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2014 Comprehensive Nfl Draft Database


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This is the same website that said Shariff Floyd was a guaranteed top 10 pick. I also disagree about McCullers, just because he is big doesn't mean he needs a double team, something you see on all of his college tape.. But that is just my opinion, you can choose to agree or disagree. When it's all said and done I'm sure I will be wrong on a number of guys anyways. You never know with the draft.

 

You could say the same about Dontari Poe, who was on nobody's radar until he had a ridiculous combine and turned into a first round pick. 

 

Scouts thought he would be a bust, because he was just a workout warrior, and he's one of the best DT's in the game now.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you, in a sense that you just never know when it comes to the draft

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You could say the same about Dontari Poe, who was on nobody's radar until he had a ridiculous combine and turned into a first round pick. 

 

Scouts thought he would be a bust, because he was just a workout warrior, and he's one of the best DT's in the game now.

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you, in a sense that you just never know when it comes to the draft

Please tell me you are not comparing Poe to Mccullers..

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I recommend checking out Pryor vs Rutgers.  That's probably the best game from a safety I've seen this year.  That Louisville defense lines its safeties up so deep.  I'm impressed with his ability to come from 25 yards deep to help in run support.  That game is really what got my high on Pryor.  I feel like since safeties work in so much space, one of the most important traits is taking the right angle to the play, and I don't think any safety in this class matches his ability in doing that.

Did a second round of charting on the SAFs and took your suggestion: Calvin Pryor vs Rutger, Terrence Brooks vs Boston College and Deone Bucannon vs Oregon (2012)

 

Calvin Pryor:

29 plays/ 17 plus/ 1 minus/+2.5 cov

(Second highest score thus far after D.Buc vs Stanford)

 

Overall from this game: Usually brought his arms to wrap; cut tackle at times but with pop w/ only 1 miss. Took good pursuit paths to the ball carrier. Played with aggression/uregency. Fought aggressively to take on and shed blocks; play (22) stacked up a blocker and made a tackle for loss. Physical presence against receivers in the middle of the field. Very active. Good coverage awareness to drive and break on ball for interception in 2-deep. Quick and fluid movement. Versatile played some Center field some half field and played some in the box SS.

 

Terrence Brooks:

31 plays/ 8 plus/ 4 minus

 

Overall from this game: Usually brought his arms to wrap. Missed on a couple of cut/dive tackles and 1 poor angle but usually took good pursuit paths to ball carrier. Worked to get off blocks. Fluid movement more fast then quick/sudden. Played a some snaps as Center field FS and some in the box.

Seemed more like a SS but could see him playing FS.

 

Deone Bucannon:

29 plays 11 plus/ 3 minus/+4 cov

 

Overall from this game: Sometimes brought arms to wrap; cut tackle at times 2 missed. Took good pursuit paths to the ball carrier. Played with aggression/urgency. Very active. 2 interceptions breaking on passes thrown in front of him. Quick, efficient  movement.

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Did a second round of charting on the SAFs and took your suggestion: Calvin Pryor vs Rutger, Terrence Brooks vs Boston College and Deone Bucannon vs Oregon (2012)

Calvin Pryor:

29 plays/ 17 plus/ 1 minus/+2.5 cov

(Second highest score thus far after D.Buc vs Stanford)

Overall from this game: Usually brought his arms to wrap; cut tackle at times but with pop w/ only 1 miss. Took good pursuit paths to the ball carrier. Played with aggression/uregency. Fought aggressively to take on and shed blocks; play (22) stacked up a blocker and made a tackle for loss. Physical presence against receivers in the middle of the field. Very active. Good coverage awareness to drive and break on ball for interception in 2-deep. Quick and fluid movement. Versatile played some Center field some half field and played some in the box SS.

Terrence Brooks:

31 plays/ 8 plus/ 4 minus

Overall from this game: Usually brought his arms to wrap. Missed on a couple of cut/dive tackles and 1 poor angle but usually took good pursuit paths to ball carrier. Worked to get off blocks. Fluid movement more fast then quick/sudden. Played a some snaps as Center field FS and some in the box.

Seemed more like a SS but could see him playing FS.

Deone Bucannon:

29 plays 11 plus/ 3 minus/+4 cov

Overall from this game: Sometimes brought arms to wrap; cut tackle at times 2 missed. Took good pursuit paths to the ball carrier. Played with aggression/urgency. Very active. 2 interceptions breaking on passes thrown in front of him. Quick, efficient movement.

Told you Pryor was good :)
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I must not be getting something about Christian Jones, maybe his 2012 film is a lot different.  But from the two videos of him against Miami and NC State in 2013, he was on the LoS so much he probably had his hand in the dirt more than 50% of the time.

 

How do we know he'll transition to ILB in a 3-4 well?

 

Christian Jones played Weak,Middle, and Strong side LB over his career at Flordia State. He had a great year in 2012 and considered coming out early but the advisory panel suggested he could be a first round selection with another year in school, Jones stayed but Florida State needed to use him at DE to replace the lost production of Brandon Jenkins and Bjoern Werner, So Jones turned into a jack of all trades.

 

Christian Jones-ILB and De'Anthony Thomas-Slot WR/KR/PR are my man crushes so far in the draft process.. 

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Your score is: 4089 (Drafting Ability: B+, Player Quality A, Future Draft Picks: N/A) 

Your Picks:
Round 2 Pick 15 (BALT): David Yankey, OG, Stanford (A-)
Round 3 Pick 3 (OAK): Seantrel Henderson, OT, Miami (Fla.) (A-)
Round 3 Pick 20 (ARI): Morgan Moses, OT, Virginia (B+)
Round 4 Pick 2: Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh (A)
Round 4 Pick 6 (CLE): Josh Mauro, DE, Stanford (A)
Round 4 Pick 7 (OAK): Pierre Desir, CB, Lindenwood (B+)
Round 4 Pick 11 (DET): Troy Niklas, TE, Notre Dame (A)
Round 4 Pick 17 (CHI): Kenny Ladler, FS, Vanderbilt (A)
Round 4 Pick 19 (DAL): A.J. Johnson, ILB, Tennessee (A)
Round 5 Pick 2: Stanley Jean-Baptiste, CB, Nebraska (B-)
Round 5 Pick 16 (CHI): Jeremy Hill, RB, LSU (A)
Round 6 Pick 2: Colt Lyerla, TE, Oregon (C-)
Round 6 Pick 13 (DET): Ricardo Allen, CB, Purdue (B-)
Round 7 Pick 2: Jeremy Gallon, WR, Michigan (A)
Round 7 Pick 12 (DET): Vinnie Sunseri, SS, Alabama (A)

 

Impossible, but we can dream right?

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If he is 220 or 230 it doesn't matter at all. Just like it doesn't matter if a guy is 5'11 or 6'0. Anyway about Jones, I'm not saying i'm against drafting him at all, I just don't think he could be a day 1 starter. I mean, even his biggest fans have to admit that Jones is slated as a 2nd-3rd rounder for a reason despite his very apparent size and speed combo. 

 

Try his listed weight at 218.  If he was 230 I wouldn't care either.  Heck, I love Shazier and he's only about 230, but that is light enough.  MOST 5'11 guys can't play in the nfl, just like MOST 218 pound linebackers can't.  If he shows up at the combine at 230 then by all means pull the trigger, but under 220 is just too light to handle the rigors of playing inside in a 3-4.

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Christian Jones played Weak,Middle, and Strong side LB over his career at Flordia State. He had a great year in 2012 and considered coming out early but the advisory panel suggested he could be a first round selection with another year in school, Jones stayed but Florida State needed to use him at DE to replace the lost production of Brandon Jenkins and Bjoern Werner, So Jones turned into a jack of all trades.

 

Christian Jones-ILB and De'Anthony Thomas-Slot WR/KR/PR are my man crushes so far in the draft process.. 

 

I've seen Thomas rated in the 6th round on a lot of sites, but it's hard for me to believe he'll go there.  Something tells me a fast 40 time will get him picked in the 2nd or 3rd.  His career best in the 100 meter is 10.31, comparatively cj2k's best in that event was 10.38 and Heyward-Bey's was 10.44.  Then again, Trindon Holliday's was an insane 9.98 and he only clocked a 4.34 (though some reports say he actually was as low as 4.18).  I think he'll clock in the low 4.3's and I don't see how he lasts past the 3rd.

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If he is 220 or 230 it doesn't matter at all. Just like it doesn't matter if a guy is 5'11 or 6'0. Anyway about Jones, I'm not saying i'm against drafting him at all, I just don't think he could be a day 1 starter. I mean, even his biggest fans have to admit that Jones is slated as a 2nd-3rd rounder for a reason despite his very apparent size and speed combo. 

 

It matters..Smith will most likely be moved to SS and be used as an in the box player.  

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Your score is: 4089 (Drafting Ability: B+, Player Quality A, Future Draft Picks: N/A) 

Your Picks:

Round 2 Pick 15 (BALT): David Yankey, OG, Stanford (A-)

Round 3 Pick 3 (OAK): Seantrel Henderson, OT, Miami (Fla.) (A-)

...........

.............

 

Impossible, but we can dream right?

The trade down options that site offers are moronic, and I don't think anyone in this thread wants to waste time on discussions based on them.

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I totally agree with you, but just felt like posting for fun. I was bored during contracts class.

There's a whole thread for that. 

 

http://es.redskins.com/topic/365692-draft-simulator-makes-you-the-gmtry-your-hand-at-selecting-players-for-the-skins/

 

The posters in this thread take these discussions pretty seriously and aren't going to be interested in really unrealistic mocks.

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guards would have a field day against Smith. 

 

Guards have a field day against Shazier, period. Shazier can't shed to save his life, but he's ok?

 

In fact it's not just Guards, any TE, any player really who gets to him, Shazier is not making the tackle. He only beats people by use of speed. If he's untouched, has a free and clear field, he'll make the tackle. If he can chase laterally, he'll run things down. He can shoot gaps or beat an o-lineman to a spot.

 

But forget about him blowing up the hole and stymieing an O-lineman.

Heck, fullbacks would have fun pushing him out of the hole.

Cite examples.

 

Because you have influence enough around here that the drive-bye person may actually start to believe this as truth. I watched Smith take on Zach Martin, head-up in the hole, during the Senior Bowl game and he held his ground, WHILE, also adding an assisted tackle on the play.

 

So that example stands in direct contrast to your supposition that FBs would lick their chops for a shot at T. Smith, notwithstanding, your thesis that Smith would lose the battle.

 

In fact that whole Senior Bowl was a clear statement from Smith that he belongs in the league. I mean for someone who is supposedly a liability against the run, he sure as heck made a ton of plays versus the run while against the top collegiate talent, including a possible (likely) 1st rounder in Z. Martin.

 

And you don't have to look that far to find copious evidence of Smith using great speed, great hustle, to make a play against the run, or in the screen game, or showcasing coverage ability:

- www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfuLAR2gDes

- www.youtube.com/watch?v=zalycQA5YiA

- www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFiB1QVZHQY

 

So, has Smith been moved out of the hole before? - Yes. But to start down the path of saying it's a foregone conclusion that he is a liability against blockers, or that he is somehow distinctly worse than say someone like Shazier, is inaccurate, IMO.

 

I'd actually say that Shazier is more of a liability when taking on blockers.

 

In fact, I'll cite one of Shazier's better games versus Indiana, as an example. He had a ton of tackles that game, he accumulated a bunch of stats, but when the handful of times that a Guard, or TE, or Tackle got to him ... nothing from Shazier.

 

Now those handful of plays were maybe in the range of 3 or 4 times for that specific game (nothing to alter the outcome), however, it was clear as day the difference between untouched Shazier and touched Shazier.

 

Again, where's the cut-up of the IOWA game?

 

Doesn't exist. Yeah, let me tell you this, Iowa stood in there with Ohio State punch for punch. And you don't have be a genius to realize the disparity in athletic abilities between the two programs.

 

I'll tell you what I saw from Shazier during the Iowa game, I saw a guy who got punch drunk. I saw a guy who progressively and "momentously" began to slow down his tempo and his speed (which happens to be his key athletic attribute) after the constant and relentlessly consistent attack of the Iowa run game.

 

In other words: Shazier got mollywhopped.

 

To translate: He got popped in the mouth, and then popped again, and yet still the waves of runs kept coming. And as the game wore on, I saw Shazier go from a guy with speed as his best asset, to basically catching blockers. He was just going through the motions. He clearly slowed down to the eye and started to receive blows rather than dish them out.

 

Like a boxer, he stopped crow-hopping, circling and just hunkered down ready to receive another jab.

 

Iowa went oldschool on him and he didn't respond.

 

I literally witnessed a play where Brandon Scherff released to the 2nd-Level on a Zone run, the run was to Scherff's side & playside toward Shazier, and Scherff met Shazier and hit him so forcefully that it literally knocked Shazier off his feet and flung him around like a helicopter blade.

 

I sat up and started to laugh, because you see things like that in the High School level when a D-1 guy plows over someone who's ceiling is just H.S.

 

It was like a cartoon. Scherff just smoked him that one play.

...

Now, while I think Shazier is going to make plays in the NFL based solely on his athleticism, which I'd cite his key attributes as being quickness & speed, I think he can just survive on that.

But will he thrive? - IDK.

 

I have some reservations on Shazier and one of them is his lack of consistency, also, but especially how he looks when taking on blockers.

 

Prime example: The Orange Bowl. Watch as #62 (who?) for Clemson clears Shazier out of the way for a Tajh Boyd 50+ yard designed QB run, TD.

 

Almost a microcosm, vignette, into Shazier's lack of stoutness at the POA vs blockers.

Matt Millen describes it perfectly @ the 0:50 seconds to 1:00 minute mark of the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1G5vLU_YCBI#t=63

 

BUT the key attribute I dislike is that he really looks vaguely disinterested in pass coverage. I mean, he literally just drops into Zone and hovers there. There's really no suddenness or quick twitch about him.

 

If the play comes directly to him, he can maybe put a hand on the ball. He did that vs Indiana. It was a simple play. But, overall, I didn't see that speed or quickness show up in pass coverage in single-man match-ups.

 

Maybe I haven't seen the right tape but call me basically unimpressed (with pass coverage).

...

Yet, we still seem to be confused as to what out current LBs were lacking last year versus our "traditional" biases as it pertains to the 3-4.

 

We run a lot of "Nickel." In fact, I'd say "Nickel" is truly our "Base" Defense. We run 2-4-5 the majority of the time. We should be able to realize that we are much less a traditional 3-4, with big fatties 2-Gapping and two big 260+ lbs interior LBs.

 

That traditional 3-4 would be great if we were still facing Gibbs' teams that ran 30+ times a game, but when we face 40+ passes a game, we need to shift the philosophy just a tad.

 

And you know, and I know, that our interior LBs were ass in pass coverage last year.

 

And to be clear, Smith is perhaps one the best, in this year's class, at being a multidimensional LB who can cover the pass, as well as, fill. I have no question about T. Smith coming in to play the pass. And I'm buoyed by what he did vs Auburn & especially in the Senior Bowl against the run.

 

He was so lively and active during the Senior Bowl, it just popped from the screen.

 

He's a more athletic, a more heady & a more charismatic leader type of version, to someone who I really wanted on the team last year, in Phillip Steward.

 

There's no lack of effort when it comes to T. Smith's ability to stick his nose in there during run plays as well.

 

But even if a team were to run a bunch, predominately pound the rock, that's why you have package groups. That's why Riley is around. Riley can load up versus the run.

 

So even if you send out the Nickel group because the offense subbed guys and that was your key to them passing the ball, even if they ran it with Smith out there, I'd expect him to step up and handle it.

 

If the offense went Super-Jumbo, then yeah, you probably sub package out Smith. My point is that you might have to do that with 'ole Whoopi Goldberg there as well.

 

This is what seattle does, they have a package group for everything and therefore their team has a lot of specialized players.

 

You know, they got one big fatty for something like playing the run and one slender speedster for something else, passrush. Whereas we have neither or another, just a bunch of dudes ok at something but not excelling at anything.

 

OK, my rant is over.

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Good rant Monk. :P

 

I haven't watched enough of these guys to say how that play against blockers, so can't add to that discussion.

 

But I do believe that scheme wise you can play to a players strenght. I think a Frazier can be highly effective if you have your dline + OLB block the o-line. He needs to have free running lanes. Basically what you want is to create running lanes for him...just like the o-line does for the RB. That's a way to use a LB who is pretty bad at shedding blockers. 

 

About the FB in the hole, how many teams still a FB? Is that a real probleme, or do the most teams rather place a 3th WR on the field? 'The spread'. In that case you rather want a coverage LB with speed. 

 

In a perfect world you have a LB who does it all, but I'm thinking in matchups. If most of the league spread you out, then you better have a ILB who can cover and stuff. In that case blockshedding becomes less important. 

 

I don't know if that is a fact, the spreading people out/no fb, but we might need to look a little different to the skillset of a LB then we are used to. 

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Your score is: 4089 (Drafting Ability: B+, Player Quality A, Future Draft Picks: N/A) 

Your Picks:

Round 2 Pick 15 (BALT): David Yankey, OG, Stanford (A-)

Round 3 Pick 3 (OAK): Seantrel Henderson, OT, Miami (Fla.) (A-)

Round 3 Pick 20 (ARI): Morgan Moses, OT, Virginia (B+)

Round 4 Pick 2: Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh (A)

Round 4 Pick 6 (CLE): Josh Mauro, DE, Stanford (A)

Round 4 Pick 7 (OAK): Pierre Desir, CB, Lindenwood (B+)

Round 4 Pick 11 (DET): Troy Niklas, TE, Notre Dame (A)

Round 4 Pick 17 (CHI): Kenny Ladler, FS, Vanderbilt (A)

Round 4 Pick 19 (DAL): A.J. Johnson, ILB, Tennessee (A)

Round 5 Pick 2: Stanley Jean-Baptiste, CB, Nebraska (B-)

Round 5 Pick 16 (CHI): Jeremy Hill, RB, LSU (A)

Round 6 Pick 2: Colt Lyerla, TE, Oregon (C-)

Round 6 Pick 13 (DET): Ricardo Allen, CB, Purdue (B-)

Round 7 Pick 2: Jeremy Gallon, WR, Michigan (A)

Round 7 Pick 12 (DET): Vinnie Sunseri, SS, Alabama (A)

 

Impossible, but we can dream right?

 

Only in the valley.

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I'm a little behind in the thread, but if the draft is so deep at Wr, does it make sense picking one at #34?

Regarding Bowen/Carriker and Wilson/Biggers, I'd rather cut them all and bring in one upper tier guy for each spot (and then let the young guys/rooks fight it out for the 4th spot). Worst case we can maybe bring one from each position back if things don't shake out how we want.

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I'm a little behind in the thread, but if the draft is so deep at Wr, does it make sense picking one at #34?

Regarding Bowen/Carriker and Wilson/Biggers, I'd rather cut them all and bring in one upper tier guy for each spot (and then let the young guys/rooks fight it out for the 4th spot). Worst case we can maybe bring one from each position back if things don't shake out how we want.

 

I think I remember reading somewhere that the rounds where you have an above average success rate for landing a good WR are the 1st, 2nd, and 7th rounds.  Now this is all proportional, so a small % of successes in the 7th round at WR could still be above average, simply due to how few players drafted in the 7th actually pan out.

 

Ah, found it.

 

http://eaglesrewind.com/2013/01/30/hacking-the-draft-default-positional-targets-by-round/

 

Chart with the below average rounds left blank.

screen-shot-2013-01-30-at-10-29-40-am.pn

 

 

 

The full chart.

screen-shot-2013-01-29-at-10-54-06-am.pn

 

 

 

So going from this, we can see that the chances we get a good WR drop way down once we hit the 3rd round.  Now since this draft class is considered a bit deeper for WR, these numbers could change some, but I feel like with the #34 pick, we could find ourselves picking up a WR that's legitimately a 1st round talent in most other drafts.  And that increases our odds of getting a successful WR.

 

Fun fact for Redskins fans.  This data ends in 2011, Alfred Morris defies that 0% in the 6th round for RB's!

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I think I remember reading somewhere that the rounds where you have an above average success rate for landing a good WR are the 1st, 2nd, and 7th rounds.  Now this is all proportional, so a small % of successes in the 7th round at WR could still be above average, simply due to how few players drafted in the 7th actually pan out.

 

yada, yada, yada...

 

Fun fact for Redskins fans.  This data ends in 2011, Alfred Morris defies that 0% in the 6th round for RB's!

Now I preface this with the fact that none of us really know how these players wil turn out until after the fact, but I just know that every time I've done a mock (and I've done far more than rational thought would allow) I always found myself kicking..err..myself if I went WR with our 2nd rounder because there were ALWAYS guys I liked later at WR but at other positions I wasn't as impressed.  Grabbing an Aaron Donald at 34 or some other position than WR always looked better to me then when I went WR first.

 

Not because I didn't like my 2nd round WR, but more because my overall draft felt weaker when I took the WR first.

 

Just my observation/assessment.

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Try his listed weight at 218.  If he was 230 I wouldn't care either.  Heck, I love Shazier and he's only about 230, but that is light enough.  MOST 5'11 guys can't play in the nfl, just like MOST 218 pound linebackers can't.  If he shows up at the combine at 230 then by all means pull the trigger, but under 220 is just too light to handle the rigors of playing inside in a 3-4.

You "love" Shazier, yet he is 230. So what is the difference between 217 and 230? Would be suddenly be a better player if he was 230? No. Cleveland's ILB is 6'0 220 and has been a top 5 ILB for years. I also guarantee he won't show up at the combine weighting 217. 

I'm a little behind in the thread, but if the draft is so deep at Wr, does it make sense picking one at #34?

Regarding Bowen/Carriker and Wilson/Biggers, I'd rather cut them all and bring in one upper tier guy for each spot (and then let the young guys/rooks fight it out for the 4th spot). Worst case we can maybe bring one from each position back if things don't shake out how we want.

Why cut them when it would do more harm then good. 

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Good rant Monk. :P

 

I haven't watched enough of these guys to say how that play against blockers, so can't add to that discussion.

 

But I do believe that scheme wise you can play to a players strenght. I think a Frazier can be highly effective if you have your dline + OLB block the o-line. He needs to have free running lanes. Basically what you want is to create running lanes for him...just like the o-line does for the RB. That's a way to use a LB who is pretty bad at shedding blockers. 

 

About the FB in the hole, how many teams still a FB? Is that a real probleme, or do the most teams rather place a 3th WR on the field? 'The spread'. In that case you rather want a coverage LB with speed. 

 

In a perfect world you have a LB who does it all, but I'm thinking in matchups. If most of the league spread you out, then you better have a ILB who can cover and stuff. In that case blockshedding becomes less important. 

 

I don't know if that is a fact, the spreading people out/no fb, but we might need to look a little different to the skillset of a LB then we are used to. 

He is 1000000% right about Shazier. His first step quickness is so good that most of the time the slower guards in college football couldn't get to him. Now, in the NFL, everyone is quick and fast, even the linemen and you cannot live on athleticism. People will compare him to L. David but David is a much much faster player and put on 10 pounds of muscle from college to the pros. There is also a 0% chance that Shazier plays ILB in a 3-4, not just because of his size but because he plays with no strength or ability to shed blockers. 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/01/27/refo-north-vs-south-2014-senior-bowl/

 

Found this article pretty interesting. 

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