The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[TheShredder]

58 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Strange stuff.       It's the national media, not so much local, that see Wentz as a punchline.  Some in the local media have actualy made fun of the national media (I've mentioned this here) for how they are over the top in their criticism of Wentz. 

Too many instances of media manipulation now. From billionaire media teams, gaslighting national outlets, to trending vlog/blog channels. Doesn't take too much effort to sniff out the BS, but you do have to try and people are lazy towards leisure activities. Too easy to paint the picture that suits your agenda when you have unlimited resources.

 

[Chris 44]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Been reading some of the fan tweets the last couple of days on twitter, wild stuff.

 

I think they are picking on the wrong target.  The local media has been IMO pretty balanced on Wentz with some exceptions like Sheehan but even Sheehan lately has come around.  It's the national media that has crapped on Wentz.

 

But I see some fans think that the local media was making it up that Wentz has struggled early in camp because they are reading current reports ironically from the same local media saying that Wentz has come on strong of late.   

 

It's an odd narrative from those fans.  For starters i don't think the local guys were just making it up considering some fans who were there and people who work for the team have said the same thing.   But the kicker to me is the same local media are the ones saying that Wentz is playing well lately in practice -- so its really odd that some on twitter are running with those same local reports and hanging the local reporters for that very positive narrative that they are bringing out -- that said fans wouldn't have known if those same reporters weren't touting Wentz now.

 

Strange stuff.       It's the national media, not so much local, that see Wentz as a punchline.  Some in the local media have actualy made fun of the national media (I've mentioned this here) for how they are over the top in their criticism of Wentz. 

Think a lot of that has to do with the national media not strictly following a single team from day to day (at least for the most part). Relying on older accounts and the ongoing narrative. Lazy but kind of understandable given the fact that they are covering 32 teams. Don't think it will change until someone in the national media sees differently (assuming Wentz plays well) and then others will follow. Local guys are much more in tune with the day to day nuances.

Edited August 11, 2022 by Chris 44

[DJHJR86]

 

 

You'd think he would have stats that are more in line with Rex Grossman than what he's put up over the last couple of seasons.  

[Skinsinparadise]

How come I am doing most of the Howell propaganda?  Where's @KDawg?

 

 

 

[bird_1972]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

How come I am doing most of the Howell propaganda?  Where's @KDawg?

 

 

 

 

Inject more of this directly into my veins! 

[Chris 44]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

How come I am doing most of the Howell propaganda?  Where's @KDawg?

 

 

 

That was a pretty pass!

[KDawg]

10 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

How come I am doing most of the Howell propaganda?  Where's @KDawg?

 

 

 

I don’t do the tweeter thing.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

All 3 QBs (one of these things is not like the other lol)

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

I’ve noticed something in these training camp sideline iPhone clips:

 

When Wentz has time, he really comes over the top with his throwing motion, his arm is almost entirely extended over his head, and the ball is often high.

 

When he’s operating in quick game or has to abbreviate his motion a bit, the ball comes out from a slightly lower launch point,  very slightly more sidearm, but it seems to be more on target, and not high.

 

I think this might have been one of the things Warner was working with Wentz on in that video clip.  
 

Now, when he really launches one, and rears back to throw a deep one, he has perfect mechanics.  Good step into the ball,  good launch point, weight transfer, footwork, etc.  And the ball can travel 70 yards in the air:  And with great accuracy. 
 

Anyway, I’m not sure what any of this means, but I thought it was notable, so I noted it.

[TheShredder]

35 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Anyway, I’m not sure what any of this means, but I thought it was notable, so I noted it.

If it's noticeable, then it makes sense with other info. There's a reason for deficiencies and when he has good pass pro he's better for sure, so I'll buy that.

 

He's really deadly off script (good Wentz bad Wentz). The bad-deadly like scrambling inside your 10 is poor situational football.

Good-deadly happens too. He's so big he can see the entire field from a top down perspective vs blank spots where shorter QBs miss a guy falling into coverage. Arm strength is good so he can hit any part of the field from anywhere.

 

Ideally he needs +2.5 sec protection and he's good. Shorter than 2.5 sec and that's where the problems start. Turner can help him by scheming hot reads to his best receivers when he smells a blitz. Been best on quick (hot) routes.

 

In Indy Wentz would audible to his favorite play and it wasn't received well. Like audible out of a run to a TE route and the OL and Coach weren't happy. When he'd do that the OL wouldn't protect him. Turner needs to manage Wentz as much as Wentz needs to do what he does best within the scheme. Must all come together as a single unit.

[Voice_of_Reason]

9 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

If it's noticeable, then it makes sense with other info. There's a reason for deficiencies and when he has good pass pro he's better for sure, so I'll buy that.

 

He's really deadly off script (good Wentz bad Wentz). The bad-deadly like scrambling inside your 10 is poor situational football.

Good-deadly happens too. He's so big he can see the entire field from a top down perspective vs blank spots where shorter QBs miss a guy falling into coverage. Arm strength is good so he can hit any part of the field from anywhere.

 

Ideally he needs +2.5 sec protection and he's good. Shorter than 2.5 sec and that's where the problems start. Turner can help him by scheming hot reads to his best receivers when he smells a blitz. Been best on quick (hot) routes.

 

In Indy Wentz would audible to his favorite play and it wasn't received well. Like audible out of a run to a TE route and the OL and Coach weren't happy. When he'd do that the OL wouldn't protect him. Turner needs to manage Wentz as much as Wentz needs to do what he does best within the scheme. Must all come together as a single unit.

Except, quick game is shorter than 2.5 seconds, and he is very good at that. He gets the ball out of his hand very quickly.

 

QBs actually rarely have less than 2.5 seconds to throw the ball.  And that's when the pocket collapses immediately because of interior pressure.  There's just almost no-way an edge defender can get there in less than 2.5 seconds.  It happens, but rarely, and only if the offensive guy basically falls down or wiffs entirely.  

 

I'm not sure about the source of your last paragraph.  I hadn't heard that reported anywhere.  And if he really was checking out of runs, my God, they were calling a lot of runs, because they ran the stuffing out of the ball anyway. 

 

Though, the Turner offense has less audibles than the WCO, so it might not be a problem.  

 

Anyway, my point was mostly on mechanics.  I don't think protection has a lot to do with what I was seeing.  It's nowhere near as pronounced, but it kindof reminded me of a pitcher who works out of the windup vs the stretch.  When he thinks he can extend the delivery, his release point is higher. When he thinks he needs to speed it up, it's lower.  

 

What's odd, I think he does better with the faster, lower release point.  That's not typically the case.  But he has so much arm strength and size, he might actually benefit from being a little more side-arm and less over the top in his delivery.  

 

Dunno.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

21 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

QBs actually rarely have less than 2.5 seconds to throw the ball. 

 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

 

[Tundra scout]

 

[TheShredder]

7 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Except, quick game is shorter than 2.5 seconds, and he is very good at that. He gets the ball out of his hand very quickly.

 

QBs actually rarely have less than 2.5 seconds to throw the ball.  And that's when the pocket collapses immediately because of interior pressure.  There's just almost no-way an edge defender can get there in less than 2.5 seconds.  It happens, but rarely, and only if the offensive guy basically falls down or wiffs entirely. 

That's an NFL QB/WR coaching point for a drop back. Last time I heard it was from Cris Collinsworth talking about running routes and the coach would blow the whistle at 2.5 sec because pass protection breaks down after that. Sometimes when an OL is dominating pass pro they breakout the timer and go into it. The point is the timing is setup.

 

Turner has to get Wentz on a roll, so whatever he does best, do it. Move the chains and take your shots!

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

 

[Conn]

 

The fact media, at the height of hope and fluff season, feels emboldened to talk to the dude like this so casually shows how far the narrative has spiraled and how much the football Overton window has shifted in the last few months, so to speak. It’s kinda crazy, as if the dude is completely washed, closer to the bottom than the middle. People didn’t even talk to a bust journeyman like Bradford this way every time he got a new chance. I’m just not sure I’ve seen anything like it in such a short period of time, he’s been uniquely run over by the bus, backed over, and run over again lol

[Voice_of_Reason]

6 minutes ago, Conn said:

 

The fact media, at the height of hope and fluff season, feels emboldened to talk to the dude like this so casually shows how far the narrative has spiraled and how much the football Overton window has shifted in the last few months, so to speak. It’s kinda crazy, as if the dude is completely washed, closer to the bottom than the middle. People didn’t even talk to a bust journeyman like Bradford this way every time he got a new chance. I’m just not sure I’ve seen anything like it in such a short period of time, he’s been uniquely run over by the bus, backed over, and run over again lol

I’m actually glad somebody addressed it with him directly.  Let him respond to it.  Ron and Scott have both responded to it, it has been a national topic of discussion, and is the “elephant in the room.”  
 

I give the reporter credit for being blunt about it and asking the question in what I thought was a non-confrontational, objective way.  He could have softened it even more, but it didn’t come off like an attack, more like a “this is what people are saying, let me give you a chance to respond to it.”  
 

I didn’t have a problem with the question, I really liked the answer.

 

I have a much bigger problem with the narrative in general and even the need to ask the question.  

[Conn]

10 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I’m actually glad somebody addressed it with him directly.  Let him respond to it.  Ron and Scott have both responded to it, it has been a national topic of discussion, and is the “elephant in the room.”  
 

I give the reporter credit for being blunt about it and asking the question in what I thought was a non-confrontational, objective way.  He could have softened it even more, but it didn’t come off like an attack, more like a “this is what people are saying, let me give you a chance to respond to it.”  
 

I didn’t have a problem with the question, I really liked the answer.

 

I have a much bigger problem with the narrative in general and even the need to ask the question.  

I don’t think the question was inappropriate or unprofessional or anything at all—you just rarely hear such straightforward criticism/reflection of criticism put forth in a casual setting like that. It just shows how far general perception has shifted, that most viewers won’t even blink at that. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I dunno man, saying “Philly didn’t want you, Indy didn’t want you” came off rather low class to me.  There are a lot better ways to word everything he said in that whole clip.

 

You never ever see this kind of open and blunt negativity said directly to a guys face.  There has been an abundance of dudes who have played worse and put themselves in worse situations where reporters still ****foot around all the drama.

 

 

[FootballZombie]

The subject of the questions themselves are fine. They are of the same variety as ones lobbed at others in our Org over the summer multiple times and similar to those asked of other QBs.

 

Its not a whole lot different from the NY media straight up asking D Jones about not getting his 5th year option picked up earlier in the offseason, which has clear connotations about being wanted by an org.

 

This specific reporter was kinda crass and put it out on the table, but those are exactly the kind of questions you would expect to be asked.

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Conn]

damn

Wright definitely gonna get killed for this…

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by Conn

[HigSkin]

 

Injuries aside, the Washington Commanders plan to have their starters play a decent amount during Saturday's preseason opener against the Carolina Panthers.

 

"We'd like to see the first group somewhere between 15 and 20 plays, something along those lines," head coach Ron Rivera said Thursday. "Then go from there with the seconds and thirds."

 

That includes quarterback Carson Wentz, who will make his Commanders' debut following this past offseason's trade with Indianapolis. The fact that Wentz will suit up does not come as a surprise, as Rivera said the 29-year-old would play in the preseason opener following Saturday's practice at FedEx Field.

 

While other clubs across the league have chosen to keep their respective starting quarterback sidelined for the preseason opener, Wentz said he's excited to suit up.

 

"I trust their decision, I trust what Coach [Scott] Turner thinks, I trust what Coach Rivera thinks and everything," Wentz said after an evening practice at FedEx Field last Saturday. "I know as an offense there are some new pieces, there are some new things so I know we want to get out there, so we’ll trust them to make the call in terms of how much. Either way, I’m excited to run out there and get some live action a little bit.”

 

By playing Wentz and the rest of the starting unit, Rivera hopes to see some consistency within the group. That includes what happens before the play -- such as getting the play-call in and breaking the huddle -- but also "being successful with the plays that are called," Rivera said.

 

 

Rivera's reasoning for having Wentz and the starting offense play somewhere between 15-to-20 plays, rather than just one drive or so, is to hopefully maximize the number of different scenarios the offense faces.

 

"We hope we get all kinds of situational football. We'd love to see a couple of third downs," Rivera said. "We'd love to see some red zone stuff, obviously, and then some short-yardage and goal-line [situations]. You hope for that in your first game. That's why you target somewhere between 15-20 plays, have a nice drive somewhere -- eight or nine plays -- and stuff like that."

 

Backup Taylor Heinicke, who started 16 games for Washington last season, will be first off the bench to replace Wentz. Rivera said the plan is to play Heinicke into the third quarter, with rookie Sam Howell coming on after to close the contest.

 

Howell, a fifth-round pick in April, was drafted as a developmental project behind Wentz and Heinicke. The former North Carolina star has flashed at camp -- particularly with his strong arm -- but still has plenty to learn, per his head coach.

 

To conclude Thursday's practice, Rivera had Howell and the third-team offense go through a two-minute drill. The head coach is hoping his rookie quarterback gets to experience the same situation on Saturday, this time in live-action against an actual opponent.

 

"I'd love to see Sam get a two-minute at the end of the game. That would be really cool," Rivera said. "It'd be a real good experience for him as well. He's still got a lot to learn, but just the consistency is what you're hoping. You're hoping he has success, hoping he controls things and is consistent with his ball placement."

 

Outside of the quarterbacks, the Commanders plan to play almost all of their starters that are not currently dealing with an injury. That includes wide receiver Curtis Samuel, who has been in and out of practice throughout training camp due to conditioning issues. Rivera said Thursday that Samuel -- who played just five games in 2021 -- will play vs. Carolina.

 

The Commanders won't play starting center Chase Roullier, however. Roullier began training camp on the Physically Unable to Perform (PUP) list but was added to the active roster just days later. The 28-year-old suffered a fractured fibula last October.

 

Defensively, cornerback Benjamin St-Juste will play on Saturday despite spending Thursday's practice working on the side field, according to Rivera.