The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[DogofWar1]

And on the 3rd day (of April) he Maye rise again!

[MartinC]

2 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

 

I guess the Rams did it when they signed Stafford but that was the rare "one year all in bet" that actually paid off. 

 

The Rams didn't plan to do it. They drafted Goff #1 overall and then built around him, got to a Super Bowl they lost and decided they would never win one with Goff. So they swapped him out with Stafford. Stafford walked into a roster stacked to win right now with almost a one season window - and delivered.

 

Generally though the idea that you build your roster and then find your QB is flawed. We've been trying that for about 30 years and counting with almost zero success. Finding a franchise QB is really really hard - when you have a top 2 pick in a QB heavy draft with 3 maybe 4 possible franchise guys and you dont already have an established elite QB it would be insane to trade out of the chance to take a swing on one of them.

[DogofWar1]

Indeed we appear to have hit the "Maye redemption arc" of this season of "The NFL Draft."

 

Do we have anymore twists and turns to go before April 25th!?

 

Who knows.  I hope not.  I'm exhausted.

[ntotoro]

25 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Ex-scout on 106.7 just now, knows Peters.  He said his scuttlebutt that he's heard is this team is more likely to take Maye.  

He also said the radio silence from the FO in regards to Maye was an indication that they were going in that direction. This FO seems pretty silent, though, unlike years past.

[illone]

 Quote of the day from Mike Mayock/John Middlekauf:

 

"If Blake Bortles can be drafted 3rd overall, anyone can"

 

😂

 

 

[SpacePenguin]

25 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

Indeed we appear to have hit the "Maye redemption arc" of this season of "The NFL Draft."

 

Do we have anymore twists and turns to go before April 25th!?

 

Who knows.  I hope not.  I'm exhausted.

 

There is a vengeful slender man generational QB prospect, some say he's 6'2, others claim he's naught 5'10, but he is lanky, probably under 200 lbs if you drained his blood, likes to run, is fragile and has people that really like linking twitter posts from clowns that say he's going number 2. One read QB my ass! What could go wrong?

 

 

 

 

Wait this is 2024!? How am I still a fan of this team, again? Ah, yeah....depression mixed with masochism. Carry on.

Edited April 3 by SpacePenguin

[The Consigliere]

4 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

Yeah this is just getting weird. It's like talking about a baseball prospect and touting how good he is at hitting home runs when there's plenty of data which directly indicates that's something he actually kind of sucks at. And then touting that player over another guy who actually does hit home runs.

 

Same with the JJ crap. There's little to no scouts I've seen quoted anywhere who suggest McCarthy is worth anything like the hype currently suggests. It just has me wondering --- is going on? Are scouts and GM's just excited about him winning a championship and playing well doing it? If so, why not draft those solid but meh Alabama QB's over the years. Its one thing if they had data like Daniels '23, Maye's '22, Caleb Williams crazy talent etc, but its just what looked like a game manager who can't make all the throws but is great between the ears. Maybe that works, but maybe it doesnt if he can't make the freaking throws, and reading the scouts it sure as hell seems like just about all of them think he's "meh". I have no idea whats going on because the Daniels hypers are logically ignoring his career and focusing on his '23, the Maye critique is focusing entirely on '23, and not on '22 and little on the talent disparity between him and LSU's squad....it's so weird, and did anyone notice NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT THE S2 TEST period. Last year was about eviscerating CJ Stroud after Purdy hit with a great S2 the year before, and now that Stroud basically dynamited the leagues defenses for four months, we haven't heard even a single peep about the S2 test. Hmmmm.....

 

It just all feels like colossal bull----, and I'll be honest, if Daniels or JJ are the pick, yes I will lose my ----, and if I'm right and they are wrong, I'll lose my ---- 10x more. If you take Daniels or freaking JJ at 2, you better freaking hit on the pick because there is an absolute mountain of data suggesting both those guys are risky as hell at that slot. I find the arguments completely unconvincing, I sure as hell better be wrong, and they better be studs because I don't know ---- beyond what are warning signs, and there are a ton w/both those guys. If the new GM ignores all of them, and drafts a bust AGAIN, trebuchet him out of Redskins Park by no later than '26.

[mistertim]

44 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

 

Is there a possibility that off-platform throwing is being conflated with the ability to throw outside the pocket or on the run? I've seen numerous throws of him delivering while on the move from outside the pocket. I'm trying to bridge a disconnect here.

 

I agree that he doesn't utilize off-platform throws much and lacks creativity behind the line of scrimmage when extending a play side to side. He's more of a throwback in the sense that he'll sprint or drift to the sideline rather than dance around to buy time. Hes more deliberate in his movements and choices when extending plays it seems; wants to leverage his elite burst and great speed whenever possible. 

 

 

Yes, I've seen him throw on the run before, too. I've also seen Maye drop back and throw with flawless footwork. Just because a guy is capable of doing something doesn't mean he consistently does it and there aren't issue with that area of his game.

 

The tape and the numbers show that Daniels is really low in how often he passes when pressured and has to break the pocket. He's much more likely to pull the ball and his eyes down and run. That's concerning to me because that was also with a very good OL and elite playmakers around him. What's going to happen when he's behind a mediocre line vs NFL pass rushers and pressure? I think we may see him bail and run even more.

 

Which is not something I really want in my QB. I guess that's where we have a bit of a historic divide between us. But that's neither here nor there. The point was that the tweet was trying to claim throwing off platform and on the run is a strength of his, when the tape and the numbers show it to be a weakness. It just screams blind homerism to me.

[WashingtonRedWolves]

10 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

Same with the JJ crap. There's little to no scouts I've seen quoted anywhere who suggest McCarthy is worth anything like the hype currently suggests. It just has me wondering --- is going on? Are scouts and GM's just excited about him winning a championship and playing well doing it? If so, why not draft those solid but meh Alabama QB's over the years. Its one thing if they had data like Daniels '23, Maye's '22, Caleb Williams crazy talent etc, but its just what looked like a game manager who can't make all the throws but is great between the ears. Maybe that works, but maybe it doesnt if he can't make the freaking throws, and reading the scouts it sure as hell seems like just about all of them think he's "meh". I have no idea whats going on because the Daniels hypers are logically ignoring his career and focusing on his '23, the Maye critique is focusing entirely on '23, and not on '22 and little on the talent disparity between him and LSU's squad....it's so weird, and did anyone notice NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT THE S2 TEST period. Last year was about eviscerating CJ Stroud after Purdy hit with a great S2 the year before, and now that Stroud basically dynamited the leagues defenses for four months, we haven't heard even a single peep about the S2 test. Hmmmm.....

 

It just all feels like colossal bull----, and I'll be honest, if Daniels or JJ are the pick, yes I will lose my ----, and if I'm right and they are wrong, I'll lose my ---- 10x more. If you take Daniels or freaking JJ at 2, you better freaking hit on the pick because there is an absolute mountain of data suggesting both those guys are risky as hell at that slot. I find the arguments completely unconvincing, I sure as hell better be wrong, and they better be studs because I don't know ---- beyond what are warning signs, and there are a ton w/both those guys. If the new GM ignores all of them, and drafts a bust AGAIN, trebuchet him out of Redskins Park by no later than '26.

And if they draft maye and he busts, then what? Nobody really knows **** when it comes to this process and who the right guy is/will be so you’d be better off just sitting back and trusting peters and co. to make the most well-informed and calculated decision possible instead of popping a hernia as soon as whoever’s name is called on draft night

[FootballZombie]

JD released a message thru the Players Tribune. Covers a lot about his life and journey.

https://www.theplayerstribune.com/posts/jayden-daniels-lsu-football-nfl

 

Touches on his grandparents, his relationship w/ football (Passed down thru family and Dad was a D1 corner), what he went thru at HS and both colleges.

 

 

Not a lot in terms of on the field stuff, just a look into his mindset. He did explain his relationship w/ Herm Edwards in detail tho, and I thought that was interesting. He really valued the human aspect of HE, and I feel like that is something he can get from DQ here as well.

 

"Man, that’s my dog. I’m not even kidding. There’s almost nothing I can say that could ever do justice to that relationship. He looked out for me. I used to sit up in his office, and he used to just talk to me about anything … life lessons about the NFL and stuff like that. He’s somebody who’s coached and played at the highest level, and is also human too. He was real about the stuff he’s been through. Listening to his stories…. I wouldn’t trade those memories for anything. After my grandparents passed, I remember he was the first person who called me. He was like, “I know football is your thing, but really take this time with your family.” He said, “I don’t even want you to come back to school right now. Take care of you.” He knew how important my grandparents were to me. And he told me it was O.K. to be selfish, in a way, to care of my mental health."

 

Also saw what Herm told him when he chose to move on was interesting as well

"“If there’s nothing there, you always got a spot with me.”"

 

 

There are also snippets of how he interacts w/ others and how he views himself

 

"Just getting invited would have been a huge honor no matter what. But I’m not afraid to admit, I wanted the Heisman. One thing that I think gets overlooked sometimes is that dog and that competitive edge in me. People don’t really get to see that side because of who I am as a person. I’m more reserved. I’m calm, I’m quiet. But I’m very competitive. I don’t back down from anything or anybody. So I worked hard for it, and I hoped God would meet my effort with a blessing."

 

 

Bit of insight, but its a decent length read.

[DogofWar1]

1 hour ago, SpacePenguin said:

 

There is a vengeful slender man generational QB prospect, some say he's 6'2, others claim he's naught 5'10, but he is lanky, probably under 200 lbs if you drained his blood, likes to run, is fragile and has people that really like linking twitter posts from clowns that say he's going number 2. One read QB my ass! What could go wrong?

 

Wait this is 2024!? How am I still a fan of this team, again? Ah, yeah....depression mixed with masochism. Carry on.

 

Vengeful Slenderman?

 

 

I think he's about 8'0" not 6'2".  But under 200 pounds and likes to run (after people).

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

Isn’t that the guy from Roblox?

[The Consigliere]

3 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

I'm trying to think of the teams that "built the roster" and then found the QB.

 

The first is the 00s Steelers who thought they stunk when they drafted Roethlisberger and then realized "Oh ****....we're good."

 

I guess the Rams did it when they signed Stafford but that was the rare "one year all in bet" that actually paid off. 

 

The other were the recent 49ers who seem to have done it three times in the last decade, which suggests they haven't actually done it. It's possible that their roster is so good that anyone could play QB. Me....you....a feral cat.

 

Also, I wish Mike Ditka were still alive to push JJ McCarthy. He would like the cut of his jib.

Oh I 1000% believe its straight bull----.

'12: Luck lands on Mannings old Colts roster. It wasn't planned, they just plugged him in.

'16 Rams with Goff: Not a plan, the problem was Bradford busted, and so when they imploded with Fisherball, and landed the first, they took Goff. 

'17/'21/'24: Trubisky to Fields to Caleb. No this wasn't a plan, it was blind luck, in exactly the same way that while the Bears stole the Panthers blind via a trade down, the Cardinals got annihilated in trading down with the Texans, thinking the Texans first would be top of the draft too (hell, they were picking 2nd after all, who would argue they'd go from 31st to 8th in one freaking offseason). The Bears meant for Trubisky to be the guy, then Fields, and neither were, so now they get Williams. Not a plan, just wanting to give Fields one more year just in case his average '22 season wasn't randomness. 

'18 Jets try to rebuild with Darnold in '18/'21 with Wilson. They didnt mean to build things for Wilson, they were trying to build things for Darnold.

'18 Cardinals try to rebuild with Rosen, then rebuild with Kyler: You think they planned on using two top picks on QB's in back to back years? Nope. 

'18 Bills set Josh Allen up Perfectly!!!! Nope, they were trying to set up things for mega bust EJ Manuel, he busted, so they had pieces in place for Allen.

 

It doesn't really matter how long we look back, any one of these teams, the Niners, the Chiefs, anybody? Its irelevant. Nobody is trying to build the team then get the QB, they are building ad hoc, and if they don't have a QB, at any time, and they know it, and ones available, they try like mad to get it done. The Niners tried to do it with Alex Smith, then Kap, then tried to trade for Cousins, then traded for Garoppolo, then traded up for Lance, then drafted Purdy...they kept trying. The Chiefs tried with Alex Smith, then went after Mahomes, the Browns good lord, the poor Browns, Manziel, Kizer, Baker, and when those 3 guys in 5 years taken with top 35 picks or so couldn't hack it, they traded a boat load of goodies for Watson who suddenly can't do it either. No matter which way you look at it, its always the same, teams try to win with QB's they think they can win it with, and if they can't, they try to find a QB another way. Nobody is ever employing a strategy of "build the rest of the team first" all teams are trying to figure out how to get there, and whether the best strategy is to stick with what they have, or trade, sign, or draft someone to fix it. They don't ever wait because they want to, if they wait, its because they have to, and occasionally its because they're too stupid to realize that they shouldn't have waited (see Giants in '18). 

 

[DogofWar1]

4 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

Isn’t that the guy from Roblox?

How dare you.

[ThatNFLChick]

1 hour ago, FootballZombie said:

JD released a message thru the Players Tribune. Covers a lot about his life and journey.

https://www.theplayerstribune.com/posts/jayden-daniels-lsu-football-nfl

 

Touches on his grandparents, his relationship w/ football (Passed down thru family and Dad was a D1 corner), what he went thru at HS and both colleges.

 

 

Not a lot in terms of on the field stuff, just a look into his mindset. He did explain his relationship w/ Herm Edwards in detail tho, and I thought that was interesting. He really valued the human aspect of HE, and I feel like that is something he can get from DQ here as well.

 

"Man, that’s my dog. I’m not even kidding. There’s almost nothing I can say that could ever do justice to that relationship. He looked out for me. I used to sit up in his office, and he used to just talk to me about anything … life lessons about the NFL and stuff like that. He’s somebody who’s coached and played at the highest level, and is also human too. He was real about the stuff he’s been through. Listening to his stories…. I wouldn’t trade those memories for anything. After my grandparents passed, I remember he was the first person who called me. He was like, “I know football is your thing, but really take this time with your family.” He said, “I don’t even want you to come back to school right now. Take care of you.” He knew how important my grandparents were to me. And he told me it was O.K. to be selfish, in a way, to care of my mental health."

 

Also saw what Herm told him when he chose to move on was interesting as well

"“If there’s nothing there, you always got a spot with me.”"

 

 

There are also snippets of how he interacts w/ others and how he views himself

 

"Just getting invited would have been a huge honor no matter what. But I’m not afraid to admit, I wanted the Heisman. One thing that I think gets overlooked sometimes is that dog and that competitive edge in me. People don’t really get to see that side because of who I am as a person. I’m more reserved. I’m calm, I’m quiet. But I’m very competitive. I don’t back down from anything or anybody. So I worked hard for it, and I hoped God would meet my effort with a blessing."

 

 

Bit of insight, but its a decent length read.

 

This was a great read. Thanks for sharing!

[The Consigliere]

5 hours ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

Because we pick second and there are only two good quarterbacks.

I saw what you did there. 

 

Disagreed. There's only 2 I think are worth a top 3 pick, but if you want a top 3 QB in this class, you need a top 3 pick. 

[mac8887]

I was able to finish my breakdown of the UNC vs NCstate game, I did it as an edit, it’s back on page 2110. These were just how I saw the plays, and I admit I’m no expert or even close to one , it’s just my opinion. I did not do this as a rebuttal either. I thank and respect anyone that does one of these full game breakdowns, this is my second one in the last few weeks, and it’s a lot of work. I do admit that I have Maye as my 4th qb in this draft, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he ends up the best. I love his arm strength and mobility for such a big guy. Right now Caleb is #1, JJ#2, Jayden#3, and Maye #4 in my opinion. The line that separates these guys for me is so thin that I’d be happy with whoever we choose. And my list changes week to week the more I watch and listen to others and the more film I’m able to watch. I had Maye at #2 last week. 

 

I was surprised with how well the UNC line played other than 2 really bad plays. Maye had a rough game, he was innacurate and inconsistent, but then also made plays that were amazing. It’s crazy how high his highs were and how low his lows were in that game alone. NCstate has a really good defense.

Edited April 4 by mac8887

[Going Commando]

Apparently Pat McAfee is right that you need to have vision to see the potential with Drake Maye judging by the mountain of obfuscation and bull**** that's piled up on him over the past four months.  But I still don't understand why it takes any vision at all to see it with him.  It took me 30 minutes of watching him to realize how special he was.  He is so unbelievably easy to see coming that I simply don't understand how so many people are missing on him.  The only guys who have been easier to see coming since Andrew Luck came out are Caleb, Burrow, and Lawrence.  He is a thousand times easier to see coming than Josh Allen and Justin Herbert were, and the fact that those two ended up being mega-hits and offer such easy comparisons for Maye makes Maye a true no-brainer.

[mac8887]

There was a point where I had Jayden really high, quite possibly was my #1 qb, but after watching this and spending a little time over the last few days watching this and thinking about it, Jayden is down to my #3 qb in this draft. He had some really bad looking plays in this cut up. I’m glad it showed all targets.

[The Consigliere]

2 hours ago, WashingtonRedWolves said:

And if they draft maye and he busts, then what? Nobody really knows **** when it comes to this process and who the right guy is/will be so you’d be better off just sitting back and trusting peters and co. to make the most well-informed and calculated decision possible instead of popping a hernia as soon as whoever’s name is called on draft night

I'd be fine with it. Went with the right guy, it didn't work out. Daniels and JJ have a ton of warning signs, I think Maye's warning signs are nearly as worrisome. 

[BayouBrave86]

People are ignoring Daniels career? What is there to ignore? He had a stellar true freshman season and a pretty solid first season at LSU learning an entirely new system. He also left an extremely toxic situation at ASU. His "down" years are equatable to JJ's best years as a QB stats wise. Jayden has always protected the ball with a solid completion percentage. 

[The Consigliere]

He was always "good" in college, I'd agree with that completely. Broke out as a freshman with a good season, was never bad in college beyond certain negative traits like pressure to sack ratio etc. 

[redskinss]

Daniels was good all 5 years in college now huh.

Guess by next week maye will have footwork to make Mohammed Ali green with jealousy

[illone]

1 hour ago, BayouBrave86 said:

People are ignoring Daniels career?

 

this is silly. Nobody is ignoring anything. 
 

You should try to separate your bias towards the kid and not get so defensive about him. None of this is personal. 
 

its not about stats or past success. 
 

This pick is about projecting a players career potential for ten plus years. 

A dual threat guy that weighs 190 soaking wet is probably the biggest risk there is at QB. Id take JJ over him because he projects higher in my model long term. Hell I’d take Penix over him too. For me he is QB6 in this draft. 

 

But to each their own.

If he is the pick I’ll just change the channel when he runs it so as to avoid the impending train wreck. I cant handle another high draft pick getting ruined by irresponsible play style. 

Edited April 4 by illone
Grammar

[ThatNFLChick]