NFL.com: Browns, Texans among five teams with new power structures (Redskins related)--MET

[Califan007 The Constipated]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000346645/article/browns-texans-among-five-teams-with-new-power-structures

 

 

 

In 2013, there were just a handful of teams (Patriots, Eagles, Seahawks, Rams, Redskins) whose coaches had final-say power over the 53-man roster. It appeared, too, that the coach-as-dictator model was slowly disappearing, with Andy Reid departing Philly and ceding control to John Dorsey in Kansas City, and just Bill Belichick and Mike Shanahan left as do-everything sideline bosses.

 

That's changed this year, with a twist. No, clubs aren't reaching for the Belichick/Shanahan blueprint. What they're seeking to copy, instead, is pretty predictable: the business plan of the champions.

 

[...]So for the week of the NFL draft, here is our 2014 addendum to the "Who's Really In Charge?" series, with a closer look at that evolving quintet.

 

Washington Redskins

Owner: Dan Snyder, 16th year

General Manager: Bruce Allen, 5th year

Head Coach: Jay Gruden, 1st year

Other front-office notables: Scott Campbell, Director of Player Personnel; Morocco Brown, Director of Pro Personnel.

 

Who's really in charge? Lots of faces are the same, but flowchart structure has been flipped upside down. Under Shanahan, the Redskins were right there with New England as one of the most coach-centric teams in the NFL. Allen now holds the complete personnel control -- right down to final say over the 53-man roster -- that Shanahan previously wielded.

 

In the past, as a GM in Washington and Tampa (and as a senior executive in Oakland), Allen grew a reputation for being a coach's administrator. Thus, he is known to be strong in managing a staff and gathering information. In essence, Campbell runs the personnel side, while Gruden (who knows Allen well from Tampa) runs the coaching operation -- with both reporting to Allen. In the new setup, assistant coaches have been asked to evaluate how players fit into the larger vision that Allen, Gruden and Campbell have put together.

 

Snyder took a step back from the football operation in 2010 to facilitate the hiring of Shanahan. It remains to be seen if that will change with the structure flipping again.

 

An outside perspective from an NFC personnel executive: "There's a more universal approach, and with a universal approach, there are guys that can work together or can't. Bruce has the personality to match it all up, to try to make it work. Jay is very flexible, but pointed on the types of players he wants. Morocco has been around that team so long, he knows the inner workings. ... (Gruden) has been around football his whole life; he understands all the aspects of it. As a head coach, he's responsible for things on a bigger level, but he's been around it. He has a good feel for all that; he's been around his brother. He's innovative with things -- he doesn't have a particular style, he's more into a lot of different things. He understands matchups on offense."

[LD0506]

Of course we have to wait-n-see how this works but I'm pretty comfy with the FO we have now. Allen is a diplomat, has a genuine flair for managing egomaniac owners or coaches and keeping the focus on results. Gruden will have to make the thing run but right now it looks like there is talent to produce and no one is going to have to be looking over their shoulder due to the atmosphere that Allen fosters.

[SWFLSkins]

The dictatorship was a failed model, hopefully democracy functions well with a well liked administrator running it. I like the prospect of this team structure. 

[TheGreatBuzz]

I never understood the "head coach has final say" model.  It would seem that a HC should be busy with so much else that he would be to busy to do a great job with personnel.  He should be able to tell the GM "I envision a player with these traits" or even "I heard about player X, check him out" but he shouldn't be the final say. 

[drowland]

I never understood the "head coach has final say" model.  It would seem that a HC should be busy with so much else that he would be to busy to do a great job with personnel.  He should be able to tell the GM "I envision a player with these traits" or even "I heard about player X, check him out" but he shouldn't be the final say. 

 

I agree.  It works for Belichick because he trains his personel people to scout and write up evaluations the way he would do it.  Pioli, Ozzie, Thomas Dimitroff all learned under Bill.  He's the exception. 

[zoony]

This is clearly the best organizational structure the Redskins have had in Snyders tenure

Two questions for me are

1- do we have the right people and were they vetted properly? I think the answers are "I don't know but i sure hope so" and "no", respectively. The lack of a proper vetting process does not rule out success, just stacks the odds a bit more. So we will see

2- how long will Snyder be content with this hierarchy? Nobody should give him the benefit of the doubt here because he has not earned it.

So those two questions notwithstanding, I am pleased with Snyders decision to overhaul the structure of the organization into a model that is more prone to success. I hope he sticks with it.

[Koolblue13]

I hope we've finally turned the corner and will be a good team again. Nice to see an article written like this.

[rskin72]

This is clearly the best organizational structure the Redskins have had in Snyders tenure

Two questions for me are

1- do we have the right people and were they vetted properly? I think the answers are "I don't know but i sure hope so" and "no", respectively. The lack of a proper vetting process does not rule out success, just stacks the odds a bit more. So we will see

2- how long will Snyder be content with this hierarchy? Nobody should give him the benefit of the doubt here because he has not earned it.

So those two questions notwithstanding, I am pleased with Snyders decision to overhaul the structure of the organization into a model that is more prone to success. I hope he sticks with it.

 

While I agree with you.....especially with the bolded comment....just wonder about your vetting comment?  Who were you referring to, the coach?  Other asst. coaches.....Allen himself? 

[LD0506]

This is clearly the best organizational structure the Redskins have had in Snyders tenure

Two questions for me are

1- do we have the right people and were they vetted properly? I think the answers are "I don't know but i sure hope so" and "no", respectively. The lack of a proper vetting process does not rule out success, just stacks the odds a bit more. So we will see

2- how long will Snyder be content with this hierarchy? Nobody should give him the benefit of the doubt here because he has not earned it.

So those two questions notwithstanding, I am pleased with Snyders decision to overhaul the structure of the organization into a model that is more prone to success. I hope he sticks with it.

 

The "right" people is always subject to opinion and for most fans, only judged by Lombardis. Can they communicate and work well together without having to walk on eggshells because of someone's ego, that to me will be a more valid measure of this FO. As far as vetting, who was supposed to do it? For the most part Bruce Allen was put in a position to build something from the ground up, did you want TheDan doing the vetting? If we're lucky (and as Skins fans we all know what a cruel notion that is) the guys we have now will choose and/or become those able to vet future hires.

 

I agree, I give TheDan the benefit of being willing to allow this incarnation to take shape, that in itself is growth from what we've seen in the past. He's mellowing out, it's just not a quick or easy process.

[ComManDersFan57]

This is clearly the best organizational structure the Redskins have had in Snyders tenure

Two questions for me are

1- do we have the right people and were they vetted properly? I think the answers are "I don't know but i sure hope so" and "no", respectively. The lack of a proper vetting process does not rule out success, just stacks the odds a bit more. So we will see

2- how long will Snyder be content with this hierarchy? Nobody should give him the benefit of the doubt here because he has not earned it.

So those two questions notwithstanding, I am pleased with Snyders decision to overhaul the structure of the organization into a model that is more prone to success. I hope he sticks with it.

I agree with number 1 completely. We'll see.

 

2. Who knows how long Snyder will be content? Has a head coach under his regime ever lasted to the end of his contract? I think Snyder gives this hierarchy a couple of years. If we aren't winning consistently by the end of year two I have a feeling that he'll be ready to make a change again.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I agree with number 1 completely. We'll see.

 

2. Who knows how long Snyder will be content? Has a head coach under his regime ever lasted to the end of his contract? I think Snyder gives this hierarchy a couple of years. If we aren't winning consistently by the end of year two I have a feeling that he'll be ready to make a change again.

 How do you "win consistently" in a two-year period? Does that mean that both seasons need to be over .500?

[ComManDersFan57]

 How do you "win consistently" in a two-year period? Does that mean that both seasons need to be over .500?

 

I meant "by the end of two years", not over a two year period. In other words, if we start winning most of our games in the second half or so of the season in 2015, I think Snyder will stay with the present hierarchy. Of course, if we have winning seasons both years he'd be a fool to change.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I meant "by the end of two years", not over a two year period. In other words, if we start winning most of our games in the second half or so of the season in 2015, I think Snyder will stay with the present hierarchy. Of course, if we have winning seasons both years he'd be a fool to change.

 

Oh I see what you mean. I really hope he gives this regime more than two years. There's really no way to know anything in that amount of time. Shanahan had a 7-1 second half of 2012 and that didn't mean too much. It was BB's third year, but after 2002, was there any reason to believe that the Pats (5-11, 11-5/SB, 9-7) were anything other than a one-hit-wonder?

[ComManDersFan57]

Yeah, I hope he gives it more than two years too. I was pissed when he only gave Marty one year.

[Taylor 36]

2. Who knows how long Snyder will be content? Has a head coach under his regime ever lasted to the end of his contract? I think Snyder gives this hierarchy a couple of years. If we aren't winning consistently by the end of year two I have a feeling that he'll be ready to make a change again.

If you look at facts and reality, and don't go for a ride on the media's spin wagon, you'll see that coaches not lasting to the end of their contracts is not all on Snyder, and mostly the best calls.  With the exception of Marty, which Snyder has admitted that firing him was a mistake on his part, Snyder has not cut a coach's tenure here short that didn't deserve to be let go.

 

1. Turner - Snyder inherited Norval, who had three weeks shy of a full seven seasons to coach this team.  His record speaks for itself, and it is debatable whether or not Snyder fired him at the right time, Turner needing to go really isn't.

 

2. Marty - Bad decision by Snyder, which he has admitted publicly, though he wanted to keep Marty as coach; he just wanted Marty to give up some of the control, which Marty refused to do.  Had Marty cooperated and stayed as coach, he may have been able to work with Snyder on getting a good GM in here and kept Vinny from coming back (Marty would have never worked with Vinny).  It is amazing to stop and think of how this franchise might be different today had that happened.

 

3. Spurrier - The Ol' Ball Coach quit.  Snyder was planning on giving him at least another season, but Stevie decided that he would rather play golf.  That is not on Snyder.

 

4. Gibbs - Gibbs decided to go back into retirement with one year left on his contract.  Snyder didn't, and probably never would have even entertained the idea of firing Gibbs.  Again, not on Snyder.

 

5. Zorn - Anyone who doesn't give Snyder a standing ovation for firing Jimbo doesn't understand football.

 

6. Shanahan - It appears that the majority of the fans were thrilled that Snyder fired Mike with one year left on his deal.  There are enough threads on this site that give plenty of reason why that was the right move.

 

So, I really think this "impatience" thing about Snyder is well overblown.  I also believe that Snyder will give Bruce all the time he wants because, like Gibbs, Bruce has a historic family connection to the Redskins, and, though it was not great for the team, Snyder stuck by Vinny for a very long time.  If he could put up with Vinny's incompetence and the products that were fielded because of him for as long as he did, there is no way he is going to short-leash Bruce with his name and experience and understanding of the game.  Say what you want about Bruce (I know there are many that question is ability to be a true GM), but on his worst day, he is 1000 times better than Vinny is.

 

I think Snyder will give this way more than two years, though, I'm hoping our record during that time will make all of this a moot point.

[Riggo-toni]

Schotferbrains could've stayed on if he'd been willing to give up GM duties and replace uber-useless Jimmy Raye. He insisted on keeping full control, which would've run us into the ground. His 01 draft was putrid, and he gave fat contracts to bubble players like Lockett because they were loyal sycophants. Raye was hands down the WORST OC in the NFL.

When Schothead took the job in SD, they made the same demands Dan did -no say over personnel and NO Jimmy Raye. People need to stop idealizing the Schothead era.

[ComManDersFan57]

 

So, I really think this "impatience" thing about Snyder is well overblown.

 

I think Snyder will give this way more than two years, though, I'm hoping our record during that time will make all of this a moot point.

 

Yeah, I do agree that the impatience thing is a bit overblown. Most of us know which coaches quit and which ones were fired and why. (Thanks for the list though) The fact still remains that these coaches didn't complete their contracts under Snyder. I also hope that the record makes all of this a moot point! We all just want to win.

[Taylor 36]

Schotferbrains could've stayed on if he'd been willing to give up GM duties and replace uber-useless Jimmy Raye. He insisted on keeping full control, which would've run us into the ground. His 01 draft was putrid, and he gave fat contracts to bubble players like Lockett because they were loyal sycophants. Raye was hands down the WORST OC in the NFL.

When Schothead took the job in SD, they made the same demands Dan did -no say over personnel and NO Jimmy Raye. People need to stop idealizing the Schothead era.

Not sure if your post was directed at mine, but I did say in my post that the reason why he was fired was because he refused to give up control.  I also said that had he agreed with Snyder's new terms, we may have been able to get this team back on track a lot sooner, because he wouldn't have been in control, but he wouldn't have agreed to work with Vinny.  So, someone else would have been brought in, possibly someone who could have made the right kinds of personnel decision we needed (regardless, anyone would have been better than Vinny). In no way am I idealizing Marty and his time here.  He was fired because he was stubborn, which, given the circumstances, I can't blame Snyder 100% for.

[Voice_of_Reason]

This is clearly the best organizational structure the Redskins have had in Snyders tenure

Two questions for me are

1- do we have the right people and were they vetted properly? I think the answers are "I don't know but i sure hope so" and "no", respectively. The lack of a proper vetting process does not rule out success, just stacks the odds a bit more. So we will see

2- how long will Snyder be content with this hierarchy? Nobody should give him the benefit of the doubt here because he has not earned it.

So those two questions notwithstanding, I am pleased with Snyders decision to overhaul the structure of the organization into a model that is more prone to success. I hope he sticks with it.

I think it's worth noting that technically (and I do mean technically) the 'Skins have had this exact same structure before.

 

Vinny was the Executive VP of Football Operations, and Zorn worked for him.  Like Gruden works for Allen. Vinny Technically had final say over personnel.  Hell, he even hired the OC and DC before failing to find a coach and promoting the OC.  Even the personnel guys who worked for VInny are the same guys who now work for Allen.  

 

The structure was the same.  Snyder, who sits in the same chair now as he did then (Owner) decided to be involved in the decision making process.  He could do that again.  There is nothing stopping him from doing that again, though we all hope he does not.  

 

What we all hope is:

 

1. Snyder allows Allen to run the show, managing the personnel group and the coaching group. 

2. That Allen is at least 1000 times more competent than VInny.  

3. That Gruden is at least 1000 times more competent than Zorn. 

 

Vinny and Zorn did, admittedly, set the bar pretty low. 

[TexasSkinsFan]

Schotferbrains could've stayed on if he'd been willing to give up GM duties and replace uber-useless Jimmy Raye. He insisted on keeping full control, which would've run us into the ground. His 01 draft was putrid, and he gave fat contracts to bubble players like Lockett because they were loyal sycophants. Raye was hands down the WORST OC in the NFL.

When Schothead took the job in SD, they made the same demands Dan did -no say over personnel and NO Jimmy Raye. People need to stop idealizing the Schothead era.

 

Out of likes but this I agree with. I like that the team started off losing the first 5 games then ended the season 8-8, but there was a lot more to this story then people remember.

[Riggo-toni]

Sorry T36- NOT aimed at you; just venting my frustration at people on this board who are nostalgic for a guy who went 8-8...A guy I Never wanted hired in the 1st place, and I was tap dancing the instant I learned he was gone.

[Taylor 36]

Sorry T36- NOT aimed at you; just venting my frustration at people on this board who are nostalgic for a guy who went 8-8...A guy I Never wanted hired in the 1st place, and I was tap dancing the instant I learned he was gone.

No worries, I just wanted to make sure that you didn't misread my post.  I was never a big fan of Marty's, and my brother was absolutely LIVID when the hiring was announced. 

[TheLongshot]

The reality is that Snyder has stepped back since he hired Gibbs.  He's done what owners should do: give their football people what they want.  Course, the problem is that he's made mistakes along the way: not having a GM-type person running football operations under Gibbs, then having that lack forcing him to promote Vinny (admittedly on Gibbs' recommendation.) and not really being prepared for a coaching search, hiring the not ready for the job Zorn to be the head coach.  To be honest, I felt sorry for Zorn because he really was set up for failure.

 

While I understand the attraction to give a successful head coach full control, not many are successful at doing that.  The priorities of a head coach are different than the ones for a personnel guy.  Head coaches are concerned about the upcoming season.  Personnel guys are looking toward the future, planning out how the roster will look and what is still needed.  I had thought from the very beginning that giving Shanahan full control was a bad idea, and I think the team has suffered because of it.

 

I do hope now that Shanahan is gone that we can finally build the team.  We will have to see if our personnel guys are the right ones now that they have control.  I'm looking forward to seeing it.

[Voice_of_Reason]

The reality is that Snyder has stepped back since he hired Gibbs. He's done what owners should do: give their football people what they want. Course, the problem is that he's made mistakes along the way: not having a GM-type person running football operations under Gibbs, then having that lack forcing him to promote Vinny (admittedly on Gibbs' recommendation.) and not really being prepared for a coaching search, hiring the not ready for the job Zorn to be the head coach. To be honest, I felt sorry for Zorn because he really was set up for failure.

While I understand the attraction to give a successful head coach full control, not many are successful at doing that. The priorities of a head coach are different than the ones for a personnel guy. Head coaches are concerned about the upcoming season. Personnel guys are looking toward the future, planning out how the roster will look and what is still needed. I had thought from the very beginning that giving Shanahan full control was a bad idea, and I think the team has suffered because of it.

I do hope now that Shanahan is gone that we can finally build the team. We will have to see if our personnel guys are the right ones now that they have control. I'm looking forward to seeing it.

Snyder did not step back during the Zorn years.

[zoony]

The "right" people is always subject to opinion and for most fans, only judged by Lombardis. Can they communicate and work well together without having to walk on eggshells because of someone's ego, that to me will be a more valid measure of this FO. As far as vetting, who was supposed to do it? For the most part Bruce Allen was put in a position to build something from the ground up, did you want TheDan doing the vetting? If we're lucky (and as Skins fans we all know what a cruel notion that is) the guys we have now will choose and/or become those able to vet future hires.

 

I agree, I give TheDan the benefit of being willing to allow this incarnation to take shape, that in itself is growth from what we've seen in the past. He's mellowing out, it's just not a quick or easy process.

To be clear I was referring to the vetting of Allen