Is Kirk Cousins Clutch? Does he have the moxy to lead a 4th Quarter comeback?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

He completed an 81 yard TD pass while trailing 20-27.

 

He completed a 43 yard pass with the score tied 27-27.

 

He completed a 55 yard pass while down 27-37.

 

I think the jury's still out on this one.

 

It's more like he completed a screen pass that Helu ran for 55 yards lol...

 

But I do agree that the jury is still out on Cousins' being "clutch". He didn't get it done this time, though.

Down 10, with 4 minutes to go, he looked pretty clutch to me..

 

What about down 3 with 2:40 left to go...how did he look to you?

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

He's no Joe Flacco.

 

(Bam! That's how you do it, son. Four words).

[GoDeep81]

What about down 3 with 2:40 left to go...how did he look to you?

 

Like an upcoming QB starting his 5th NFL game. (And a seasoned vet for the 57 minutes before that) You?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

Like an upcoming QB starting his 5th NFL game. (And a seasoned vet for the 57 minutes before that) You?

 

So you're saying he didn't look clutch to you then? If so, I agree.

[Stang2012]

I agree with what someone said earlier. I was pleasantly surprised he didn't fold when we were down 10. We put 7 more on the board and were in position to tie or win. That last series was horrible for Cousins and believe me he knows it. Gotta give him a chance to work through some of this stuff. I think part of our problem is we've been waiting for RG3 to turn the corner for a while now so a lot of us are probably not as patient as we should be with Cousins.

[mistertim]

Are we having this discussion about a guy with five starts under his belt?  Can we get an actual sample size?  He's only played in two clutch situations in his career in meaningful games.  He's 1 for 2.

I don't think its right to try and label him as a choker OR clutch at this point. That being said, there is nothing wrong with bringing it up since there IS a trend of him playing worse at the end of games than the beginning. Dismissing the conversation by bringing up his starts is just deflecting. Again, its too early to label him one way or the other but the topic is valid. 

 

As far as his play later in games, I posted these numbers in another thread and while they are certainly not definitive in any way, it does present a potentially worrying trend:

 

2013:

 

BY QUARTER CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG LNG TD INT SACK RAT

QUARTER = 1 14 25 120 56.0 4.80 23 1 0 2 82.1

QUARTER = 2 19 33 315 57.6 9.55 62 1 1 1 87.3

QUARTER = 3 13 26 97 50.0 3.73 21 1 2 1 40.1

QUARTER = 4 35 71 322 49.3 4.54 17 1 4 1 43.3

 

 

2014:

 

BY QUARTER CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG LNG TD INT SACK RAT

QUARTER = 1 17 18 191 94.4 10.61 37 3 0 0 150.5

QUARTER = 2 16 25 167 64.0 6.68 31 0 0 1 83.3

QUARTER = 3 11 21 175 52.4 8.33 81 1 0 0 96.3

QUARTER = 4 8 17 144 47.1 8.47 55 1 1 1 71.7

 

 

Now this may not mean anything and may not continue but the numbers show that Cousins has, by a good margin, been worse at the end of games than he has the beginning. It may mean that defenses have successfully adapted to him or that he is just streaky. Hard to say for sure; we'll see what happens. 

[GoDeep81]

So you're saying he didn't look clutch to you then? If so, I agree.

 

I was trying to say the topic is stupid to begin with..

[ncr2h]

It's more like he completed a screen pass that Helu ran for 55 yards lol...

 

But I do agree that the jury is still out on Cousins' being "clutch". He didn't get it done this time, though.

 

What about down 3 with 2:40 left to go...how did he look to you?

 

The 55 yard screen pass was one of Cousins' better passes of the day, on a day which he had an epic performance.  He had pressure in his face and was forced to release the ball before Helu was ready for it.  Now, that's not to say that Cousins was solely responsible for the result on that play.  But it was a perfect playcall, perfectly executed pass (that was actually a difficult pass), and great run after the catch by Helu.  The fact that it was a screen pass shouldn't detract from Cousins' credit for the play, given the difficulty of that particular screen pass.

 

He had a bad final drive.  That being said, I find it funny that everyone claims that Garcon was open.  RG3 would not have considered Garcon open on that play - there was a CB between Garcon and Cousins.  Griffin would have waited for Garcon to clear the CB, which may have disrupted the throw or led to a sack if there was pressure on the play.  Everyone is already adjusting their expectations of what constitutes an "open" receiver now that we have a guy who can throw the ball before the receiver makes the break.

[Sticksboi05]

It's more like he completed a screen pass that Helu ran for 55 yards lol...

 

But I do agree that the jury is still out on Cousins' being "clutch". He didn't get it done this time, though.

 

What about down 3 with 2:40 left to go...how did he look to you?

 

I miss the days when Brunell could just toss it to Moss and he'd take it to the endzone.

[TradeTheBeal!]

Kirk's mechanics broke down on him in the second half.  He threw a lot of bad balls.  We can fix it.

[ncr2h]

 

I don't think its right to try and label him as a choker OR clutch at this point. That being said, there is nothing wrong with bringing it up since there IS a trend of him playing worse at the end of games than the beginning. Dismissing the conversation by bringing up his starts is just deflecting. Again, its too early to label him one way or the other but the topic is valid. 

 

As far as his play later in games, I posted these numbers in another thread and while they are certainly not definitive in any way, it does present a potentially worrying trend:

 

2013:

 

BY QUARTER CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG LNG TD INT SACK RAT

QUARTER = 1 14 25 120 56.0 4.80 23 1 0 2 82.1

QUARTER = 2 19 33 315 57.6 9.55 62 1 1 1 87.3

QUARTER = 3 13 26 97 50.0 3.73 21 1 2 1 40.1

QUARTER = 4 35 71 322 49.3 4.54 17 1 4 1 43.3

 

 

2014:

 

BY QUARTER CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG LNG TD INT SACK RAT

QUARTER = 1 17 18 191 94.4 10.61 37 3 0 0 150.5

QUARTER = 2 16 25 167 64.0 6.68 31 0 0 1 83.3

QUARTER = 3 11 21 175 52.4 8.33 81 1 0 0 96.3

QUARTER = 4 8 17 144 47.1 8.47 55 1 1 1 71.7

 

 

Now this may not mean anything and may not continue but the numbers show that Cousins has, by a good margin, been worse at the end of games than he has the beginning. It may mean that defenses have successfully adapted to him or that he is just streaky. Hard to say for sure; we'll see what happens. 

 

 

Keep in mind that Cousins had a pass to Roberts where Roberts was ruled down by contact inside the 1 yard line, giving the skins a 1st and goal from inside the 1.  Helu ran it in for the TD.  How much of a game changer is that half yard when it comes to Cousins' 4th quarter qb rating?  I'm guessing it's pretty big, given the small sample size.  Should we let 1/2 yard of YAC have such a huge impact on our opinion of Cousins?

[War Paint]

I agree with what someone said earlier. I was pleasantly surprised he didn't fold when we were down 10. We put 7 more on the board and were in position to tie or win. That last series was horrible for Cousins and believe me he knows it. Gotta give him a chance to work through some of this stuff. I think part of our problem is we've been waiting for RG3 to turn the corner for a while now so a lot of us are probably not as patient as we should be with Cousins.

I agree with this.  Once we were down by 10, I thought the wheels were going to completely fall off and that we would probably end up losing the game by 17+ points.  I was pleasantly surprised to see us jump back in the game.  I was disappointed with the last drive, but at the same time, I'm not going to give Kirk 100% of the blame for that.  I wasn't thrilled with the playcalling on the final drive.  I think the busted up run on 1st down put us behind the eight ball and seemed to set the failed tone of the remaining drive.  Who knows, if Alfred Morris would've gained 4-6 yards with that run on 1st down instead of getting tackled for a loss, maybe the drive would've had better results.  It is what it is. 

[SkinsHokieFan]

Kirk's mechanics go awry when the pocket gets messy or it gets late in the game and it is close.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

Keep in mind that Cousins had a pass to Roberts where Roberts was ruled down by contact inside the 1 yard line, giving the skins a 1st and goal from inside the 1.  Helu ran it in for the TD.  How much of a game changer is that half yard when it comes to Cousins' 4th quarter qb rating?  I'm guessing it's pretty big, given the small sample size.  Should we let 1/2 yard of YAC have such a huge impact on our opinion of Cousins?

 

 Roberts wasn't anywhere close to scoring on that play, though. After he was clearly down, he reached forward trying to get the ball to the end zone. This wasn't like the Niles Paul non-TD against the Jags where it could have gone either way. Roberts was down well short of the goal line.

[Koolblue13]

One of my brilliant eagle fan friends posted a pic of RG3 in the stands in eagles gear and captioned it happiest eagle fan. He couldn't understand why that was so wrong.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I was trying to say the topic is stupid to begin with..

 

If we're trying to reach a conclusion about whether or not Cousins should be considered "clutch", I agree.

 

If we're trying to say Cousins was indeed clutch in the Eagles game by listing some great throws he made earlier in the game, then that's definitely open to debate.

 

If we're trying to say Cousins was definitely not clutch in the Eagles game by listing how he did in the last several minutes and the game on the line, then that's definitely open to debate as well.

 

[Bordeaux]

Could've had a game winning drive last year against the Falcons too. Yesterday was a good learning experience, just need to execute better.

[Jandre002]

C'mon. The game was lost on defense and special teams. Give Kirk more time on this. He made some big boy throws out there yesterday and he'll be clutch if given more opportunities.

 

He did make some amazing throws, that one to Garcon on the sideline was the most impressive IMO.

But you have to wonder if, with the pressure on, he just didn't have it. Romo is at times amazing, but the number of times hes choked when the games on the line isn't coincidence. The pressure gets to some people.

 

Cousins, after making extremely difficult throws all game, missed a Jackson and missed a wide open Garcon on that last drive. So its definitely not ability, but seems more like he can't deal with pressure.

 

Could also have been just a bad play by him, which everyone has of course. I'm sure will have a better answer in the weeks to come.

[PMI]

You absolutely cannot expect a QB to pull miracles when the defense and special teams give up a ton of points.  It doesn't work that way.  Sometimes the QB can do it and win those games but if the defense and special teams blow it, then there's not much you can do about it.

 

I agree that the defense and to a larger extent special teams was the big issue yesterday.  But there really were no miracles required out of Cousins.  He had a great day overall and I was very pleasantly surprised with how he ran the offense, but let's face it, he missed a wide open target on 4th and 10, and he missed it very badly.  We complete that pass and we are, at worst, setting up a game-tying field goal.  When it comes to the specific issue of being CLUTCH, that is precisely the kind of strike you make, and he missed it badly.  It is not something I will overreact over going forward, but I do think it's concerning that he was so accurate most of the day but couldn't get us one first down on that last drive, especially after the timeout.

 

In any case though, I loved the way he looked overall.  I was a little worried about whether he could produce a solid game on the road against Philly and he was extremely effective.  Definitely feel better about the situation than I did a few days ago.

[jtown]

I just want to say that being clutch is a myth.  There is a book called "stumbling on wins" and it pretty much uses statistics to prove that clutch is a myth and its more of a reflection of peoples warm memories of paticular events.

 

2nd.  The final drive.  I felt like the eagles stepped upbig time and batted a ton of balls .  And that last play to garcon ( can someone post a replay)  Looked to me like he was double covered and not " wide open" like everyone is claiming.

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

Both of ours QBs have people who they can do no right by. They both have people who are excusing every mistake they make. Often times the people who fall into one category for Cousin, fall into the other category for Griffin and vice versa.

 

I like to think that I'm not doing either of those things. That I've formed an opinion based on what I'm seeing on the field. I'm ready to call it... Cousins is better. You can call me what you like but I'm fairly certain I'll be proven right when only one of them still remains on the team.

[AM626]

I've been told Cousins was pretty clutch in college, and I saw him make some pretty clutch throws last night. I do agree his mechanics broke down the last 10 minutes but Cousins is a different QB than RGIII. He's not the instinctive playmaker that Robert is that starts shining when the game is on the line.
But I think once he settles down and gets more familiar with the offense he will become more consistent throughout the whole game and we will see him improve in the 4th quarter and maybe even start to develop clutchness, if that is a word. For now he looks like a guy that needs to feel a little more confident and can lose his feet when the ground gets shaky, but still color me impressed already with the short playtime he had so far. Let it play out the coming weeks and we will know soon enough if he can develop his play of the 1st half throughout a full game and bring in some W's, at least we're in all these games.

[Voice_of_Reason]

A couple thoughts before I delve into some quote:

 

- Cousins had quite a few late game heroics in college.  

- He came in completely cold in the Ravens game in a critical position and threw a beautiful TD to preserve the season

- He has started 2 meaningful games (I throw all of 2013 away for both Griffin and Cousins as though it didn't happen.) Played pretty well in both, starting in a reserve role, which isn't easy.

 

Is he clutch? No idea.  Ask me after he has 3-4 years of starting experience.  

 

Also, in my opinion, Cousins didn't have a great last drive, but Gruden had a worse drive.  That was the first time the entire game where it looked like Gruden was a first time HC, trying to balance play-calling, time management, etc.  And they didn't do a great job of any of it.  Play calling was suspect. Tried to work the outside with 3 TOs.  Running a play on 1st down that hadn't worked all day. 

 

I think that was the one time Gruden didn't do a good job in game.  Again, I'm not calling for him to be fired, it's his 3rd game.  But he'll look at it, and probably learn from it.  He's coached 3 games, expecting him to be Joe Gibbs (I) in a tight situation is probably not fair.  

You absolutely cannot expect a QB to pull miracles when the defense and special teams give up a ton of points.  It doesn't work that way.  Sometimes the QB can do it and win those games but if the defense and special teams blow it, then there's not much you can do about it.

You can expect a QB, and an offense, to drive the ball and get a tying FG when the D/ST has set them up on the +41.  Regardless of what has come before it. That was the situation that presented itself.  The offense, and Cousins, had the opportunity to be heroes.  They couldn't pull it off.  

 

That is not a referendum about anybody.  It's just simply fact. 

 

C'mon. The game was lost on defense and special teams. Give Kirk more time on this. He made some big boy throws out there yesterday and he'll be clutch if given more opportunities.

It really wasn't.  The game was lost because the offense couldn't score in the final 2 minutes when they were set up on the +41.  They had the opportunity to go in and either tie or win the game.  Everything else is irrelevant.  That's the position you want to be in against a tough team on the road.  If you gave 31 HCs in the NFL a chance to take down by 3 at the 41, 3 TOs + the 2 min warning against the Eagles in Phily, I think all 31 take that and just skip the rest of the game.  

 

Are we having this discussion about a guy with five starts under his belt?  Can we get an actual sample size?  He's only played in two clutch situations in his career in meaningful games.  He's 1 for 2.

I refuse to answer the "clutch" question because of this. 5 starts, 1-1 in the meaningful starts.  

 

It's more like he completed a screen pass that Helu ran for 55 yards lol...

 

But I do agree that the jury is still out on Cousins' being "clutch". He didn't get it done this time, though.

 

What about down 3 with 2:40 left to go...how did he look to you?

The pass to Helu was pretty good, actually.  

 

 

 

He had a bad final drive.  That being said, I find it funny that everyone claims that Garcon was open.  RG3 would not have considered Garcon open on that play - there was a CB between Garcon and Cousins.  Griffin would have waited for Garcon to clear the CB, which may have disrupted the throw or led to a sack if there was pressure on the play.  Everyone is already adjusting their expectations of what constitutes an "open" receiver now that we have a guy who can throw the ball before the receiver makes the break.

I have to ask: Why do you ALWAYS have to bring up how bad you think Griffin is to support your position that Cousins is the second coming of Joe Montana? You have NO IDEA what griffin would have done. You don't know what the game plan would have been.  You don't know if maybe his athletic ability might have frozen the defense and opened up more big plays.  You don't know how well he might have played.  You have absolutely no idea. You can't have any idea because Griffin was probably watching the game with his wife and dog from his living room, and wasn't even in Phily.  

 

You like Cousins.  Fine.  Trumpet how good he was yesterday.  But why in the name of all that is Holy do you feel the need to tear down a guy with a dislocated ankle who PLAYS FOR YOUR TEAM.  That is, assuming you are actually a 'Skins fan, and not just a Cousins fan.

 

Kirk's mechanics go awry when the pocket gets messy or it gets late in the game and it is close.

I think you're right when the pocket gets messy (which can be said about every QB ever), but late in games, I am not sure that's what it effects it. 

[Dan T.]

He did it in college.  With a tiny bit of pro experience under his belt, he can do it in the NFL.

[skins island connection]

 Lets give Cousins some time to get in sync with the offense, mainly the WR/TE communication.  He played very well yesterday, not perfect, but very well; and i'd challenge anyone to find a great QB past or present who hasn't thrown a pic late in a game; it happens, get over it.

 

 Everyone was ready to give Griffin a year or 2 to become a 'pocket passer', yet they don't want to give Cousins 2 games; 2 meaningful games, not games at the end of a season where we're far removed from playoff contention.

 

I would like to say he does, but honestly, none of us really know; it looks promising, but until there is proof and/or time to prove/disprove, this is a moot topic.