New OC Thread (Welcome Aboard Eric Bieniemy!)

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Heinicke was responsible for Thibodeaux but didn’t recognize it.  Not saying that to slam him but it’s the reason he came unblocked.

[Voice_of_Reason]

8 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Hill is a gadget player, Howell is a QB only.  A QB that when Ron last gave an update said he was working hard on footwork, taking the appropriate drops, etc.  

 

As much as I’d like to see Howell, I gather he’s truly not ready enough.  The way Ron talks about Taylor’s play in years past as well as recently, it’s pretty obvious he’d like to play someone else.  🤣

He’s dying to play somebody else but up until now just couldn’t.

 

Im not sure of that really good and remarkable play on 4th down saved TH’s job.  

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

3 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

He’s dying to play somebody else but up until now just couldn’t.

 

Im not sure of that really good and remarkable play on 4th down saved TH’s job.  

It absolutely saved his job, in conjunction with the next two or three picks not getting picked.

[Voice_of_Reason]

Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

It absolutely saved his job, in conjunction with the next two or three picks not getting picked.

Did Ron say anything today? I’ve been busy.  
 

If it wasn’t declared definitely, there’s a chance he could change his mind or make a change over the bye week.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Just now, Voice_of_Reason said:

Did Ron say anything today? I’ve been busy.  
 

If it wasn’t declared definitely, there’s a chance he could change his mind or make a change over the bye week.

He said when Wentz is ready, he’ll be the backup.

[skins island connection]

On 12/4/2022 at 8:54 PM, NoVaSkins21 said:

Agreed the game in 2 weeks is basically a playoff game.  Let's hope Turner scripts a better game plan.  Heinicke is what he is he is.  Too high on some throws or not enough arm strength on others.  

 

 I think they should call more designed roll-out plays for TH. Its already bad that the line can't pass protect, so have him roll out, maybe a designed run or 2, just to keep the defense guessing. It seemed like the Giants knew about 60% of the plays before the snap, and thats on Turner solely.

[SkinsFTW]

4 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

He said when Wentz is ready, he’ll be the backup.

 

It's probably not the most efficient thing in the world to have a backup QB that's paid more than the entire OL + probably a few more players as well.

[Redwards]

12 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

He said when Wentz is ready, he’ll be the backup.

Ron realizing now what he rest of the NFL sporting world knew last year: Wentz ain't gonna get it done.  He's done as a player.

 

Now we're out two draft picks and $28 million that could have been used to build an O line.  And now we're still without an answer at the game's most important position after three years.  Unreal.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

14 minutes ago, Redwards said:

Ron realizing now what he rest of the NFL sporting world knew last year: Wentz ain't gonna get it done.  He's done as a player.

 

Now we're out two draft picks and $28 million that could have been used to build an O line.  And now we're still without an answer at the game's most important position after three years.  Unreal.

It didn’t work out, but neither did any other offseason QB move made by any other team.

 

He definitely overestimated the OL, the criticism there is fair.  But It’s hard for me to saddle him with not figuring the QB position out as if that’s not the bazillion dollar problem every team without one faces.

[Warhead36]

I think Wentz would have worked if we had the same OL as last year. But when you let guys like Scherff go, what do you expect?

[RandyHolt]

Why did Samuel and Jahan come to life this past week?  Game script or trying to throw a changeup - maybe trying to validate using our best weapons after seemingly months of meh production from them. 

 

Clearly Turner went out of the way to target Jahan early and it was obvious. Maybe it was easing him back from injury?  Samuel got a lot of targets and came through after getting less than 3RECs/GM over the past 8 games. Odd to me with Jahan out most of those games. The Heinicke factor. I think I finally learned to spell his name since he aint going away.

 

MORE of those 2 stud WRs please.

Edited December 6, 2022 by RandyHolt

[CTskin]

11 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

I think Wentz would have worked if we had the same OL as last year. But when you let guys like Scherff go, what do you expect?

Scherff is having an awful season, not the best time for that example… the problem is an average OL has been decimated by injuries.

Edited December 7, 2022 by CTskin

[Redwards]

On 12/6/2022 at 9:07 AM, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

It didn’t work out, but neither did any other offseason QB move made by any other team.

 

He definitely overestimated the OL, the criticism there is fair.  But It’s hard for me to saddle him with not figuring the QB position out as if that’s not the bazillion dollar problem every team without one faces.

My problem is their evaluation team truly blew it.  EVERYONE knew Carson was done.  He had nothing left with regard to being a true franchise QB you can win a SB with.  I'm not castigating Ron and his FO for not solving the QB issue by Year 3.  You can't manufacture a QB if there isn't one to be had and I've never held it against them for not trading a king's ransom to move up for Fields.  

 

However, I expect them not to panic (and that is exactly what they did after not getting their top two coveted QBs in Rogers and Wilson) and convince themselves that giving up 2 draft picks (and 2nd rounder very likely at the time) and $28 million for a QB who was done vs. just sucking it up for another year, being honest with themselves on the QB front, and taking that money to build the rest of the team, then taking stock of what they can do at QB the next offseason was the right answer.  

 

The latter is what they should have done.  That's not hindsight; I was saying it at the time (as were plenty of fans and practically all the rest of the NFL, and Ron got very defensive about it) and when Ron went with Carson, I was done with Ron.  It told me all I needed to know.  (I'm not and never have castigated anyone for being on the Ron bandwagon.  But I'm certainly off it.)  Until this franchise can be truly honest with itself and not feel ultimate pressure to solve the QB problem when a true possible solution isn't to be had, they're going to continue to make bad decisions and hamstring this team for the long run.  

 

The QB problem was always going to still be there heading into 2023, even after they traded for Carson.  Everyone who was capable of taking an honest look at him knew this.   But at least if they had not talked themselves into this situation, they could have a much stronger line right now.  Solve one problem.  Don't create two.  Except now we have neither.  Both are in very bad shape.  We still have two problems.  

 

 

Edited December 7, 2022 by Redwards

[Conn]

Did we already forget the report that Snyder wanted Wentz and Rivera liked him enough to go with it? Who knows what QB decision they’d have arrived at without that interference. I’m not saying Rivera was dictated to, it wasn’t the Haskins situation. But it certainly effected things. That’s the problem with the rot starting at the head of the franchise and spreading downward. We can’t really know. 

Edited December 7, 2022 by Conn

[Warhead36]

15 minutes ago, Conn said:

Did we already forget the report that Snyder wanted Wentz and Rivera liked him enough to go with it? Who knows what QB decision they’d have arrived at without that interference. I’m not saying Rivera was dictated to, it wasn’t the Haskins situation. But it certainly effected things. That’s the problem with the rot starting at the head of the franchise and spreading downward. We can’t really know. 

I hate Snyder as much as anyone but that's a cop out. Wentz was a Rivera decision. If Snyder still had any sort of pull to that extent he wouldn't have let Rivera flat out release Haskins in 2020.

[Conn]

1 minute ago, Warhead36 said:

I hate Snyder as much as anyone but that's a cop out. Wentz was a Rivera decision. If Snyder still had any sort of pull to that extent he wouldn't have let Rivera flat out release Haskins in 2020.

 

Snyder has as much pull as he wants until he’s gone. I don’t know why I’d be asked to ignore this specific Snyder QB report when all the rest have been true. Rivera angrily dismissed it in a presser because that’s what you have to do. And again, I’m saying that Rivera was on board with it and not forced—but that influence still matters. Maybe Snyder’s interest in Wentz was the tie-breaker and “permission” to jettison that draft capital and cap $$ when in a vacuum they’d have gone for a Mariota type. There’s really no way to know which again, is the problem I’m posting about. I’m not pretending Rivera was pulled kicking and screaming into the Wentz deal. I’m simply saying that that influence (when Snyder was supposed to be uninvolved with the team btw) matters and is corrupting and has to be taken into account. 

[MartinC]

On 12/6/2022 at 7:34 AM, Warhead36 said:

I think Wentz would have worked if we had the same OL as last year. But when you let guys like Scherff go, what do you expect?

 

To me the problem was not letting Scherff go, it was the way we tried to replace him with aging retreads. I don't think we should have offered the contract Scherrf got and I'm not sure he would have signed it to stay in Washington anyway. Letting him walk was the right decision - but you had to have a plan to replace him.

[Thinking Skins]

29 minutes ago, Conn said:

Did we already forget the report that Snyder wanted Wentz and Rivera liked him enough to go with it? Who knows what QB decision they’d have arrived at without that interference. I’m not saying Rivera was dictated to, it wasn’t the Haskins situation. But it certainly effected things. That’s the problem with the rot starting at the head of the franchise and spreading downward. We can’t really know. 

That's interesting, given the winning streak and the benching of Wentz. I know it was because of injury but could that story be true? I don't think Rivera wants to put Wentz back in and now I need to check my dates because with the story about the sale coming out maybe Rivera has power to keep Heinicke in now. 

[HigSkin]

 

[Warhead36]

Yeah I'm not gonna blame Turner for the end of the game. The OL literally could not block at all. We called two run plays that should have net us 5-7 yards which would have at least put us in long FG range. At some point your players have to be able to execute.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

I hate Snyder as much as anyone but that's a cop out. Wentz was a Rivera decision. If Snyder still had any sort of pull to that extent he wouldn't have let Rivera flat out release Haskins in 2020.

“Full control” is a term that gets carried away with.  Just as it did with Shanahan.

 

Sure, the coach has “full control” but the coach still has to meet regularly with the owner, listen to their ideas, pretend they are good, and so on and so forth.

 

It’s just one of those things that you’ll never really know how things transpired when you have a bad owner.  Bad owners have bad ideas, and not every coach or GM is equipped with the skills to massage an owners ego and talk them down from bad ideas.  Sometimes bad owners can be convincing.  The rot starts at the top and filters its way down in a variety of ways.  Nobody is immune.

 

None of that is to say that Wentz was solely a Dan thing, just that we will never know because we always have to question these things because of him.  That and it fits Dan like a glove.

[Voice_of_Reason]

I don't know where exactly to put this, so I'll put it here, since it is offensive related.

 

I looked up to see if there were swarms of locus today signifying the end of the world.  

 

Doc Walker was on Galdi in this morning's podcast, and ...  he made cogent points which I agreed with.  I didn't think it was possible.  He didn't use any of the "old tough man take his manhood" phrases.  He didn't use any stupid nicknames or call anybody the Caveman.  (He actually used that nickname on at least 2 players, I forget who, I think he might have forgotten he used it before also....  It might have been more, I stopped listening to him a while ago.  

 

I almost died from shock. 

 

And the thing he said which I totally agree with is his unsung hero and MVP was been Larsen.  The has looked good basically when Rouiller played for the first game, and after Larsen came back.  When Nick Martin was playing, it was dreadful.  

 

Coincidence? I THINK NOT.  

 

Larsen's immergence did coincide with Tre Turner coming back healthy, and BRob returning as well.  So it wasn't ONLY him.  

 

But I'll fight anybody who thinks fixing the center spot wasn't a HUGE reason for the turn-around.  Especially the ability to run the ball.  

[Voice_of_Reason]

Replying to the Nick Aldridge tweets of plays, specifically the last one:

 

If Thomas gets ANY type of block on the last play, that's probably 7-10 yards easy. The entire offensive line set up a The Great Wall of China to BRob's right, and all Thomas had to do was keep his body between the rusher and the ball carrier.  Didn't even have to really move him, just stay between them.  (Granted, I get this is a hard thing to do, but he is a professional football player, and this is his job, so he should be able to do it.)

 

He allows the defender to get inside of him. And the play is dead.   

 

If he had shaded to the inside, played on the inside half of the defender, and forced the defender to go outside and around him, BRob is by him before he takes his 3rd step and into the secondary. Instead Thomas just lunges and falls down flat on his face.  

 

If you continue to play it out, defender 36 looks like he's in the hole to make the play after probably a 5-7 yard gain, however Dotson is heading right at him.  If BRob clears, Dotson gets to the defender.  Granted, Dotson might get pancaked going up against a LB, but if he gets in the way a little bit, there is only one more defender between BRob and the endzone.  Even if Dotson doens't get to him, it's 1:1 between Robinson and the backer 7 yards down field.  I'll take that.  The LB might have the advantage, but Robinson could truck him, put a move on him, something.  But he never got the opportunity to even try.  

 

It was that close.  All Thomas has to do is not completely fall over.   

 

Honestly, you can't draw up a running play any better than that.  You're one player making the block they are supposed to from getting 7-9 yards, and if the WR actually can impede the LB, it's sprung for the TD. Or BRob breaks a tackle.  He probably has to break 1 tackle and he scores.    You don't expect that, so you'll live with the 7-9 yards.  

 

But Damn.  That was SO SO SO close.  

[FLSkinz83]

We really need to figure out what the heck we're doing with our protection schemes.

[FLSkinz83]

2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I don't know where exactly to put this, so I'll put it here, since it is offensive related.

 

I looked up to see if there were swarms of locus today signifying the end of the world.  

 

Doc Walker was on Galdi in this morning's podcast, and ...  he made cogent points which I agreed with.  I didn't think it was possible.  He didn't use any of the "old tough man take his manhood" phrases.  He didn't use any stupid nicknames or call anybody the Caveman.  (He actually used that nickname on at least 2 players, I forget who, I think he might have forgotten he used it before also....  It might have been more, I stopped listening to him a while ago.  

 

I almost died from shock. 

 

And the thing he said which I totally agree with is his unsung hero and MVP was been Larsen.  The has looked good basically when Rouiller played for the first game, and after Larsen came back.  When Nick Martin was playing, it was dreadful.  

 

Coincidence? I THINK NOT.  

 

Larsen's immergence did coincide with Tre Turner coming back healthy, and BRob returning as well.  So it wasn't ONLY him.  

 

But I'll fight anybody who thinks fixing the center spot wasn't a HUGE reason for the turn-around.  Especially the ability to run the ball.  

 

Agreed.   I would add that Schweitzer was bad at Center in the first Philly game.