The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[zCommander]

Just now, KDawg said:

None of the guys I named are superstars, though.

 

Yeah but still no slouch either. Add a #1 Wr to that group. Add a TE and so forth but you don't need to replace everyone. That is just absurd. 

[mac8887]

31 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

Wow. You abandoned that "stats don't matter" argument faster than I evacuate dairy. 

Stats definitely matter if your losing

[Rufus T Firefly]

2 minutes ago, mac8887 said:

Stats definitely matter if your losing

They "matter" when they say what you want them to say, but not when they don't. We all know that's what you mean. 

[Renegade7]

12 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

Hopefully the new GM understand that you have to build a team around the QB and not the way around. See Purdy for example or even Josh Allen. Allen wasn't Allen until the Bills built a playoff team around him and it took them 3 years. We still have some good players and don't need a total rebuild. Not sure why people keep on saying that or even thinking that. 

 

When your best WR basically disappears and the two DTs our defense is supposed to be centered around does as well, all on long term deal, that will have a lot to do with it.

 

Sam, even as a first round grade the previous year, wasn't a prospect like Allen or worth waiting for.  Purdy is in the best situation imaginable, the only team in the NFL that seems to be good or really good without a franchise QB...dude has zero pressure and one of the best offensive minds in the game...we'd end Purdy's career before it started with our oline.

 

We have a lot of work today...saying the GM should focus around a QB is like saying the sky is blue or water is water...it's which QB to build around that makes or breaks franchises and gets people fired.

 

We don't know what we have anymore...most of our best players were overachiever otherwise their raw talent would've stood out this year...folks like Curl, let someone else overpay them when you have a record terrible defense. 

 

Accept that hole if he wants too much, don't keep the band together if the music is trash.

[GoDeep81]

Im still on the Howell bus myself. If a new GM/group come in thinking we'll be fixed with a new QB and team in one year, I'll root for em' same as always, but know they're sniffing pixie dust. This is a project they're inheriting. A BIG project. I've seen Sam have god awful/****ty halfs, then do the same thing JB did today and have the D throw up on themself at the end, as usual. He's got happy feet now. Ok.. He threw 2 nice passes to start. One drop, one tip for int. They're down 10 before the game even starts. Then they ran the ball like twice the rest of the half. They sputter along with long developing plays until a receiver falls down twice and he throws another pic. Just par for the crummy course as far as Im concerned. Dumb plays, dumb strategy, dumb coaches, dumb players. It's all dumb. lol  And If he truly is broke next year, like others said, we should be in position to draft a QB then. I guess that's the long way of me saying I don't think he's the main problem. And I certainly don't see us getting some ringer QB1 picking 4th. We're not that lucky. On that note, ho ho ho.. Merry Christmas! 

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

Alright, I’ve decided who I want QBing this team next year.

Spoiler

Why not?

Edited December 25, 2023 by Sacks 'n' Stuff

[KDawg]

6 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

Yeah but still no slouch either. Add a #1 Wr to that group. Add a TE and so forth but you don't need to replace everyone. That is just absurd. 

I don’t think you understand how many people on the roster are FA.

 

You obviously have to keep some of our players that are under contract, but not all of them will return. Shaka Toney? 
 

We are going to be very light on returners.

 

QB: Howell

WR: McLaurin, Dotson, Brown, Milne, Tinsley

RB: Robinson, Rodriguez

TE: Thomas, Bates, Turner, Hodges, Rogers

OL: Leno, Wylie, Gates, Cosmi, Scott, Paul, Stromberg, Daniels, Good Jones

DL: Payne, Allen, Mathis, Ridgeway, Toney, Henry, Jones

LB: Davis, 

S: Martin, Butler

Corner:  Forbes, St Juste, Holmes, Castro Fields

 

That is what is returning. 
 

That team wins 1-2 games next year as is. If that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TheItalianStallion]

Looks like EB's offense is actually fine, as are our offensive skill position players. We clearly need upgrades along the OL, but Howell is really slowing down. He was visibly getting better throughout much of the season, but he's having a hard time now. There's still cause for optimism with him, and this is not to say that Brisette is the answer, but I'm more inclined to draft a QB now than I was a few weeks ago.

[mac8887]

2 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

They "matter" when they say what you want them to say, but not when they don't. We all know that's what you mean. 

What I'm saying is anyone who thinks Sam is a viable option next year has got to take the Homer glasses off. I've never seen a more excused qb. How many giant fans do you think are clamoring for tommy cutlets instead of drafting a guy, I seriously doubt many, and to be honest he has outplayed Sam since he's been in

[zCommander]

7 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I don’t think you understand how many people on the roster are FA.

 

You obviously have to keep some of our players that are under contract, but not all of them will return. Shaka Toney? 
 

We are going to be very light on returners.

 

QB: Howell

WR: McLaurin, Dotson, Brown, Milne, Tinsley

RB: Robinson, Rodriguez

TE: Thomas, Bates, Turner, Hodges, Rogers

OL: Leno, Wylie, Gates, Cosmi, Scott, Paul, Stromberg, Daniels, Good Jones

DL: Payne, Allen, Mathis, Ridgeway, Toney, Henry, Jones

LB: Davis, 

S: Martin, Butler

Corner:  Forbes, St Juste, Holmes, Castro Fields

 

That is what is returning. 
 

That team wins 1-2 games next year as is. If that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So you need 17 more. 9 from the draft, well not all will work out but at least there is the FA. Still far cry from blowing it up though, honestly. It will take two years to have a playoff team. You could get lucky be having a damn good coach though. Also don't discount any players that are on the 2nd or the 3rd team that could be semi-stars as well. 

 

Edited December 25, 2023 by zCommander

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

1 minute ago, mac8887 said:

I've never seen a more excused qb.

You weren’t around ten years ago then.

[Rufus T Firefly]

2 minutes ago, mac8887 said:

What I'm saying is anyone who thinks Sam is a viable option next year has got to take the Homer glasses off. I've never seen a more excused qb. How many giant fans do you think are clamoring for tommy cutlets instead of drafting a guy, I seriously doubt many, and to be honest he has outplayed Sam since he's been in

It doesn't matter what argument you think you're making. When you're doing things like "stats don't matter until I want them to matter" you're not making any argument. 

[Renegade7]

6 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

You weren’t around ten years ago then.

 

Bruh, even the last one defied all logic...

 

" F it, Terry down there somewhere..."

[mac8887]

1 minute ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

You weren’t around ten years ago then.

10 years ago we had rg3 who you could at minimum say had an elite trait with his speed. Show me one area in sams game where he is elite or even has the potential to be. 

 

6 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

It doesn't matter what argument you think you're making. When you're doing things like "stats don't matter until I want them to matter" you're not making any argument. 

Fine then, we are losing and his stats stink so what even is the argument?

[SoCalSkins]

21 minutes ago, GoDeep81 said:

Im still on the Howell bus myself. If a new GM/group come in thinking we'll be fixed with a new QB and team in one year, I'll root for em' same as always, but know they're sniffing pixie dust. This is a project they're inheriting. A BIG project. I've seen Sam have god awful/****ty halfs, then do the same thing JB did today and have the D throw up on themself at the end, as usual. He's got happy feet now. Ok.. He threw 2 nice passes to start. One drop, one tip for int. They're down 10 before the game even starts. Then they ran the ball like twice the rest of the half. They sputter along with long developing plays until a receiver falls down twice and he throws another pic. Just par for the crummy course as far as Im concerned. Dumb plays, dumb strategy, dumb coaches, dumb players. It's all dumb. lol  And If he truly is broke next year, like others said, we should be in position to draft a QB then. I guess that's the long way of me saying I don't think he's the main problem. And I certainly don't see us getting some ringer QB1 picking 4th. We're not that lucky. On that note, ho ho ho.. Merry Christmas! 

Here is the Howell bus after today:

 

[zCommander]

21 minutes ago, Sacks 'n' Stuff said:

You weren’t around ten years ago then.

 

Try last 2 years

[Bacon]

Welp. The Pats won and we're in line for Drake Maye. I would be on board if we didn't have a bottom 5 OL and a paucity of weapons. He would be coming to a poor situation.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Something to think about.

 

Most of the discussion I see revolves around who selects ahead of us and whether or not they need a QB.  A lot of teams need a QB.  If this class ends up as advertised, those top 3 picks become even more valuable.  I know the thought is if a team has any question with their current QB, they don’t pass on a Caleb Williams.  But there’s still a lot to learn about all of these QBs, and todays general consensus is likely to change come April.  I wouldn’t be surprised to see teams trade up if these guys are really that good.

Edited December 25, 2023 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[88Comrade2000]

7 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Howell is toast. Trade him for whatever you can get and start over with a new QB drafted in the top 5

I doubt anyone gives anything more than a 6th or 7th rounder but why even waste that? He’s likely to be cut at some point.

 

Our rookie qb will eventually be qb1 and we will sign a veteran backup. Maybe even resign Jacoby if he’s a fit for the new offense. Sam would be third string at best.

 

 

 

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

I’ve been averse to the idea but I guess I’m ok with drafting a QB now. Was really hoping that was a position we might have shorn up 🙁. Sucks.

[skinsarethebest]

4 hours ago, MrJL said:

if Howell is actually this bad then we should still be drafting high in 2025 if we start him behind an improved offensive line.  I'm still in favor of building that

 

It's kind of amazing how many were desperate to keep TH around for extra time and how many want to move on from Howell immediately

Heinecke had a clutch gene and a moxie that Howell seems to be utterly lacking in. 
 

Also, Taylor won more games than Howell and didn’t crap the bed against some of the worst teams in the league.

 

TH seemed to inspire his teammates and was an underdog feel good story.  Howell doesn’t really seem to be able to rally others around him and tbh, it doesn’t look like his teammates care that much for him (despite all the public statements and platitudes).  Actions speak louder than words. Look at the change in play and momentum when he was replaced the last 2 games.

 

Howell has been here two years and been the starter for almost a whole season.  It’s not unreasonable to cut bait when something isn’t working out especially when you’re in position to actually do something about it.  In this case, we can, due to our high draft pick.

 

Lastly, not every year is a good year for drafting a QB.  As luck has it, this is a good year.  Who knows about 2025…. In fact, Howell’s year was one of the worst in recent memory for QBs apparently (from a talent perspective) and even then no one took him until we did in the fifth round.

Edited December 25, 2023 by skinsarethebest

[Koolblue13]

I was and am a fan of Sam. He's awful now. I don't know if we ruined him with a dip**** like EB who was a nepotism hire by a dyeing dinosaur or our complete neglect of the OL from coaching to personnel.

 

Sam's fate is tied to these losers.

 

He's probably spent now and we should grab Daniels which sucks. 

19 minutes ago, skinsarethebest said:

Heinecke had a clutch gene and a moxie that Howell seems to be utterly lacking in. 
 

 

Sneakers team had hope and a better coaching staff. Had a great OL coach, better play calling, better team around him. Dude blows octopus on a better offense now.

 

He threw murder balls and TMac had the moxie and balls. 

 

Experienced but bad OC with a crap QB vs a incompetent OC and a rookie QB with a worse OL is the conversation.

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, skinsarethebest said:

Heinecke had a clutch gene and a moxie that Howell seems to be utterly lacking in. 
 

Also, Taylor won more games than Howell and didn’t crap the bed against some of the worst teams in the league.

 

 

 

 

Put me in stitches Bro.

[88Comrade2000]

8 hours ago, KDawg said:

I don’t think you understand how many people on the roster are FA.

 

You obviously have to keep some of our players that are under contract, but not all of them will return. Shaka Toney? 
 

We are going to be very light on returners.

 

QB: Howell

WR: McLaurin, Dotson, Brown, Milne, Tinsley

RB: Robinson, Rodriguez

TE: Thomas, Bates, Turner, Hodges, Rogers

OL: Leno, Wylie, Gates, Cosmi, Scott, Paul, Stromberg, Daniels, Good Jones

DL: Payne, Allen, Mathis, Ridgeway, Toney, Henry, Jones

LB: Davis, 

S: Martin, Butler

Corner:  Forbes, St Juste, Holmes, Castro Fields

 

That is what is returning. 
 

That team wins 1-2 games next year as is. If that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

We are getting rid as much of what you listed as possible.

 

We are 2-3 years away from being legit contenders.  Allen will be traded. Mclaurin probably also traded.

 

We are drafting our new starting qb and likely have a veteran backup. Sam bring on the roster next year seems unlikely.

 

We are drafting at least 2 starting o-linemen and maybe 2 more for depth. Might even sign 1-2 more starting o-linemen in the draft.

 

I know some think we don’t need that much change, just fill holes. Ron built a 4-13 team. That’s what his ****ty 4 years has gotten us.  There really isn’t much here now to build on.

 

You won’t fill all your needs in one year. In 2-3 years, I doubt most of the players listed will even be in the roster.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

We are getting rid as much of what you listed as possible.

 

We are 2-3 years away from being legit contenders.  Allen will be traded. Mclaurin probably also traded.

 

We are drafting our new starting qb and likely have a veteran backup. Sam bring on the roster next year seems unlikely.

 

We are drafting at least 2 starting o-linemen and maybe 2 more for depth. Might even sign 1-2 more starting o-linemen in the draft.

 

I know some think we don’t need that much change, just fill holes. Ron built a 4-13 team. That’s what his ****ty 4 years has gotten us.  There really isn’t much here now to build on.

 

You won’t fill all your needs in one year. In 2-3 years, I doubt most of the players listed will even be in the roster.

I agree. And that’s what I was saying.