!!!!0mgz!!!! Trent Williams finally showed up

[Idaho fan]

16 hours ago, jsharrin55 said:

Since the Pats offered a first, I wonder if they'd wait until after they play the Pats to trade TW, so they don't need to face him. 

 

Not that it makes a big difference, since the early line is 16 points, but another knock to the all precious BA/DS ego if he switches teams and mauls us. 

 

Ive wondered the same thing... Sounds like the continual short sided type of decision making Allen has.

 

I have never ever rooted for losses in my 30+ years of being a fan.  But im there now.  I hope we lose to the Dolphins.  I hope we lose to a team that is obviously tanking.  

[carex]

3 minutes ago, GoSkinsGo said:

This team reminds me of the Crosby, Stills and Nash lyric. 

 

“We never failed to fail. It was the easiest thing g to do.“

 

I'm sure they had a plan, but it’s been a long time since they had one that looked like a good one. 

 

trying to collect draft picks, building through that and only signing moderately priced FA was only like four years ago, wasn't it

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

We'd have to go back 5,000+ posts and revisit history to really dig in, but remember back when this was just all about money, he'll be here before week 1, then it evolved into Bruce was just biding his time and would strike when the trade iron is hot?

 

Here we sit rolling into week 5 - No Trent - sacrificing a lot of money - all stories about trade talks consist of teams being told he's not available.  After all, what is a team to think when the Skins are in FULL MODE?  They ain't got time to be talking about no trades!

[GoCommiesGo]

3 minutes ago, carex said:

 

trying to collect draft picks, building through that and only signing moderately priced FA was only like four years ago, wasn't it

The drafting has been better but a plan is not confined to one area. It’s a meshing at all levels of an organization.

 

Pointing to one compartment as an improvement while the rest of the organization fails is not proof of a  plan. Let alone a good one. 

 

 

[wit33]

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

We'd have to go back 5,000+ posts and revisit history to really dig in, but remember back when this was just all about money, he'll be here before week 1, then it evolved into Bruce was just biding his time and would strike when the trade iron is hot?

 

Here we sit rolling into week 5 - No Trent - sacrificing a lot of money - all stories about trade talks consist of teams being told he's not available.  After all, what is a team to think when the Skins are in FULL MODE?  They ain't got time to be talking about no trades!

 

Wild stuff. Money is money and Trent forfeiting quite a bit. I imagine he and his team are shocked it’s drawn out this long. 

 

I believe Trent is a guy who will play until 37-38, and can make up some of it through his freakish abilities allowing him to play in years not afforded to many. 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said:

After this week, and potentially next week, look for the national media to really start digging and throwing darts. It's never a good look to be a the worst team in football, particularly in a high visibility/scrutiny place like DC, and particularly when you are owned by Dan Snyder.

 

Many of them are so far behind that they still follow the '00-'07 "Dan just wants to win" narrative. Can't wait to see all of them drag his scary ass into the light and crush him, badly, starting with how the team has handled this nonsense.

 

I agree with this 100%.  I am a bit of a national football news junkie.  I watch most of the shows on NFL Network,  ESPN, and Fox Sports.  And Dan has escaped a lot of scrutiny because basically aside from 2012 the national media hasn't really found this team to be relevant where they barely ever even talk about them.    So we get little attention period.

 

Dan long ago got nailed for what you bring up -- the splashy FA signings and coach signings.  Most of the national media still define him that way.   That's when he got national attention. But he's been mostly off their radar. 

 

I always botch his last name but Barry Z. from the WP said recently the national media is starting to catch on finally about the new realities centered on Dan.  And this point might sound strange because yeah the national media doesn't think much about this team and Dan. But they really haven't caught onto the narrative that Redskins fans are just checking out on the team -- that story is really mostly local thus far.   

 

But it would be interesting to see how Dan deals with national stories about Redskins fans being fed up.   And the build up to the match up with the Dolphins will be a punch line topic for the national media all week long.  I'd put money that Dan will see this match up as the be all and end all because the level of embarrassment to losing to a team that is trying to tank would be epic. 

[Est.1974]

Still a sad side show to the main show **** storm.

[carex]

11 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I agree with this 100%.  I am a bit of a national football news junkie.  I watch most of the shows on NFL Network,  ESPN, and Fox Sports.  And Dan has escaped a lot of scrutiny because basically aside from 2012 the national media hasn't really found this team to be relevant where they barely ever even talk about them.    So we get little attention period.

 

Dan long ago got nailed for what you bring up -- the splashy FA signings and coach signings.  Most of the national media still define him that way.   That's when he got national attention. But he's been mostly off their radar. 

 

I always botch his last name but Barry Z. from the WP said recently the national media is starting to catch on finally about the new realities centered on Dan.  And this point might sound strange because yeah the national media doesn't think much about this team and Dan. But they really haven't caught onto the narrative that Redskins fans are just checking out on the team -- that story is really mostly local thus far.   

 

But it would be interesting to see how Dan deals with national stories about Redskins fans being fed up.   And the build up to the match up with the Dolphins will be a punch line topic for the national media all week long.  I'd put money that Dan will see this match up as the be all and end all because the level of embarrassment to losing to a team that is trying to tank would be epic. 

 

 

what's this new narrative about Dan you're talking about

[KDawg]

26 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

We'd have to go back 5,000+ posts and revisit history to really dig in, but remember back when this was just all about money, he'll be here before week 1, then it evolved into Bruce was just biding his time and would strike when the trade iron is hot?

 

 

I don't remember that. But then again, I'd have to go back to check, but I'm pretty sure I was on board with trading him from day one.

[Skinsinparadise]

13 minutes ago, carex said:

 

 

what's this new narrative about Dan you're talking about

 

As Rick Snider who covered the team for over 20 years has point out, the new realities for Redskins is different from years past including under Dan and worse than it ever was become anger has been supplanted by apathy.

 

A.  The narrative about Dan years back was a variation of him being this arrogant imperious Young Turk type, ready to take on the league, made splash signings and it backfired.    Though the backdrop as to Redskins fans centered on some anger not really apathy.  The talk was Dan can sell hope to Redskins fans and keep them coming even if they aren't winning because the dude knew how to market. 

 

B.  The new narrative about Dan really centers mostly on fans checking out in him.  Anger turned to apathy.  Declining fan attendance.  Declining TV ratings.  A once strong and proud fan base finally checking out and at the very least greatly weakened.  The backdrop being that Dan won't ever figure it out.  Yes he doesn't make splashy FA signings anymore.  And other changes have been made.  But on the aggregate some of the same things have continued to happen and plenty of fans have just given up.   And the fact that the sample size is now 20 years has somewhat killed the narrative that Dan would eventually figure it out.   He can't play the I was young and stupid narrative but now I'be matured dance anymore. 

 

 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

1 minute ago, KDawg said:

I don't remember that. But then again, I'd have to go back to check, but I'm pretty sure I was on board with trading him from day one.

I was speaking to the dwindling but ever so faithful fan contingent.  I recall many folks making Trent out to be a greed monger that would show up with hat in hand when it got real.  Pretty sure that's what Full Mode thought as well, "we expect Trent to play football....here".

[carex]

15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

As Rick Snider who covered the team for over 20 years has point out, the new realities for Redskins is different from years past including under Dan and worse than it ever was become anger has been supplanted by apathy.

 

A.  The narrative about Dan years back was a variation of him being this arrogant imperious Young Turk type, ready to take on the league, made splash signings and it backfired.    Though the backdrop as to Redskins fans centered on some anger not really apathy.  The talk was Dan can sell hope to Redskins fans and keep them coming even if they aren't winning because the dude knew how to market. 

 

B.  The new narrative about Dan really centers mostly on fans checking out in him.  Anger turned to apathy.  Declining fan attendance.  Declining TV ratings.  A once strong and proud fan base finally checking out and at the very least greatly weakened.  The backdrop being that Dan won't ever figure it out.  Yes he doesn't make splashy FA signings anymore.  And other changes have been made.  But on the aggregate some of the same things have continued to happen and plenty of fans have just given up.   And the fact that the sample size is now 20 years has somewhat killed the narrative that Dan would eventually figure it out.   He can't play the I was young and stupid narrative but now I'be matured dance anymore. 

 

 

 

but that's not really a new narrative about Snyder.  The first is an attempt to get into his head, to figure out what he would do and why he would do it.  The second is just talking about what he has to deal with

[Skinsinparadise]

17 minutes ago, carex said:

 

but that's not really a new narrative about Snyder.  The first is an attempt to get into his head, to figure out what he would do and why he would do it.  The second is just talking about what he has to deal with

 

A.  The old narrative is Dan is a bit of a George Steinbrenner type who likes to splash his money, interject himself in football operations, yet he loses.  But God bless the Redskins fans who keep coming to games and watching them.  Dan is a marketing genius who can pull fans in even when they don't win.

 

B.  We got sort of an in between narrative when Dan made his last refuge of doing interviews where he talked about how he's matured.  In the past he was young and stupid but now he says he gets it.  He even would say in interviews in a joking way they should have never given him the team at that age.

 

C.  The narrative now is Dan is just a loser.  The franchise isn't good.  He hasn't won.  He hasn't learned on some key fronts.  And he can no longer get the fans to keep coming and watching -- they've checked out.

 

A & C are very different.  If you don't want to buy it that's cool.  But I agree with @Mr. Sinister 's point. It's going to be a wild week now that one leading up to the Dolphins game.  And Dan will likely get some attention and he clearly seems uncomfortable with that.   

 

And we are going to be the butt of the jokes of the national media that week.  As the tweet I posted last night said, at least the Dolphins are trying to tank.  Now imagine if they actually lose to the Dolphins?  That would double up on it all. 

[Wildbunny]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I always botch his last name but Barry Z. from the WP

 

That's Barry Svrluga. I know why you failed at this one

[TD_washingtonredskins]

2 hours ago, GoSkinsGo said:

The drafting has been better but a plan is not confined to one area. It’s a meshing at all levels of an organization.

 

Pointing to one compartment as an improvement while the rest of the organization fails is not proof of a  plan. Let alone a good one. 

 

 

 

I was in this camp until recently...but are we sure? 

 

Trent Murphy, Morgan Moses, Sua Cravens, Josh Doctson, Matt Jones, Spencer Long...there are a lot of guys in the first 3ish rounds who either underachieve or don't play at all. We've hit on some, sure. And we've even had some extremely impressive value picks (Ioannidis, Fuller) but we've had some stinkers too. 

[GoCommiesGo]

3 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

I was in this camp until recently...but are we sure? 

 

Trent Murphy, Morgan Moses, Sua Cravens, Josh Doctson, Matt Jones, Spencer Long...there are a lot of guys in the first 3ish rounds who either underachieve or don't play at all. We've hit on some, sure. And we've even had some extremely impressive value picks (Ioannidis, Fuller) but we've had some stinkers too. 

Better is relative, in my view. They haven’t made ridiculous trades and have gotten value in the later rounds. 

 

They haven’t hit on everything, but it’s been a noticeable improvement. 

[method man]

6 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

I was in this camp until recently...but are we sure? 

 

Trent Murphy, Morgan Moses, Sua Cravens, Josh Doctson, Matt Jones, Spencer Long...there are a lot of guys in the first 3ish rounds who either underachieve or don't play at all. We've hit on some, sure. And we've even had some extremely impressive value picks (Ioannidis, Fuller) but we've had some stinkers too. 

 

What he's probably getting at is that it has been better with Kyle Smith at the helm the past couple years. 2018 isn't looking great as 3 out of the first 4 picks have not been productive (Guice, Christian and Apke). It's weird but we have consistently been bad at Day 2 and better at Day 3

[tmandoug1]

Boggles my mind that we haven't traded Trent for draft capital.......just don't get it. 

[TD_washingtonredskins]

17 hours ago, GoSkinsGo said:

Better is relative, in my view. They haven’t made ridiculous trades and have gotten value in the later rounds. 

 

They haven’t hit on everything, but it’s been a noticeable improvement. 

 

i think it's completely fair to give them credit for operating with some level of fiscal responsibility. We can debate the merits of that...but the fact that it's happened is admittedly undeniable. 

 

However, as a fan, I only care about that because it seems to me that you could theoretically build a better team when you aren't paying a Haynesworth $100M. But, given that we've been WORSE under Allen, the value of operating that way is lost on me. Simply stated, I didn't care about the optics of the Redskin One days at all...I just assumed it was a stupid way to run a team. In hindsight, that method was more successful ON THE FIELD, so I am not benefiting from Allen's conservative approach. The bottom line might be, but I don't give a **** about that. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

6 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

i think it's completely fair to give them credit for operating with some level of fiscal responsibility. We can debate the merits of that...but the fact that it's happened is admittedly undeniable. 

 

However, as a fan, I only care about that because it seems to me that you could theoretically build a better team when you aren't paying a Haynesworth $100M. But, given that we've been WORSE under Allen, the value of operating that way is lost on me. Simply stated, I didn't care about the optics of the Redskin One days at all...I just assumed it was a stupid way to run a team. In hindsight, that method was more successful ON THE FIELD, so I am not benefiting from Allen's conservative approach. The bottom line might be, but I don't give a **** about that. 

I agree with everything you've said here.  I'd just like to add that only here is not paying guys like Haynesworth 100M & actually using draft picks seen as something to receive credit for.  As if that's some groundbreaking strategy.  It's only groundbreaking in Ashburn because of Vinny.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

6 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I agree with everything you've said here.  I'd just like to add that only here is not paying guys like Haynesworth 100M & actually using draft picks seen as something to receive credit for.  As if that's some groundbreaking strategy.  It's only groundbreaking in Ashburn because of Vinny.

 

Good point and well-said!

[Califan007 The Constipated]

17 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I agree with everything you've said here.  I'd just like to add that only here is not paying guys like Haynesworth 100M & actually using draft picks seen as something to receive credit for.  As if that's some groundbreaking strategy.  It's only groundbreaking in Ashburn because of Vinny.

 

We've been giving credit and praise to other teams for doing those same things for years now. Why not also give it to the Redskins when they do it?

[carex]

3 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

We've been giving credit and praise to other teams for doing those same things for years now. Why not also give it to the Redskins when they do it?

 

cause then they'd have to criticize the Skins less

[Skintime]

Maybe after 27 years of failure people are tired of promises not panning out.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

14 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

We've been giving credit and praise to other teams for doing those same things for years now. Why not also give it to the Redskins when they do it?

That's like my son deserving praise for brushing his teeth at night.  Why should I credit him for doing what most kids do and are supposed to do?

10 minutes ago, carex said:

cause then they'd have to criticize the Skins less

 

Your obsession with folks loving to criticize the Redskins is just as odd as a lot of your takes.  I actually long for the day we can agree on something.  Watching exciting, winning football trumps criticizing every single day of the week.