Will Cousins Play For The Skins In 2018

[XtremeFan55]

48 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

 

That can't be Dan!  Are you serious??  OMG.  We are officially screwed.  Looked like an Junior High School kid...and not a cool one either...  This image is forever burned into my brain.  Time to find a new team for me.  No hope. Run..Cousins...run far away....!

[Taylor 36]

1 minute ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

Think about this, brother, what you're saying here is actually a case against Snyder, not for him. 

 

Lavar and Portis? Both ended up being issues for their coaches. Both were insubordinate and corrupted the organizational hierarchy necessary for any success.

 

I wasn't surprised to read this recently: 

 

 http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/washington-redskins/ex-player-makes-quite-comparison-between-patriots-and-redskins-2016-book

 

We even got to hear Portis last month talk about he and Moss taking shots before the game and Zorn having a problem with that which created an issue in the locker room. He actually said that without batting an eyelid.  

 

Snyder enables this. RG3 was just another one in a pattern of this awful behavior. 

 

This is what occurs beneath the surface that we have no idea about until it comes out or blows up... yet, all along, we're trashing the staff, coaches and other players who are essentially stuck trying to overcome this bs while being constantly undermined. It seems like it's a small thing on the surface and on a micro level, too. But it's not at all. In each instance the consequences are disastrous and create factions/divisions within what is supposed to be an unified organization. Even if those divisions start small, they snowball into avalanches of ego where each side is trying to destroy the other - only to destroy any chances they had at success in the process.

 

This isn't even getting into Dan's hiring process (or lack thereof) that continuously leaves the organization in bad hands at an executive level and personnel-level, which is really the biggest problem there is and limits the ability for anyone to succeed there.   

I understand what you are saying.  The point I was trying to make, which I obviously didn't do so well, is that Snyder has been friends with players before but that didn't interfere with contract negotiations with other players.  I definitely wasn't saying that it was fine or good that he was friends with players, just showing that the RGIII bowling night wasn't an isolated event to just that one player.  It is definitely an indictment on Snyder and his undermining of coaches, but I don't see it as an indictment on Snyder's involvement or handling the Kirk situation. I hope that makes sense?!?!?

[TSO]

10 minutes ago, Taylor 36 said:

I understand what you are saying.  The point I was trying to make, which I obviously didn't do so well, is that Snyder has been friends with players before but that didn't interfere with contract negotiations with other players.  I definitely wasn't saying that it was fine or good that he was friends with players, just showing that the RGIII bowling night wasn't an isolated event to just that one player.  It is definitely an indictment on Snyder and his undermining of coaches, but I don't see it as an indictment on Snyder's involvement or handling the Kirk situation. I hope that makes sense?!?!?

 

Makes sense, but I'm not sure that distinction really matters in the end. Or is even fair to make. For instance, there are plenty of reports out there that one of Kirk's major hesitations regarding this FO is what he saw regarding RG3's treatment compared to his. Anyone putting themselves in his shoes would acknowledge that as a legitimate factor. If you worked somewhere, did a better job than another guy, but that guy was treated like royalty whereas you're questioned every step of the way by those at the highest levels, even though your nearest superiors praise you and elevate you over the other guy, and that filtered into how they've approached paying you for years straight... how would that make you feel about things there? 

 

It's definitely a nuanced situation. You'll like your peers and your nearest superiors, appreciate their support, but there's no way you're going to be fond of those at the top. And those at the top should mean more as they've got the ultimate say in everything.  

 

So it can absolutely be seen as an indictment on Snyder. 

[XtremeFan55]

There is so much wrong with that video of Snyder bowling with RG3 that I don't even know where to begin.  You can't have any kind of authoritative structure when your owner who is the top leader behaves like this with select players.  Everything fits now.  All the rumors and stories fit and that video is worth way more than a thousand words.  If someone hasn't learned to grow up and lead by the age of 50, they never will.  I am serious now.  I am through with this team.  I like Cousins and will be tempted to follow the team he ends up at other than here.  Hopefully Denver.  If not I am going to be a 49ers fan since they appear to be on the threshold of the next group of up and coming teams.  I will shut the door on the way out....

[Skinsinparadise]

11 minutes ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

Makes sense, but I'm not sure that distinction really matters in the end. Or is even fair to make. For instance, there are plenty of reports out there that one of Kirk's major hesitations regarding this FO is what he saw regarding RG3's treatment compared to his.

 

Yeah this seems to be part of the soup in the narratives.  We got the story about the Browns game.  RG3 got a 16 million extension coming off of a bad season.  Kirk coming off of a good year was initially given a 12 million dollar offer.  They upped it eventually.  But the team didn't even respond to Kirk's agent's counter offer.  Can you imagine Dan acting the same way with his bowling buddy?  

 

I can totally see a scenario where Kirk talked to Dan and Dan said look I hire Bruce and Schaffer to take care of these things for me.  I have to trust them to do their job without interference.   But for Kirk he knows (because he's seen Dan first hand dote on the players he loves) that Dan can interfere if he really really wants to get a deal done.

 

Personally, I do think Bruce is mucking this up without Dan's interference.  However, if I thought Dan really wanted Kirk badly he would indeed interfere.

[Taylor 36]

21 minutes ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

Makes sense, but I'm not sure that distinction really matters in the end. Or is even fair to make. For instance, there are plenty of reports out there that one of Kirk's major hesitations regarding this FO is what he saw regarding RG3's treatment compared to his. Anyone putting themselves in his shoes would acknowledge that as a legitimate factor. If you worked somewhere, did a better job than another guy, but that guy was treated like royalty whereas you're questioned every step of the way by those at the highest levels, even though your nearest superiors praise you and elevate you over the other guy, and that filtered into how they've approached paying you for years straight... how would that make you feel about things there? 

 

It's definitely a nuanced situation. You'll like your peers and your nearest superiors, appreciate their support, but there's no way you're going to be fond of those at the top. And those at the top should mean more as they've got the ultimate say in everything.  

 

So it can absolutely be seen as an indictment on Snyder. 

What you're saying makes sense, and I completely understand where you're coming from.  I am just of the opinion that Allen is overwhelmingly vastly responsible for the mess we are in with Kirk.  I think that Dan has sat back and let Allen do his job (though Allen doesn't do his job well, but that's for another thread).  I honestly believe if all things were to be the same with the exception of Bruce Allen not being here and anyone else, including old bugeyes Vinny, the deal would have been done last offseason and this thread wouldn't exist.  

[purbeast]

2 hours ago, goskins10 said:

I just wish as my dad used to say - **** or get off the pot!!  Stoop this dangling and drama. Sign him or move on. I prefer they sign him to  LTD but another tag would be beyond stupid, of course unless Kirk forces their hand. And he may, especially if Bruce wants to start with another lame offer like last years feeble attempt. Next 2 months or so will tell a lot about this franchise and it's direction.

 

 

For me, it's more like the next 2 weeks after tomorrow's game.  If they don't sign him to an LTD right after the season ends, in my eyes, it's not happening.  There is literally absolutely no logical reason to drag the negotiations out, and if you sign him (or at least try) immediately, then he knows he is wanted here.  If it makes it past a few weeks, they will probably tag him and it'll either be the biggest $34 million mistake they've ever made for a 1 year rental, or he'll be gone to a better team.  Either way, if no deal is done quickly, in my mind we have at most 1 more year with him then we're back to the doldrums of hell.

[TSO]

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Personally, I do think Bruce is mucking this up without Dan's interference.  However, if I thought Dan really wanted Kirk badly he would indeed interfere.

 

Yeah, it's definitely nuanced. That's the key word and why I will always stand by discussion boards versus twitter or other social media outlets: nuance. 

 

I agree with every word you said and find no contradiction with what I see regarding Dan. It's all true even if, at first glance, it may come off as contradictory. Good leadership entails elevating those around you, enabling them to achieve more than they would otherwise, but also knowing when to step in and steer them to the right direction when they've gone astray. I'm not sure Dan does any of those things and Allen is just another major part of that. Also goes back to Dan's hiring process that I mentioned. 

 

2 minutes ago, Taylor 36 said:

What you're saying makes sense, and I completely understand where you're coming from.  I am just of the opinion that Allen is overwhelmingly vastly responsible for the mess we are in with Kirk.  I think that Dan has sat back and let Allen do his job (though Allen doesn't do his job well, but that's for another thread).  I honestly believe if all things were to be the same with the exception of Bruce Allen not being here and anyone else, including old bugeyes Vinny, the deal would have been done last offseason and this thread wouldn't exist.  

 

I agree with this, and see above why there's no contradiction.

 

Allen is absolutely the guy spearheading this bs, but Dan is ultimately responsible and in a direct way because Allen is not only his hire, but also because there is no in-between there. This is not some low-level janitor at Redskins Park failing to clean the facilities up well where it'd be ridiculous to trash Dan for, even though he's ultimately responsible. There's a ton of people between Dan and that janitor in the chain of command and organizational hierarchy there. First one we should look at is which assistant or secretary hired said janitor. Heck, maybe they were given too limited of an allowed salary for hiring said janitor, which caused them to hire a poor one, so who gave them that limit and why? Now we're getting closer to Dan's station, lol.   

 

With Allen, however, there isn't anyone above him other than Snyder. Snyder is directly responsible for every single move Allen makes. You could argue that's even Dan's main responsibility as owner, to hire the best possible candidate to be his top executive and to then ensure his top executive is handling things properly. 

[goskins10]

10 minutes ago, purbeast said:

For me, it's more like the next 2 weeks after tomorrow's game.  If they don't sign him to an LTD right after the season ends, in my eyes, it's not happening.  There is literally absolutely no logical reason to drag the negotiations out, and if you sign him (or at least try) immediately, then he knows he is wanted here.  If it makes it past a few weeks, they will probably tag him and it'll either be the biggest $34 million mistake they've ever made for a 1 year rental, or he'll be gone to a better team.  Either way, if no deal is done quickly, in my mind we have at most 1 more year with him then we're back to the doldrums of hell.

 

Let me start with saying I agree they need to get a deal done and not give him any kind of tag. If they end up tagging him it's very unlikely it will end with Kirk signing a LTD.

 

Having said that, I don't think they can start negotiating with him until the league season is over. But even if they can, the important date is March 6th, the last day to apply the tag to a player. That's why I said 2 months. 

 

 

[purbeast]

2 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

Let me start with saying I agree they need to get a deal done and not give him any kind of tag. If they end up tagging him it's very unlikely it will end with Kirk signing a LTD.

 

Having said that, I don't think they can start negotiating with him until the league season is over. But even if they can, the important date is March 6th, the last day to apply the tag to a player. That's why I said 2 months. 

 

 

Oh I was under the assumption that as soon as their season is over they could start negotiating.

 

If they drag it out anywhere close to March 6th then IMO no LTD will had.  Again, there's just no reason to drag this out.  I'm open to hearing a valid reason to drag it out, but I have yet to hear one and have yet to be able to think of a logical reason to drag it out.

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

I agree with every word you said and find no contradiction with what I see regarding Dan. It's all true even if, at first glance, it may come off as contradictory. Good leadership entails elevating those around you, enabling them to achieve more than they would otherwise, but also knowing when to step in and steer them to the right direction when they've gone astray. I'm not sure Dan does any of those things and Allen is just another major part of that. Also goes back to Dan's hiring process that I mentioned. 

 

The problem also with Dan when he fraternizes like buddies with his favorite players whether its hanging out in Vegas with Portis, bowling with RG3, Arrington, etc is he sets himself up as a guy who is willing to give preferential treatment when it floats his boat.    So it makes the negotiation process with his players nonlinear from the start -- especially with the bigger names on the squad who can give an apples to apples comparison to what they've seen to their own situation. 

 

So for example Dan can't argue to Kirk that hey that's just how I roll -- I am pure business with my players and I have to be clinical about it no matter how much I dig you -- since Kirk knows its not true. He doesn't have to guess its not true.  He's seen that its not true.

 

Heck as for Kirk's predecessor, it was clear that Dan went as far as firing his head coach on his behalf.  And we got Jay and Scot having to plea with Dan to let Kirk start in 2015.  And other narratives like Dan didn't hire AJ Smith because he disagreed with Dan's take on the QBs in the fold.   And that Scot pushed Bruce-Dan to sign Kirk in 2015 and was brushed off.   There is the story that part of the soup that got Scot fired involved disagreement about Kirk.  The stories about Jay standing at the table for Kirk behind the scenes on the contract but to no avail.  The Doug comment about Kirk not being a top 10 guy.   The mean spirited press release in July.  And there is much more gossip-reports than just that. 

 

That's a lot of crap for Kirk to digest about the FO.  And somehow he's supposed to say you know Bruce-Dan you are right I deserve a below market deal from you guys -- you've made a compelling case that I don't deserve Carr, Stafford type of money, etc.   For you guys anything! 

 

 

[RemoveSnyder]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-heres-what-it-will-cost-redskins-to-get-kirk-cousins-deal-done/

 

Joel Corry is a former sports agent 

the Redskins are prohibited from signing Cousins -- who was designated as a franchise player for a second straight year -- to a multiyear deal until the end of the 2017 regular season on Dec. 31.

 

 

[RemoveSnyder]

https://nflcommunications.com/Documents/2017 Offseason/06 20 17 - Important Dates.pdf

 

February 20             --  First day for clubs to designate Franchise or Transition Players.

Feb 27-- March 5    --  Combine Timing and Testing, Lucas Oil Stadium, Indianapolis, Indiana.

March 6                   --  Prior to 4:00 p.m., New York time, deadline for clubs to designate Franchise or Transition Players.

[goskins10]

27 minutes ago, purbeast said:

Oh I was under the assumption that as soon as their season is over they could start negotiating.

 

If they drag it out anywhere close to March 6th then IMO no LTD will had.  Again, there's just no reason to drag this out.  I'm open to hearing a valid reason to drag it out, but I have yet to hear one and have yet to be able to think of a logical reason to drag it out.

 

Again, i am in total agreement with you on what they should do. If it were me, ignoring that I would not let it get this far, I would hit Kirk with a really really solid offer the first day they can negotiate, whatever day that is. But not sure Bruce's ego will let him do that. 

12 minutes ago, Monk4thaHALL said:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-heres-what-it-will-cost-redskins-to-get-kirk-cousins-deal-done/

 

Joel Corry is a former sports agent 

the Redskins are prohibited from signing Cousins -- who was designated as a franchise player for a second straight year -- to a multiyear deal until the end of the 2017 regular season on Dec. 31.

 

 

 

 

Thanks. Wasn't sure if it was the end of reg season or end of NFL season. Either way, my 2 month comment (which has now gotten way too much attention  :-) , was that they have until March 6th before they have to tag or sign him or let him go in free agency. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

This is on point to a lot of discussion here -- what extends to the HC also IMO extends to the QB.

 

Andy Benoit‏Verified account @Andy_Benoi48m48 minutes ago

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If an NFL owner isn't willing to endure a few 7-9 type seasons, there's not much hope for his franchise. Difference between average and great in NFL is razor thin. Constant coaching changes don't get teams over any hump.

14 replies22 retweets68 likes

 

 

 

 

 

On twitter, I presume USA today running a story on this on their blog when done?  Right now, 95% Kirk  5% Bruce

 

Diane Chesebrough‏ @DiChesebrough

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If you could ONLY keep one: either QB Kirk Cousins or team President Bruce Allen; which would it be? #Redskins

 

[bobandweave]

23 hours ago, BurgundyBooger said:

 

Except a Super Bowl ring.

 

Cant buy those but give him his due, everyone knows he’s tried to

[bobandweave]

15 hours ago, petedaddy said:

Darnold trying his best to lower his draft stock enough so we can pick him.   Then we can have two years of hope/excitement before he flames out and we can start over again

 

Went to the game last night. Was really excited to see him play. He wasn’t helped by his receivers dropping all the passes they did but he was a turnover machine last night. Fumbles, pick 6, other bad mistakes.

 

I sat next to mostly Ohio State fans but one guy who had come to support USC said after the second half started

 

”we have a chance (USC was down 3 scores) Darnold hasn’t turned the ball over this half”

 

Two plays later they turned it over again and that was all she wrote. Now as my first impression of the guy was expecting a whole lot more out of him then what I saw. Didn’t come away impressed at all and think his draft stock takes a massive hit because of last nights game

[Veryoldschool]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

However, if I thought Dan really wanted Kirk badly he would indeed interfere.

 

 

1.  Dan doesn't really believe in Cousins and therefore doesn't want to pay him.

2.  Cousins doesn't believe in Dan and because of that doesn't want to be here.

3.  Combination of both.

 

It doesn't matter why it doesn't get done I am blaming Snyder.  If Snyder doesn't understand Cousins is a top 5-10 level talent and he should pay him as such it is Snyder's fault.  If Snyder and Allen have been so irritating to Cousins because of RGIII, contracts or other reasons that Cousins doesn't want to stay it is Snyder's fault.

 

Any sensible employer treasures highly talented, superior performing, workaholic employees and if that employee is also charming, gracious and unfailingly positive and supportive they value them even more.  Cousins is all of those things and more.  I am sure every other owner would not only extend Cousins but would relish the fact that such a winsome young man was going to be the face of the franchise for another decade.   

 

Somehow Snyder doesn't feel that way about Cousins.  I have my theory and you have yours but no matter the reason why Snyder doesn't treasure Cousins and his failure to make Cousins feel treasured and extended by the Skins maybe be the biggest sports owner mistake since Ruth was traded.  I am sure there has been another incredibly stupid ownership play in the years since the Ruth trade, I just can't of one as dumb as Synder losing Cousins.

 

I hope I am shocked and Snyder secures Cousins on a LTD but if Snyder fails in that I hope he lets Cousins go free.  I don't want to see Snyder hold Kirk's career hostage by either the franchise tag or transition tag.  Twice is more than enough, it is time to set him free.

 

 

[bobandweave]

3 hours ago, purbeast said:

Oh I was under the assumption that as soon as their season is over they could start negotiating.

 

If they drag it out anywhere close to March 6th then IMO no LTD will had.  Again, there's just no reason to drag this out.  I'm open to hearing a valid reason to drag it out, but I have yet to hear one and have yet to be able to think of a logical reason to drag it out.

 

Playing the devils advocate here so don’t get angry about what I’m saying but I will give you a couple of reasons to drag this out from the different sides I see

 

Cousins dragging this out is great for him and much better then just signing a long term deal right now. Which is one of the primary reasons why it hasn’t happened yet.

 

We all know that Kirk wants to be courted. He has expressed his feeling of seeing how the red carpet was rolled out for Griffin and not for him. The longer this goes the more attention he gets from the media, and the more important he looks to the league overall. The added attention gives him the courting he desires. 

 

And the longer this goes the more money he gets in his pocket. 44 million over the past two seasons is incredible. He probably wouldn’t have gotten that if he signed a LTD either season. He openly admits that in the interviews I’ve heard, his agents job is to get him the most money possible and he’s done a great job of that. The possibility that they tag him a third time and he gets another 30+ on top screams financially while he gives up the security of knowing where he will be in three years it’s still the best move financially to be doing

 

Now on the teams side of dragging this out that does a couple of things for them too. For one the media is engaged with the team over this and some believe any media attention good or bad is good since it sells. The teams always being discussed more the longer this goes. 

 

Another thing that helps the team I think they believe about dragging this out for them is that they are banking on one team offering up more for Kirk the closer this gets to finalization. The better he plays the more teams desperate for a QB may give for him. He’s shown the longer this goes how he’s not a flash in the pan player. Last draft they were reported to have been offered a second, third, and fourth round pick for him. Maybe this year they get offered more? This years offer was more then the previous years offers so he’s done nothing to make an offer worse this season. 

 

In the end Kirk decides if he wants to be here long term not the team. But I can see a case for dragging this out for both sides

[purbeast]

1 minute ago, bobandweave said:

 

Playing the devils advocate here so don’t get angry about what I’m saying but I will give you a couple of reasons to drag this out from the different sides I see

 

Cousins dragging this out is great for him and much better then just signing a long term deal right now. Which is one of the primary reasons why it hasn’t happened yet.

 

We all know that Kirk wants to be courted. He has expressed his feeling of seeing how the red carpet was rolled out for Griffin and not for him. The longer this goes the more attention he gets from the media, and the more important he looks to the league overall. The added attention gives him the courting he desires. 

 

And the longer this goes the more money he gets in his pocket. 44 million over the past two seasons is incredible. He probably wouldn’t have gotten that if he signed a LTD either season. He openly admits that in the interviews I’ve heard, his agents job is to get him the most money possible and he’s done a great job of that. The possibility that they tag him a third time and he gets another 30+ on top screams financially while he gives up the security of knowing where he will be in three years it’s still the best move financially to be doing

 

Now on the teams side of dragging this out that does a couple of things for them too. For one the media is engaged with the team over this and some believe any media attention good or bad is good since it sells. The teams always being discussed more the longer this goes. 

 

Another thing that helps the team I think they believe about dragging this out for them is that they are banking on one team offering up more for Kirk the closer this gets to finalization. The better he plays the more teams desperate for a QB may give for him. He’s shown the longer this goes how he’s not a flash in the pan player. Last draft they were reported to have been offered a second, third, and fourth round pick for him. Maybe this year they get offered more? This years offer was more then the previous years offers so he’s done nothing to make an offer worse this season. 

 

In the end Kirk decides if he wants to be here long term not the team. But I can see a case for dragging this out for both sides

I get why Kirk would drag it out, he's not dumb.  Which is why the team needs to make him an offer he can't refuse ASAP.

 

As for the team dragging it out, I don't buy the first reason.  No matter what happens, KC is going to be talked about BIG time over the off season.  If they "overpay" him immediately, that will be talked about for months and there will be people defending both sides if it was worth/not worth it like their lives depend on it, just like they do now.

 

As for it making them get more from another team, what benefit does that give them?  They give up KC and have no QB - now what?  Take a gamble in the draft with a rookie from a high pick?  Because that's worked out so well for them in the past?  Roll with McCoy who can't even throw the ball 30 yards?  There really is no benefit in them letting KC get away in any way shape or form.  It leaves them QB-less once again, and that hasn't worked out for them the past 2+ decades, and it's not going to work out for them now. 

 

f he leaves, it sets such a terrible precedent for this team saying "hey we don't take care of our own, but you should want to come here!".  No serious coach or player will want to come here and play here.  And it also will basically let some vets on the team know that they don't care about getting things done now, and players like Kerrigan and Williams who are in the prime are going to be playing on a team that won't even have a chance any time in the near future. 

[skinzplay]

I usually agree with Keim on basically everything, and I'm with him when he says that he views Cousins as being among the top 10-15 QBs in the league, no higher. But the problem for us is that there is no guarantee that, if he walks, we can even find a QB who's top 20-25. We have no running game whatsoever, and I'm not convinced we ever will in Gruden's offense. One approach would be to invest heavily in that defense (it's a young, talented unit) and get a sturdy, every-down back. We wouldn't need a powerball contract QB, just a game manager. I love seeing seasons of 4,000+ passing yards, but I'd readily take a playoff win and half as many yards. Run the dangnabbit ball.

 

I'm really torn on this one. I like Cousins, and if I were running the FO, I'd get a LTD done. Not sure he wants to stay, and if he doesn't, I can't blame him for feeling that way.

[bobandweave]

27 minutes ago, purbeast said:

I get why Kirk would drag it out, he's not dumb.  Which is why the team needs to make him an offer he can't refuse ASAP.

 

Please understand I was just playing the other side of this and don’t think your wrong about anything you said. Just was giving an idea on what the players involved get out of dragging this out.

 

With that said I don’t believe in the NFL salary cap era any player is worth giving a contract he can’t refuse in the league and that’s the only thing we disagree on

 

27 minutes ago, purbeast said:

As for it making them get more from another team, what benefit does that give them?

 

Comes down to them feeling there will be a marriage to Cousins or not.

 

Kirks relationship to this point is like a woman they are dating. She wants to get married but do they want to put a ring on it? Takes two to want to stay together and commit

 

Questions are out there about the team wanting to marry the QB or the QB wanting to marry the team so if either of them don’t want that then the benefit for the team is to hopefully get a kings ransom for the bride before moving on.

 

The more they can get for Kirk if he doesn’t want to stay here the better the team is in this divorce. That’s business

 

Doesnt matter on the future if the player wants to leave. Ultimately it’s up to him to decide if he wants to be here or not. If he does it won’t take an offer he can’t refuse to get it done, if he doesn’t then the team owes its fans to get more then the third round pick for him they will get as a consolation prize

[CapsSkins]

6 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Personally, I do think Bruce is mucking this up without Dan's interference.  However, if I thought Dan really wanted Kirk badly he would indeed interfere.

 

This is what gives me a measure of confidence. Last season, I was torn on whether Kirk was worth a long-term deal. This year, I think that answer is obviously yes. Say what you want about my ability to evaluate talent, but I don't think it's absurd to think that Dan might have been in a similar boat. Last season, perhaps he was uncertain and so he let Bruce handle the process (e.g. if we can do it and "win" the deal sure, if it doesn't work out whatever). This season, it's possible he's made his mind up that Kirk *has* to be extended, particularly as that narrative has become a common refrain across league circles. And the one thing we all know is that what Dan wants, Dan gets. The scuttlebutt also seems to be that Kirk is resentful of Bruce but believes Dan has come around after Dan buttered him up a little bit. So I imagine we'll go through the same song and dance this offseason but this time with a directive from Dan that this deal gets done-- and thus it will.

 

Remember, Kirk likes Jay, his teammates, the team is on the rise and he values consistency in a system. He knows he's about to get paid no matter what. He feels supported by the owner to some extent. It's not like we need to move heaven and earth to get this guy. We're in pole position. Just need to not **** it up. That's not a certainty, which we as Skins fans understand all too well, but let's not pretend like this is some Herculean ask.

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

It doesn't matter why it doesn't get done I am blaming Snyder. 

 

 

Me, too.  My interest in Bruce Allen in the whole mess is he's the one driving the dumpster truck.  And I think Kirk and his people are pretty honest -- their issue according to beat guys seemed to consistently square on Bruce, Bruce, Bruce.   But like I said, Bruce is Dan's guy.  So the responsibility falls back on Dan.   I don't think Bruce is carrying Dan's water blow by blow with the contract.  I think Bruce is the leading actor in the dysfunction.  But to your point, if Dan really cared a lot he'd interfere.  I agree with Cooley who likes to say there is one guy who changes the dynamics here in a heartbeat if he choose to do so and that would be Dan.

 

2 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

  If Snyder and Allen have been so irritating to Cousins because of RGIII, contracts or other reasons that Cousins doesn't want to stay it is Snyder's fault.

 

 

  100% agree.

 

2 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

Any sensible employer treasures highly talented, superior performing, workaholic employees and if that employee is also charming, gracious and unfailingly positive and supportive they value them even more.  Cousins is all of those things and more.  I am sure every other owner would not only extend Cousins but would relish the fact that such a winsome young man was going to be the face of the franchise for another decade.   

 

Couldn't agree more with this, too.   The thing i care about above all is great play.  Personality is a bonus.  But Kirk is clearly a great dude.  I met him a couple of times in a couple of settings which reinforced the way he comes off in interviews, etc -- classy.

 

2 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

Somehow Snyder doesn't feel that way about Cousins.  I have my theory and you have yours but no matter the reason why Snyder doesn't treasure Cousins 

 

I'm not sure if I landed on one specific theory for Dan's/FO stupidity on it. I landed on a theory for Bruce.  For Dan I suspect there are a few things in play.  I recall your theory and I don't think that's it because I can think of a couple of guys Dan seemed to really dig that fit that category, too.  But it could be so.  I guess there is no way to know.

 

If I have to land on one thing, I'd say its Kirk isn't a sexy sell for Dan.   He had Brad Johnson in his lap but let him go since he likely wasn't as a sexy sell as gunslinger Jeff George.  Dan seems to like the dudes with pizzazz.  Kirk comes off like a great guy.  But his personality isn't exciting where he brings added buzz to sell jerseys.  

 

I am not giving up, though.  I am more pessimistic than optimistic that a deal gets done.  But I am hoping Dan realizes that it will end up a marketing fiasco in the end to let Kirk go.  And that's what helps propel the deal.  I genuinely thinks fans complaining about it -- like the Fassel drill from years back can have an impact here.

 

Normally I don't live and die with a player transaction.  But this is the QB.  The position is as important as HC IMO.

[ncr2h]

If I'm Cousins, I would love to sign another one year deal with the Redskins, but would be hesitant to sign a long term deal.

 

The Skins' future is very uncertain:

 

- Will Jay still be the coach 2+ years from now?

- Will Reed, Thompson, Williams, etc. all bounce back from injury and hit the ground running?  Are we bringing in any new weapons, and if so, how do we know they won't struggle like Pryor?

- What are the chances the defense improves enough to be a top 10 unit?

- What are the chances we build a respectable ground attack?

 

Meanwhile, it's only a matter of time before Brady and Roethlisberger retire.  If Kirk's goal is to make a long term impact off the field - which, in his words, can't be done without sustained success on the field - why sign long term with a team like the Redskins, whose front office hasn't proven anything, when you could potentially sign with the Steelers or the Patriots, who have huge fanbases and decades of success?  If he makes the $34 million this season, he will have made ~$80M in the past 3 seasons.  He could realistically go to the Patriots or Steelers and say, "Hey, I've made a ton of money, and now I just want to win.  Sign me up for something in the range of $15-20M and use the leftovers to build out the roster."