Renegade7 Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 56 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: Anyone involved in this stupid debate of how things would have gone differently in those 6 passes, on both sides. Good people on both sides... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 1 minute ago, Renegade7 said: Good people on both sides... The thing is I haven’t seen anyone trash Heinecke. Most, including myself, just remain skeptical because it’s a small sample size and there have been some worrisome moments and decisions. But I haven’t seen anyone say he shouldn’t be the starter right now. On the other side, the Taylor stans are acting exactly Like cult members. He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. I get being optimistic, but there’s a fine line between excitement and delusion. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 1 minute ago, PartyPosse said: The thing is I haven’t seen anyone trash Heinecke. Most, including myself, just remain skeptical because it’s a small sample size and there have been some worrisome moments and decisions. But I haven’t seen anyone say he shouldn’t be the starter right now. On the other side, the Taylor stans are acting exactly Like cult members. He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. I get being optimistic, but there’s a fine line between excitement and delusion. You can keep saying that until you are ODU baby blue and the face and it won't change anything. Nature jus has to take its course, the back and forth on the chargers game has me in stitches. Havin said that, hes gonna beat the Saints, its destiny, and I plan on taking my Dad to the Tampa game to see this enigma in person. It's different from the 400s where you can see everything, not jus what TV has space for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 30 minutes ago, ODU AGGIE said: Nah, no need for that, MT. You're happy to point out concern for his durability, his lack of enough games to adequately evaluate him, his lack of arm strength, his tendency to throw high and so on. While we are happy to point out his successes, praise his pocket sense, appreciate his moxie/grit, delight in his ability to save a play with his legs and so on. It's all good. Cheers! I still don't get this binary thinking. I've said plenty of times that Heinicke has played well and I've certainly remarked in the game day threads when he makes a great pass or great play. I've said what I like about him, what he does well, and what he seems to struggle with. Yet when I counter something here that I think is incorrect, a bit overly optimistic, or just pie-in-the-sky thinking, I get told not to "pop other peoples' balloons" and asked why I'm so negative. That's why I'm wondering if having 2 threads may be a good idea. Some people want to be homers, which is absolutely fine (I have precisely zero against you personally or for being a Heinicke homer, especially since you're quite open about it), and some want to tend towards being more realistic (even if it can seem overly negative or cynical...hey, we're WFT fans so we're scarred). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasRoane Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 16 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. Welcome to the Hive PP! What took you so long?!?! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ODU AGGIE Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: The thing is I haven’t seen anyone trash Heinecke. Most, including myself, just remain skeptical because it’s a small sample size and there have been some worrisome moments and decisions. But I haven’t seen anyone say he shouldn’t be the starter right now. On the other side, the Taylor stans are acting exactly Like cult members. He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. I get being optimistic, but there’s a fine line between excitement and delusion. I honestly believe it is your take that is hyperbole. While I am an acknowledged fan of TH, I know I have not said anything near like, "He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame." I cannot recall anyone else saying anything like that either. I also do not believe I (or anyone else) have accused anyone of trashing him. I think the only thing we Heinicke (note the spelling) fans can be accused of is not agreeing with your skepticism while we enjoy his play on the field. Cheers! 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodytusk Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 17 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: On the other side, the Taylor stans are acting exactly Like cult members. He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. I get being optimistic, but there’s a fine line between excitement and delusion. I feel like, at this point, its a tradition of this fanbase to dance on that line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 11 minutes ago, ODU AGGIE said: I honestly believe it is your take that is hyperbole. While I am an acknowledged fan of TH, I know I have not said anything near like, "He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame." I cannot recall anyone else saying anything like that either. I also do not believe I (or anyone else) have accused anyone of trashing him. I think the only thing we Heinicke (note the spelling) fans can be accused of is not agreeing with your skepticism while we enjoy his play on the field. Cheers! Well, yeah, obviously it’s hyperbole to get my point across lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ODU AGGIE Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, PartyPosse said: Well, yeah, obviously it’s hyperbole to get my point across lol. Well, you know -- if it takes hyperbole to get your point across about there being a fine line, maybe, just maybe, the delusion is yours, and the excitement is ours. Maybe -- lol. Cheers! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, ODU AGGIE said: Well, you know -- if it takes hyperbole to get your point across about there being a fine line, maybe, just maybe, the delusion is yours, and the excitement is ours. Maybe -- lol. Cheers! If you can’t see all the ignorant parts of this post despite all I said then I don’t know what to tell you. lol cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ODU AGGIE Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 1 minute ago, PartyPosse said: If you can’t see all the ignorant parts of this post despite all I said then I don’t know what to tell you. lol cheers! I guess I have you at a loss for words, and that seems to be a good place for this to end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rook Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 1 hour ago, mistertim said: Yet when I counter something here that I think is incorrect, a bit overly optimistic, or just pie-in-the-sky thinking, I get told not to "pop other peoples' balloons" and asked why I'm so negative. I think it is because you called people's posts "silly". That is pretty condescending for people who are just posting what-if scenarios. The Rook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, The Rook said: I think it is because you called people's posts "silly". That is pretty condescending for people who are just posting what-if scenarios. The Rook I was saying the entire "what-if" thing is silly because it could go in so many different directions, so automatically assuming that it would go in the direction of Heinicke doing something amazing is a bit ridiculous. The entire thing was about 6 passes and was nonsensical. And it wasn't posted as just a "what if" scenario anyway. It was a "If this thing that didn't happen had happened, then I'm positive that x would definitely have been the outcome". Can't people just talk about what Heinicke has done or is doing without moving into absurdity in an effort to pump him up more? This is the sort of stuff that made the Cult of Colt so hard to wade through. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 2 hours ago, mistertim said: Maybe we should have 2 Heinicke threads then. One "Taylor Heinicke QB discussion" thread where people talk about his play and one "Taylor Heinicke homers and dreamers" thread where "bad vibes" aren't allowed and people talk about what-ifs, merchandise, how amazing he could eventually be, or already is, etc. I'm honestly only half joking. As @ConnSKINS26brought up earlier, this is the thread we have to discuss Heinicke in general, and it isn't necessarily just meant to be a fan club. If someone wants a Heinicke homers thread, and want to be homers without having to deal with people "popping their balloons", maybe they can create one? I'll promise to completely stay out of it. This thread is fine. My whole point was yes you are going to have homerism in a TH thread and that is okay. You have to respect their jubelism. You can make your point without trying to belittle them. I have no problem if someone says what if. My response to that is yeah I can see that but what if this happens instead. It is all about the perspective of one's poster and how you respond to it. That is all. You can still have a healthy debate without hurting someone's position or their feelings. Sure we are extreme here but I miss the days of this forum when we actually talked about real stuff and the tangibles and how important or not important said player is to the team. i know you like to see more out of TH. Who doesn't? I want to see how he does in all 17 games (if he is given that chance). What his fate holds after the season ends is another story. TH has an opportunity to write that story and ride into the sunset or stay here and continue another chapter instead. Does he have a weak arm and is less than 6' feet tall. Sure. But does that mean he can't play in the NFL and be a starter. Nope. If the dude is winning games or at least trying to win the games (our D sucks so I am not going to pin all loses on TH unless he makes a boneheaded play at the end of the game and the other team scores because of that). I want to see him getting more and more comfortable at his position and keeps on developing chemistry with his WRs, TEs and RBs. What else more can you ask for. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 6 minutes ago, zskins said: This thread is fine. My whole point was yes you are going to have homerism in a TH thread and that is okay. You have to respect their jubelism. You can make your point without trying to belittle them. I have no problem if someone says what if. My response to that is yeah I can see that but what if this happens instead. It is all about the perspective of one's poster and how you respond to it. That is all. So pointing out how it's silly to assume a given outcome for a random hypothetical situation is now "belittling"? I literally said that it would be just as silly for me to claim that Heinicke would have thrown picks in those drives. I didn't tell anyone they were dumb for supporting Heinicke or for being a homer. I was saying that I don't see why it's necessary to try to make up random scenarios to pump the guy up as much as possible. He's already playing pretty well. Feels like people are being a bit overly sensitive in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, PartyPosse said: The thing is I haven’t seen anyone trash Heinecke. Most, including myself, just remain skeptical because it’s a small sample size and there have been some worrisome moments and decisions. But I haven’t seen anyone say he shouldn’t be the starter right now. On the other side, the Taylor stans are acting exactly Like cult members. He’s done no wrong, everything is perfect and he’s already a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. I get being optimistic, but there’s a fine line between excitement and delusion. The same argument can validly be made the other way as well...never seems to be lol...but it can. I mean,, it would be nice if one side was not portrayed as having reasonable questions and doubts while the other side are kool-aid drinking cult members who are convinced Heinicke will be enshrined in the HOF at halftime of the Saints game. Edited October 7, 2021 by Califan007 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapsSkins Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 5 hours ago, ODU AGGIE said: True, but the way it all came down, you have to believe it was a winnable game that we just didn't win. Shoulda, coulda, woulda. Close, but no cigar. We should have beat the Chargers (AG fumble the backbreaker) but we also should have lost to the Giants (Slayton drop and obviously Lawrence offsides). We were always likely to lose in Buffalo. So 2-2 is about right and instead of 0-1 in the division and 1-1 in the conference, we're 1-0 in the division and 2-0 in the conference. Good trade for us. Saints game should be fun. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) 38 minutes ago, mistertim said: So pointing out how it's silly to assume a given outcome for a random hypothetical situation is now "belittling"? I literally said that it would be just as silly for me to claim that Heinicke would have thrown picks in those drives. I didn't tell anyone they were dumb for supporting Heinicke or for being a homer. I was saying that I don't see why it's necessary to try to make up random scenarios to pump the guy up as much as possible. He's already playing pretty well. Feels like people are being a bit overly sensitive in here. You are being overly sensitive here. When you say that it is silly is telling that someone that they are stupid because they are not at your intellect level and hence dumb. You are the only one with a level head and is more reasonable than others. I am reasonable as they come. But I am also excited with what I see in TH so far. Can he be a franchise QB. Who knows or even maybe. Can he win us a SB this year. Why not or are we so insufferable that we can't even fathom to think like that anymore. Is that even being realistic? Time will tell. Until then just enjoy the ride. Edited October 7, 2021 by zskins 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILikeBilly Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 25 minutes ago, mistertim said: .... He's already playing pretty well.... To me, your quote above sums up your feeling and what you have been saying. Many of us completely disagree with your quote. We feel he is playing better than any Washington QB since RGIII's rookie year. I don't think Kirk ever had so many late first half, end of game scoring drives that mattered. In our two wins Taylor lead two late forth quarter scoring drive in each game to win the games. Kirk isn't that clutch. Alex could win, but because of his injury, we never got to see what might have been. No one else has been close. Taylor is the best QB we have had in a decade and you say he is playing pretty well. Wake up dude. For us he is the best. For the youngsters, he is the best ever Washington QB. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, zskins said: You are being overly sensitive here. When you say that it is silly is telling that someone that they are stupid because they are not at your intellect level and hence dumb. You are the only one with a level head and is more reasonable than others. So we have to respect everything anyone says equally because we don't want to hurt their feelings? It has nothing to do with my intellect level or theirs. Some things are objectively nonsensical. Saying you know what the future would have been if one thing had happened instead of the other is nonsensical, especially in a system with as many unknowns and moving parts as a sports game. 7 minutes ago, ILikeBilly said: To me, your quote above sums up your feeling and what you have been saying. Many of us completely disagree with your quote. We feel he is playing better than any Washington QB since RGIII's rookie year. I don't think Kirk ever had so many late first half, end of game scoring drives that mattered. In our two wins Taylor lead two late forth quarter scoring drive in each game to win the games. Kirk isn't that clutch. Alex could win, but because of his injury, we never got to see what might have been. No one else has been close. Taylor is the best QB we have had in a decade and you say he is playing pretty well. Wake up dude. For us he is the best. For the youngsters, he is the best ever Washington QB. Yeah and this is exactly the stuff I'm talking about. He's started 4 games and I need to "wake up" because I had the audacity to say he's playing pretty well instead of saying he's the greatest thing since who knows what and is the savior of the franchise. I can't imagine the pearl clutching that would be going on here if someone actually said something mean about Heinicke instead of just mostly praising him. Edited October 7, 2021 by mistertim 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zCommander Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, mistertim said: So we have to respect everything anyone says equally because we don't want to hurt their feelings? It has nothing to do with my intellect level or theirs. Some things are objectively nonsensical. Saying you know what the future would have been if one thing had happened instead of the other is nonsensical, especially in a system with as many unknowns and moving parts as a sports game. Dude how long have you been here? Make a counterpoint but don't attack the poster. You keep on saying nonsensical but that is just your opinion that someone might not share doesn't mean that it make you more right and everyone has to be at your so called tempered enthusiasm. Edited October 7, 2021 by zskins 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PartyPosse Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 19 minutes ago, mistertim said: can't imagine the pearl clutching that would be going on here if someone actually said something mean about Heinicke instead of just mostly praising him. Well it is a cult. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, zskins said: Dude how long have you been here? Make a counterpoint but don't attack the poster. You keep on saying nonsensical but that is just your opinion that someone might not share doesn't mean that it make you more right and everyone has to be at your so called tempered enthusiasm. Um, explain how I'm attacking you? Fine, we disagree. You apparently believe it's rational for someone to essentially say "If this thing that didn't happen actually happened, then I know exactly what the outcome would have been, regardless of how many unknowable variables there are". I think it's completely irrational, hence "nonsensical." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CobraCommander Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, -JB- said: I wanna be impressed but honestly it just shows how pathetic we have been at the position in the last 22 years. I heard on the radio he is on pace for 30 tds which would be the most since Sonny Jurgensen. FDR was president when that man was born. How awful is that? NFL qbs regularly get 30+ these days Edited October 7, 2021 by Florgon79 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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