No whining about the fact we won please!

[S.T.real,lights,out]

Ugh, pointless, pathetic win against a horrid opponent

Right a team that will prob end up winning the division that until this year we haven't beat sice Todd Collins was out QB....good call man...

[S.T.real,lights,out]

And News flash to everyone whining like girls....there is something called trading up. There is this remarkable thing where if there is a guy a team really likes and they think he may be gone by the time they pick. Well you can call a team and offer them something like extra picks and then we switch spots and get their pick and they get ours. Its only been around since like the 1st ever draft so some of you may not have heard about it. But its pretty cool. Try reading about it....

[Burgold]

I

And even then he was good for what, oh yeah a one year run. He needed a complete team around him to win that SB, evidence the Rams.

As good a qb as he was, John Elway never won a Superbowl until he had a complete team around him and when he finally did... he was not the star of those Superbowls. Dan Marino as good as he was never won a Superbowl.

The great thing about football is that it truly is a team sport. You need almost all of the components to work to be great.

I'm not saying we don't need a great qb... I'm saying we need a great team with a great or at least very good qb.

[Wyvern]

Even with all the 2012 draft speculation -- I was on record as hoping for Skins wins even though they essentially out of playoff consideration. My point was that when you're building a new "winning team" with young players -- victories matter because they reinforce so many posiitve things, especially with the younger players.

Now I'm not certain where the Skins will wind up picking on draft day -- but today's win against the Giants goes a long way to boosting the internal confidence of Redskins players in their ability to compete in this division. It reinforces the mentality of keeping scrappy and not giving up, even if some are starting to suggest 'mailing it in.' In this year's Redskins, I've seen a lot of character, a williness to continue to fight on even in the face of adversity. The team showed willingness to pick itself up off the mat, and play hard.

I think what the occasional Skins win does for reinforcing this kind of 'team character' -- especially during this challenging sesaon--- will somewhat compensate the franchise for sliding a few spots back in the draft. ...True, we'd all like the Skins to draft 6-8 more 'winners', but it's also important that the franchise's current 53 players (and also the coaches) understand that they ALREADY have a winning edge inside them, -- that they're in a winning system with winning coaching.

[Trippster]

Some observations:

1. Almost every game every year we score between 15-20 points

2. Every year that's enough to win us 6 or 7 games but lose us 9 or 10

3. Rex will occasionally have a fantastic game (see yesterday)

4. Rex will more often have a downright crappy game (see most games this year)

5. The Redskins will occasionally sweep a division rival (see yesterday)

6. The Redskins will more often get swept by a division rival (see Cowboys and most likely Eagles)

7. This mediocrity has occurred for the last 20 years

8. This mediocrity is mostly tied to not having a franchise quarterback

9. This mediocrity will continue for the next 20 years without one

10. Redskins fans who recognize this should not be villified for wanting a change, nor should their fanhood be called into question

[S.T.real,lights,out]

Some observations:

1. Almost every game every year we score between 15-20 points

2. Every year that's enough to win us 6 or 7 games but lose us 9 or 10

3. Rex will occasionally have a fantastic game (see yesterday)

4. Rex will more often have a downright crappy game (see most games this year)

5. The Redskins will occasionally sweep a division rival (see yesterday)

6. The Redskins will more often get swept by a division rival (see Cowboys and most likely Eagles)

7. This mediocrity has occurred for the last 20 years

8. This mediocrity is mostly tied to not having a franchise quarterback

9. This mediocrity will continue for the next 20 years without one

10. Redskins fans who recognize this should not be villified for wanting a change, nor should their fanhood be called into question

Ok, please send this to the team when you get a chance and tell the guys that we would like them to play like Tampa did on Sunday. Tell guys like Fletch, Rak and RK to take it easy and not play as hard b/c want a better draft pick. Tell our o-line who dominated one of the best D-lines in football to just let them stuff the run and sack Rex all day.

Whats funny to me is that everyone on here is complaining about the way we are playing when no one points out things like we may have finally found some real depth at the o-line position. We have two YOUNG and very exciting backs. Does Rex still suck? Sure he does. Are we going to get a QB in this draft? Yup! Might we have to trade one of next years pick to get him? Yup! Oh well, i will take what we are doing over what teams like Tampa is doing anyday. It shows our guys believe in Shanny and are playing hard b/c they know if they dont they will be gone. It shows we have heart. What is a lot more than can be said about our team in years past.

So if people want to kill this team b/c we are improving while rebuilding well fine. Just do it somewhere else please.

[THEREALTOR1]

Even with all the 2012 draft speculation -- I was on record as hoping for Skins wins even though they essentially out of playoff consideration. My point was that when you're building a new "winning team" with young players -- victories matter because they reinforce so many posiitve things, especially with the younger players.

I agree Wyvern. Based on the quote I read from Shanny regarding his thinking that this team is a good team and is going to start winning football games, and people will start jumping on the bandwagon, etc...it almost seems like this team simply lost its confidence over the last 2 months, and somehow its been restored. This team played like a confident football team yesterday, very much so like they played the first few weeks of the season, and when they play confident, they win football games. It seems like they lost that somewhere around the bye week, and unfortunately weren't able to get it back until this past week, but IMO if they continue to play with that confidence for the rest of the year, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they won out.

[Wyvern]

Some observations:

7. This mediocrity has occurred for the last 20 years

8. This mediocrity is mostly tied to not having a franchise quarterback

9. This mediocrity will continue for the next 20 years without one

I think #7 may not be an accurate observation -- unless you want to readjust to 17 years? (1991/1992 were prettry good years, 1999, and Gibbs 2 -- we made the playoffs)

As for #8 -- that's more like speculation. There are franchise QBs on mediocre teams (Bradford, Stafford, McNabb, Cutler just before traded to Chicago, etc., Warner's stint with the Giants) and they weren't the only factor in whether the team emerged from mediocrity.)

As for #9 -- you cannot 'observe' 20 years into the future. That would speculation or 'prediction.'

As for your #10 "observation' -- I agree that Redskins fans' opinions need to be presented and received with respect on ES. Sadly, it's sometimes hard to distinguish between discouraged Redksins fans, and other teams' fans who are simply trolling the ES boards.

[Burgold]

Yup, it was good to see such solid play against the Jets, then the Pats (although the D really didn't come to play), and then the Giants. It's a good trendline esp. when the key players we are relying on include so many rookies. Our middle really has been much better since Hurt was inserted. Smith has had two pretty solid games in a row. Royster can contribute. Helu is a player. I think everyone's forgotten that Kerrigan is a rookie. Gomes looked pretty darn good out there today. And Orakpo, Riley, and a handful of other up and comers look like they are still up and coming.

Now, there is a part of me that wishes that the receiving resurgance was about Hankerson, Paul, and Armstrong instead of Moss, Gaffney, and Stallworth, but you can't have everything.

[S.T.real,lights,out]

Now, there is a part of me that wishes that the receiving resurgance was about Hankerson, Paul, and Armstrong instead of Moss, Gaffney, and Stallworth, but you can't have everything.

I agree, but i think Gaffney is so under-rated on this team. He may not be very young but hes REALLY good. I hope Hank can come back strong and i hope we bring in another big time #1 WR either through FA or the draft. But i like Gaffney a lot. It seems like hes almost always open.

[SWFLSkins]

As good a qb as he was, John Elway never won a Superbowl until he had a complete team around him and when he finally did... he was not the star of those Superbowls. Dan Marino as good as he was never won a Superbowl.

The great thing about football is that it truly is a team sport. You need almost all of the components to work to be great.

I'm not saying we don't need a great qb... I'm saying we need a great team with a great or at least very good qb.

And this has been my stance all along. Including the much trumpeted QB v. OL thread. But many think that somehow the OL for the Packers totally sucks and it is only Rodgers who should get the credit for the teams success.

---------- Post added December-19th-2011 at 08:07 AM ----------

I agree, but i think Gaffney is so under-rated on this team. He may not be very young but hes REALLY good. I hope Hank can come back strong and i hope we bring in another big time #1 WR either through FA or the draft. But i like Gaffney a lot. It seems like hes almost always open.

And catches the ball. I agree the team still needs that guy, maybe Hank is him but I don't think the farm should be bet on it and someone should be brought in.

---------- Post added December-19th-2011 at 08:09 AM ----------

I agree, but i think Gaffney is so under-rated on this team. He may not be very young but hes REALLY good. I hope Hank can come back strong and i hope we bring in another big time #1 WR either through FA or the draft. But i like Gaffney a lot. It seems like hes almost always open.

And catches the ball. I agree the team still needs that guy, maybe Hank is him but I don't think the farm should be bet on it and someone should be brought in.

[KDawg]

Well, folks... If you're going to win a game in a lost season... That's how you freakin' do it. Total domination.

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

And this has been my stance all along. Including the much trumpeted QB v. OL thread. But many think that somehow the OL for the Packers totally sucks and it is only Rodgers who should get the credit for the teams success.

That OL gives up 40-50 sacks a year. People have tried to think up bull**** reasons why their OL gives up sacks, including blaming them on Rodgers himself, but 40-50 sacks is not a good number, especially when you have a great QB that finds open WRs quickly.

As for the 2nd tier QBs, yes, they can be good, but they are also far more risky, which is why they're 2nd tier QBs. Take Ryan Tannehill. Talent-wise, he's as good as any QB in the draft. But he's very raw for his position, he hasn't put up massive numbers, he has limited starting experience, and he tends to disappear against the best competition. In general, if we're drafting a QB in the second round, it's too likely that they will fail. For every Drew Brees or Brett Favre, there's about 2 Jake Plummers and 6 Chad Hennes. And while Tannehill, Foles and Cousins are not Chad Henne or John Beck, by definition they are riskier prospects, and thus more likely to not only fail, but to eat up valuable development time. Look at what happened with Gibbs's awful QB decisions (Brunell > Brees, Campbell > Rodgers), they wasted the careers of pretty solid Redskins teams.

I believe that it is imperative that we come out of this draft with at LEAST Barkley, and preferably Griffin or Luck. Does this mean we have to tank? It would help in that regard, but if we do end up winning out (which is entirely likely - we lost very winnable games against the Jets and Pats, and demolished the Giants and will probably demolish the Vikings, because this team is not that bad, in fact a full strength Redskins team is quite possibly the best team in a weakened NFC East), then we need to bite the bullet and trade multiple picks to get the guy we want. Depth is great, more picks is great, but we need the franchise QB. Not just a good QB, not just a guy like Josh Freeman or Joe Flacco, but a great, top 5-10, 4000 yards 30 TDs QB.

[mtruslow]

Today's game, for all intents and purposes...was a BLOWOUT. The Skins were never close to not being in control of this one.

Speaking of whining, I've heard Skins fans ****ing for YEARS about how even when we win, it's never easy.

Well, here ya go guys.

And against a first place division rival no less!!!!!

Someone remind me the last time we had a win this dominating...I'm sure it's been 5 years.

December 30 2007 over Dallas. Skins 27 Dallas 6

[Henry]

Some observations:

1. Almost every game every year we score between 15-20 points

Then this game should please you, because over the past five weeks we've scored 24, 23, 19, 27 and 23 points. With rookies stepping in as veterans go down our offense is actually improving. Not just showing flashes, but consistent improvement.

2. Every year that's enough to win us 6 or 7 games but lose us 9 or 10

Huh. Over the past six years this team has won '6 or 7 games' exactly once. Last year. We've won 4 or 5 twice over that same span. According to my observations, winning fewer games hasn't exactly helped us much either.

3. Rex will occasionally have a fantastic game (see yesterday)

4. Rex will more often have a downright crappy game (see most games this year)

Rex sucks. What's your point?

5. The Redskins will occasionally sweep a division rival (see yesterday)

Occasionally? No. Extremely rarely. In fact, we haven't swept the Giants since the turn of the century. This is kind of a big deal.

6. The Redskins will more often get swept by a division rival (see Cowboys and most likely Eagles)

That's a huge understatement.

7. This mediocrity has occurred for the last 20 years

8. This mediocrity is mostly tied to not having a franchise quarterback

9. This mediocrity will continue for the next 20 years without one

10. Redskins fans who recognize this should not be villified for wanting a change, nor should their fanhood be called into question

This mediocrity has occurred for a lot of reasons. In the 90s it was tied to the fact that the QB we drafted with the #3 pick was terrible, our front office made some awful decisions and our coach was decidedly unimpressive.

In the 00s it was tied to the fact that our owner was impatient, naive, and continued to look for overly simplistic answers to complex problems. All we need to put us over the top are some big free agents. All we need to put us over the top is a new coach. All we need are some new coordinators.

Now, apparently, it's 'all we need is a new QB.'

Fans who say this are not being vilified for wanting a QB, but for suggesting that that's the entire answer to the problem. For repeating the mistake this team has been making for decades by assuming the answer is simple. This team does need a QB. It also needs a lot of other things. A LOT of other things. Fortunately, the way this team full of rookies has been playing the past month, it appears some of those things are finally being addressed. And it's a good sign. Those who 'want a change' should see that that change is already occurring instead of crying about draft position.

[Chachie]

I'd rather have a better squad overall next season than a highly drafted, expensive QB gamble/project. Let's win games and make our current roster better prepared to serve any quarterback. Let's learn how to win. Now.

[coolbeans]

I just wanted to give the skins props for yesterday's game. Yes, I know it helped out my favorite team and I understand the draft positioning thing but skins fans should be proud of their team today. They have been out of the playoff picture for many weeks now but have played some of their best football. There is no quit in that team or that coaching staff. That should serve you well in the near future. IMO, if you add a real NFL QB, a true #1 WR, and a shutdown corner to the skins, they will be a playoff team every year. The attitude and toughness to win is there. They are just getting inconsistant play at QB and lack a true playmaking WR on offense. The defense is solid but a shutdown corner would go along way to helping the front 7 get to the QB more often and thus becoming a dominating D. Most of you already know all of this I'm sure but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents. Good game yesterday and thanks a bunch!

[Slateman]

You're the GM. You call in whatever experienced QB you want. Whom do YOU call? I'll be waiting since you're obviously the expert about quarterbacks on Extremeskins.

And yes. Kyle called the same play twice within a few short minutes against the wind, against a team that wasn't giving up the long ball. Dumb!

I don't call in an experienced QB. I get a new one in the draft.

Its Kyle's fault that Rex said, screw it, even though he's not open (and on the second one, he was double covered) and put it up for grabs? Nice try. Completely on Rex. He could have dumped it off. He could have thrown it away. Instead, he gave it away.

[TheGreek1973]

A lot of people are saying we need a QB or else. think about what happened this season guys. We lost to the Cowboys twice, first with 5 field goals and a real desperate pass that somehow connected late and second in OT where our kicker batched two winning kicks (you want to talk about our major problems, how many games we would have won if we had a kicker that was automatic like Mosley was in his prime in the past 7 years?). We win those to games who do you think would be on top of the division right now? That's with a QB that has issues, got benched for a total looser, got back in there with an OL that has lost the starting LT and RT. Also our number one receiver was out for a long time, our promising WR rookie out for the season, our Pro SS in and out and now out for the season, our FS in and out, etc.

yes we need a QB but we are also building a team that with a few more talent at the right spots we could content. So no to trading the farm for Luck or GRIII (and God forbid Barkley). Even if we win out we are still most likely picking top 10 so imagine the talent there in other positions if the 3 QBs go before 10.

[Crazy Levi]

I felt like the Skins have quit at the ends of the seasons the previous three years...certainly don't feel that way this year.

[BeefJerky]

It feels damn good to knock the gnats out of the playoffs ( pretty much). That was the most dominate I've seen this team play in a LOOOONG time. Way to go skins!

[Tsoe]

Some observations:

1. Almost every game every year we score between 15-20 points

2. Every year that's enough to win us 6 or 7 games but lose us 9 or 10

3. Rex will occasionally have a fantastic game (see yesterday)

4. Rex will more often have a downright crappy game (see most games this year)

5. The Redskins will occasionally sweep a division rival (see yesterday)

6. The Redskins will more often get swept by a division rival (see Cowboys and most likely Eagles)

7. This mediocrity has occurred for the last 20 years

8. This mediocrity is mostly tied to not having a franchise quarterback

9. This mediocrity will continue for the next 20 years without one

10. Redskins fans who recognize this should not be villified for wanting a change, nor should their fanhood be called into question

Rex had a mediocre game at best yesterday and we still won against the Giants. Yes we need a QB, but we don't need first round first pick.

[jtpop]

Never hear me whine about a win, I ALWAYS want the skins to win. We will pick where we pick, and we most assuredly need to draft a QB with our top 10 pick wherever it is.

[Darth Tater]

Rex had a mediocre game at best yesterday and we still won against the Giants. Yes we need a QB, but we don't need first round first pick.

If your defense is holding opponents to less than 20 points a game (the other 1-2 points per game we're giving is due to offensive fails), you best be winning a good percentage of them else its pretty obvious that upgrading the offense is you number 1 priority. It is also pretty obvious what needs to be upgraded most on offense is the QB. Hell, you realize that if we had just a decent QB, we'd be AT LEAST 8-6 right now and only need to win 1 of our final 2 to win the division. Give us a top quality guy at that position and with the loss by GB yesterday and we'd be looking at a potential for winning HFA.

[RabidFan]

hopefully we're in the top ten with a win vs Minny, not so bright.