2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[DWinzit]

11 hours ago, KDawg said:

I think we are being a bit harsh on Dyami. He’s a rookie. Rookie receivers don’t typically show out in year one unless they are a legitimate top end elite talent. Brown wasn’t going to be that. But he can be an awesome receiver.

 

But he has to show it a little next season. Would be nice to see it towards the back end this year.

Sure we shouldn't consider him a bust and he still gets to prove himself the rest of this year a next. However, so far he has been a big disappointment  and my point was adding his college QB which he had great success with could be very beneficial to him

 

[philibusters]

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

Again, Dyami is a rookie. We need to understand patience. If he struggles and shows no signs of improvement through the rest of this season and next it’s probably fair to pile on.

 

We need to break this trend of believing the rookies need to come in and be excellent day one. Development is very often necessary.

 

I agree.

 

Of the four guys taken in the first 3 rounds (Davis, Cosmi, St. Juste, and Dyami), I actually thought Dyami might be the most ready from day 1 because I thought Davis was super athletic but raw, I thought WR was an easier adjustment than Offensive Tackle, and I thought St. Juste was a bad pick where we projected too much.  There were lots of wrong takes in there, but that was my takes after the draft as we wait for camp to start.

[“Misdirection”]

Had the Ole Miss game on last night. Was multi-tasking but I did not come away with a positive impression of Corral as a top 10 kind of guy. Seemed loose with the ball with a few fumbles, and throws didn’t seem very accurate or powerful. 
 

Anyone have differing thoughts on that performance? 

[method man]

13 hours ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

So we were both wrong. 😆

I included the 3rd rounders from 2020 in the analysis

14 hours ago, KDawg said:

Again, Dyami is a rookie. We need to understand patience. If he struggles and shows no signs of improvement through the rest of this season and next it’s probably fair to pile on.

 

We need to break this trend of believing the rookies need to come in and be excellent day one. Development is very often necessary.

The guy has less than 100 yards receiving across 5 games with his snap count. I’d get those numbers for a WR4 but he has been a WR2 by snap count when he has played

 

Hopefully he develops but I am not holding my breath and his presence shouldn’t prevent the team from seeking upgrades at the other outside spot

[Warhead36]

My issue with Dyami is that he doesn't get open. Like, ever. Even young developing receivers can break free of coverage. I don't know if its an issue of route running or is he's just not that explosive or what.

 

Like method mad said his production is way too low for someone who's played as many snaps as he has.

[KDawg]

56 minutes ago, method man said:

I included the 3rd rounders from 2020 in the analysis

The guy has less than 100 yards receiving across 5 games with his snap count. I’d get those numbers for a WR4 but he has been a WR2 by snap count when he has played

 

Hopefully he develops but I am not holding my breath and his presence shouldn’t prevent the team from seeking upgrades at the other outside spot

 

18 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

My issue with Dyami is that he doesn't get open. Like, ever. Even young developing receivers can break free of coverage. I don't know if its an issue of route running or is he's just not that explosive or what.

 

Like method mad said his production is way too low for someone who's played as many snaps as he has.

he’s open more than you guys think. And our QB situation stinks, too. All of that does matter.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

Edited November 14, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, LLandryistheshiz said:

Had the Ole Miss game on last night. Was multi-tasking but I did not come away with a positive impression of Corral as a top 10 kind of guy. Seemed loose with the ball with a few fumbles, and throws didn’t seem very accurate or powerful. 
 

Anyone have differing thoughts on that performance? 

 

Yep.  Different impression for me.  Had a few fumbles?  I saw 2 but I missed much of the 2nd half, I had the game recorded so I'll go back and watch.  The 2nd fumble I didn't take him as being loose, he was trying to bulldoze defenders like he was John Riggins for extra yards, they did recover that fumble, I doubt we'd see him dare with a play like that in the NFL.  

 

He's playing with a high ankle sprain so he has not had his wheels in his recent games.  Yet, he still from what I saw was pretty good.  And he did so playing a team who beat Alabama.  He doesn't really have killer weapons either. 

 

My top concern with him is his frame-injuries.  But the player I dig. 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Herbert was one of my guys, i didn't fall for him until later in the process though.  Shows that you can get a good RB in almost any round.   I like Patterson but too bad we didn't go fishing earlier in that draft.  Next year...

 

 

 

[PartyPosse]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

he’s open more than you guys think. And our QB situation stinks, too. All of that does matter.

I agree. I see him and AH running around uncovered all the time. Taylor looks at Terry, JD, RSJ and then panics. That’s it.

[method man]

Great Howell breakdown here. Was done before the season got started. The gist here is that he can become a good NFL starter but his average arm, tendency to lock on to the #1 WR and lack of agility relative to the elite guys to avoid pressure will limit his ceiling. I think we can all agree with that 

 

Film Don’t Lie: Sam Howell is a Good Quarterback but a Limited One - Visit NFL Draft on Sports Illustrated, the latest news coverage, with rankings for NFL Draft prospects, College Football, Dynasty and Devy Fantasy Football.

[Warhead36]

Average arm? Yuck. Count me out then. I'm sick of noodle armed QBs. GIve me a guy with a cannon. I know arm strength isn't the end all be all but I'm sick of hitching our wagons to mediocrity. Get a thoroughbred and coach him/develop him.

[88Comrade2000]

If we can play the way we did the rest of the year; we won’t be anywhere near drafting a qb.

[KDawg]

3 hours ago, method man said:

Great Howell breakdown here. Was done before the season got started. The gist here is that he can become a good NFL starter but his average arm, tendency to lock on to the #1 WR and lack of agility relative to the elite guys to avoid pressure will limit his ceiling. I think we can all agree with that 

 

Film Don’t Lie: Sam Howell is a Good Quarterback but a Limited One - Visit NFL Draft on Sports Illustrated, the latest news coverage, with rankings for NFL Draft prospects, College Football, Dynasty and Devy Fantasy Football.

I don’t agree that he has an average arm or that he locks on the number 1 guy… he had Newsome and Brown last year and both produced. Among others. 
 

I do agree that he is more of a pocket guy that can run a little than he is a runner/elusive guy.

[DWinzit]

3 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Average arm? Yuck. Count me out then. I'm sick of noodle armed QBs. GIve me a guy with a cannon. I know arm strength isn't the end all be all but I'm sick of hitching our wagons to mediocrity. Get a thoroughbred and coach him/develop him.

His arm strength is not considered below average so shouldn't fall into the noodle arm club. Not a gun but has the arm for all the throws.

[kingdaddy]

Scratch QB from our list of needs in the 1st round....best playmaker available on defense is the pick. In TH we trust.

[RichmondRedskin88]

1 minute ago, kingdaddy said:

Scratch QB from our list of needs in the 1st round....best playmaker available on defense is the pick. In TH we trust.

TH doesn’t have an arm to stretch the defense.  You have to have that at QB to have consistent success. 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 minute ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

TH doesn’t have an arm to stretch the defense.  You have to have that at QB to have consistent success. 

 

Yup.

 

You need some explosive play potential, cause penalties can put you in awkward spots.  This game against the Bucs was relatively flag free.  19 yard drives don't normally happen cause a flag will derail it before then.

[kingdaddy]

16 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

TH doesn’t have an arm to stretch the defense.  You have to have that at QB to have consistent success. 

His legs more than make up for his limited arm....We've barely scratched the surface of using his legs. In the 2nd half they finally started rolling him out and that's where he's most dangerous. Keep surrounding him with talent and he's fine. 

[method man]

38 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

His arm strength is not considered below average so shouldn't fall into the noodle arm club. Not a gun but has the arm for all the throws.

Yes. Sam has a Cousins like arm. More than enough for the NFL. What the guy is saying in his breakdown is he can’t just flick his wrist and throw it 40 yards

[RichmondRedskin88]

57 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

His legs more than make up for his limited arm....We've barely scratched the surface of using his legs. In the 2nd half they finally started rolling him out and that's where he's most dangerous. Keep surrounding him with talent and he's fine. 

Having legs doesn’t make up for arm.  You HAVE to have a vertical threat or defenders creep up on the line.  That hurts your run game and makes screens tougher. 

[philibusters]

High end arm strength in your QB is nice, but its a luxury.    I mean you look at some of the better QB over the past 20 years who had average to below average arms

 

Tom Brady

Payton Manning

Matt Ryan

Drew Brees

Phillip Rivers

Deshaun Watson

 

Arguably the top 4 QB's from last year's draft---Trevor Lawrence, Justin Fields, Zach Wilson, and Trey Lance---had better arms than the top guys this year.  I would rate them all as having above average NFL arms.  By contrast the 5th QB in last year draft had an average arm more in line with guys like Pickett and Howell and he is been the best of the bunch and has the Patriots at 6-4 after going 19-23 for 3 TD's and 0 interceptions today.

 

When you dip into the below average arms, like a Taylor Heinicke or Colt McCoy you do start to run into problems, but having an average arm (average being relative to NFL QB's) doesn't really cap your ceiling.

 

Edited November 14, 2021 by philibusters

[kingdaddy]

37 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

Having legs doesn’t make up for arm.  You HAVE to have a vertical threat or defenders creep up on the line.  That hurts your run game and makes screens tougher. 

Heinicke's arm looked fine today....made a lot of deep out throws and a nice deep throw for the TD. We can win with this kid....just ask Tom Brady.

[CommanderDOOM]

What about a "below average" arm??

[philibusters]

1 minute ago, TheShredSkinz said:

What about a "below average" arm??

 

It makes it tougher.   Take Payton Manning and Drew Brees.  By the end of their career they had below average arms and neither was as good as they were in their peak.  Even Big Ben in Pittsburgh is learning to play with a below average arm (at one point his arm was pretty good).  With a below average arm you can still look pretty good when guys are open, but in games where the coverage is tight and there are few wide open receivers the offense is going to stall if you have a below average arm.   With an average arm you can still complete enough passes into tight windows by contrast.