goskins10 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 11 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: That was pretty much my point. I also chuckled at the idea that giving up 500 yards was the grand plan. I gather Gruden like myself, was thanking the man above for the turnovers. Of course the plan was never to give up 500 yds. We have a lot of young guys they were protecting. They also missed quite a few tackles - that ofcoruse was not in the game plan. But the plan was to not give up the 50 yd TDs and make Fitz go the length of the field on long drives. He will make a mistake. The fact that he did what they knew he would do - make some poor decisions at key spots - is not just luck. They forced those mistakes. That one fumble where Anderson punched the ball out was not just luck. The interception by Norman was a bad throw but he made a crazy catch. That was OBJ worthy. The int by Stroman was a solid DB play where he read the play and jumped the route. It's amazing how we are willing to give the other teams all kinds of credit for making great plays but when our team does it, well we just got lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 4 minutes ago, goskins10 said: It's amazing how we are willing to give the other teams all kinds of credit for making great plays but when our team does it, well we just got lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 9 minutes ago, Califan007 said: He was thanking the players themselves for the turnovers. Let's not act like the ball kept slipping out of the hands of Tampa players running free towards the end zone. I feel no desire to diminish what it took on the Skins players' parts to create those turnovers because it took a lot. My first statement about the whole deal was a credit to the players that made those plays. I should have reworded to avoid this type of response from you. Perhaps I should have said Gruden thanked the man above for those opportunities being presented to the players to capitalize on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said: My first statement about the whole deal was a credit to the players that made those plays. I should have reworded to avoid this type of response from you. Perhaps I should have said Gruden thanked the man above for those opportunities being presented to the players to capitalize on. No, we all know what you were doing, because you do it often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Man, you guys are riled up today. I sincerely apologize for not unequivocally stating in each and every response that the guys who made plays weren’t lucky, about anything other than Fitz being Fitz. 3 minutes ago, Califan007 said: No, we all know what you were doing, because you do it often. Go back and read my first post on the matter. This entire conversation revolves around me crediting the player not the scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Man, you guys are riled up today. I sincerely apologize for not unequivocally stating in each and every response that the guys who made plays weren’t lucky, about anything there than Fitz being Fitz. The we just got lucky thing is not necessarily just a you thing. In fairness - or unfairness you are just bearing the brunt of the frustration as it's the latest. I see so many times - again not saying just you - but so many times when we make a play - "we got lucky there!" As soon the other team makes the same ****ing play - wow what a great play - we suck!! I get really tired of that garbage. My way of saying sorry - your comment touched a nerve and I probably responded more harshly than was deserved. But I stand by the content of the comment, maybe just not the tone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 13 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Go back and read my first post on the matter. This entire conversation revolves around me crediting the player not the scheme. 1 So you were saying Gruden was thanking the man above for giving him players that could make the plays needed to win the game? (I don't really want to go back and read earlier posts lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Skins Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, goskins10 said: Last year many were calling for Kotwica's head. Glad cooler heads prevailed. I think I'd still rather have Brian Mitchell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 Just now, Reaper Skins said: I think I'd still rather have Brian Mitchell Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper Skins Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 3 minutes ago, Califan007 said: Why? Cuz I'm a dumb fan who leads with his heart instead of his head and it would be a cool storyline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 18 minutes ago, goskins10 said: The we just got lucky thing is not necessarily just a you thing. In fairness - or unfairness you are just bearing the brunt of the frustration as it's the latest. I see so many times - again not saying just you - but so many times when we make a play - "we got lucky there!" As soon the other team makes the same ****ing play - wow what a great play - we suck!! I get really tired of that garbage. My way of saying sorry - your comment touched a nerve and I probably responded more harshly than was deserved. But I stand by the content of the comment, maybe just not the tone. What gets me is, when players on other teams do it we hear 'Oh, look, a DB who actually held onto the ball"..."Our players would never be smart enough to punch the ball out like that".... "Why can't we have DBs who make acrobatic INTs like that?" When the Skins players DO make plays like that, it's "We were lucky the Bucs suck so much" lol.... 2 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said: Cuz I'm a dumb fan who leads with his heart instead of his head and it would be a cool storyline I appreciate the honesty one million percent lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Reaper Skins said: I think I'd still rather have Brian Mitchell Why, because he has a bigger mouth and talks a good game? Great players rarely make great coaches. 4 minutes ago, Reaper Skins said: Cuz I'm a dumb fan who leads with his heart instead of his head and it would be a cool storyline Lol Ok, fair enough. Honestly is the best policy. We fans are more than entitled to our irrational wants as long as we own them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: I give credit to the players making plays that were there to make moreso than I do the scheme. @Califan007 Not sure how that constitutes as saying they were lucky. My comment about Gruden was more about the fact that I'm sure he didn't feel comfortable giving up that kind of yardage and that everything was going to be okay. Fortunately our guys capitalized on mistakes. I don't see how that's taking anything away from them. As for "doing that all the time", yeah I'm totally known for talking about how "lucky" the Redskins are. I'm on record talking about how the Redskins rarely seem to get the bounces, pivotal calls, teams pooping the bed against them, etc. What you really meant is that I and many others consider Alex to be rather lucky that other contributors have helped carry his poor play. That I have said and is fair game. But to act like I constantly discredit other members of the team and consider them "lucky" with regularity is BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 26 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: @Califan007 Not sure how that constitutes as saying they were lucky. My comment about Gruden was more about the fact that I'm sure he didn't feel comfortable giving up that kind of yardage and that everything was going to be okay. Fortunately our guys capitalized on mistakes. I don't see how that's taking anything away from them. As for "doing that all the time", yeah I'm totally known for talking about how "lucky" the Redskins are. I'm on record talking about how the Redskins rarely seem to get the bounces, pivotal calls, teams pooping the bed against them, etc. What you really meant is that I and many others consider Alex to be rather lucky that other contributors have helped carry his poor play. That I have said and is fair game. But to act like I constantly discredit other members of the team and consider them "lucky" with regularity is BS. 1 Focusing on what I bolded: The Skins didn't capitalize on mistakes, they caused them. Only the first INT by Norman could be considered a mistake by the Bucs, but it took one hell of an effort to turn it into anything other than an incompletion. But the Anderson forced fumble--where was the Bucs mistake that he took advantage of? Anderson being alert and smart caused the fumble, not any "mistake" made by the Bucs. The Stroman INT...that was Stroman being alert, reading the route correctly, reading Fitz' eyes, maybe all three...probably all three...far more than it was a "mistake" that the Skins took advantage of. The last fumble...Smith used his speed and long-ass arms to (finally) get Fitz and throw him to the ground, and from what the commenters said Kerrigan knocked the football loose as Fitz was being sacked. I'm not sure what 'mistakes' on the Bucs part were there to take advantage of. If the Bucs let Smith through untouched, maybe, but that didn't even happen. So I'm not sure why our guys "capitalized on" mistakes instead of "forced" or "created" mistakes. And yes, it's more than mere semantics. As for my comment about what you do often, I wasn't talking about saying the Skins were "lucky"...that's just a subset. But in all honestly it's not that important to go into. Let's just say your screen name seems to play a role in how you talk about the team, and it's noticeable lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbird2 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, goskins10 said: Of course the plan was never to give up 500 yds. We have a lot of young guys they were protecting. They also missed quite a few tackles - that ofcoruse was not in the game plan. But the plan was to not give up the 50 yd TDs and make Fitz go the length of the field on long drives. He will make a mistake. The fact that he did what they knew he would do - make some poor decisions at key spots - is not just luck. They forced those mistakes. That one fumble where Anderson punched the ball out was not just luck. The interception by Norman was a bad throw but he made a crazy catch. That was OBJ worthy. The int by Stroman was a solid DB play where he read the play and jumped the route. It's amazing how we are willing to give the other teams all kinds of credit for making great plays but when our team does it, well we just got lucky. We got lucky that we have guys making amazing plays. Hat's off to the entire team. It really was a gritty, gutty W and the team showed up to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 12 minutes ago, Califan007 said: So I'm not sure why out guys "capitalized on" mistakes instead of "forced" or "created" mistakes. And yes, it's more than mere semantics. It really is semantics. You are looking for a reason to pick a fight about it because I said it. I'd venture a guess if one of the more positive folks here used the same language, you probably let it go. Just to be clear here, by no means was I insinuating that the Redskins defensive players that made plays were gifted anything. There were gifts provided by Fitz in the game, like when he tried to turn the corner for a TD, rather than diving for the first down and the first interception by Norman. Even with Norman, that was a pick he's had the propensity to drop in Washington, so not discounting that play either. By no means was I discounting the other plays made, particularly loved the Stroman and Anderson plays. That said, I'm sure Rodgers wasn't only devastated on the sideline because Anderson made a play, but because he allowed the play to be made by leaving the ball out there. We've been on the other end of that play more than enough times to know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePackisback Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 3 hours ago, bakedtater1 said: Yes thank you..my thoughts exactly.. good call man Please stop..for everything holy please.. nothing going on in Wisconsin ya gotta come here to this boring place.. cowboysfan Yep I enjoy it here. I promise you guys I hate Dallas too. They are enemies of us too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePackisback Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 I'm a diehard Packer fan. I get too emotionally invested in my team at times. We seem to be choke artists in big games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morneblade Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Califan007 said: What gets me is, when players on other teams do it we hear 'Oh, look, a DB who actually held onto the ball"..."Our players would never be smart enough to punch the ball out like that".... "Why can't we have DBs who make acrobatic INTs like that?" When the Skins players DO make plays like that, it's "We were lucky the Bucs suck so much" lol.... Because it happens rarely here, that's why. And that is to be expected, because for 20+ years, we've sucked. And the reason we've sucked is because we have not made plays very often. It stands to reason. So, when all of a sudden we much a punch of plays in one game, yeah....................it's very abnormal. Even, dare I say, lucky? Not only that, this has not even looked like a "good" football team. It's very flawed, and every win has looked bad offensively. We have yet to put together one complete game yet. I bet most teams felt like they were unlucky against us. I know Dallas does, I bet Tampa does as well as Carolina. I bet Green Bay does too. Fact of the matter is that outside of the Arizona game, offensively we've looked pretty bad, in a league geared around offense. So, it's not much of a stretch to think it's "luck". Now, I've already stated my thoughts on "luck" (hint, there really isn't any, outside of a ball bouncing funny) but when a team that has been bad for a couple decades, all of a sudden starts to win games, but look bad doing it? It's a easy statement to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Kev Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 2 hours ago, goskins10 said: It's amazing how we are willing to give the other teams all kinds of credit for making great plays but when our team does it, well we just got lucky. I wanted to post something similar, but you've absolutely nailed it in one sentence. Respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 I know for a fact that those that want to tar and feather me because they assumed I meant the team was lucky to get those turnovers, have made many “unlucky” claims over the years. That the other team was “lucky” for X reasons. We’ve been known to make the other team “lucky” on numerous occasions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PF Chang Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 2 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: @Califan007 Not sure how that constitutes as saying they were lucky. My comment about Gruden was more about the fact that I'm sure he didn't feel comfortable giving up that kind of yardage and that everything was going to be okay. Fortunately our guys capitalized on mistakes. I don't see how that's taking anything away from them. As for "doing that all the time", yeah I'm totally known for talking about how "lucky" the Redskins are. I'm on record talking about how the Redskins rarely seem to get the bounces, pivotal calls, teams pooping the bed against them, etc. What you really meant is that I and many others consider Alex to be rather lucky that other contributors have helped carry his poor play. That I have said and is fair game. But to act like I constantly discredit other members of the team and consider them "lucky" with regularity is BS. People are doing a great job of intentionally misinterpreting what you're saying. Nobody has ever had 500 yards of offense and only scored 3 points the way Tampa did on Sunday. Never happened until then. So yeah I think it's fair to call that lucky. Some of that was because we made great, timely plays to force turnovers. Other times - how often does a team lose 14 yards on a bad snap leading to a missed 48 yarder? How often does a kicker miss a 30 yarder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 2 minutes ago, PF Chang said: People are doing a great job of intentionally misinterpreting what you're saying. Nobody has ever had 500 yards of offense and only scored 3 points the way Tampa did on Sunday. Never happened until then. So yeah I think it's fair to call that lucky. Some of that was because we made great, timely plays to force turnovers. Other times - how often does a team lose 14 yards on a bad snap leading to a missed 48 yarder? How often does a kicker miss a 30 yarder? Or, the Redskins were just unlucky to give up so many yards despite executing a very good game plan. That's actually not that far a stretch. The missed tackles gave them at least 4 or 5 1st downs that they should not have had and at least 100 yds if not more that they should not have had. So is that us being unlucky with the missed tackles or them being lucky? It's neither. They made good plays to keep their feet moving and not going down. We made bad plays by not wrapping them up. But that is the same with the TOs. They made bad plays and we made good plays. There are some just lucky breaks. For example it would be fair to say Alex has been lucky with his fumbles as they all seem to stay right next to him or a teammate is there to get it. He should have had at least 2 or 3 more lost fumbles. 13 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: I know for a fact that those that want to tar and feather me because they assumed I meant the team was lucky to get those turnovers, have made many “unlucky” claims over the years. That the other team was “lucky” for X reasons. We’ve been known to make the other team “lucky” on numerous occasions. Absolutely right. I have said we were lucky in some cases and that the other team was lucky in some cases. It was not my point that there is never any luck involved, just that it seems luck is invoked way too often and quite a bit lopsided against our own team - but that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tay Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Morneblade said: Because it happens rarely here, that's why. And that is to be expected, because for 20+ years, we've sucked. And the reason we've sucked is because we have not made plays very often. It stands to reason. So, when all of a sudden we much a punch of plays in one game, yeah....................it's very abnormal. That's not true. We're actually top 10 in forced fumbles since 2015. That's one where we're relatively good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morneblade Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 41 minutes ago, Tay said: That's not true. We're actually top 10 in forced fumbles since 2015. That's one where we're relatively good. So, you pick one stat that has a 2 year trend to debunk 20+ years of bad teams? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.