2017 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread

[JamesMadisonSkins]

The more I read about the DL in this draft, the more I think we go DE in the 1st or 2nd ... and then wait until the 4th or 5th to take one of the NTs that falls to that range. So a 2 DL draft ... but just one "premier" guy ... But per the WalterFootball rankings, a lot of the NTs are also listed as DEs and vice versa, but guys that I'd pencil in as mid-round NTs and the round I would be okay with them are ...

 

- Elijah Qualls (3rd), Jarron Jones (3rd), Jaleel Johnson (3rd), Carlos Watkins (3rd), Eddie Vanderdoes (4th), Vincent Taylor (4th)

 

But these guys can really play any position along the DL in the 3-4 ... they're all in the 6'1 to 6'3 and 300 to 315 pound range. Qualls is 6'1 and 315 ... so he may be the closest to a "fat boy" in that group that could be a pure 3-4 NT ...

 

But Stevie Tu'ikolovatu (5th) at 6'1 331 is the only "fat boy" who you may be able to prescribe as being a pure 2-down run-stuffer, true NT. Everyone else above could likely play DE ala Chris Baker.

 

[Est.1974]

1 hour ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

The more I read about the DL in this draft, the more I think we go DE in the 1st or 2nd ... and then wait until the 4th or 5th to take one of the NTs that falls to that range. 

 

But Stevie Tu'ikolovatu (5th) at 6'1 331 is the only "fat boy" who you may be able to prescribe as being a pure 2-down run-stuffer, true NT. 

 

 

It has to be...Stevie T....can't see what's not to like about him in the mid rounds..age maybe but I'll take him.

 

I agree DE early then NT later.

[Dark Acre]

Given that this has been a passing league for some years now, why do people refer to run stoppers as 2 down players?  In a passing league, they're 1 down players.  ?

[Morneblade]

5 minutes ago, GothSkinsFan said:

Given that this has been a passing league for some years now, why do people refer to run stoppers as 2 down players?  In a passing league, they're 1 down players.  ?

 

 

 Pass/run ration is approx. 60/40 right now. And because down and distance has a lot to do with sub packages. 2nd and 3 is much different than 2 and 10. Or 3rd and 1 compared to 3rd and 7.

[clskinsfan]

Done with tape on WR's, As always my rankings are purely based on tape. No health or off field issues are taken into account. And my views mean absolutely nothing. I have QB's and TE's left. Then I will list my top 50 players. There are so many good WR's in this draft that I had to cheat a little bit. My top "ten" WR's:

 

Mike Williams

Corey Davis

John Ross

Zay Jones

Malachi Dupre 

DeDe Westbrook 

Ju Ju Smith Schuster 

Cooper Kupp 

Chris Godwin

Chad Hanson

Ardarius Stewart (my sleeper WR in this draft)

 

I will add that there is A LOT of depth at the WR position in this draft. But I only have a first round grade on Williams. A lot of second and third round grades in this draft though. Starting TE tape now.

[Skinsinparadise]

Just watched Bruce's Allen's full interview from CSN, its about 15 minutes long.  Here's the link for those interested.   He seemed pretty direct that they are going with a full BPA approach to the draft.  They have graded players and are working the board that way.   When asked about it, Bruce said he's comfortable riding with what they have now at DT -- though granted what else could he say to that question.

 

http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/video/exclusive-bruce-allen-talks-redskins-offseason-jp-finlay

[RWJ]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Just watched Bruce's Allen's full interview from CSN, its about 15 minutes long.  Here's the link for those interested.   He seemed pretty direct that they are going with a full BPA approach to the draft.  They have graded players and are working the board that way.   When asked about it, Bruce said he's comfortable riding with what they have now at DT -- though granted what else could he say to that question.

 

http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/video/exclusive-bruce-allen-talks-redskins-offseason-jp-finlay

Best get a legit NT and ILB.  That's all I can say.  You, SIP?

[skins2victory]

Caleb Brantley...... What are the thoughts on this guy?? Mayock has him listed as his 2nd rated interior DL behind Jonathan Allen. Sounds like he would be a big reach at #17.  If we could trade back 10-12 spots to draft him, and get another 2 round pick for the trade, how would ya'll feel about that??

[3 Rings]

48 minutes ago, skins2victory said:

Caleb Brantley...... What are the thoughts on this guy?? Mayock has him listed as his 2nd rated interior DL behind Jonathan Allen. Sounds like he would be a big reach at #17.  If we could trade back 10-12 spots to draft him, and get another 2 round pick for the trade, how would ya'll feel about that??

 

I don't think Brantley is going to be that much of a reach to be honest.  He's going to be one of those picks the no one really gets excited about as fans of whichever team drafts him.  Then, 3 years later he's likely to be all pro.  I like him and would be pretty psyched to get him at #17.  

[wilco_holland]

4 hours ago, skins2victory said:

Caleb Brantley...... What are the thoughts on this guy?? Mayock has him listed as his 2nd rated interior DL behind Jonathan Allen. Sounds like he would be a big reach at #17.  If we could trade back 10-12 spots to draft him, and get another 2 round pick for the trade, how would ya'll feel about that??

 

This years draft is not very top heavy. After the first 15 picks there is a huge group of guys who could go mid round one to even early round three. Not really big talent difference and really depends on what you like as a team. The 20th rated player on one teams board might be 50th at an other team. 

 

Brantley fits that group. Some teams might love him and others don't. So I don't think it's a reach but I would love to trade a little back. Because I feel like at the end of round one there arent a lot of teams that would take him. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

7 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Just watched Bruce's Allen's full interview from CSN, its about 15 minutes long.  Here's the link for those interested.   He seemed pretty direct that they are going with a full BPA approach to the draft.  They have graded players and are working the board that way.   When asked about it, Bruce said he's comfortable riding with what they have now at DT -- though granted what else could he say to that question.

 

http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/video/exclusive-bruce-allen-talks-redskins-offseason-jp-finlay

 

 

 

 

I wish I could believe him as that's the only way to draft the first two days in particular. Even if the highest player graded is in a strong position on your roster, unless it's minimal to the next player you have graded, you DON'T window dress your board and make an exception just because your're weaker in another position. 

 

But as it's coming from him I'll reserve the right to expect the complete opposite. 

 

Hopefully for once he's being honest and proves me wrong. 

 

Hail. 

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

Or Bruce could be setting everybody up for his Deshaun Watson pick..

[Skinsinparadise]

10 hours ago, RWJ said:

Best get a legit NT and ILB.  That's all I can say.  You, SIP?

 

I am torn because I am strict BPA but also think the current state of the D line is fairly pathetic.  Lets take NT -- IMO I wouldn't take one in the 2nd round but I am fearful they could be gone by the third, though someone should still be there:  Tomlinson, Qualls, Vanderdoes, etc.  At the moment, I'd take my chances though and go BPA.

 

I've seen Bruce double down in multiple interviews now that in his mind they lost to the Giants and didn't win the division because they couldn't run the ball and couldn't stop the run.  They talked to Hightower last week.  I was ruling out RB based on Gruden's chalk talk where he apparently said he's happy with Fat Rob and would only take a RB if he saw them as a game changer and he expects Fournette to be gone by their pick.  But Bruce's comments have made me rethink that it might be in play.

[Koolblue13]

I'm good with BPA. As long as it's BPA up the middle of our defense. 

 

I would honestly be fine trading Kirk for 2 1rsts and a 2nd next year too. 

 

Load the defense up and let STudfeld start. Bank defense this draft and let the young bucks start. Trade up next year for thee QB and whatever other position is lacking.

 

Solid defense and great run game will keep you in every game.

[wilco_holland]

3 hours ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

Or Bruce could be setting everybody up for his Deshaun Watson pick..

 

You can say a lot about DeShaun Watson but at the end of the day the dude is a winner. When he plays football he is most of the time on the winning side. Don't know if it is skill or luck...but yeah. Picking him at 17 might even be value in some peoples eyes...

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

@wilco_holland  IMO, if our plan is to truly go kamikaze style into next offseason without having addressed the elephant in the room, Kirks LTD, we will have seriously lost. So it wouldn't shock me in the slightest to start addressing the QB this year and letting them sit, especially if we can get value. Is DW the answer, I don't have a clue, but playing chicken with the question into next year would be really foolish.

[wilco_holland]

25 minutes ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

@wilco_holland  IMO, if our plan is to truly go kamikaze style into next offseason without having addressed the elephant in the room, Kirks LTD, we will have seriously lost. So it wouldn't shock me in the slightest to start addressing the QB this year and letting them sit, especially if we can get value. Is DW the answer, I don't have a clue, but playing chicken with the question into next year would be really foolish.

 

I think we might take one in the middle rounds...but don't see the value in that. You can grab a Nathan Peterman in the third and hope he is the next Kirk...but man that feels like a wasted pick. I rather adress an other position. 

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

I agree this cloud of Kirk looming over us isn't good for anyone, other than Kirk.  It puts us in a position of weakness. It's only gonna get worse as time ticks away. That's why I'd do everything I could to get a deal done before the draft because if you don't have it done, I feel you have to be realistic and plan for the inevitable.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

Generally the better run defending DT's also have longer arms.  The ability to maintain leverage, and keep the OL off them, while reading the RB is much easier with longer arms.  If you don't have longer arms, then you need to be athletic and powerful enough that when you do win, you can capitalize.

 

Like Seattle's hard cutoff of 32" arm length minimum for corners, some GM's have a cutoff of 34" arm length for the DL.  There have been successful run stuffing DT's with shorter arms and some with longer arms.  But generally the run stuffers have longer arms.  Stacy McGee who we just signed and is described as a run stuffer has 34.5" arm length.

 

Elijah Qualls arm length is a ridiculously tiny 30.625".  Caleb Brantley is actually next shortest in this DT class at 32" even.  This isn't the end all be all, but it worries me.

[DC Lumber Co.]

17 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

Done with tape on WR's, As always my rankings are purely based on tape. No health or off field issues are taken into account. And my views mean absolutely nothing. I have QB's and TE's left. Then I will list my top 50 players. There are so many good WR's in this draft that I had to cheat a little bit. My top "ten" WR's:

 

Mike Williams

Corey Davis

John Ross

Zay Jones

Malachi Dupre 

DeDe Westbrook 

Ju Ju Smith Schuster 

Cooper Kupp 

Chris Godwin

Chad Hanson

Ardarius Stewart (my sleeper WR in this draft)

 

I will add that there is A LOT of depth at the WR position in this draft. But I only have a first round grade on Williams. A lot of second and third round grades in this draft though. Starting TE tape now.

 

No love for Josh Reynolds? He's right in there with Zay Jones, Chris Godwin, and JuJu for my favorites out of the receivers not considered 1st rounders. Not a fan of DeDe's game but ill have to check out Ardarius Stewart.

[Bonez3]

So, on pure need, talent and availability... I've found McDowell would be a great pick.

 

This is exactly the player the Skins need. Lines up at all DL positions. Size and athleticism is freakish. The off field stuff and attitude issues are only concern if real. I'm thinking I would REALLY like this pick. 

 

So far, my wish list is growing. Foster, Fournette, McDowell, Baker and Peppers.

 

FWIW, Kizer is the best QB in this draft IMO. I have no clue how his comparisons to Newton aren't being propagandized. Further, he is a true pocket passer with GREAT pocket presence. I think he is going to give a team a potential franchise changing player. I actually think his ND status might be working against him given the NFL failures of more recent Notre Dame QBs

[DC Lumber Co.]

15 minutes ago, Bonez3 said:

So, on pure need, talent and availability... I've found McDowell would be a great pick.

 

This is exactly the player the Skins need. Lines up at all DL positions. Size and athleticism is freakish. The off field stuff and attitude issues are only concern if real. I'm thinking I would REALLY like this pick. 

 

So far, my wish list is growing. Foster, Fournette, McDowell, Baker and Peppers.

 

FWIW, Kizer is the best QB in this draft IMO. I have no clue how his comparisons to Newton aren't being propagandized. Further, he is a true pocket passer with GREAT pocket presence. I think he is going to give a team a potential franchise changing player. I actually think his ND status might be working against him given the NFL failures of more recent Notre Dame QBs

 

Yeah but the off the field/locker-room/bad-teammate stuff with McDowell can't be understated. The reports that came out about him and how detrimental he was to the program I posted a while back were pretty egregious.

 

and FWIW I will be extremely pissed if we draft a QB anywhere before the 4th round this year. A bad year for QBs plus a deep draft for the positions we actually do need (especially after taking a developmental QB last year in Sudfeld) would be ignorant. Not like we can stash a higher pick than that on the practice squad, and at that point we'd either be giving up on a solid backup in Colt or giving up on Sudfeld and that would mean another wasted draft pick. Or we can be extra dumb and carry 4 QBs, costing us elsewhere on the roster!

[Bonez3]

@DC Lumber Co. I'm not advocating drafting a QB. But I stated at end of NCG that Watson is a Vince Young protoge. Trubisky is unproven IMO. Kizer, IMO, warrants top 3 talk, and he is the only QB that does. That's it.

 

But what in particular were the reports on McDowell, because his film on the field is go, go, go. Nothing lazy or slack off that I have seen thus far. 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

What are folks' thoughts on Tanoh Kpassagnon (sp) from Villanova? Dude is listed as an EDGE in some mocks that I've seen, but he's probably more along the lines of a 4-3 DE or DT. The dude is a small-school prospect who's 6'7 280 ... I would imagine he could fill out quite nicely and fit into the DL rotation ... but outside of him being anywhere from 2nd to 4th round talent and having that frame, I don't know a ton about him (I should, my school played Villanova this year)

[DC Lumber Co.]

10 minutes ago, Bonez3 said:

@DC Lumber Co.

But what in particular were the reports on McDowell, because his film on the field is go, go, go. Nothing lazy or slack off that I have seen thus far. 

 

Here is the post I made about McDowell I was referring to. Huge buyer beware, IMO. 

 

Quote

Interesting tidbit on Malik Mcdowell from a podcast I found on another forum:

 

"As soon as he got to Michigan State he caused nothing but trouble to teammates and coaches." 

"This past year he routinely cussed out teammates and coaches on the practice field." 

"Routinely went rover on the field and ignored play calls for almost whole games." 

"His family firmly disliked by most families at Michigan State." 

"Cancer... called by multiple people." 

"I talked to one NFL decision maker who said that he would pay his signing bonus if he was drafted by any team in his division."