The Official 2023 ES Free Agency Thread... available until Free Agency 2024 begins

[Skinsinparadise]

if only this dude was on the street this off season and could be had cheap?  And considering how great our LGs were this season, there was no need for someone one like Risner.  Our young QB didn't really need an O line. 

 

I can't wait until the next HC sends Rivera his SB ring because of the masterful job he has done with this roster.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2024-free-agent-rankings-free-agency

 

65. G DALTON RISNER, MINNESOTA VIKINGS

Risner’s 2023 free agency didn’t pan out as he’d hoped, so he bided his time before joining the Minnesota Vikings a few weeks into the season on a one-year flier. Risner quickly supplanted Ezra Cleveland at left guard and has been a plus pass protector for the fifth season in a row.

Risner does well to initiate contact with a solid punch, ensuring he doesn’t expose his chest or get his hands swatted away. Even on bull rushes where Risner is driven back and gives up pressure, he keeps his feet square and stays in front of the rusher to prevent a hit on the quarterback, frequently providing this signal-caller with just enough time to still get a pass off.

Top free agent comparison: Connor McGovern, 2023

Player	Pass-block grade	True pass set pass-block grade	Positive run-block grade percentage		APY as % of Cap at signing
Dalton Risner	71.6	67.4	9.0%		?
Connor McGovern	75.0	64.8	8.8%		3.3%

*All data in tables reflects two years prior to UFA contract signing

Contract Projection: Three years, $24 million ($8 million per year), $15 million total guaranteed

Edited January 3 by Skinsinparadise

[JamesMadisonSkins]

36 minutes ago, NYSkins21 said:

Is he implying that we’d be trading JA and mid round picks for the #1 overall pick, giving us #1 AND #2 overall?

 

That would be crazy and I don’t know how we’d pass on that?

 

No, if you dig deeper he's saying Washington would trade #2, Jon Allen, and probably the Bears 2nd rounder back for #1.

 

Which in all honesty, is not a lot to give up. I think we expect Allen to demand a trade and thus, trading him for a 2nd round pick more likely than not.

 

So by that expectation we're essentially giving up two 2nds to move up from #2 to #1. It's a decent amount to give up for a re-building team BUT it's actually not a terribly steep price all things considered. If we could get to #1 and get "our sure fire guy" without giving up future draft capital that's a W.

@Skinsinparadise you know we were all clamoring for it. 

 

Seriously, if the ES collective was able to run our front office during the Rivera era, we'd be a great team.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Sign a LG, Draft an OT in R2. Those two things immediately bolster the OL. Now, what to do about LT? You'd also have some depth, presuming you don't cut Wylie and Gates. Those two would kick to reserve roles, which isn't terrible.

 

You'd still have a hole at LT. I have advocated for cutting Leno because of the cap space you'd gain. But maybe he's improved with a better LG next to him. And if you can get out of this draft without sacrificing your 2025 draft capital, that may be a position we kick down the road. The OL can be improved and Leno could be kept around or re-structured to play LT one more year. You won't be able to go from a bottom-dwelling OL to a Top 5 unit overnight. But if we can get from the bottom to the middle this year, that would be a win. 

 

If we double-tap OT in R2 and R3 and keep Leno, it opens the door long-term to having a solution at both Tackle spots. Idk what the deal is with Braeden Daniels and if he has a future here with the new FO. 

Edited January 3 by JamesMadisonSkins

[NYSkins21]

22 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

No, if you dig deeper he's saying Washington would trade #2, Jon Allen, and probably the Bears 2nd rounder back for #1.

 

Which in all honesty, is not a lot to give up. I think we expect Allen to demand a trade and thus, trading him for a 2nd round pick more likely than not.

 

So by that expectation we're essentially giving up two 2nds to move up from #2 to #1. It's a decent amount to give up for a re-building team BUT it's actually not a terribly steep price all things considered. If we could get to #1 and get "our sure fire guy" without giving up future draft capital that's a W.

@Skinsinparadise you know we were all clamoring for it. 

 

Seriously, if the ES collective was able to run our front office during the Rivera era, we'd be a great team.

I’d rather just stay at #2 (if we have it), draft either QB and trade JA for a second.

[method man]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

McKinney is my guy at safety in the draft and we need one.  He's still young and a captain.  And I read NY likely lets him go.  He was one of my favorite players in that draft.  I watched him closely live in an Alabama game and was impressed with how he directed traffic.

 

Keim loves to say that a problem with the backfield is no one there directs well or is a good communicator.  I know Curl's dad thinks his son deserves this massive contract judging by his social media posts.  But for a dude who doesn't do turnovers and isn't much of a communicator, I don't think I'd break the bank for him.  When ESPN asked personnel guys to rank their top safeties, Curl didn't even break the top 25.  Don't get me wrong, he's a good player but i am not breaking the bank for him.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2024-free-agent-rankings-free-agency

 

43. S XAVIER MCKINNEY, NEW YORK GIANTS

McKinney’s coverage grades as a free safety (81.4) and in the box (79.4) are top-10 marks among safeties in 2023, and there is a big enough sample size of box play despite his general deployment as a deep player. Over the past three seasons, McKinney’s 7.0 yards allowed per target in coverage ranks top-25 among safeties, and his 17 combined interceptions and forced incompletions put him in the top 20.

While he could make more plays at or near the line of scrimmage, he rarely whiffs on open-field tackles. The 24-year-old has missed just 7.8% of his tackle attempts over his career, 11th-best among 89 safeties with at least 100 tackles over the past four seasons, making him a reliable enough last line of defense.

Top free agent comparison: Jahleel Addae, 2017

Player	Coverage grade w/ no pressure	Cov. grade on throws in ≤ 3s	Forced incompletion rate	Run-defense grade	APY as % of Cap at signing
Xavier McKinney	73.4	76.4	9.3%	66.1	?
Jahleel Addae	71.4	77.3	7.7%	69.5	3.4%

*All data in tables reflects two years prior to UFA contract signing

Contract Projection: Three years, $24.75 million ($8.25 million per year), $17 million total guaranteed

He’s the best “middle class” safety target for us to pursue as he solves the FS problem. Martin takes over Kam’s role and Forrest plays SS next season with Butler and Reaves as depth.

 

I do want them to check in with Winfield’s camp. Winfield is having a 1st team All Pro type of season at FS for the Bucs. 91 PFF grade with 5 sacks, 5 FFs and 3 picks.

 

You and I are in the same camp regarding the need for blue chip players. Winfield is, without a doubt, a blue chip player

[Redskins 2021]

6 hours ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

 

No, if you dig deeper he's saying Washington would trade #2, Jon Allen, and probably the Bears 2nd rounder back for #1.

 

Which in all honesty, is not a lot to give up. I think we expect Allen to demand a trade and thus, trading him for a 2nd round pick more likely than not.

 

So by that expectation we're essentially giving up two 2nds to move up from #2 to #1. It's a decent amount to give up for a re-building team BUT it's actually not a terribly steep price all things considered. If we could get to #1 and get "our sure fire guy" without giving up future draft capital that's a W.

@Skinsinparadise you know we were all clamoring for it. 

 

Seriously, if the ES collective was able to run our front office during the Rivera era, we'd be a great team.

 I think that is most likely the trade if we want Williams. They will want there second back and either Allen, Payne, or Terry.

Edited January 3 by Redskins 2021

[DWinzit]

Really think this is a missed opportunity for Washington at their weakest position

 

The Cowboys signed OT La’el Collins to their practice squad.

Collins worked out for the Cowboys earlier this week. There were reportedly other teams interested in his services, but a reunion with Dallas was always the most likely outcome. Collins played for Dallas from 2015 to 2021. He then joined the Bengals. Things didn’t work out in Cincinnati and he was released in September. Collins will get back up to playing speed while on the Cowboys’ practice squad. The team can call him up to the gameday roster whenever they deem fit.

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/fantasy/football/player-news

Edited January 4 by DWinzit

[kingdaddy]

4 hours ago, Redskins 2021 said:

 I think that is most likely the trade if we want Williams. They will want there second back and either Allen, Payne, or Terry.

We're gonna trade back to #3 with New England and then ship those assets we acquire to Chicago for #1 overall and still have lots of draft picks. 

Wash trades #2 pick and 2025 5th round pick to New England for 2024 #3 overall, 2024 2nd round pick, 2025 1st round pick.

Wash trades #3 overall pick, 2024 2nd, 2025 1st, 2025 2nd to Chicago for 2024 #1 overall pick, 2024 6th, 2025 5th round pick.

 

Commanders take Williams

Pats take Drake Maye

Bears take Marv Harrison

Bears then select Michael Penix with their other 1st round pick. 

 

[ThatNFLChick]

I figure we go mostly offense in the draft and defense in FA. But we won't be able to fill every hole. 

 

Would anyone be open to Noah Fant as TE option or Michael Pittman JR as WR (I like Tee Higgins but Pittman doesn't have the injury history and would be coming off his best season)?

Edited January 4 by ThatNFLChick

[Redskins 2021]

53 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

We're gonna trade back to #3 with New England and then ship those assets we acquire to Chicago for #1 overall and still have lots of draft picks. 

Wash trades #2 pick and 2025 5th round pick to New England for 2024 #3 overall, 2024 2nd round pick, 2025 1st round pick.

Wash trades #3 overall pick, 2024 2nd, 2025 1st, 2025 2nd to Chicago for 2024 #1 overall pick, 2024 6th, 2025 5th round pick.

 

Commanders take Williams

Pats take Drake Maye

Bears take Marv Harrison

Bears then select Michael Penix with their other 1st round pick. 

 

 Possible, but new england make want Williams as well. They may make a direct offer to Chicago. We will get Maye or Williams if that who we want.

Edited January 4 by Redskins 2021

[kingdaddy]

56 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

I figure we go mostly offense in the draft and defense in FA. But we won't be able to fill every hole. 

 

Would anyone be open to Noah Fant as TE option or Michael Pittman JR as WR (I like Tee Higgins but Pittman doesn't have the injury history and would be coming off his best season)?

How has Fant been this year? Pittman would be great but costly....pairing him with Terry and Dotson would be great for sure. If Fant is a fit in the new offense then why not if he can play? He's a guy I haven't hear much about this year. I like the idea of adding a taller WR.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

 

Some of these guys were possible FA targets for us over Wylie. What does this stat mean, I think it generally means the rest of their OL's are better than average at pass protection. None of ours could make this list, as they all sucked too much. For example, is Steele really THAT bad? No, he's just got two stellar Guards that don't allow pressure, so whatever pressure he allows will have an abnormally high share.

 

Key thing here is that the Cin LT Orlando Brown making this list probably means their RT Jonah Williams was considerably better in pass protection. Jonah Williams is a free agent.

[RWJ]

3 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

I figure we go mostly offense in the draft and defense in FA. But we won't be able to fill every hole. 

 

Would anyone be open to Noah Fant as TE option or Michael Pittman JR as WR (I like Tee Higgins but Pittman doesn't have the injury history and would be coming off his best season)?

Fant is not a FA next year, I don't believe.   My bad, Fant is a FA.  

Edited January 4 by RWJ

[Koolblue13]

12 minutes ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

Some of these guys were possible FA targets for us over Wylie. What does this stat mean, I think it generally means the rest of their OL's are better than average at pass protection. None of ours could make this list, as they all sucked too much. For example, is Steele really THAT bad? No, he's just got two stellar Guards that don't allow pressure, so whatever pressure he allows will have an abnormally high share.

 

Key thing here is that the Cin LT Orlando Brown making this list probably means their RT Jonah Williams was considerably better in pass protection. Jonah Williams is a free agent.

It would be incredible for one of our guys to make that list. 

[ThatNFLChick]

2 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

How has Fant been this year? Pittman would be great but costly....pairing him with Terry and Dotson would be great for sure. If Fant is a fit in the new offense then why not if he can play? He's a guy I haven't hear much about this year. I like the idea of adding a taller WR.

 

The Seahwaks use their TEs more as blockers but fans seem to like him. I just think he is young, talented, 6'4, 26 years old has improved his blocking and has always been a good pass catcher. I don't think he'll be too expensive and in the right system can be a legit weapon

 

I think we need a tall, physical WR. I know this draft is loaded with WRs but if we decide to go the FA route Pittman will cost less than Higgins (but still cost a bit). He's 6'4", just turned 26, doesn't have the injury issues Higgins has had and by all accounts is a good locker room guy 

 

 

[RWJ]

1 minute ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

The Seahwaks use their TEs more as blockers but fans seem to like him. I just think he is young, talented, 6'4, 26 years old has improved his blocking and has always been a good pass catcher. I don't think he'll be too expensive and in the right system can be a legit weapon. 

 

I think we need a tall, physical WR. I know this draft is loaded with WRs but if we decide to go the FA route Pittman will cost less than Higgins (but still cost a bit). He's 6'4", just turned 26, doesn't have the injury issues Higgins has had and by all accounts is a good locker room guy 

 

It puts us in a situation of do we trade F1 if we sign player like Pittman.  He will cost a bunch.  I like Fant too! 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

Why do people expect JAllen to demand a trade? Because he’s tired of losing? 

[method man]

1 hour ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

The Seahwaks use their TEs more as blockers but fans seem to like him. I just think he is young, talented, 6'4, 26 years old has improved his blocking and has always been a good pass catcher. I don't think he'll be too expensive and in the right system can be a legit weapon

 

I think we need a tall, physical WR. I know this draft is loaded with WRs but if we decide to go the FA route Pittman will cost less than Higgins (but still cost a bit). He's 6'4", just turned 26, doesn't have the injury issues Higgins has had and by all accounts is a good locker room guy 

 

 

The Seahawks are probably not going to retain Fant given that they just gave Dissly a multiyear deal. I’d want to understand just how good he has become as a blocker. I don’t really want a move TE.

 

I can’t get Pittman’s terrible game against us last year out of my head. He is a heck of a possession receiver though and can man the X. I take Mike Evans over both on a 3 year deal if he were open to coming here

[LetMeSeeYourWarFace21]

On 12/29/2023 at 3:45 PM, CapsSkins said:

Trade Jon Allen to a contender to do right by him .....

 

 

 

Mannn, yall be losing me with all this "do right by him" bull**** whenever a player leaves. I'm sorry, is he Darrel Green? Is he Cal Ripken? Is he Ovechkin? We "did right by him" when we signed him to a big contract. We dont owe him ****....I have no ill will towards Allen at all, but we can trade him to the Panthers for all I care......

Edited January 4 by LetMeSeeYourWarFace21

[kingdaddy]

5 hours ago, LetMeSeeYourWarFace21 said:

 

 

Mannn, yall be losing me with all this "do right by him" bull**** whenever a player leaves. I'm sorry, is he Darrel Green? Is Cal Ripken? Is he Ovechkin? We "did right by him" when we signed him to a big contract. We dont owe him ****....I have no ill will towards Allen at all, but we can trade him to the Panthers for all I care......

This is pretty well said....I don't see anything close to Miles Garrett or Aaron Donald when I see Allen play. If he wants out of here then give his agent permission to seek a trade that involves nothing less than a high 2nd round pick in return. 

[DWinzit]

23 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

if only this dude was on the street this off season and could be had cheap?  And considering how great our LGs were this season, there was no need for someone one like Risner.  Our young QB didn't really need an O line. 

 

I can't wait until the next HC sends Rivera his SB ring because of the masterful job he has done with this roster.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-2024-free-agent-rankings-free-agency

 

65. G DALTON RISNER, MINNESOTA VIKINGS

Risner’s 2023 free agency didn’t pan out as he’d hoped, so he bided his time before joining the Minnesota Vikings a few weeks into the season on a one-year flier. Risner quickly supplanted Ezra Cleveland at left guard and has been a plus pass protector for the fifth season in a row.

Risner does well to initiate contact with a solid punch, ensuring he doesn’t expose his chest or get his hands swatted away. Even on bull rushes where Risner is driven back and gives up pressure, he keeps his feet square and stays in front of the rusher to prevent a hit on the quarterback, frequently providing this signal-caller with just enough time to still get a pass off.

Top free agent comparison: Connor McGovern, 2023

Player	Pass-block grade	True pass set pass-block grade	Positive run-block grade percentage		APY as % of Cap at signing
Dalton Risner	71.6	67.4	9.0%		?
Connor McGovern	75.0	64.8	8.8%		3.3%

*All data in tables reflects two years prior to UFA contract signing

Contract Projection: Three years, $24 million ($8 million per year), $15 million total guaranteed

It felt like the arrogance of the staff led to the team not looking at Risner even though he was available until after week 2.

 

Dalton and Cosmi would have solidified the OG spots. That probably would have translated to better play at LT and C.

 

I am not sure the Paul/Charles experience played out that well

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

Trading good players for picks sounds kinda sexy until the new player isn’t as good as the one you traded.

 

Keep TMac, Payne, Allen. Get some young, aggressive coaches in the building.

 

I think it’s easy to throw out the baby with the bath water when things go sideways. I’m happy to keep a few of our core guys. 
 

 

Edited January 4 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy

[method man]

44 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

Trading good players for picks sounds kinda sexy until the new player isn’t as good as the one you traded.

 

Keep TMac, Payne, Allen. Get some young, aggressive coaches in the building.

 

I think it’s easy to throw out the baby with the bath water when things go sideways. I’m happy to keep a few of our core guys. 
 

 

That new player doesn’t necessarily have to be as good as the guy you traded away given the massive difference in cost

[wit33]

While it’s not an uncommon situation, I’m waiting for the overhaul before speculating on the team’s decisions regarding the talented players. My inclination is to retain Allen and Payne; I believe they can lead a defensive resurgence with excellent coaching, potentially becoming one of the league’s best tandems in the coming years. If they are positive influences in the locker room and wish to stay, investing in them financially while aiming for the playoffs next year seems prudent.
 

The new regime, whether it’s labeled as a rebuild or something else, should set reaching the playoffs as the immediate goal. The top players currently on the roster fit in this window. Must keep great talent much more than you don’t. 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

16 minutes ago, method man said:

That new player doesn’t necessarily have to be as good as the guy you traded away given the massive difference in cost

You gotta pay somebody. It’s not like we’re hurting for cap room. And it’s not like those guys are bums. 
 

And I otherwise disagree with your statement. That’s what Bruce Allen bargain shopping will do to a team. 
 

It’s okay to pay good players. Payne/Allen/TMac earned their deals. They’ll be nice pieces for a new coach.