The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[ThomasRoane]

3 hours ago, Riggodrill44 said:

You guess you’re not watching football. I’ve watched every QB in football struggle when facing superior pressure. 
 

How about we fix the last be and see if Wentz can run this offense.

In 91 Rypien got sacked 7 times, Gibbs prioritized protection. We need to do the same.

 

Salary cap era won't allow that anymore.  However, $25 million would have bought some decent linemen.

 

Good QBs (that earn $20 Million or more) have the ability to play even in a dirty pocket.  QB and Oline have a hand-in-glove relationship.  A good QB can maike a bad Oline play better by making quick decisions (pre-snap and post-snap) and by being able to slide or climb the pocket.  Wentz has proven that he's not a good QB.  Case in point.  Down only 12-7 at the end of the first half the coaching staff was afraid to dial up some plays to get into Field Goal position.  Instead, they played conservative and milked the clock.  

[JSSkinz]

If we do lean on the run and do it effectively it means longer drives which is usually a positive when it comes to keeping the D fresh while eating up clock. With this O line my fear is it will create more opportunities for penalties which immediately become drive killers.

Edited October 6, 2022 by JSSkinz

[RandyHolt]

Dotson struggling against press coverage.... sigh. I was told here not to worry that he will be in the slot.

 

I refer to my concern as Desmond Howard Phobia.

[NeverSurrender]

5 hours ago, ThomasRoane said:

 

Good write up.  Cooley and Paulson are usually spot on.

 

I know Ron has to ride it out with Wentz until he gets hurt.  Deep down, he probably has a serious case of buyer's remorse,  If Wentz doesn't get hurt and continues to underperform and under deliver then it could mean the team moves on to yet another savior coach.  RR isn't the best coach but the Commanders can do a lot worse.  And has!  The stench of Dan Snyder just won't leave this team.  New names or uniforms can't make the franchise smell better.

 

I'm really frustrated because RR should have just stuck with his plan.  Build a great team and THEN add the QB.  He panicked though for whatever reason.  Obviously, he didn't truly believe in Wentz.  We know that because he's still on a one year deal!  And, RR admitted that Wentz needs a lot of help to succeed.  That's fine for a Taylor Heinicke who costs you $2 million or Sam Howell on a rookie (5th rounder) deal.  For $25M you should have a QB that can overcome poor line play.  You shouldn't have to "prop up" a $25M quarterback.  

 

Best case scenario now is that Wentz doesn't finish the season.  TH plays a coupled of games until Turner feels Howell is ready.  Then finish up with Howell.  Add some Oline, sign Payne, cut WJ3 and get yourself a good cover corner and an athletic free safety.  I think the rest of the team is good enough to really compete next season.  

But we also need to draft O-line, line backers and as you said CB.  I dont think we can fill all those spots in 1 offseason. Otherwise i agree with everything you said. 

[ThomasRoane]

9 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

If we do lean on the run and do it effectively it means longer drives which is usually a positive when it comes to keeping the D fresh while eating up clock. With this O line my fear is it will create more opportunities for penalties which immediately become drive killers.

 

That's the problem.  You're basically asking the offense to play mistake free.  We all know that's not realistic.  The players on the other side of the ball are good too and sometimes the X beats the O.  Bad calls are part of the game.  Washington seems to get more of those than most!  It's a part of the game though.  If Wentz requires a clean pocket and players who don't make mistakes then he's not a solution.  He's THE problem.  

4 minutes ago, NeverSurrender said:

But we also need to draft O-line, line backers and as you said CB.  I dont think we can fill all those spots in 1 offseason. Otherwise i agree with everything you said. 

 

Agreed.  And yet we gave away picks for Wentz when more than likely the Colts would have cut him.  

[NoCalMike]

If the scouting on Dotson is that he struggles with press coverage against the more physical corners, there are remedies for that, plus he is a rookie that has played a total for 4 games.  He is going to likely bulk up and strengthen some just by virtue of getting older. but until then, what you do is have him start running routes that are designed to create space.  Slants, screens, crosses. Put him in bunch formations where you use other WRs to screen defenders off so Dotson can break free.   

 

Also, when it comes to a run-heavy offense, as others have pointed out, that is all good, but that  means you have to finish damn near every drive with some kind of points.  One of the problems with the offense last year was possessing the ball on offense for a lot of minutes but they moved down the field so slowly that any time they didn't get points it felt like so long until they would be in the red zone again.  This O-line can run block, but they also aren't the big physical O-line that blows up a D-line throughout the course of a game.  It isn't that kind of unit right now.  

Edited October 6, 2022 by NoCalMike

[Riggodrill44]

3 hours ago, ThomasRoane said:

 

Salary cap era won't allow that anymore.  However, $25 million would have bought some decent linemen.

 

Good QBs (that earn $20 Million or more) have the ability to play even in a dirty pocket.  QB and Oline have a hand-in-glove relationship.  A good QB can maike a bad Oline play better by making quick decisions (pre-snap and post-snap) and by being able to slide or climb the pocket.  Wentz has proven that he's not a good QB.  Case in point.  Down only 12-7 at the end of the first half the coaching staff was afraid to dial up some plays to get into Field Goal position.  Instead, they played conservative and milked the clock.  

Have you seen Dallas, Philly OL’s?

This has nothing to do with salary cap and everything to do with Ron’s talent evaluation….he sucks!

[wit33]

3 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

If the scouting on Dotson is that he struggles with press coverage against the more physical corners, there are remedies for that, plus he is a rookie that has played a total for 4 games.  He is going to likely bulk up and strengthen some just by virtue of getting older. but until then, what you do is have him start running routes that are designed to create space.  Slants, screens, crosses. Put him in bunch formations where you use other WRs to screen defenders off so Dotson can break free.   

 

Also, when it comes to a run-heavy offense, as others have pointed out, that is all good, but that  means you have to finish damn near every drive with some kind of points.  One of the problems with the offense last year was possessing the ball on offense for a lot of minutes but they moved down the field so slowly that any time they didn't get points it felt like so long until they would be in the red zone again.  This O-line can run block, but they also aren't the big physical O-line that blows up a D-line throughout the course of a game.  It isn't that kind of unit right now.  

I imagine the hope will be to couple last years run game success with big plays Wentz can provide. I have been on train to allow Wentz to carry the offense, but without escapability that’s just not realistic in the NFL. 
 

I’m transitioning to how Washington can win football games this year and hope wild card scenarios are of discussion here in early December.  It does seem there’s some potential in becoming a run dominate offense paired with a big armed QB and talent at WR. 
 

Establishing some sort of identity separates a team from the bottom 3rd and allows the team to compete with teams 6-20 for most part. I’ll root for this ceiling. 

[NoCalMike]

1 minute ago, wit33 said:

 I have been on train to allow Wentz to carry the offense, but without escapability that’s just not realistic in the NFL. 
 

 

 

Maybe Scott Turner needs to get proactive with it and understand that if the line can't block long enough to setup big plays, then get Wentz moving around right at the snap of the ball.  Bootlegs, roll outs, just shifting the pocket even to setup shorter timing plays.  You don't need a mobile QB for those kinds of things necessarily.

[Voice_of_Reason]

9 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

5.  The good news is he thinks their identity could be build off of what @Voice_of_Reason has been railing against all off season as to what he doesn't want 😀 and that is be a run dominated team.  He thinks they execute outside zone really well -- the O line and both Bates and A. Rogers block it well

 

(That’s a bridge to nowhere for those of you playing along at home.)

[wit33]

2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

(That’s a bridge to nowhere for those of you playing along at home.)

9 wins and seventh playoff spot is probably the ceiling (unless you have a dual threat QB), but I’m going go ahead and root for that this year. Wentz ain’t it for 58-42 pass to run ratio. 

[samy316]

2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

(That’s a bridge to nowhere for those of you playing along at home.)

Wentz ain’t gonna get better, especially with this line.  Even if our line was better at pass blocking, he’s too inaccurate, unaware in the pocket and a statue behind center.  They almost have no choice now but to become run-oriented team going forward, since this line can run block better than they can pass block.  Having a mobile QB sure would be ideal right now.  The Colts had it right last year, using that formula to win 9 games and Wentz screwed that up when they needed him most.  Limiting Wentz, and his mistakes will increase our chances for victories.

Edited October 7, 2022 by samy316

[Conn]

Colts OL is awful in pass pro (again) and the godly Matt Ryan is struggling even worse than Wentz did there. Interesting. 
 

(this is more about Irsay getting ****ed over than some defense of Wentz. Complete schadenfreude. But it’s all I have right now. 

[FLSkinz83]

I'd take Wentz over Ryan.  

[Jumbo]

1 hour ago, Conn said:

Colts OL is awful in pass pro (again) and the godly Matt Ryan is struggling even worse than Wentz did there. Interesting. 
 

(this is more about Irsay getting ****ed over than some defense of Wentz. Complete schadenfreude. But it’s all I have right now. 

 

Not only does tonights game back this, but all over the league you're seeing what o line woes are doing to hinder a number of qbs, inc. the goat.

 

It's not a blanket excuse for wentz or any other struggling qbs. Most of them have their piece of the overall offensive issues on said teams, to varying degree.

 

It's just telling you that the people who just want to use the dynamic to attack the qb they "hate" ( and here to boost a backup in truly stupid manner ) are being  dumbasses in their "analysis."

[Califan007 The Constipated]

55 minutes ago, FLSkinz83 said:

I'd take Wentz over Ryan.  

 

I'd take Wentz over Russell Wilson and his contract as well lol...Ryan and Wilson are offering up bags of cat vomit in tonight's game.

[NoCalMike]

23 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

I'd take Wentz over Russell Wilson and his contract as well lol...Ryan and Wilson are offering up bags of cat vomit in tonight's game.

 

Yeah when you think about it going into the season the general consensus was that Russell Wilson was the best of the three, but so far.......given contract considerations, I think the Commanders came out of the other side the best because even if Wentz ends up a dud, he can be cut no harm no foul beyond this season. 

[Warhead36]

LMAO Wilson is actually dog doo doo

 

EDIT: Meant to put this in the gameday thread

Edited October 7, 2022 by Warhead36

[HigSkin]

This....

 

 

[FLSkinz83]

I bet Irsay blames the O-Line.     Just a reminder that Colts O-Line was crap last year as well.

Edited October 7, 2022 by FLSkinz83

[Zim489]

That game was like watching the Commanders playing vs the Commanders.

 

One of the worst games I have ever watched. 

 

If a team is willing to let a QB go in their "prime" theres a good reason for it. Teams don't let good QBs go willingly. 

[FLSkinz83]

I'm looking forward to the Colts game in a few weeks.    I'm sure JDR, with the help of WJ3 and Fuller will make Ryan look good again.

[NickyJ]

Something about 2022 is treating most QBs awfully. Carr was the QB I was fan-boying over last offseason. He hasn't been doing too hot either, but better than what we saw tonight or out of Washington the last 4 weeks.

[wit33]

1 hour ago, Jumbo said:

 

Not only does tonights game back this, but all over the league you're seeing what o line woes are doing to hinder a number of qbs, inc. the goat.

 

It's not a blanket excuse for wentz or any other struggling qbs. Most of them have their piece of the overall offensive issues on said teams, to varying degree.

 

It's just telling you that the people who just want to use the dynamic to attack the qb they "hate" ( and here to boost a backup in truly stupid manner ) are being  dumbasses in their "analysis."

Especially if you lack mobility. 

 

Just now, NickyJ said:

Something about 2022 is treating most QBs awfully. Carr was the QB I was fan-boying over last offseason. He hasn't been doing too hot either, but better than what we saw tonight or out of Washington the last 4 weeks.

QBs 8-20 will fool you a few seasons over a 10-15 year career. 

[FLSkinz83]

Wentz had 7 INT's and 8 fumbles last year...total.....Ryan through 5 games has 7 INT's and 10 fumbles.