StillUnknown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 minute ago, CRobi21 said: He was huge for us when Doo had to be shut down. He'll forever be connected to this franchise. replacing Hudson with Harris doesn't necessarily improve the pen. Harris is probably better, but its doesn't strengthen the unit if he's simply replacing Hudson. We need additions more than replacements 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoodBits Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 I was a little wary of Hudson due to his injury history and lack of extended track record. Glad they didn’t break the bank for him. Harris is much better overall (Huddy’s stretch run excluded). Bit of a risk with 3 years committed to a 35 year old, but my sense is the Nats feel like they’ve still got a window the next year or two. They’ve gotta land Donaldson though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacon Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 If we can fall a couple million short of spending eleventy billion on Rendon, we can splurge on Daniel Hudson. This is silly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoodBits Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, Bacon said: If we can fall a couple million short of spending eleventy billion on Rendon, we can splurge on Daniel Hudson. This is silly. We’ve got a big hole at the hot corner to fill first, and all of the options being tossed around cost a significant chunk of our remaining space under luxury tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metalhead Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) From what I had read Hudson wanted two years, Nationals only one. They had at least a mutual agreement on salary. But then they sign a different guy for three years. This bullpen needs as much stability and help as possible, just re-sign Hudson too, dammit! Edited January 3, 2020 by Metalhead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan2k Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 The playoff bullpen is set. We are going to add someone at the deadline and lets see how Voth, Ross and Fedde play into the pen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacon Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, skinsfan_1215 said: We’ve got a big hole at the hot corner to fill first, and all of the options being tossed around cost a significant chunk of our remaining space under luxury tax. I do believe the finer points of our pen and bench will sort themselves out after Donaldson signs. It's not wise to lower our ceiling on the most important deal we have left to make this winter. But also, sign Hudson. He deserves it and we need his services. If you think we don't, try to power through the first four months of the season with what we have and see what happens. We're one injury away from reigniting last season's garbage fire. Edited January 3, 2020 by Bacon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Damn 3 years is definitely risky but I guess when your bullpen has been atrocious you’re going to have to be able to go a bit overboard to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Yeah, we definitely still need another bullpen arm. Preferably Hudson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 16 hours ago, skinsfan_1215 said: I was a little wary of Hudson due to his injury history and lack of extended track record. Glad they didn’t break the bank for him. Harris is much better overall (Huddy’s stretch run excluded). Bit of a risk with 3 years committed to a 35 year old, but my sense is the Nats feel like they’ve still got a window the next year or two. They’ve gotta land Donaldson though. I agree. Risky at 3 years but It definitely bolsters the bullpen considerably from the beginning of last season. Get to start off the season with Harris/Doolittle at the back end. I’m sure Rizzo will figure out the rest of the ‘pen. I don’t think he was ever going to go Wild in free agency for bullpen arms. Harris has been very consistent and considerably better than Hudson through the years so no shock Rizzo went this route. Edited January 3, 2020 by -JB- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoodBits Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, bearrock said: Yeah, we definitely still need another bullpen arm. Preferably Hudson. I don't really think we do going into the season. Certainly possible we add another arm along the way depending on how guys are performing and staying healthy, but we've already assembled as good of a bullpen already as we've had to open the season in years. Doolittle, Rainey, and Harris combo should be able to lock down the backend of the pen. We're bringing back some warm bodies like Strickland and Elias, who hopefully will be healthier and more effective this year. Could we see The Bear on the opening day roster? Suero was decent for us last year. The rotation spot loser of Ross/Fedde should be our long reliever. Keep in mind that by investing a billion dollars in the rotation, you're hoping to minimize how many times you need to rely on your bullpen for more than 3 inning in a given game. So a couple quality arms and then some fillers should be enough to get the job done. Edited January 3, 2020 by skinsfan_1215 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 26 minutes ago, skinsfan_1215 said: I don't really think we do going into the season. Certainly possible we add another arm along the way depending on how guys are performing and staying healthy, but we've already assembled as good of a bullpen already as we've had to open the season in years. Doolittle, Rainey, and Harris combo should be able to lock down the backend of the pen. We're bringing back some warm bodies like Strickland and Elias, who hopefully will be healthier and more effective this year. Could we see The Bear on the opening day roster? Suero was decent for us last year. The rotation spot loser of Ross/Fedde should be our long reliever. Keep in mind that by investing a billion dollars in the rotation, you're hoping to minimize how many times you need to rely on your bullpen for more than 3 inning in a given game. So a couple quality arms and then some fillers should be enough to get the job done. This bullpen was still a dumpster fire after acquiring Hudson. They had high 4s era in July and September and mid 5s in August. That's still solidly in the bottom third of the league (very close to worst). If you go into the season with Harris replacing Hudson, you may get a marginal upgrade (plus the increased availability of Elias, hopefully), but it's still only a marginal upgrade over a terrible bullpen. Modern day starters are not expected to be inning eaters no matter how much they get paid. The big 3 all hovered right at 6 innings per start (also only the second time in Stras' career when he threw more than 200 innings in a season). Plus Max will likely have to dial down the load some going forward. Sanchez averages a tic over 5 innings per start. Staying pat with a marginal upgrade over a terrible pen all to save 5-6 million for another pen help is incredibly myopic. In all likelihood, they will have to shell out (again) prospects for pen help midseason. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 if we know we're going to have to trade for bullpen help, now would be the time to do it as opposed to the deadline when the premium goes up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoodBits Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 3 hours ago, StillUnknown said: if we know we're going to have to trade for bullpen help, now would be the time to do it as opposed to the deadline when the premium goes up Didn't really cost us much last year. Majority of relievers are pretty volatile year to year, kind of makes sense to see if you can find someone undervalued (like Hudson) who can add a quality arm down the stretch. And who knows, maybe one or two of your guys have a great year and you don't need to add anyone. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) Let’s be honest about Hudson. Rizzo had no intentions of re-signing him last season & winning the WS isn’t going to change that. He’s not coming back. We upgraded with Harris and he’s our set up man. Edited January 3, 2020 by -JB- 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Nats still need to add at least one more good arm to then pen. If the Nats improved their horrid 5.66 bullpen ERA to league average, that is worth about 6.5 WAR, which is more than the difference between Rendon and Donaldson. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacon Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, -JB- said: Let’s be honest about Hudson. Rizzo had no intentions of re-signing him last season & winning the WS isn’t going to change that. He’s not coming back. We upgraded with Harris and he’s our set up man. Yeah, but with only Doolittle and a marginal improvement over Hudson our pen is still average at best. You need more than 2 reliable arms to survive a 162 game season. 3 can get you through a stretch run, as we know, but overworked arms start breaking down over time. Especially when your two best relievers are 33 and 35 years old. Who is our setup man when our setup man has pitched multiple games in a row? Who is our closer when he's been worked to death? The answers right now are not encouraging and hinge on hope. Edited January 3, 2020 by Bacon 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 hour ago, skinsfan_1215 said: Didn't really cost us much last year. Majority of relievers are pretty volatile year to year, kind of makes sense to see if you can find someone undervalued (like Hudson) who can add a quality arm down the stretch. And who knows, maybe one or two of your guys have a great year and you don't need to add anyone. It still cost us 15th, 21st, and 27th prospect in our system. Doing that year after year is how you end up with a depleted system. And even that only worked cause Hudson played above everyone's expectations. 1 hour ago, -JB- said: Let’s be honest about Hudson. Rizzo had no intentions of re-signing him last season & winning the WS isn’t going to change that. He’s not coming back. We upgraded with Harris and he’s our set up man. Apparently they offered him 2/10, so it seems they did want him back if the price was right. Given that Harris is here, it doesn't have to be Hudson, but they still need someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 (edited) Assuming donaldson signs here, i wonder what their plan is for kieboom Edited January 3, 2020 by StillUnknown 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StillUnknown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Apparently its a 2yr deal. Could be a sneaky good signing Although i hope this doesnt lead to Kieboom at third. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmirOfShmo Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, StillUnknown said: Apparently its a 2yr deal. Could be a sneaky good signing Although i hope this doesnt lead to Kieboom at third. Maybe it's leading to Kieboom to Cubs for Bryant? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, StillUnknown said: Apparently its a 2yr deal. Could be a sneaky good signing Although i hope this doesnt lead to Kieboom at third. I think the idea today (maybe not tomorrow) is Kieboom will be working a lot at 3B this spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 You could probably have Kieboom still as sky falls down back up plan for 3rd or give him an opportunity to win the job away from Castro. In which case, Castro would be the utility infielder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander -JB- Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 10 minutes ago, EmirOfShmo said: Maybe it's leading to Kieboom to Cubs for Bryant? 🤞 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRobi21 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Without looking up his numbers, he was always a tough out last year when we played MIA. iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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