Does the overall ineptitude and fail of this franchise make you enjoy professional football less?

[Taylor703]

I watch religiously but honestly it wasn't the Redskins lack of success that changed things for me, it was the death of Sean Taylor. I can't explain what changed or how it changed but watching football hasn't been the same since that happened. I still love the game, I watch a ton of football, college and pro but something just feels different....

[kleese]

I think saying the team quit or has no pride makes fans feel better about rationalizing their own feelings.

The team didn't quit or lack heart Thursday; they just got rolled.

If I asked ES to name the players that DO play with heart I have a feeling we'd see names like Morris, Kerrigan, Garçon, and DHall. Not coincidentally, those are also some of the best players on the team. Funny how good players LOOK better.

I

[Diehard Otis]

I think saying the team quit or has no pride makes fans feel better about rationalizing their own feelings.

The team didn't quit or lack heart Thursday; they just got rolled.

If I asked ES to name the players that DO play with heart I have a feeling we'd see names like Morris, Kerrigan, Garçon, and DHall. Not coincidentally, those are also some of the best players on the team. Funny how good players LOOK better.

I was surprised to see you post in here, so I had to come read it for myself.  I respect your perspective Kleese.  You don't do the "Woe is poor me for cheering this team <sob><sob>" stuff.  I won't participate with all that either.

 

You walk an honorable path.

[kleese]

I was surprised to see you post in here, so I had to come read it for myself. I respect your perspective Kleese. You don't do the "Woe is poor me for cheering this team <sob><sob>" stuff. I won't participate with all that either.

You walk an honorable path.

I've been accused of walking many paths in my day and I do believe this is the first time anyone has said any of them were honorable, so thank you for that

During games, I let emotion flow. But when I discuss something, whether it be sports, politics, social issues or whatever, I try to keep the emotion down and stick to the points at hand because I believe that makes for a more civil (and interesting discussion).

The prediction threads are a great example of allowing emotion to rule the day. It is actually very much against trends and numbers to predict back to back home blowouts early in the season. Picking Seattle to win 45-10 is actually simply not a very reasonable prediction based on everything we know about the NFL. Of all teams, the Redskins would certainly be one to defy logic and history in a negative way, but it's still an emotional reaction based on frustration.

It's easier to not watch or back away from the team if you convince yourself THEY don't care or they aren't trying hard. But as bad as these 20+ years have been, only a handful of times have I felt the Redskins quit or didn't have any heart. Most of those instances came late in the season of a lame duck tenure-- like the final games of last year.

I think the Redskins probably tried as hard Thursday as they did the previous Sunday in Philly. Maybe the energy wasn't quite there due to many factors include injury, disappointment from the loss, lack of experience from key players/coaches, etc but I don't think it was lack of effort or caring. They got whipped. They lack talent in many areas. They were best up. The coach is a rookie and laid an egg. He got schooled by an old vet. It happens.

I said before the year I thought we'd go 7-9 with some upside to maybe make a run. After four games I am ready to amend that and say the upside clearly isn't there. 7-9 IS the upside. I'm disappoints to realize that, but I still think there is hope in this season in terms of our coach and many players growing into roles so that we can feel good about 2015.

[Diehard Otis]

I've been accused of walking many paths in my day and I do believe this is the first time anyone has said any of them were honorable, so thank you for that

During games, I let emotion flow. But when I discuss something, whether it be sports, politics, social issues or whatever, I try to keep the emotion down and stick to the points at hand because I believe that makes for a more civil (and interesting discussion).

The prediction threads are a great example of allowing emotion to rule the day. It is actually very much against trends and numbers to predict back to back home blowouts early in the season. Picking Seattle to win 45-10 is actually simply not a very reasonable prediction based on everything we know about the NFL. Of all teams, the Redskins would certainly be one to defy logic and history in a negative way, but it's still an emotional reaction based on frustration.

It's easier to not watch or back away from the team if you convince yourself THEY don't care or they aren't trying hard. But as bad as these 20+ years have been, only a handful of times have I felt the Redskins quit or didn't have any heart. Most of those instances came late in the season of a lame duck tenure-- like the final games of last year.

I think the Redskins probably tried as hard Thursday as they did the previous Sunday in Philly. Maybe the energy wasn't quite there due to many factors include injury, disappointment from the loss, lack of experience from key players/coaches, etc but I don't think it was lack of effort or caring. They got whipped. They lack talent in many areas. They were best up. The coach is a rookie and laid an egg. He got schooled by an old vet. It happens.

I said before the year I thought we'd go 7-9 with some upside to maybe make a run. After four games I am ready to amend that and say the upside clearly isn't there. 7-9 IS the upside. I'm disappoints to realize that, but I still think there is hope in this season in terms of our coach and many players growing into roles so that we can feel good about 2015.

As we discuss this, the Patriots are getting wiped out in Kansas City.  And New England has been a Contender for years.

 

Now, it was not my intention to be rabble rousing or polemical in my prior post, but too many folks here are selling our Redskins way too short.  I believe that we are in the toughest 4 game stretch of our season.  Does this mean our season is over before October?  Certainly not.  But as you have said, we do have a Rookie Head Coach.  This fact has been glossed over by too many fans. 

 

Gruden needs time to adjust to being a Head Coach.  For all we know, we could be on the cusp of something magical - who knows at this point?  But It seems there's a consensus kneejerk reaction back to "20 years of futility".  That's frustrating.  And I'm just not ready to adopt that line of thinking based on the Coach's first 4 games. 

 

There is still time for The Skins to get it together.  Sure, some can (and will) disagree with this sentiment, and that's fine.  But the schedule lightens up later in the year, as long as the team doesn't get into too big of a hole.  I just won't wave the white flag prematurely. 

 

The beauty of this is that there is still plenty of Football left to be played.

[respectgibbs]

Honestly, it's the general pussification of the NFL over the past 10 years which has made me enjoy it less. 

[Dirt]

Football is what it is. I'm watching the renowned new England Patriots "poo all over themselves" right now. In fact, lots of games this weekend looked like one of the teams didn't know their fundamentals.

We let our fandom and emotion complicate things. The truth is far more boring. Our QB had a bad game which, while he's no world beater, is still unusual. And our secondary is awful (which is a problem many teams have).

We had this discussion when we traded for Robert. It's too much to ask to make all phases of your team great, so a great QB can make it all better. I should say, a great, improvisational QB. Russell Wilson is making a career of it, and Robert is the same way. Asking for perfect drop back passing is too much. Asking for a shut down secondary PLUS a great pass rush PLUS an amazing o line is too much.... (asking for a good special teams is NOT btw....dammit...)...we need to be decent in all areas, let Alfred do his thing in the run game and have a dynamic qb (rg3 remember him....let him just do his thing too.).. and then we'll win some games and lose some games with only a couple being embarrassing losses.

It's actually not as bad as it seems. A good healthy rg3 will make everything better just as it did in '12.

My football hype isn't dead. I'm just waiting for rg3 to come back, and if he cant, or busts, then we're back to where 80% of teams are.

[Diehard Otis]

Football is what it is. I'm watching the renowned new England Patriots "poo all over themselves" right now. In fact, lots of games this weekend looked like one of the teams didn't know their fundamentals.

We let our fandom and emotion complicate things. The truth is far more boring. Our QB had a bad game which, while he's no world beater, is still unusual. And our secondary is awful (which is a problem many teams have).

We had this discussion when we traded for Robert. It's too much to ask to make all phases of your team great, so a great QB can make it all better. I should say, a great, improvisational QB. Russell Wilson is making a career of it, and Robert is the same way. Asking for perfect drop back passing is too much. Asking for a shut down secondary PLUS a great pass rush PLUS an amazing o line is too much.... (asking for a good special teams is NOT btw....dammit...)...we need to be decent in all areas, let Alfred do his thing in the run game and have a dynamic qb (rg3 remember him....let him just do his thing too.).. and then we'll win some games and lose some games with only a couple being embarrassing losses.

It's actually not as bad as it seems. A good healthy rg3 will make everything better just as it did in '12.

My football hype isn't dead. I'm just waiting for rg3 to come back, and if he cant, or busts, then we're back to where 80% of teams are.

Yessir Dirt.  There has been an (understandably) bad reaction to Thursday's wipeout.  It leaves a terrible taste in my mouth too.  But you're right.  I suppose its hard to see it clearly when we're all so emotionally involved. 

 

[it reminds me of chess: when you're playing, you see the board a certain way.  But when you're observing a game, it seems like the players always overlook such elementry moves.]

[BraveWarrior]

I love pro football, and even though the Redskins have been horrible for so long, I keep coming back, week and week, season after season. And I also watch a lot of other games each week, even if it's just for background while I do other things. But I have noticed my overall interest in the NFL waning. I don't plan to watch games with friends, because it's usually embarrassing for me when their teams do so well and my team ****s the bed. I no longer put the pregame stuff on 2 hours before the games each Sunday; I turn on the TV about 5 minutes before a game is about to start. And I watch very little of the NFL Network programming anymore, as they commit hours and hours of analysis to the same handful of stories each week. Most of these stories have more to do with gossip and rumors rather than actual football information. I refuse to watch just about anything relating to the NFL on ESPN. If NFLN wants to do the fans a service, they should crack open the NFL Films archives and show games from the '70s and '80s. Of course, Goodell would probably force them to stop, as it would be visual evidence for everyone to see how poor today's product is compared to back then.  

 

Someone else mentioned that, for such a bad team, the Redskins continue to get a lot of press. The problem is it's all about crap that means little when it comes to what happens on the field. As much as I think RG3 is a good guy and a great athlete, I was put off by all the coverage of his 2013 Summer Rehab Tour. I guess it would have been tolerable had he not gone through it all, only to have nothing to show for it in his play, and the team's mismanagement of him when the season started. I feel like I like RG3 less for all of it, and it stinks because he may yet turn out to be a great player for us.  

 

Anyway, tangential rant over. Bottom line - It sucks to constantly be an irrelevant team by Halloween every season. It sucks to watch the team spinning its wheels year after year, while other clubs perform complete rebuilding projects and turn into success stories all around us. It sucks to fall for the same preseason hype every spring and summer, only to watch it all come apart before the leaves change color.

[Boss_Hogg]

I'm not sure how one can compare the Patriots getting rolled on MNF to the Redskins getting rolled on TNF.

 

The Patriots have actually accomplished something like Superbowls and division championships in the last 20 years. They rarely get blown out, in fact ESPN posted a graphic that the Pats haven't given up 40+ points since 2000!

 

The Redskins have done squat and continue to be a laughing stock every year (save 2005, 2007, and 2012).

 

Patriots getting blown out does not equal Skins getting blown out. Skins get blown out 2-3 games every year.

 

2014: Giants (national TV)

2013: Chiefs, Eagles (national TV), Broncos, Packers, 49ers

2012: Steelers

2011: Bills, Eagles

2010: Eagles (national TV)

2009: Giants (national TV) Cowboys (National TV)

[Tsailand]

Yes, and this should have been a poll.

 

But oddly enough, it makes me enjoy baseball more.  Go Nats!

[ihateusernames]

Long time listener, first time caller. I'd like to see the answer to this question in poll form

[Boss_Hogg]

Poll added my fellow masochists

[Dirt]

I'm not sure how one can compare the Patriots getting rolled on MNF to the Redskins getting rolled on TNF.

 

 

No matter how damning that history is, it's still comparable.  In the scope of a game itself, whether it's the great Tom Brady or the "hot" Kirk Cousins, it shows the better game plan winning, with a little of "QB had a horrible night". 

 

Don't try to convince Patriots fans that this game didn't matter because of what happened in the past.  Some of them might think so, but they shouldn't, and we shouldn't either.  There's no mystical prime-time ghost that haunts any team.  

 

Every season is a new season.  Losses should make us upset, sure, but blowout losses shouldn't escalate it.

 

Which is more embarrassing, REALLY?...:Failing to get 10 yards at the end of the eagles game, or letting some whoever TE catch 3 TDs.  We were supposed to feel 'good' about that philly loss right?  Bull****, we should be furious that our team couldn't scoot into FG range.  But no, we came out of that all happy.  Next game is a blowout by halftime, and we don't get a chance to evaluate a football game normally.  Coaches don't either, that's why they put in the backups for crying out loud.  It happens.

 

Let's remember that we're bad, but don't let one blowout loss make everything so much worse.  Cousins with only 2 INTs would have lost the game as well.  Hell, Cousins with 0 INTs might have, we might have had a field goal blocked.  HELL, Cousins with 3 TD passes might have still lost the game, IT DID LAST WEEK AT PHILLY....

 

Perspective.  We already know we're not great, please, let's not have Thursday night take us to a new level of sorrow because it happens to the best, and worst of them.

[Zazzaro703]

Yes, but it's a few other things as well. I have lost a lot of interest in the NFL itself. So many new rules, poor officiating throughout the league with refs deciding games on bad calls. All the ridiculous suspensions like taking a cough medicine with codeine resulting in a 4 game vacation. The league becoming all about money with overseas games, Thursday night games etc etc. Politics entering into the league where analysts don't say our team name, refs refusing to do our games.

Then last but not least, all the bonus extras that come with the Redskins. Hiring or retaining coordinators before hiring head coaches. Tons of personnel decisions and draft picks that boggle the mind and leave one scratching their head in confusion year in and year out. Again, the name debate. A star player returning home while injured because his house was broken into a week before killed by a one in a million shot to the leg severing an artery because the scumbags decided to try and rob his house again. Being issued a salary cap penalty for violating the salary cap rules in an uncapped year. Not living in the DMV area and having to hear and take a bunch of crap from fans of all the other teams. Leaving our Franchise QB in a playoff game when obviously hurt resulting in a major injury. All the media leaks intended to bring a player or the team down every sunday morning before the games at the end of a season. Lack of discipline across the board resulting in game changing penalties year in and year out. The team at war with one of the main papers in the area resulting in a lot of pot stirring, controversy and stories citing "unnamed sources" at all turns. A crappy stadium thats too big so a third of it is opposing team fans. All the ridiculous streaks teams we play against break when they play us (I know not a single person was surprised to see Eli had his first rushing TD since 2011 last Thursday and it just so happens that his 2011 rushing TD was against you guessed it... The Redskins). The personal or team best performances players/teams have against us. When Espn or NFL network is talking about a player and showing their highlights, there is ALWAYS a clip of them doing something against the Redskins (Anyone else notice this?) It goes on and on. If the Redskins just came out and lost because they aren't good enough it would be one thing, but we seem to lose in spectacular and historic fashion while also losing outside the football field. Sometimes I feel like following the Redskins is like watching a train derail and crash into an elementary school playground.

Yeah, I'm starting to wear thin and hope we start winning soon.

[skins island connection]

It can put a strain on your mentality; the frustration, referees, expired beer, etc.

 

There will be another day; another day, where the Redskin loyal will once again hold their heads high and smile.

 Hell, I hold my head high today, even though the frustration level of the decision-making by the FO is making my hair gray [ even grayer ], because I was fortunate to have lived in the era where the Redskins were the team people didn't want to face, in a stadium, even trashy as some describe, was an actual 'home field advantage' that would make the sissies in Seattle regret coming to, with a HC who knew what strings to pull with players to get the most out of them, and players who cared about winning, not how much money they make.

 

I've lived through the good times, and I know how to live through the bad.

 

It will get better....one day....

[kleese]

It can put a strain on your mentality; the frustration, referees, expired beer, etc.

There will be another day; another day, where the Redskin loyal will once again hold their heads high and smile.

Hell, I hold my head high today, even though the frustration level of the decision-making by the FO is making my hair gray [ even grayer ], because I was fortunate to have lived in the era where the Redskins were the team people didn't want to face, in a stadium, even trashy as some describe, was an actual 'home field advantage' that would make the sissies in Seattle regret coming to, with a HC who knew what strings to pull with players to get the most out of them, and players who cared about winning, not how much money they make.

I've lived through the good times, and I know how to live through the bad.

It will get better....one day....

I agree, and when it happens will someone please volunteer to put the newspaper headline on my tombstone?

[skinsfan35yrs.]

As we discuss this, the Patriots are getting wiped out in Kansas City.  And New England has been a Contender for years.

 

Yeah but the Patriots dont have the losing track record like the Skins have. All teams may have bad games but most  teams can rebound, except this team. We seem to amplify how bad we are, continually.

[VCDefectors]

I know one thing, the NFL is much better off with a winning Redskins team. As a Cowboys fan, the Eagles and Giants will never live up to the great Redskins-Cowboys historical rivalry. I'm sad that the young fans of today weren't around during the great George Allen or Joe Gibbs teams. Believe me, there was no more important rivalry in football. I can promise you that!! 

I just hate what the radical left/progressive politicians in DC are doing to harass the NFL and the Washington Redskins. They can't fix the economy and they can't keep us out of unwinnable wars, but they sure can harass Roger Godell and Dan Snyder over fake issues, can't they?! It just sickens me.

[Gizmo 3squire]

Yup, it does. I've contemplated on taking a hiatus from watching football tbh.

[Bigmuss1]

I voted yes as well.  It's so frustrating to watch other PROFESSIONAL football teams look like a PROFESSIONAL football team.  

[pjfootballer]

I don't know that I'm fairweather. I'm 30 years old. I barely remember the 1991 team, but I was so young that I didn't actually watch the game (I just remember going to a big Super Bowl party). I've stuck with the team for my entire adolescent and adult life. But there's only so much a person can take.

When the team doesn't show any desire to win, why should I?

I get the impression that those who were old enough to remember the 80's teams probably have a bit more patience with the Redskins. For the people my age and younger, though, I have no idea why we do it.

Nope. Even us old timers are getting fed up. Been watching every game since 1976. Saw some losing and I saw some winning. Last year in stopped watching after the Minnesota loss. I figured the team had given up, so I did too. I'd watch other games and switch back to "check in" on them, but I didn't watch a full game after that.

I watched the first three games this year. I should have turned off the Houston game, but I was determined things were different and chalked it up to first game for coach. Thoroughly enjoyed the Jax game as it was the first time in a long time they looked like a complete team. Hung in there with the Philly game and wasn't as upset as I usually am because they gave a hell of an effort on the road. Thursday? Turned on a movie at 21-7. I'd seen that bull**** before.

I'm actually going to the game Monday night. Mom has season tickets and I usually go to one game a year with her. I picked this one because I hate sitting in the sun for day games. I won't wear anything Redskins. I'll go, but I'm "meh" about it. I expect us to lose so I won't be torn up. It will bother me to see a lot of bandwagon Seahawks fans there.

I'll tune in every week, but if I see what I saw Thursday, the channel can be changed very easily.

[StephenB]

Homeland starts up again on Sunday night.  I'll DVR it have it ready for Monday night.  I'm not wasting my time with this any longer.  Like some previous posters have pointed out, it feels different this time as even the hardcore, old-timers have given up hope.  At this point, I just want to see fans stop going to games and Snyder eventually moving the team.  The NFL will then award us a new franchise that'll probably be owned by someone way more competent.  Of course, this will take years to come to fruition.

[Boss_Hogg]

It's also distressing to see other rookie coaches perform so well. Pagano, Arians, Chip Kelly, Both Harbaughs, Trestman, Bill O'Brien etc.

 

I'm also worn down with this stupid name change crap! It's bad enough my favorite team is horrible, but to have UnWise Mike and his minions attack you on social media and call you a racist, makes it even harder.

[nemocystem]

I find the product getting harder to watch as a whole, with or without my Redskins. I'm old skool I guess, when it comes to football. I love defensive battles, & 3 yards & a cloud of dust. I love nasty hits, & skill position intimidation. These are the main reasons I love football. The more they change the sport towards flag, or a 7on7 type of skill game, the less I want to watch football, & the more I'd rather watch Hockey, or Soccer. Those sports are meant to be played that way, & football is becoming less of what makes it different, & more of the same.

Also...I pretty much concur with the OP in that when we suck as we have for as long as we have, I find it upsetting to watch other teams play competent football, & garner praise, & accolades. It's like having an amazing fling with the model trophy chick for a short time, & then being forced to watch as she ends up cheating on you with your neighbor who also works with you in the same department. They get married, he has pictures everywhere, he gloats about how awesome married life is with his amazeballs wifey. She brings him baked goods, & wonderful lunch nuggets to the office on occasion. They have glorious neighborhood block parties, & often frequent the same establishments, & on the odd instance you can hear them making whoopy.

That's how I feel about the NFL when we suck. Welcome to my world.