All things defense

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

31 minutes ago, Searchingforaqb said:

 

Maybe they traded Sweat as there never was a real offer for Young?

Highly likely at this point.  To my knowledge there have been no rumors pointing may specifically team to Chase, just general “Young and Sweat could be on the move”.

 

Typically, if there is genuine interest from a team(s) regarding a player, it’s in the atmosphere well before now.

 

 

[Warhead36]

I think there's interest for Young but nobody is offering what the team wants. I wouldn't deal Young for a 3rd either.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I think there's interest for Young but nobody is offering what the team wants. I wouldn't deal Young for a 3rd either.

The stage has been set with a 2nd for Montez, meaning Young is a 2nd at minimum- based on potential.

 

[Saeth29]

Apparently Sweat is valued higher than Young elsewhere around the league.  

 

[RandyHolt]

I boldly predict our defense will do NO worse than it has the first 2 months, without those 2.

 

I boldly predict our defense will do better if JDR is relieved of duty.

[Warhead36]

2 hours ago, RandyHolt said:

I boldly predict our defense will do NO worse than it has the first 2 months, without those 2.

 

I boldly predict our defense will do better if JDR is relieved of duty.

I mean its hard to be worse.

[Silvernon]

Second rounder from the Bears os good enough for Sweat. 

 

Let's see how Toohill does the rest of the way. 

[XxSpearheadxX]

1 minute ago, Silvernon said:

Second rounder from the Bears os good enough for Sweat. 

 

Let's see how Toohill does the rest of the way. 

We basically got what we spent on him, if we were a superbowl contender sure keep him around. Otherwise? We got what we spent on him back. That's awesome. 

Chase young is more just cutting of some fingers to save the hand. Not awesome but understandable 

[wit33]

Just now, goskins10 said:

 

 

Maybe I am missing something. But how is Josh Harris being a ****ty owner? He can make personel changes due to lack of performance. The team is 3-5 and woefully underperfroming (or performing just as it should, niether is good). So they are making some moves that will help the team. I was one of the longer Ron hold outs thinking he was jsut struggling under mini-me's ignorance. But the game has passed him - and that includes JDR. Ron is a great guy but he lost his edge as a good coach. So Ok, just move on. If I missed something said let me know. 

 

If they fire Ron tomorrow it's not being a ****ty owner unless he goes out of his way to embarress him, ala Bruce Allen and Scott M.

 

Last sentence really makes no sense. WHat was all a mistake? Trading 2 players from an underperforming until that are both on last contracts that would have eaten a lot of CAP space even if you just sign 1 much less two? And you get a 2nd and a 3rd for them. 

 

I am just not seeing how any of that is being a ****ty owner. 

**Not all directed at you, side tangent:

 

The NFL is known for its unpredictability when it comes to wins and losses. It's often a fine line between being a double-digit winning team and a team drafting in the top ten. I'm not in favor of parting with good players that a new regime could use to initiate a turnaround. I might be biased, as I have an overall liking for the roster, although there's not much to support that sentiment these days.
 

Nonetheless, there's a considerable amount of time until the next season, and we'll need to wait and see how things unfold.

 

Personally, I believe that rebuilding teams should use their draft capital to acquire established NFL players to aid in the rebuilding process, especially when they aren't picking within the top 5. It's interesting to note that the Bears are receiving criticism for a strategy similar to what the Niners are being praised for, and the Bears are in a position to transition swiftly due to financial flexibility. In my opinion, the media and fans often have this perspective reversed.

[Silvernon]

46 minutes ago, XxSpearheadxX said:

We basically got what we spent on him, if we were a superbowl contender sure keep him around. Otherwise? We got what we spent on him back. That's awesome. 

Chase young is more just cutting of some fingers to save the hand. Not awesome but understandable 

I mean.... it's only one 2nd rounder. 

 

Still, it is only slightly below the fair market value  (~late 1st Rnd).

 

He played well while he was here and had some great moments. One of the guys who doesn't show up for OTAs, so it seemed inevitable. 

 

But Toohill is a guy I like at LE and want to see what they got before he hits free agency. 

[XxSpearheadxX]

@Silvernontrue I guess he was a late 1st rounder

[Bacon]

The return on Sweat was really good. We traded the #26 pick of the 2019 draft for the likely #33-36 pick of the 2024 draft. Can't complain there.

 

Trading Chase Young for essentially a 4th rounder...well...awful organizations put themselves into awful situations.

[Captain Wiggles]

16 minutes ago, Bacon said:

The return on Sweat was really good. We traded the #26 pick of the 2019 draft for the likely #33-36 pick of the 2024 draft. Can't complain there.

 

 

It cost more than the 26th pick in 2019 to draft Sweat. Traded up with Indianapolis to get him. 

[Silvernon]

1 hour ago, Captain Wiggles said:

 

It cost more than the 26th pick in 2019 to draft Sweat. Traded up with Indianapolis to get him. 

 

That was my thinking, but they're not wrong. At the end of the day it was pick 26.

 

You got production at the position for 4.5 years and you get back close to the original price, aka draft pick.

[PeterMP]

But trading picks back normally has a value.  The 26th pick in 2019 is worth more than the 24th pick in 2024.  That's not how you think about his value at all.  His value is what is based on what somebody is going to give you.  But if you are, you have to take into account that if you traded a 1st round pick in 2019 and were taking back picks on 2024, you'd get more than a 1st round pick back.

[method man]

1 hour ago, Bacon said:

The return on Sweat was really good. We traded the #26 pick of the 2019 draft for the likely #33-36 pick of the 2024 draft. Can't complain there.

 

Trading Chase Young for essentially a 4th rounder...well...awful organizations put themselves into awful situations.

We won the trade. We got above slot production out of Sweat for 4.5 years and recouped a high 2nd. Simple enough

[Silvernon]

7 minutes ago, PeterMP said:

But trading picks back normally has a value.  The 26th pick in 2019 is worth more than the 24th pick in 2024.  That's not how you think about his value at all.  His value is what is based on what somebody is going to give you.  But if you are, you have to take into account that if you traded a 1st round pick in 2019 and were taking back picks on 2024, you'd get more than a 1st round pick back.

You're actually not correct, but that would have been true mid-2000s when the rookie contracts were outta wack. 

 

A productive 24th pick rookie in 2024 far outweighs.the value of the 24th pick of 2019 who is now getting serious $$ if he is any good, which he should be in your argument. 

 

Sweat will get paid, just like Preston got paid.

[PeterMP]

15 minutes ago, Silvernon said:

You're actually not correct, but that would have been true mid-2000s when the rookie contracts were outta wack. 

 

A productive 24th pick rookie in 2024 far outweighs.the value of the 24th pick of 2019 who is now getting serious $$ if he is any good, which he should be in your argument. 

 

Sweat will get paid, just like Preston got paid.

 

I'm not sure I'm following what you're saying.

 

Let me give an example of what I mean.  The Broncos traded a 2023 3 rd pick to the Seahawks.  The Broncos gave up a 2024 3rd round pick.

 

So the Seahawks are putting a 3rd round pick off for a year and the Broncos are moving up a year.  But the Seahawks also got a 2023 4th round pick.

 

Moving back a year in the 3rd round was worth a 4th round pick.  Moving back 5 years in the first round should be worth even more.

 

**EDIT** Sorry.  Reading my post over, I mixed it up in the 2nd sentence.  The rest is right.  I'll point out that I'm pretty sure it has always been like that pretty much.  Moving back in years has always had value.

Edited November 1, 2023 by PeterMP

[RandyHolt]

It's total BS to say no D assistant can coach the D to allow 35 points per game to finish out the year. There it is: yet again, a futility record our defense is chasing half way through the season, like clockwork:  "Washington's defense ranks 31st in scoring and 29th in yards per game. If those rankings continue, it would be the worst defensive showing in franchise history"

 

Is that Del Rio and his son still over there? 

Edited November 1, 2023 by RandyHolt

[HOF44]

13 hours ago, wit33 said:

**Not all directed at you, side tangent:

 

The NFL is known for its unpredictability when it comes to wins and losses. It's often a fine line between being a double-digit winning team and a team drafting in the top ten. I'm not in favor of parting with good players that a new regime could use to initiate a turnaround. I might be biased, as I have an overall liking for the roster, although there's not much to support that sentiment these days.
 

Nonetheless, there's a considerable amount of time until the next season, and we'll need to wait and see how things unfold.

 

Personally, I believe that rebuilding teams should use their draft capital to acquire established NFL players to aid in the rebuilding process, especially when they aren't picking within the top 5. It's interesting to note that the Bears are receiving criticism for a strategy similar to what the Niners are being praised for, and the Bears are in a position to transition swiftly due to financial flexibility. In my opinion, the media and fans often have this perspective reversed.

If think it should mainly be built by the draft with some mid level solid free agents brought in.  The problem with acquiring “top” talent through free agency is that if they were really that good they would not be on the market. Does one slip through every now and then?  Probably, but your not gonna build a top team on mainly free agents. 

[kingdaddy]

16 hours ago, RandyHolt said:

I boldly predict our defense will do NO worse than it has the first 2 months, without those 2.

 

I boldly predict our defense will do better if JDR is relieved of duty.

Today is the perfect time to dump JDR....elevate Kerrigan to DC and see what he can do. If you're gonna start dumping your players then the DC should go with them. 

So will we see Andre Jones Jr. and KJ Henry elevated to replace Sweat and Young? 

[RandyHolt]

17 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Today is the perfect time to dump JDR....elevate Kerrigan to DC and see what he can do. If you're gonna start dumping your players then the DC should go with them. 

So will we see Andre Jones Jr. and KJ Henry elevated to replace Sweat and Young? 

 

Its grinding on my nerves that now JDR, the DC who somehow failed to utilize Sweat and Young, has full control on developing ruining their replacements.  JDR should have no control at this point. If they don't want to fire him fine just make him stand next Ron on the sideline, neutered. I get it Harris and Magic dont want to appear rash or have to deal with naming or axing an interim DC, but at this point Josh is fooling himself thinking anyone in the room is respecting what JDR is asking them to do.

Edited November 1, 2023 by RandyHolt

[RandyHolt]

Too bad Harris is not going to fire JDR - who is gunning for the most point/yards allowed team record.

 

In a Seinfeld run Ashburn world JDR would be forced out a la George Costanza

 

 

Edited November 1, 2023 by RandyHolt

[gortiz]

2 hours ago, RandyHolt said:

Its grinding on my nerves that now JDR, the DC who somehow failed to utilize Sweat and Young, has full control on developing ruining their replacements.

its wild to me that he's kind of shielded during all this.  its not a far fetched to say he screwed up chase and Montez to some degree. of course alongside with Ron. 

[goskins10]

16 hours ago, wit33 said:

**Not all directed at you, side tangent:

 

The NFL is known for its unpredictability when it comes to wins and losses. It's often a fine line between being a double-digit winning team and a team drafting in the top ten. I'm not in favor of parting with good players that a new regime could use to initiate a turnaround. I might be biased, as I have an overall liking for the roster, although there's not much to support that sentiment these days.
 

Nonetheless, there's a considerable amount of time until the next season, and we'll need to wait and see how things unfold.

 

Personally, I believe that rebuilding teams should use their draft capital to acquire established NFL players to aid in the rebuilding process, especially when they aren't picking within the top 5. It's interesting to note that the Bears are receiving criticism for a strategy similar to what the Niners are being praised for, and the Bears are in a position to transition swiftly due to financial flexibility. In my opinion, the media and fans often have this perspective reversed.

 

Could not disagree more with the bolded. You will always overpay in free agency and most times those players do not perform as well due to chemistry. I have no problem building depth with FAs but you need to draft your top players or you end up in CAP hell. 

 

As for parting with good players - I get what yoj are saying but in this case they were likely losing one if not both anyway. Previusly we would have just let **** happen and get almost nothing for the resources. So move these two guys, get some additional draft resources and start your rebuild. Now they have draft capitol to do what they want in th draft. Is there a QB they want? A LT? (That is my hope as i think Howell can be th guy). Move down and build the entgire roster as we look for stars in next years draft? All options are there.