Year three under Rivera and we still have no identity

[drowland]

43 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

You only save $5.8M by cutting him, so meh.  He’s way down on the list of things to address in my mind.
 

I would be interested in what the trade market is for McLaurin and Allen.  Two guys on long, fair  market deals.  Not saying I want to trade them.  I love those guys, but they may be our best assets.  Would someone trade for a tagged Payne?  Would Sweat have a market?  I could see a team looking at his talent and having the confidence that they can get more out of him.

 

Payne is the best player on this team right now IMO.  I would make him a priority to extend.  Sweat I would trade and I'd trade Gibson as well.  I think Gibson is a nice weapon but they don't know how to utilize him and I don't see them paying him. He's not a natural RB and the Williams kid along with Robinson are.  Plus they have Mckissic and Samuels to use in the passing game who can play the hybrid role.  

[BraveWarrior]

I read Ron completely wrong when he was hired. I thought he was a tough, no-nonsense guy who would build a strong, physical team that pushes their opponent around for 4 quarters. After the Gruden era, I was begging for them to get a defensive minded HC, but this, this just isn't working. We certainly haven't established any kind of physicality on defense, and our O line aren't mean, nasty guys who block their man until the whistle blows. When was the last time one of our O linemen had a pancake block, or blocked their guy 10-15 yards downfield, like Trent Williams used to do? If we were 1-3, but our opponents were coming out of these games black and blue and knowing they were lucky to survive a dogfight, I could live with that. But the Eagles and Boys played us like they knew the outcome before the games started, and felt like they didn't even have to expend much effort to win. That's the biggest problem I see as far as a lack of identity. We play like doormats, and the other teams know that going in. 

[88Comrade2000]

If we move on from Ron; every player’s future here is uncertain.

 

You don’t know which players will fit the new coach’s schemes. I’d expect another roster turnover.

[Zim489]

2 hours ago, drowland said:

 

Payne is the best player on this team right now IMO.  I would make him a priority to extend.  Sweat I would trade and I'd trade Gibson as well.  I think Gibson is a nice weapon but they don't know how to utilize him and I don't see them paying him. He's not a natural RB and the Williams kid along with Robinson are.  Plus they have Mckissic and Samuels to use in the passing game who can play the hybrid role.  

The issue with Payne just like it was in 2018 when we drafted him was that it’s poor roster management paying two interior lineman in 2020s top dollar. Especially as more and more of the league moves to 3 man fronts 

[BraveWarrior]

5 minutes ago, Zim489 said:

The issue with Payne just like it was in 2018 when we drafted him was that it’s poor roster management paying two interior lineman in 2020s top dollar. Especially as more and more of the league moves to 3 man fronts 

But we had been a 3-4, and moved back to a 4-3 with the new regime. I was in favor of it, because for the entire time we were a 3-4, we never drafted a true NT or brought one in via free agency. But yeah, money-wise, there's no way we keep 4 first rounders on our D line for too much longer. 

[CjSuAvE22]

Too many titles for rivera, he just shoulda been given head coach priorities and nothing more but since we are a backwards team we hired a coach then a year later a gm.

[ClaytoAli]

This is Scott Turner’s first stint as an Offensive Coordinator. Ron brought him in and he stinks. 
 

He is a Ron guy and it’s on Ron to get him out of here. If Ron won’t part with his friend’s kid that he has now hired three times, he needs to go too.

 

He is learning on the job in Washington.

Edited October 3, 2022 by ClaytoAli

[CobraCommander]

2 minutes ago, ClaytoAli said:

This is Scott Turner’s first year as an Offensive Coordinator. Ron brought him in and he stinks. 
 

He is a Ron guy and it’s on Ron to get him out of here. If Ron won’t part with his friend’s kid that he has now hired three times, he needs to go too.

 

He is learning on the job in Washington.

This is not Turners first year unless I’m missing something. Some of us have been saying for awhile he stinks but everyone said to give him a chance with a real QB. 

[ClaytoAli]

7 minutes ago, CobraCommander said:

This is not Turners first year unless I’m missing something. Some of us have been saying for awhile he stinks but everyone said to give him a chance with a real QB. 

First time as an offensive coordinator… he was an interim for a short time under Ron in Carolina. FIXED!

[Tonysoprano1]

In my mind I'm trying to decide who is worse Turner or Del Rio. Hard to decide because they're both so awful. And that's on rivera. All three need to go all three bad signings. Rivera hasnt accomplished anything he said he was going to do in almost 3 years here. The team is a mess at this point and Turner n Del Rio are both awful

[Probos]

It's pretty clear Ron is not up to the task and completely over his head.  Mix in his arrogance, stubbornness, deflecting blame and inability to accept the responsibility for this team being bottom 3 in the league and it makes it that much more infuriating.  Dan gave him complete control of everything, and at this point he's failing miserably at all those jobs.  And I don't wanna hear this "he's changed the culture" **** either.  Has he?  Really?  Tell me how please?  In the NFL or any other high level sports league "culture" flows from WINNING, Period.  Do that and there's an almost 100% chance the "culture" will get better.  

 

I will not stop beating this drum -- This all goes back to Dan.  Ron is his hire.  I know we as fans have no control, but as long as this snake his its head in place nothing will change.

 

"Happy Thanksgiving everybody."

[theTruthTeller]

4 hours ago, Probos said:

I will not stop beating this drum -- This all goes back to Dan.  Ron is his hire.  I know we as fans have no control, but as long as this snake his its head in place nothing will change.

I have no reason to believe that RR wasn't the best coach who would come here.  The reasons for good coaching prospects to look elsewhere are starting to pile up.

 

Most people on this board, including myself, thought we got an unexpected gift with RR.  I thought the best we would get would be something along the lines of a head of concessions at a Div II school.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

18 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Identity, imo, isn't the word for it,  there are some project management terminologies on tip of my tongue that would be a better description for longterm strategic exection of an overall team building philosophy.

 

 

I agree...to me, you guys are talking about an organization having a mission statement/strategic plan. Not necessarily laying out the operational plan (are we going to be a passing team or running team) since that might depend more on which unicorn-type player you luck into in the draft, but that you are going to set your goals, objectives, themes, etc. and measure your success over 1-, 3-, and 5-year increments...what have you. 

 

I agree...even Belichick probably knows that he's always going to try to "Moneyball" the league to an extent. For a while, he tried to find an undervalued area and exploit it. He had Gronk and Hernandez and tore teams apart that way. He was one of the first (maybe THE first, but I don't recall) to really exploit the slot receiver. He was quick to defer to try to get the "double-dip" to score at the end of a half and get the ball to start the second half. Anyway...that was part of their organizational philosophy but it was a bigger-picture idea than "be a pound-it-out team"

[Redwards]

1 hour ago, theTruthTeller said:

I have no reason to believe that RR wasn't the best coach who would come here.  The reasons for good coaching prospects to look elsewhere are starting to pile up.

 

Most people on this board, including myself, thought we got an unexpected gift with RR.  I thought the best we would get would be something along the lines of a head of concessions at a Div II school.

That's the next hire, for sure.  

 

Ron's the apex.  How freaking miserable.

 

[NoCalMike]

Giving Ron the keys to everything was a mistake.  If that was what it took to get him signed here, the front office should have said no thanks. It is usually a no-win situation because if you get a few years into their contract and the team hasn't improved significantly, then it looks bad on everyone having to go to the coach and usurp some of that power back.

 

I feel like the roster has improved since 2020, but a roster is different than a team.  Has the team improved? I guess to be fair it is too early to say definitively for 2022, but it isn't looking so good right now. 

[BringMetheHeadofBruceAllen]

3 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

Giving Ron the keys to everything was a mistake.  If that was what it took to get him signed here, the front office should have said no thanks. It is usually a no-win situation because if you get a few years into their contract and the team hasn't improved significantly, then it looks bad on everyone having to go to the coach and usurp some of that power back.

 

I feel like the roster has improved since 2020, but a roster is different than a team.  Has the team improved? I guess to be fair it is too early to say definitively for 2022, but it isn't looking so good right now. 

 

Yeah, very few people in this world can do two jobs well. Ron should stick to coaching, but I guess he wouldn't have come here if Snyder didn't give him the keys to the franchise. Snyder knew he'd wind up with someone like Rich Kotite if he didn't allow the coach to be GM.

 

On second thought, Rich Kotite may have been a better choice...

Edited October 3, 2022 by BringMetheHeadofBruceAllen

[CjSuAvE22]

7 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

 

I feel like the roster has improved since 2020, but a roster is different than a team.  Has the team improved? I guess to be fair it is too early to say definitively for 2022, but it isn't looking so good right now. 

The roster has improved is news to me, the best players on the team have been picked by the old regime…wjiii stinks fuller stinks  norwell and turner stink jamin davis stinks kam curl and gibson don’t make up for the players rivera has brought in.

[Est.1974]

23 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

That end of first half overall decision making was just mind boggling on so many levels and just incompetence at its finest. Just talking about it again makes me want to break something.

Elements of the game like that are simply unforgivable. 

[skins island connection]

12 hours ago, Tonysoprano1 said:

In my mind I'm trying to decide who is worse Turner or Del Rio. Hard to decide because they're both so awful. And that's on rivera. All three need to go all three bad signings. Rivera hasnt accomplished anything he said he was going to do in almost 3 years here. The team is a mess at this point and Turner n Del Rio are both awful

 

 Some are thinking the defense is playing better, but not me. Opponents just playing conservative, taking as much time off the clock as possible.

Opponents took their foot off the gas in the 2nd halves of games. Dallas was a case of a half-ass offense with a back-up QB; see how well they hold up against a strong team. They'll get crushed, just like the Commanders got crushed. Same with the Eagles; Hurts isn't an all-star QB but comparatively speaking he's an MVP.  

Edited October 3, 2022 by skins island connection

[wit33]

 

 

 

19 hours ago, Zim489 said:

The issue with Payne just like it was in 2018 when we drafted him was that it’s poor roster management paying two interior lineman in 2020s top dollar. Especially as more and more of the league moves to 3 man fronts 

 

Payne is good player trending towards great. Yes, you sign two interior DL to top dollar contracts. Can’t fathom keeping a Kendall Fuller or Jackson versus Payne. These “rules” the weaker franchises abide by to remain in the safety zone of mediocre is tiresome. Make the money work. 
 

The line of scrimmage remains as one of the most important factors to winning a game—Payne and Allen are positives to achieving this goal. 
 

 

[zCommander]

Grant on the radio today brought up some points on why Ron can't be fired. Still has 2 years left. Dan will need to fire everyone which will include like 20 coaches and assistance. Too much money to throw away to start over again after only 3 years. 

 

I think with Ron being so high up on the totem pole gives him some leverage too. I don't see him going anywhere yet. Ron needs to get a better D coach though.

 

Turner is here for the next two year, contract wise, if I am not mistaken. 

 

JDR should be gone after this season if not before the season ends. 

 

Edited October 3, 2022 by zCommander

[skinfan2k]

23 hours ago, BraveWarrior said:

I read Ron completely wrong when he was hired. I thought he was a tough, no-nonsense guy who would build a strong, physical team that pushes their opponent around for 4 quarters. After the Gruden era, I was begging for them to get a defensive minded HC, but this, this just isn't working. We certainly haven't established any kind of physicality on defense, and our O line aren't mean, nasty guys who block their man until the whistle blows. When was the last time one of our O linemen had a pancake block, or blocked their guy 10-15 yards downfield, like Trent Williams used to do? If we were 1-3, but our opponents were coming out of these games black and blue and knowing they were lucky to survive a dogfight, I could live with that. But the Eagles and Boys played us like they knew the outcome before the games started, and felt like they didn't even have to expend much effort to win. That's the biggest problem I see as far as a lack of identity. We play like doormats, and the other teams know that going in. 

He is a no-nonsense guy.  He is built for the 1990s.   His offense and his personality is built to run the ball, and stop the run.  but in this NFL, it doesn't matter.  You set up the run with the short passing game. 

[Zim489]

58 minutes ago, zCommander said:

Grant on the radio today brought up some points on why Ron can't be fired. Still has 2 years left. Dan will need to fire everyone which will include like 20 coaches and assistance. Too much money to throw away to start over again after only 3 years. 

 

I think with Ron being so high up on the totem pole gives him some leverage too. I don't see him going anywhere yet. Ron needs to get a better D coach though.

 

Turner is here for the next two year, contract wise, if I am not mistaken. 

 

JDR should be gone after this season if not before the season ends. 

 

You just cant keep him if he limps to a 3-4 win season. You cant let him trade the future away in desperation. Cant saddle the next staff with the currents staff QB. They cant keep making the same mistake over and over. Do something ahead of schedule for once. Not behind.

[sebestian]

On 10/2/2022 at 5:21 PM, Zim489 said:

Its abundantly clear they never had a plan from beginning. It has been just a year to year get as best as we can. No idea on how to build a franchise. They just get "good" players and plug them in and hope they do well.

 

Its why I am such a stickler for a GM lead franchise a HC only thinks in one year increments. A true GM in this spot would start shopping some players for some picks when its clear the team isnt going anywhere. Ron isnt trading a sole. In fact I wouldnt be surprised if they traded for Roquan smith using our top 5 pick .

 

There needs to be a clear and coherent plan set by the FO. 

This !!  It is what every good organization does, and yet, here we are.  It really is mind boggling.

[sebestian]

21 hours ago, CjSuAvE22 said:

Too many titles for rivera, he just shoulda been given head coach priorities and nothing more but since we are a backwards team we hired a coach then a year later a gm.

Exactly!!!!