rick7423 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 it's hard to improve when the rest of the team is playing much worse. Whether he'd be playing as well if everyone was playing up to their 2012 standards is up for debate. But we've stunk it up plenty of times when he wasn't on the field the last two season also, so it's hard to say he's dragging the team down. Really? Taker a look at this article. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2304287-redskins-cant-pin-all-of-their-problems-on-the-offensive-line Our OL, believe it or not, is ranked 11th in the league. They break down all the stats, and it is pretty eye opening. There are needs on this team, but overall the OL and DL are not as bad as we think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradboyd80 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Really? Taker a look at this article. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2304287-redskins-cant-pin-all-of-their-problems-on-the-offensive-line Our OL, believe it or not, is ranked 11th in the league. They break down all the stats, and it is pretty eye opening. There are needs on this team, but overall the OL and DL are not as bad as we think. Anybody that actually watches this team and thinks the OL should be ranked 11th is smoking some good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 I agree with Gruden, and also Terry Shea on 980 about a month ago, who made the point that anybody Griffin works with on the side doesn't necessarily know the specific concepts of the Gruden playbook. So whoever he works with probably needs to be on the payroll and intimately familiar with what Gruden's trying to accomplish. That said, some of it just has to come through live fire reps. I don't know how much a QB coach/guru can help you regarding pocket presence and sensing pressure, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rick7423 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Anybody that actually watches this team and thinks the OL should be ranked 11th is smoking some good stuff. Read the article, they explain your position quite clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Griffin played well against the Giants. His qb rating was 106 in a game in which he was constantly under pressure. I agree he's got a lot of work to do and he may not be the franchise qb that most people thought in 2012. But the guy will be a starting nfl qb for someone. But his Total QBR was only 21, and 50 is average. He played much better, because the last few memories of him on the field weren't positive at all. So he definitely improved on the last few outings. It was the Minnesota game the last time he looked remotely competent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aireskoi Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Really? Taker a look at this article. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2304287-redskins-cant-pin-all-of-their-problems-on-the-offensive-line Our OL, believe it or not, is ranked 11th in the league. They break down all the stats, and it is pretty eye opening. There are needs on this team, but overall the OL and DL are not as bad as we think. That was a nice read. It's just another piece of evidence that Griffin is a big problem on the field right now. Jay was obviously correct in starting Colt as the most ready to play, but he has injury problems of his own. Lets hope Griffin can really start to develop as a passer to go with his raw skills and arm talent before he goes down again. I also think we are not running the offense we would like to run due to our O'line, so the stats don't mean much to me. We need a talent upgrade at 2 of the 3 - RT, LG, and RG...at least. We will probably all look back on this time one day and wonder why they didn't let Kirk play more. I still think he is the guy that will have the best career of the 3 when it's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Do you really believe that the oline is almost top ten? Is it because Alfred Morris has been running through gaping holes? How about our ability to get that third and one or third and two at will? Could it be the thirty-five sacks given up over the last 7 games? Robert only started one of them, right, so... that's all on RGIII's head. In what universe has our line play been good? In what characteristic? Pass blocking? Run blocking? I guess there haven't been a tremendous number of holds or false starts, but...? Our line is not bad, it is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Good hot take! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Glad you're not part of this organization. Wish guys like that weren't a part of our fanbase either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stp240 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Do you really believe that the oline is almost top ten? Is it because Alfred Morris has been running through gaping holes? How about our ability to get that third and one or third and two at will? Could it be the thirty-five sacks given up over the last 7 games? Robert only started one of them, right, so... that's all on RGIII's head. In what universe has our line play been good? In what characteristic? Pass blocking? Run blocking? I guess there haven't been a tremendous number of holds or false starts, but...? Our line is not bad, it is terrible. 100% agreed We have the worst line in the NFL and it's not even close. Look at how the pocket instantly collapses on every drop back. The interior linemen are pushed 6 yards into the backfield by the time the QB is finished his drop! Not just here and there either, they are very consistent! (way to go guys!) There is no room to find throwing lanes or throw the ball. Meanwhile, romoSUCKS can drop back nice and relaxed while his line holds strong at the line of scrimmage. Did that artical really blame the niles paul toss up interception on RG3? The pictures in that artical actually prove how bad we are on plays where the Defense only rushes 4. Williams is beat and chester is in Griffins lap! in 2.5 seconds! That is unacceptable. Every successful qb has a line that can give them seemingly infinate amount of time when a defense chooses to rush 3 or 4 guys, several times a game. They conveniently leave out the fact that the majority of sacks are coming on 3rd and long (where the qb must have time for routes to develop down field) and we are usually facing a blitz. So there you have it, sacks in under 3 seconds. If there were a stat for most sacks given up in under 3 seconds, we would lead the league, no doubt about it. THAT is exactly how you ruin a quarterback The TE's and backs are unspeakably bad as well. And Penalties! OMG Every other play is Holding, false start, holding, false start, holding, false start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perez24 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 unfortunately NFL CBA rules limit the amount of time a guy can work out with his coaches. As to getting a mentor, he's worked with someone named Terry O'Shea, but Gruden actually cautioned against things like that saying tou can get to many voices in your head I only know Terry Shea from 2 interviews I've heard with him on the 980 AM, but he seems insane. He may have a great track record, but he sounded kind of delusional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 This whole topic reminds me of Jason Campbell on the forums. I'm curious where most of the people on either side of this debate would have been on the Campbell issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortiz Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Show me one offseason where there weren't reports of RG3 working with people to improve. His 1st and only off season so far ... which was probably his most critical off season ... spent that entire time rehabbing. I agree 100% with OP, he needs time to unwind, still has not had an off season to do that. But, he needs major, major tutelage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrecker Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 it's hard to improve when the rest of the team is playing much worse. Whether he'd be playing as well if everyone was playing up to their 2012 standards is up for debate. But we've stunk it up plenty of times when he wasn't on the field the last two season also, so it's hard to say he's dragging the team down. A good QB will make up for other offensive deficiencies. RG3 adds to them. Not a hater, just my observation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gortiz Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 The Education of a Quarterbackhttp://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/03/sports/football/the-education-of-the-packers-aaron-rodgers.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 Between Rodgers’s second and third seasons, Quarterback School consisted of 10 hours in the film room and 3 hours on the practice field a week, an offensive study conducted in “painstaking detail,” Clements said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 First of all, a quarterback has to want to spend hours breaking down film and really immersing himself in football during the off-season. If he wants to do that, he would likely benefit greatly from spending time working on his profession. That's why, all along, I've said that I want someone with Manning's mentality. A nerdy guy who really is overly obsessed with being the best. I wouldn't really want to have someone like that as a family member or friend, but definitely do as the QB of my favorite team. Secondly, of course these guys have every right to take time off, but that's kind of the point. Every person in this organization can do more to be successful. They aren't obligated to, but they are then accountable for their results. If Griffin comes back next year and makes mental mistakes like taking the wrong drop for the given play call or protection, that's on him. If Jordan Reed is confused on pass protection, it's on him. So, these guys don't HAVE to do anything more than they are doing. They are checking the box and probably working hard from 9 to 5. But the great players live and breathe this stuff. That is the culture we need and the types of players we should be targeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aireskoi Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 First of all, a quarterback has to want to spend hours breaking down film and really immersing himself in football during the off-season. If he wants to do that, he would likely benefit greatly from spending time working on his profession. That's why, all along, I've said that I want someone with Manning's mentality. A nerdy guy who really is overly obsessed with being the best. I wouldn't really want to have someone like that as a family member or friend, but definitely do as the QB of my favorite team. .... That is the culture we need and the types of players we should be targeting. What if the QB that you describe is already on the team? http://es.redskins.com/topic/382266-thoughts-on-cousins-and-the-next-few-weeks/?p=10075626 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 I would love if Redskins.com would broadcast RG3's daily workouts this offseason as a live stream. We could see when he arrives and how hard he is working. Maybe we could tweet feedback if we notice something if off with his footwork. Together we could make him a great QB again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldSkinner Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Why does this mentality just pertain to RG3? There are lot more people that need work. And by that I mean the whole damn team. Kirk - learn to stop making silly mistakes Colt - hit the weight room so you aren't throwing nerf footballs Almo - learn to catch Entire Oline - Learn pass protect responsibilities Merriweather and Clark - learn to tackle Reed/Paul - learn how to help out in blocking Jackson - learn how to block as a WR Even Tress Way - learn to pin teams deep instead of touchbacks Jim Haslett - learn how clean out his office It's not RG3 doesn't care and likes playing poorly. I'm sick of hearing about the Qbs needing work. Yes we all know they need work. Why aren't people calling out the OTHER players in TEAM sport. Every player on the Redskins has something to improve on this offseason. I agree that there are other players that need to attend major off-season programs, but the issues plaguing these players are relatively easier to fix compared to the complexities of the quarterback position. Alfred Morris's inability to catch passes and DeSean Jackson's inability to block defensive backs can kill drives, but a fundamentally unsound QB can kill a whole team. All those players improving won't magically transform us into a winning franchise if Robert doesn't improve, but an improved Robert can compensate for some of those glaring issues and turn this team around. You're right in that this is a team sport, but teams have critical components and leaders, and this team's leader isn't performing well irrespective of everyone else. If Robert doesn't commit a MAJORITY of the upcoming offseason to improve, he's cutting his future in the NFL short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 RG3 will be another bust for us as long as we avoid to build the lines. He could have been the best QB in history if he had time in the pocket but we don't do things right for us. He is going to ask for a trade this offseason and get away from a coach who has 0 trust in him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 What if the QB that you describe is already on the team? http://es.redskins.com/topic/382266-thoughts-on-cousins-and-the-next-few-weeks/?p=10075626 Yeah, I'm cool with Cousins having a chance to take the job. I actually want next year to be wide open in that regard. My point isn't really specific to any single player, I think it's a trait that needs to exist within most players if they want to be great. Without that drive, they are bound by their physical gifts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradboyd80 Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 A good QB will make up for other offensive deficiencies. RG3 adds to them. Not a hater, just my observation. Then what happened in 2012? Because that is exactly what he did that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aireskoi Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Then what happened in 2012? Because that is exactly what he did that year. He had his 2nd knee explosion? This is 2014 talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Then what happened in 2012? Because that is exactly what he did that year. I'm not sure we really know how to assign the credit for that year. I have no doubt that he deserves some. He was confident and as healthy as we've seen him. However, the scheme that the Shanahans unveiled deserves a lot of the credit as well. Defenses were flat-footed almost the entire season. The unknown of what Griffin could do with his legs was almost more valuable than what he actually did when he ran (with a couple exceptions of course). That slant over the middle to Garcon was open 85% of the time. That was due to the LBs essentially standing in place (allowing Griffin to virtually ignore one of the three layers of the defense when making his decisions) because they were worried about the read-option looks going on behind the line of scrimmage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3200fps Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Then what happened in 2012? Because that is exactly what he did that year. Why is it so difficult for everyone that hangs on to "2012" so much that THEN he was Robert Griffin III, not the "RG3" yet? The dude was given the world after that season and it has most definitely been a net negative and a contributing factor to the person we see today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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