy spending $ in FA. Thats just not the McLoughan way. I do think we'll go after one or two more B to B+ type players but you're out of your mind if you think we'll go after an Eric Berry type. I do hope we address the D aggressively in the draft. We need youth and athleticism all over. O is mostly okay although if there is a solid value C or LG I'd go after them.