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ESPN: 20 NFL coaches of all time

Farbod21

By Farbod21
in The Stadium

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Voice_of_Reason

Voice_of_Reason

Posted
Posted
Gibbs beat Shula straight up in SBXVII. That's how Gibbs goes above Shula. He also beat Bud Grant & Tom Landry in the playoffs to get there.

Yeah, I'm not sure I can fully buy that argument. With that logic, Tom Flores gets a vote because he beat Gibbs straight up (and rather convincingly) in SuperBowl XV.

Again, I think Gibbs is amazing and incredible in what he was able to do with 3 good to very good QBs. But what Shula did, the consistency and the records, it's very difficult to put him anywhere but right up at the top. .

---------- Post added May-21st-2013 at 08:14 PM ----------

Nope. Never happened.

I believe that Holmgren and Parcells are the only two to win one with one team and get there with another.

Yes, that is true, Interestingly, Parcells' New England Patriots lost to Holmgren's Green Bay Packers.

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DC9

DC9

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Yeah, I'm not sure I can fully buy that argument. With that logic, Tom Flores gets a vote because he beat Gibbs straight up (and rather convincingly) in SuperBowl XV.

Again, I think Gibbs is amazing and incredible in what he was able to do with 3 good to very good QBs. But what Shula did, the consistency and the records, it's very difficult to put him anywhere but right up at the top. .

Devil's Advocate... Shula got to play the Pats, Jets, and Bills... along with the Colts for YEARS. He wouldn't have been so sparkly in the NFC East during Gibbs I's tenure when more often than not the Champion of the East was winning the Super Bowl.

The Raiders and Steelers of the 70s were very good, but when they got great, Shula wasn't very good. When the AFC as a whole got better (Elway, Kelley, etc) Shula got very average.... even with Marino.

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Gart Monk

Gart Monk

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Yeah, I'm not sure I can fully buy that argument. With that logic, Tom Flores gets a vote because he beat Gibbs straight up (and rather convincingly) in SuperBowl XV.

Tom Flores definitely gets a vote, perhaps he should get in over Coughlin. Him and Shanahan are in the same boat IMO.

Gibbs beat Grant, Landry & Shula in 1982. He beat Walsh the next year. Then he vanquished the juggernaut 46 defense before destroying Reeves/Elway in 1987. Finally he regrouped and won 1991 like it was nothing.

Gibbs won a SB with Rypien. Shula lost SBs with Marino & Unitas.

Gotta go with Gibbs for quality over quanity.

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Voice_of_Reason

Voice_of_Reason

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Devil's Advocate... Shula got to play the Pats, Jets, and Bills... along with the Colts for YEARS. He wouldn't have been so sparkly in the NFC East during Gibbs I's tenure when more often than not the Champion of the East was winning the Super Bowl.

The Raiders and Steelers of the 70s were very good, but when they got great, Shula wasn't very good. When the AFC as a whole got better (Elway, Kelley, etc) Shula got very average.... even with Marino.

Tom Flores definitely gets a vote, perhaps he should get in over Coughlin. Him and Shanahan are in the same boat IMO.

Gibbs beat Grant, Landry & Shula in 1982. He beat Walsh the next year. Then he vanquished the juggernaut 46 defense before destroying Reeves/Elway in 1987. Finally he regrouped and won 1991 like it was nothing.

Gibbs won a SB with Rypien. Shula lost SBs with Marino & Unitas.

Gotta go with Gibbs for quality over quanity.

Ok, I concede the point. That's enough evidence for me. I really didn't feel good about arguing against Gibbs anyway. :)

Picking between these guys is like picking the shiniest gold coin in the bunch. You really probably couldn't go wrong with any of them.

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Larry

Larry

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Posts are being migrated over from the old board.  It'll take a while. 

 

And I went over to the ESPN page.  There's not much to talk about, yet.  They're supposedly announcing their first one, tomorrow, and then one a day after that.  Although, they will allow fans to vote (nice of them to do that, after they've already decided who they're going to announce.)  When I voted, Gibbs was like #6, and I didn;t really have any serious complaints.  (In fact, I wasn't sure if maybe #7 should have been higher than Gibbs.  Can't remember who it was, though.  Hallas?) 

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Darkstarr

Darkstarr

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I appreciate the love and respect for Joe Gibbs. I have to admit though, I have a three way tie for Best Coach of All Time:

Walsh

Gibbs

Belichik

Walsh for his innovation, Gibbs for his preparation and gameday coaching ability, and BB for what he's been able to do in the Salary Cap era. No one is close to any of these three and that includes Lombardi.

U are going to put Walsh in there over Paul brown via innovation? Wow the man is the father of modern football and has 7 titles? not to mention he has a team named after him heh heh. Take a moment to go look at all the innovations and coaches he truely influenced. from Weeb, shula, noll, and even gibbs. Nobody imo innovated more then this man in football history.

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Larry

Larry

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When Shanny does that, he'll be the first ever head coach to win it with 2 different teams, which merits an automatic placement in the top 20 IMO.

 

I thought Parcells did it. 

 

I certainly believe that Tuna deserves to be somewhere on this list, for the number of times he came in to a loosing team and turned them into winners. 

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DogofWar1

DogofWar1

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Shanahan will jump way up if he wins one here. I don't think any coach has one a superbowl with multiple teams have they??

As others have said, no one has done it.

 

That goal, and winning with multiple QBs are the most elusive things in the game it seems, only three people have done the latter in the SB era, Gibbs (Theisman, Williams, Rypien), Parcells (Simms, Hostettler), and Seifert (Montana, Young).

 

If Shanahan somehow pulled off a Superbowl here, not only would he have 3 wins, which only 4 other coaches have done (Belichick, Noll, Gibbs, and Walsh), he'd be the 4th coach to do it with multiple QBs, and the only one to do it with multiple teams.

 

He'd be easily deserving of top 10 all time if that happened.  The only thing keeping him out of the top 5 then would probably be legacy; if his coaching tree had some major success he'd probably get into the top 5, so basically Kubiak and Kyle need to win some Superbowls in the future too (the latter hopefully with us).  Also, he might get credit for some of the offensive concepts the NFL uses going forward, the Pistol was developed at Nevada but Mike and Kyle adapted it for the NFL first, and did largely the same thing with the zone read, and obviously the zone blocking scheme.

 

So yeah, Mike is one SB, and a couple good years from his pupils away from being considered one of the best coaches of all time I think.  That is, of course, a high barrier, but I think our team is definitely going to be a contender at least.

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PlexLong

PlexLong

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I like Rick's reason for putting Gibbs so high on his list. Winning 3 with 3 different QBs (None HOFers) is pretty amazing. Especially since he won them in less than a 10 yr span and went to a 4th in that same span. I'm not mad at Shany being snubbed for right now, I think the moves he's made over the past 3 yrs have began to re-write the next chapter of his legacy in right way. Things ended bad for him in Denver and he was never given full credit for those Elway teams. If we continue to be a consistent playoff team and get to or even win an SB, then I think Coach Shanahan will jump in the view of many. At least Rick did acknowledge him and the rings in the article.

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CrypticVillain

CrypticVillain

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The official list is coming out now and Mike Shanahan is listed as #19...

 

Full article here(right-click). Including some words from John Elway.

Mike Shanahan, a former college quarterback whose teams have
regularly ranked among the NFL's best on offense, was the fifth head
coach to win back-to-back Super Bowls.

 

Shanahan played quarterback at Eastern Illinois, but his
collegiate career was cut short because of a ruptured kidney. After
taking a hit to the chest during a scrimmage his junior year, his heart
stopped beating and a priest administered last rites at the emergency
room. He was revived and underwent successful surgery, but he was told
his playing days were over. Nevertheless, he petitioned the school --
unsuccessfully -- to keep playing.

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Riggo-toni

Riggo-toni

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Allen, much as I appreciate how he resurrected this franchise from an even deeper abyss than it was post-Gibbs, is one of the few coaches who truly deserves the criticism "couldn't win the big one."  He overworked old guys who were consequently always broken down by December.  It's why he never won another playoff game after '72 season.  Still, he did invent the nickel and dime defenses, as well as offseason workouts.

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Bishop Hammer

Bishop Hammer

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As for Gibbs, it wasn't just 3 different starting QBs and RBs, it was, except for maybe the OL (there was certainly some change between 1982 & 1991), 3 different time periods several years apart. It wasn't like 3 in a row, or 3 in 5 years with essentially the same team but for QB and RB. It was 1982, 1987, and 1991. That's 5 and 4 year gaps. That's impressive.

Hells yeah! Considering that Gibbs had a run heavy offense having three different rbs and O-lines is just as impressive as different qbs.

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SkinsGuy

SkinsGuy

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Hells yeah! Considering that Gibbs had a run heavy offense having three different rbs and O-lines is just as impressive as different qbs.

 

 

For me, Joe Gibbs doesn't just belong at the top of the list because of what he did the first time around (four Super Bowls in 10 years, three victories with three different QBs and three different RBs).He deserves to be there for the second time around as well.

 

How he got to the playoffs 2 of 3 years with that team that was so bad before he got there and so bad after he left was remarkable.

 

Especially the 2005 season, where the Redskins were one Carlos Rogers dropped INT away from the NFC Championship game.

 

To me, no matter of what this list states, Gibbs was the greatest head coach of all time.

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