Who should be Starting RB in 2018??? (Public Poll)

[CommDownMan]

I see things where Marshall/Bibbs are considered more 3rd down guys like CT.  While I get that thumpers generally are 1/2 down guys, but as long as we have capable blocking backs and can get 3-4ish yards on early downs, why not just use what we have and change the offense.  More CT or players with a similar skill set won't hurt this offense.  Then use Kelley/Perine in a less traditional role.

[Renegade7]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

The concept that Guice could be done seems crazy to me. Maybe if like Galette he suffers the same injury 2 camps in a row. 

I know I'm paranoid and he didn't have back to back ACL tears.  Having back to back years with injuries on the same knee, he's a running back, I don't think this as impossible as we all hope it is.  I absolutely want to be wrong, I don't think I am.

[Why am I Mr. Pink?]

Rob Kelley .... if nothing else just bc of ball security.

 

I can see the vision criticism and his lack of making defenders miss or getting extra yards but he is like a basic breakfast. Gets the yards the O line can block for him and does okay on ball security.

 

He is not a plus player but he is not a minus player either imo.

[Sandy Monk]

A healthy, starting OL will be more frequently opening up lanes like the one Perine ran through and then got hurt on. You have even close to a crease like that, and unspectacular RBs can get some good yards, even if 4-5 a clip. 

 

Everything that comes down to this offense being top 10 vs being middle of the pack... comes down to having the healthy OL. 

[Renegade7]

1 hour ago, OVCChairman said:

I'm sorry but I'm not ready to look for Guice's replacement yet.  For all we know, you're right, he may be done... but in that same breath, he may be fine.  We would have to give up quite a bit to get Bell or Coleman, and if we were to do that AND Guice was capable of coming back and being a starter, then we have a bigger problem on our hands.   We'd also have to give Bell or Coleman a big time contract extension, when we have 2 very big years of FA looming.... To lock up $10 mil to an RB because you're worried that our 2nd round rookie isn't going to recover from knee surgery would be irresponsible.  You'd be telling Guice you're done with him, and you can't even trade him til after year 3 if i'm not mistaken.... 

 

I'd gladly give up a 2nd if Atlanta comes to conclusion they can't pay both their running backs starter money or wait for off season and see if Bells asking price comes down.

 

This isn't about disrespecting Guice, Atlanta and New Orleans (and philly last year) have taken to the the next level what giants did to get their last two super bowls, they have basically two starting RBs so run game never skips a beat.  Unless we believe Guice can be Bell or Gurley it would be irresponsible asking him to be that coming knee injuries in back to back years in 2019.

 

Managing a football roster is not about sentimentality, it's about results.

[JSSkinz]

2 minutes ago, Sandy Monk said:

A healthy, starting OL will be more frequently opening up lanes like the one Perine ran through and then got hurt on. You have even close to a crease like that, and unspectacular RBs can get some good yards, even if 4-5 a clip. 

 

Everything that comes down to this offense being top 10 vs being middle of the pack... comes down to having the healthy OL. 

 

Right, that's why the Cowboys got Zeke with the 4th overall pick, the Eagles traded for Ajayi, and the Giants used the 2nd overall pick in the draft on Barkley.

[Renegade7]

If you want to be elite, get elite talent, it's not rocket science.

[Sandy Monk]

3 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

Right, that's why the Cowboys got Zeke with the 4th overall pick, the Eagles traded for Ajayi, and the Giants used the 2nd overall pick in the draft on Barkley.

 

Your sarcasm is noted. Still, there many backs that can get the job done, if the OL is excellent. If you have the luxury of getting a star RB to make the run game all the more potent? Hey, go for it. 

[OVCChairman]

5 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

I'd gladly give up a 2nd if Atlanta comes to conclusion they can't pay both their running backs starter money or wait for off season and see if Bells asking price comes down.

 

This isn't about disrespecting Guice, Atlanta and New Orleans (and philly last year) have taken to the the next level what giants did to get their last two super bowls, they have basically two starting RBs so run game never skips a beat.  Unless we believe Guice can be Bell or Gurley it would be irresponsible asking him to be that coming knee injuries in back to back years in 2019.

 

Managing a football roster is not about sentimentality, it's about results.

 

 

and the money you'd have to pay Coleman to sign him would tie up cap money we need in other areas... unless you think THIS team is good enough to give up a 2nd round pick to bring Coleman here THIS year and make a run at a superbowl.  I personally don't think we're at that point where Coleman is the missing piece to get us there.  

 

ME personally, I'd prefer not to give up a 2nd round pick on a 1 year rental for THIS team... we're not that close.  You're right, it's not about sentiment, it's about results, and this team has not shown me enough results to think were close enough.  If we're 5-1 and in command of the NFC East... Call Atlanta and upgrade the position... but lets be honest...

[JSSkinz]

4 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

I'd prefer not to give up a 2nd round pick

At best Atlanta will only get a 4th rd compensatory for him, why would anyone give up a 2nd for him?

 

Bottom line is Atlanta moves him or keeps him and gets a weak comp pick the following season.

[OVCChairman]

1 minute ago, JSSkinz said:

At best Atlanta will only get a 4th rd compensatory for him, why would anyone give up a 2nd for him?

 

Bottom line is Atlanta moves him or keeps him and gets a weak comp pick the following season.

 

 

Renegade suggested he would give up a 2nd rounder... i was responding to that statement.  

[JSSkinz]

Just now, OVCChairman said:

 

 

Renegade suggested he would give up a 2nd rounder... i was responding to that statement.  

My bad, didn't see that.

[Renegade7]

10 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

and the money you'd have to pay Coleman to sign him would tie up cap money we need in other areas... unless you think THIS team is good enough to give up a 2nd round pick to bring Coleman here THIS year and make a run at a superbowl.  I personally don't think we're at that point where Coleman is the missing piece to get us there.  

 

ME personally, I'd prefer not to give up a 2nd round pick on a 1 year rental for THIS team... we're not that close.  You're right, it's not about sentiment, it's about results, and this team has not shown me enough results to think were close enough.  If we're 5-1 and in command of the NFC East... Call Atlanta and upgrade the position... but lets be honest...

 

C'mon, man, don't think I'd propose that trade without making sure we extend him? Our whole convo has been about playing him with Guice but expecting more from Coleman.

 

I think we're better then I thought we were with WR depth, and Alex being 34 we have a window we can't waste or play around with.  Are we win now or not?  

 

It's not Tevin is gonna get Bell money.  Much around i love Crowder, I'd live with letting him walk to know I have a legit starting RB. We need that mire then a slot WR right now.

5 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

Renegade suggested he would give up a 2nd rounder... i was responding to that statement.  

Ya, I'm not an expert on NFL trade value, NFL never ceases to amaze me on that one.  That's my line and what I think we should draft with that 2nd rounder anyway, we may be able to get him for less, but sure that would get it done and be worth it.

[OVCChairman]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

C'mon, man, don't think I'd propose that trade without making sure we extend him? Our whole convo has been about playing him with Guice but expecting more from Coleman.

 

I think we're better then I thought we were with WR depth, and Alex being 34 we have a window we can't waste or play around with.  Are we win now or not?  

 

It's not Tevin is gonna get Bell money.  Much around i love Crowder, I'd live with letting him walk to know I have a legit starting RB. We need that mire then a slot WR right now.

 

 

I don't think it's that easy, as I don't think Coleman agrees to an extension knowing that he's coming here to do the same thing he did in ATL... be a secondary back.  If he wanted to do that, he would likely sign a deal with ATL... given their position and the fact that they have legit SB aspirations.  If he were to come here and sign a contract for <$ 4 mil a year, lets do it... but I don't think that's possible, and I don't think he would want to come here knowing Guice is the guy going forward.  He's going to get looks this offseason from teams willing to make him THE GUY... we likely arent...   

[Renegade7]

1 minute ago, OVCChairman said:

 

 

I don't think it's that easy, as I don't think Coleman agrees to an extension knowing that he's coming here to do the same thing he did in ATL... be a secondary back.  If he wanted to do that, he would likely sign a deal with ATL... given their position and the fact that they have legit SB aspirations.  If he were to come here and sign a contract for <$ 4 mil a year, lets do it... but I don't think that's possible, and I don't think he would want to come here knowing Guice is the guy going forward.  He's going to get looks this offseason from teams willing to make him THE GUY... we likely arent...   

 

Huh?  If anything with Guice not proving anything on this level in a game outside a sick spin move, Tevin's resume makes him the starter. 

 

I'll look to see if he wants to be a workhorse, but sounds more like he wants more money and deserves it, not that he's tired of sharing carries with Freeman.  Guice hasn't been here long enough to say he can't lose his starting job to injury, that doesn't mean I want to throw him in the trash. 

 

We can't have it both ways, we cant say we want to ease Guice in in 2019 and say we want him to be the workhorse back same year, that's going to backfire.

[OVCChairman]

11 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Huh?  If anything with Guice not proving anything on this level in a game outside a sick spin move, Tevin's resume makes him the starter. 

 

I'll look to see if he wants to be a workhorse, but sounds more like he wants more money and deserves it, not that he's tired of sharing carries with Freeman.  Guice hasn't been here long enough to say he can't lose his starting job to injury, that doesn't mean I want to throw him in the trash. 

 

We can't have it both ways, we cant say we want to ease Guice in in 2019 and say we want him to be the workhorse back same year, that's going to backfire.

 

OK but that would mean 2 consecutive years we've used a 2nd round pick with your plan... on a position that we can, for the majority of the time, only have 1 on the field at a time.  Guice has not PROVEN he'll be good enough, but he also hasn't PROVEN he wont.  You're predicting the worst, which I get, trust me I'm a Redskins fan... but at this point we have no reason to believe he won't return to being a good and productive back in the NFL.  

[JoggingGod]

1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

 

So this was the stuff I was reading when we drafted him: 

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/derrius-guice?id=32462018-0002-5601-017c-b2cb76f248b4

 

 

Like you and others have mentioned, playing the whole year on that grade 1 knee sprain probably was the ticking time bomb that went off with the ACL.  To me, that's two years in a row dealing with knee injuries.  Yes, I hope I'm wrong, I'm jus not optimistic at all, and a big part that is what I said and my total lack of faith in our training staff.

Disgusting?  We've had rhis discussion before, we're walking into a gun fight with a knife concerning our run game versus the other NFC powers.  If you can't resolve that cheaply, which we seem to be failing at miserably, we gotta pay for it.  Either way, needs be resolved.  I know it's $$$, but it's has to be resolved, otherwise were gonna stay outside looking in with a qb in his mid-30s

Bell is going to cost a high draft pick and $16 million. You don’t pay a stopgap RB that much.

[Renegade7]

2 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

OK but that would mean 2 consecutive years we've used a 2nd round pick with your plan... on a position that we can, for the majority of the time, only have 1 on the field at a time.  Guice has not PROVEN he'll be good enough, but he also hasn't PROVEN he wont.  You're predicting the worst, which I get, trust me I'm a Redskins fan... but at this point we have no reason to believe he won't return to being a good and productive back in the NFL.  

I mean, can't say this enough, a lot teams we have to deal with for wild card have two starting backs, going into 2018 we dont even have one. 

 

Having two backs is jus smart to me these days given they get injuried often and we are hoping for best with Guice. 

 

I can't get down with the whole one back on the field thing, because that's like saying having CT is good enough while he can play in the slot (not to mention gets hurt too).

 

I'll try to ignore my gut on Guice, in the middle he's a peice of the puzzle that will be our backfield, but never a Bell, Gurley, Lynch type.  Say I'm right and we stayed pat anyway, we're having this exact same convo this time next year and Alex is then 35. Worth the risk? I don't think so.

[Malapropismic Depository]

Didn't that 33-yard run by Carter, look almost exactly like the 34-yarder by Guice ?

[Renegade7]

9 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

Bell is going to cost a high draft pick and $16 million. You don’t pay a stopgap RB that much.

He's not getting franchised next year, so no pick, and you must think I'm psycho trade for a one year rental on Bell.  Do I need to put a disclaimer that we should not trade for someone in a contract year unless they agree to an extension first?  I feel like I'm being accused of stupidity everytime I see this posted.

[OVCChairman]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

He's not getting franchised next year, so no pick, and you must think I'm psycho trade for a one year rental on Bell.  Do I need to put a disclaimer that we should not trade for someone in a contract year unless they agree to an extension first?  I feel like I'm being accused of stupidity everytime I see this posted.

 

 

The reason you're up against this, is because the rest of us have Guice locked in as our RB of the future.. We're not willing to consider that his time as a starting RB in Washington is done.  We don't agree with your assessment that we need to replace him yet.  You're seeing it that we need to get the RB of the future.  We're seeing it that we HAVE the RB of the future until we're proven wrong.  We're talking from 2 different positions here bud.  

[Morneblade]

2 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

So this was the stuff I was reading when we drafted him: 

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/derrius-guice?id=32462018-0002-5601-017c-b2cb76f248b4

 

 

Like you and others have mentioned, playing the whole year on that grade 1 knee sprain probably was the ticking time bomb that went off with the ACL.  To me, that's two years in a row dealing with knee injuries.  Yes, I hope I'm wrong, I'm jus not optimistic at all, and a big part that is what I said and my total lack of faith in our training staff.

 

 

Ok, thanks for clarifying your position.

 

I'll go back to what I said earlier. If his injury at LSU was a ticking time bomb, better it go off now, and have one of the best fix it, than going off later in his career where the chances of a 100% recover go down. He's very young, this should not be a big deal.

 

I get what you're saying about the training staff, but I think the bigger issue there is the facilities and to be honest, lack of player awareness. Seems our players don't do as much in the preventative care category as they should, if you believe the rumors. Maybe some of that does go back on the staff, but they players have to be accountable. And then there is Dan, who doesn't spend on stuff like this until he's made to.

[Renegade7]

3 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

  We're talking from 2 different positions here bud.  

I know.  I also know one us is wrong and the risks that come with it.

[OVCChairman]

Just now, Renegade7 said:

I know.  I also know one us is wrong and the risks that come with it.

 

In YOUR opinion... sure.. But there's no way to know WHO is wrong yet.  You're allowed to have an opinion, and people are allowed to disagree with it.. 

[Renegade7]

2 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

 

In YOUR opinion... sure.. But there's no way to know WHO is wrong yet.  You're allowed to have an opinion, and people are allowed to disagree with it.. 

Never said people werent, thought we were having a healthy discussion here. I work in IT, so I belive in this thing called preventative maintainence.  Say I'm wrong on Guice but we have another guy anyway, that puts on level and in some cases better then teams we are competing with.  If I'm right on Guice, we're safe. Win win.