2024 Rookie camp/OTA/Training camp thread.

[clskinsfan]

2 hours ago, Going Commando said:

I think the dude who is going to explode under the new regime is B Rob though.

Love B Rob. But Ekeler is going to get a significant amount of touches. Would love to see some 2 back sets with both on the field though. Move Ekeler in motion to get him open. 

[FootballZombie]

Dot is like the rare example of a player we don't overvalue vs how they are viewed around the NFL.

 

By all means, he is talked about in good regard, and always included w/ Terry as an example of a good weapons for a young QB. You don't always get that vibe around here tho.

 

 

I have no insight as to whether this is right/wrong, but It is quite odd.

[goskins10]

8 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

Jamin Davis is already pretty decent.  PFF grades him a 67 last year, which is kind of amazing given how bad the defense was.  If he doesn't stick around, it will likely be due to a numbers game--not wanting to spend too much on LB after signing Luvu, or having Magee break out. But I could also see him having a good year if he can stay healthy.  He's one of our only big players on defense, and he's going to benefit from not having to play inside now that we've got Wagner and Luvu.  At least one of those two should be on the field at all times, unless we get really unlucky with injuries.

 

They declined Davis 5th yr option. That probably speaks to what they think of him. I feel bad for him. He was overdrafted which put higher expectations on him then they didn't really have a plan for him. A fresh start may truly do him some good either here or somewhere else. As you say he was starting to at least geta feel fro the NFL game towards the end of last year. If he continues they may decide to pay him afterall. This pretty much a one yr prove it deal at this point. 

 

 

33 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

Dot is like the rare example of a player we don't overvalue vs how they are viewed around the NFL.

 

By all means, he is talked about in good regard, and always included w/ Terry as an example of a good weapons for a young QB. You don't always get that vibe around here tho.

 

 

I have no insight as to whether this is right/wrong, but It is quite odd.

 

 

I think Dotson could be a stud. He never seemed to mesh with EB's offense. And with the oline being so bad, esepcailly as the season went on he just didn;t get many chances. I expect him to return to his rookie year form and better. 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I’m all for giving a young player the benefit of the doubt, but Dotson was awful last year. 
 

The coaches didn’t do him any favors but he dropped a lot of easy balls and looked disinterested at times.

 

Let’s hope the light comes on for him. 

[Warhead36]

28 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I’m all for giving a young player the benefit of the doubt, but Dotson was awful last year. 
 

The coaches didn’t do him any favors but he dropped a lot of easy balls and looked disinterested at times.

 

Let’s hope the light comes on for him. 

I can't disagree. He was legitimately terrible last year. But sometimes the environment around you is so bad it just causes you to crater. I will say if anything last year proved Dotson is never going to be a true elite player. At best he'll be a good #2, because a true stud thrives no matter the situation.

[kingdaddy]

1 hour ago, goskins10 said:

 

They declined Davis 5th yr option. That probably speaks to what they think of him. I feel bad for him. He was overdrafted which put higher expectations on him then they didn't really have a plan for him. A fresh start may truly do him some good either here or somewhere else. As you say he was starting to at least geta feel fro the NFL game towards the end of last year. If he continues they may decide to pay him afterall. This pretty much a one yr prove it deal at this point. 

 

 

 

 

I think Dotson could be a stud. He never seemed to mesh with EB's offense. And with the oline being so bad, esepcailly as the season went on he just didn;t get many chances. I expect him to return to his rookie year form and better. 

Dotson is one of the top 3 guys on this roster that NEEDS to be a stud starting this season. He's a 1st round pick that needs to demand more of himself and hit at least 80 catches for over 1100 yards and 8 TD's. Dotson needs to push Terry for the #1 WR role given that he's a 1st ****ing round pick. 

[bowhunter]

12 hours ago, redskinss said:

I heard one reporter say almost everybody was in attendance. 

 

Who wasn't there?

I think just Chase Young, but at least this year he has a valid reason

[KDawg]

I think a lot of you are really forgetting how good Dotson was his rookie year.

 

I thought it was pretty obviously a Bienemy problem. 
 

We’ll find out. 

[AlwaysBeRedskins2Me]

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I think a lot of you are really forgetting how good Dotson was his rookie year.

 

I thought it was pretty obviously a Bienemy problem. 
 

We’ll find out. 

To an extent but we certainly can't take all the culpability away from Jahan. When balls hit your hands, you gotta catch them. Especially as an NFL wide receiver.

[Conn]

Jamin Davis’ fit in this defense is still up in the air, sure. I think it’s probably good, and he’ll rush the passer some and be productive if he’s healthy. 
 

But people seem to be forgetting that the main reason we didn’t pick up Davis’ 5th year option actually boils down to two things other than his production on the field:

 

1. The guy showed he’s a ****ing moron who needs to grow up. Might still have jail time on the table unless I missed an update? But either way showed a very clear lack of good judgement. Not a guy you want to invest dollars in right away when you’re trying to build a culture—not without it being earned. Not at his level of production. 
 

2. Top LB salaries are insane due to so many EDGE players technically being linebackers. That’s not an attractive 5th year option unless the guy is a stud, which is why using a 1st round pick on an offball linebacker in the first place is not a super efficient decision. You lose the advantage of the worthwhile 5th year option unless the guy’s a total stud. 

Edited May 16 by Conn

[Going Commando]

8 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

Love B Rob. But Ekeler is going to get a significant amount of touches. Would love to see some 2 back sets with both on the field though. Move Ekeler in motion to get him open. 

 

That would be a really nice outcome, but I think Ekeler is going over his cliff.  I think he was brought in mainly as a mentor and third down pass catcher.  At this point BRob is probably a way better player than him.

[Rex Tomb]

2 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

 

That would be a really nice outcome, but I think Ekeler is going over his cliff.  I think he was brought in mainly as a mentor and third down pass catcher.  At this point BRob is probably a way better player than him.

Can't imagine that... Eckeler, just two seasons ago, was one of the top backs in the league... had a bad stint last year with LAC.

[KDawg]

6 hours ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said:

To an extent but we certainly can't take all the culpability away from Jahan. When balls hit your hands, you gotta catch them. Especially as an NFL wide receiver.

I don’t know. I think you kinda can take away a lot of it if it’s true.

 

If a coach is always on you, doesn’t design things for you, puts you late in progression and makes you second guess yourself… it’s extremely difficult to play well for a young player.

 

You can say, “he needs to get through that…” and I’d agree. But these guys are human.

 

If he doesn’t improve this year, then ya, it’s a Jahan problem. The proof will show itself. 

[Llevron]

3 hours ago, KDawg said:

I don’t know. I think you kinda can take away a lot of it if it’s true.

 

If a coach is always on you, doesn’t design things for you, puts you late in progression and makes you second guess yourself… it’s extremely difficult to play well for a young player.

 

You can say, “he needs to get through that…” and I’d agree. But these guys are human.

 

If he doesn’t improve this year, then ya, it’s a Jahan problem. The proof will show itself. 

 

I think people see guys like Terry and think "If he can do it so can the other guy" or something like that. And not realize it is very difficult to be the best version of yourself if you are off mentally and how much bad leadership can really just **** up the moral to the point that its impossible for people to function at their best. 

 

Terry was in a funk himself last season too btw. You could see it physically on him just how we walked. None of them were the same. 

[The Sisko]

10 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

That would be a really nice outcome, but I think Ekeler is going over his cliff.  I think he was brought in mainly as a mentor and third down pass catcher.  At this point BRob is probably a way better player than him.

 

10 hours ago, Rex Tomb said:

Can't imagine that... Eckeler, just two seasons ago, was one of the top backs in the league... had a bad stint last year with LAC.

Eckeler is one of the signings I was really intrigued by. He could be near a steep drop off, but more likely IMO, the Chargers were just not using him to maximize his talents. For some reason they seemed to want to run him up the middle 10 or 15 times a game when that’s really just not who and what he is. I suspect if left to mostly catch passes and be a change of pace, he somewhat reverts to his prior form. 

[Warhead36]

Ekeler balled out in the opener last year but then got hurt and had to play the rest of the season injured and on an absolute mess of a Charger team(they actually had worse coaching than us if we you can believe that). I'm excited to see what he can do if healthy.

[clskinsfan]

This is why analytics and PFF both can be laughingstocks. 

 

[ntotoro]

11 hours ago, KDawg said:

I think a lot of you are really forgetting how good Dotson was his rookie year.

 

I thought it was pretty obviously a Bienemy problem. 
 

We’ll find out. 

 

I want to believe that... badly... especially as good as he was his rookie season and the ceiling he showed. A player who loses motivation because of a coach makes me wonder. Some people can get the best out of others, some can't... but a player who just says "**** it" makes me worry.

 

Terry wasn't exactly in a position to succeed, was hurt and still got 1000 yards. He didn't have a season full of mulligans and mistakes.

[Going Commando]

Terry played through turf toe.  And he definitely got frozen out by Howell and Bieniemy.  Howell never really trusted him and Bieniemy's system sucked for receivers.  Despite all of that, he still got his thousand yards.

 

Jahan has somewhat low upside because of his lack of size and strength, although he does have weirdly strong red zone ability for a tiny receiver because he is so good at playing above the rim.  He's not going to have a Nico Collins type of break out because of the lack of play strength though.  His best case scenario is probably Tyler Lockett with a red zone game, which would be huge for us.  Wish we would use him in the return game.  He's the best return man on our roster now that Gibson is gone.

 

I do think that Jayden will be very good for Jahan at least, as long as Jayden hits the ground running.  You don't want to play a bunch of man coverage against Jayden because of his incredibly dangerous run threat, which should free Jahan up to get off the line of scrimmage.  You also don't necessarily want to play a ton of two high against Jayden for the same reason, and Terry is the one who will dictate the high safety, so Jahan is going to get a lot of one on ones.  The table is set for him to have success.  He just needs to run his routes like a stud and catch the ball.

 

We could use more speed at WR though.  Speed is what defines Miami and KC and we don't have anyone in our offense with elite speed other than Jayden.  Jayden's a gifted vertical passer, we need multiple guys who can smoke one on one coverage deep to take advantage of this.

 

We also need a way better OL.  We need a group that can hold up forever in pass pro, and I'm still not sure what kind of run game we are installing.  I'd consider totally reshuffling the line.  Cosmi is our best pass protector and our fastest OL.  Braeden Daniels our second fastest one.  We also know Wylie has an issue with over setting.  Why not try Cosmi and Daniels at our tackle spots and move Wylie inside then?  Especially if you want to run outside zone a lot.

[Chump Bailey]

14 hours ago, goskins10 said:

He was overdrafted

 

That's an understatement for me, friend. Jamin and Forbes were ridiculous reaches in the 1st round. 

[Going Commando]

38 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Ekeler balled out in the opener last year but then got hurt and had to play the rest of the season injured and on an absolute mess of a Charger team(they actually had worse coaching than us if we you can believe that). I'm excited to see what he can do if healthy.

 

Ekeler is turning 29 and coming off a three ypc season where he looked slow.  This is pretty much what the cliff looks like for backs.  Moments of old magic are still there, but the general effectiveness and consistency just disappear abruptly.  He's never been a workhorse back either, more of a pass catching and red zone specialist.  At this point in each of their careers, B Rob is much better than him, and Jayden will probably carry the ball more than Ekeler.  I see him as third in the pecking order, and more likely to make his impact as a pass catcher and locker room presence.

[Koolblue13]

I see Ekeler having a lot of 5 run/5 catch games and not much more. BRob is going to be the feature back and closer to 20 carry/5 catch games, while CRod has 10 carry games straight up the middle.

[kingdaddy]

11 hours ago, Rex Tomb said:

Can't imagine that... Eckeler, just two seasons ago, was one of the top backs in the league... had a bad stint last year with LAC.

Agreed, it's well documented that Ekeler played hurt for most of last season. Given full health this season, at only 28 years old, he could be one of the biggest steals of the off-season across the league. He and BRob are gonna be a nice 1-2 punch if the O-line improves.

[skinsfan66]

17 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

Terry played through turf toe.  And he definitely got frozen out by Howell and Bieniemy.  Howell never really trusted him and Bieniemy's system sucked for receivers.  Despite all of that, he still got his thousand yards.

 

Jahan has somewhat low upside because of his lack of size and strength, although he does have weirdly strong red zone ability for a tiny receiver because he is so good at playing above the rim.  He's not going to have a Nico Collins type of break out because of the lack of play strength though.  His best case scenario is probably Tyler Lockett with a red zone game, which would be huge for us.  Wish we would use him in the return game.  He's the best return man on our roster now that Gibson is gone.

 

I do think that Jayden will be very good for Jahan at least, as long as Jayden hits the ground running.  You don't want to play a bunch of man coverage against Jayden because of his incredibly dangerous run threat, which should free Jahan up to get off the line of scrimmage.  You also don't necessarily want to play a ton of two high against Jayden for the same reason, and Terry is the one who will dictate the high safety, so Jahan is going to get a lot of one on ones.  The table is set for him to have success.  He just needs to run his routes like a stud and catch the ball.

 

We could use more speed at WR though.  Speed is what defines Miami and KC and we don't have anyone in our offense with elite speed other than Jayden.  Jayden's a gifted vertical passer, we need multiple guys who can smoke one on one coverage deep to take advantage of this.

 

We also need a way better OL.  We need a group that can hold up forever in pass pro, and I'm still not sure what kind of run game we are installing.  I'd consider totally reshuffling the line.  Cosmi is our best pass protector and our fastest OL.  Braeden Daniels our second fastest one.  We also know Wylie has an issue with over setting.  Why not try Cosmi and Daniels at our tackle spots and move Wylie inside then?  Especially if you want to run outside zone a lot.

 Are you underestimating Tyler Lockett or setting the bar for Dotson high. Lockett is a little older now but if Jahan reached Tyler's career one day, then he would have been a good pick in the 1st. rd. for sure is what I think. I would take a Tyler Lockett type WR any day. 

[Going Commando]

12 minutes ago, skinsfan66 said:

 Are you underestimating Tyler Lockett or setting the bar for Dotson high. Lockett is a little older now but if Jahan reached Tyler's career one day, then he would have been a good pick in the 1st. rd. for sure is what I think. I would take a Tyler Lockett type WR any day. 

 

Lockett wasn't much of a receiver until his fourth season when he was 26.  Jahan has already posted similar production to Lockett's first two years and he came into the NFL a year younger.  I don't think that is too high a bar for Jahan to reach, especially not as his best case scenario.  It would also be a pretty major disappointment if Jahan didn't break out until he was 26.  He kind of needs to do it this year.  Definitely has to if he wants his fifth year picked up.