visionary Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted September 23, 2018 Share Posted September 23, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted September 24, 2018 Share Posted September 24, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanboyOf91 Posted September 24, 2018 Share Posted September 24, 2018 Pretty much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busch1724 Posted September 24, 2018 Share Posted September 24, 2018 Don't know that he's that smart. He's been consistent over the years about tariffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted September 26, 2018 Share Posted September 26, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo-toni Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Screw them, and screw all those "real 'muricans" who voted for this assclown "cuz he tells it like it is" and are now being ****slapped by his stupid policies. Here's to schadenfreude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Anyone smart enough to know if this is a good deal or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 1 hour ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Anyone smart enough to know if this is a good deal or not? I seriously doubt it does all that Trump says it will. My guess on the margins some things might be better but overall there probably won't be a big difference. Probably, just adjusting some flaws with NAFTA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 1 hour ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Anyone smart enough to know if this is a good deal or not? Way too early to know the impacts cause we don't know actual details. We know that two areas changed to some degree from NAFTA but not much more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 2 hours ago, TheGreatBuzz said: Anyone smart enough to know if this is a good deal or not? I think trade agreements are like NFL draft picks. You need a few years to get a good feel for it's impact. Wapo article has a good overview on what's changing compared to NAFTA https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2018/10/01/us-canada-mexico-just-reached-sweeping-new-nafta-deal-heres-whats-it/?utm_term=.b9c25b7b99ad Hot take would be nothing earth shattering for any country. US got dairy concession. Auto seems like a reasonable tradeoff among the three countries (no tariff for Canada and Mexico parts, but must provide higher wages), but you wonder about competitiveness of NA manufacturered cars overseas. Then again, you probably have those cars locally made near those markets anyway. Concessions on dispute resolution could have long term consequences. US corporations have typically used those procedures to their advantage in trade agreements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 23 minutes ago, bearrock said: Wapo article has a good overview on what's changing compared to NAFTA https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2018/10/01/us-canada-mexico-just-reached-sweeping-new-nafta-deal-heres-whats-it/?utm_term=.b9c25b7b99ad That actually sounds like a pretty good deal. And lots of things that I would never have expected a Republican administration to sign off on. (Environmental regulations? Easier unionization?) At least based on that one article, I wouldn't have a problem voting to ratify it. (Meaning I could see the R's opposing it in large numbers.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearrock Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 4 minutes ago, Larry said: That actually sounds like a pretty good deal. And lots of things that I would never have expected a Republican administration to sign off on. (Environmental regulations? Easier unionization?) At least based on that one article, I wouldn't have a problem voting to ratify it. (Meaning I could see the R's opposing it in large numbers.) I think there's at least two reasons for it. One is to increase the cost of production in Mexico to decrease Mexican competitiveness compared to US and Canada. The other is to make it politically palatable to US Labor. I don't think GOP would object to more strigent conditions overseas. All in all, I think it's a reasonable deal. No major winners, no major losers. On paper at least. How a trade agreement should be, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 1 minute ago, bearrock said: I think there's at least two reasons for it. One is to increase the cost of production in Mexico to decrease Mexican competitiveness compared to US and Canada. The other is to make it politically palatable to US Labor. I don't think GOP would object to more strigent conditions overseas. I actually proposed something similar, back when NAFTA was rolled out, although for a different reason. My motivation was to see to it that NAFTA improved the economy of Mexico. I wanted to make sure that the factories which I foresaw moving there, actually "trickled down" to Mexican workers. My suggestion was that I thought Mexico should immediately impose a minimum wage. Nothing high. I proposed a dollar an hour. Something low enough to make it desirable for businesses to move there, but high enough to see to it that the workers got something out of it. And I will assert that it's to the US advantage for Mexican workers to make more money. For one thing, it reduces the incentive to become illegal immigrants in the US. And it can help make Mexicans into better consumers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 1 hour ago, bearrock said: I think trade agreements are like NFL draft picks. You need a few years to get a good feel for it's impact. Wapo article has a good overview on what's changing compared to NAFTA https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2018/10/01/us-canada-mexico-just-reached-sweeping-new-nafta-deal-heres-whats-it/?utm_term=.b9c25b7b99ad Hot take would be nothing earth shattering for any country. US got dairy concession. Auto seems like a reasonable tradeoff among the three countries (no tariff for Canada and Mexico parts, but must provide higher wages), but you wonder about competitiveness of NA manufacturered cars overseas. Then again, you probably have those cars locally made near those markets anyway. Concessions on dispute resolution could have long term consequences. US corporations have typically used those procedures to their advantage in trade agreements. Based on that article, nothing earth shattering. Actually, Mexican auto workers benefit; since they will get paid more. I don't get the feeling this is going to create alot of American jobs; which is one of the main reasons Trump is engaging in his trade wars. If it passes though, it will be a win for Trump.. Thing is, that's a big if. 3 countries and their legislatures have to pass it and there's no guarantee they do. Whatever the impact of this new deal; won't be felt until after 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 From what I've read, I think everything is generally ok. I doubt it has any major ramifications in anyone's life, except possibly dairy farmers. I wonder if there's a chance that the cost of milk goes up if we're suddenly in a much bigger market. I do think these agreements generally reflect Trump's total 18th century view of trade. He just doesn't understand it on a fundamental level, because he only sees it from the employment. I mean, everything in manufacturing is driven by production costs. To me, it's pretty easy to get to that $16 an hour number. If you have three employees making $11, you fire one, give the other two a raise to $16, and implement automation that allows you fire one of the two remaining. Trump really thinks that steel mills which employee 15,000 people can come back if he just wills it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 (edited) Edited October 1, 2018 by visionary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 The GOP won't cross Trump on this, since they fear the Trump voters. OF course the Dems are more favorable to it, since it's more in line with their positions on trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 3 hours ago, Larry said: That actually sounds like a pretty good deal. And lots of things that I would never have expected a Republican administration to sign off on. (Environmental regulations? Easier unionization?) Its not surprising to me. It’s been the discussion for years in the conservative circles I’ve followed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 (edited) Edited October 2, 2018 by visionary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 33 minutes ago, visionary said: What did Fox & Friends say about it? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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