Time for Allen and Shanahan to Come Clean

[RyansRangers]

What upsets me the most is the lack of intensity with this team. The cowboys who are 3-8 show more heart and intensity then the skins do

[dchogs]

Just root for Detroit to get the top pick, then we deal with them to get Andrew Luck.

dude, we need way more than a new QB. we need to be trading down instead of up.

[veteranskinsfan]

The Skins have a long list of positions that need fixing. It is going to take at least two more seasons to fix these problems. We are one of the oldest teams in the NFL. I read a good article this week in the Post about the need for continuity in the front office and coaching and then also the team itself. I was watching a game last week and one of the announcers said two of their offensive linemen had played like 8 years together but they converted it to total games played as a tandem. We do not have that type of continuity on either side of the ball.

[zoony]

Either you're joking, or you've seriously regressed mentally.

Landry has the same position coach as last year. He has a new DC & HC that not only hold him but his position coach to higher standards. Which would be part of the same Shanny "micro mgt" you mentioned earlier in another thread.

Rak has done jack**** & played like dog****? Seriously, what ****ing games are you watching? You HAVE to be joking with that buncha crap. Here are his stats. Go take a look at this year & last year. They're nearly identical. They just don't show how many times he gets held, whether it gets called or not.

I'm watching the games. I'm watching him get pushed around, week in and week out by Tight Ends. I saw him today do absolutely nothing other than jump into the pile. I think he got a holding call.

The reverence he's held in by Redskins fans is a joke. Give Rocky McIntosh the same number of rushes I bet he's in the 8 sack neighborhood, too. At least Rocky isn't a complete liability in coverage and against the run, too.

Modern day Redskins fans, all about the big hits and the numbers. Kind of explains how guys like Ryan Clark escape notice, and guys like Laron Landry are hailed as guys to "build around" :ols:

And ftr, "plays like crap" is a bit of pushing at the edges to make a point. But you know that, seeing as how you've been reading my posts for 5 years.

[longball]

What upsets me the most is the lack of intensity with this team. The cowboys who are 3-8 show more heart and intensity then the skins do

Its more of whats to come, players are not even playing! Look at the cowbuys they are chomping at the bit for next year. I prray for a lockout, we need more time to change this losing mentality.

[bulldog]

I have a wager with a friend at work that the Cowboys (then 1-7) had a realistic chance of overtaking the Redskins for last place in the NFC East.

Unfortunately, the Redskins seem to be making my case for me getting the money. Dallas is now 3-8 and up on the Colts 17-7.

Anyone watching the Cowboys-Colts game can see that Dallas even without Romo sits to pee has a lot more skill position talent than Washington.

Dallas' #3 running back and #3 receiver are better than our #1 back and #1 receivers.

Sad but true.

[Rufus T Firefly]

dude, we need way more than a new QB. we need to be trading down instead of up.

Nothing means anwhere close to what a Franchise QB does. If you can rebuild around a stud like Luck, you do it.

[SKIN4WAHOOZ]

. We passed up on players like Brian Westbrook, Terrell Owens, Randy Moss and signing a former Eagles WR; known as Kevin Curtis. Bruce Allen should have went over Shanny and signed Randy Moss as soon as he became available.

the fact that we did pass on players like this is great. that means we are getting away from the garbage moves that has put this franchise in the state its in. your theory couldnt be farther from the truth!

[Mooka]

This team needs a COMPLETE REBUILD FROM THE FOUNDATION UP.

That's not what Shanahan and Allen are here to do.

They're building a team that can run Shanahan's offense, not from the ground up. That means old or young, rookie or vet, free agents or trades.

They're not done either. Not even close. They've just begun to change over the roster. I expect more moves this off-season like the last one.

[Thirtyfive2seven]

Best way I could phrase it... I would trade Orakpo for a first rounder, no question.

Wow. The problem with you saying that is the Skins have NO ONE to replace him with. So lets say they trade him for a 1st round pick - what do they do with that pick? Go out and get another pass rusher? That just seems stupid to me. I would trade Cooley for a 1st rounder because we have Davis who seems to be capable of stepping up to take his place. For the record though I don't want to trade Chris.

I would love to get Luck or any other good QB in the draft. I wish this team would start building from the ground up and start with the QB and the offensive lines. After that they can start picking WR's and RB's and of course address the defensive lines and that side of the ball

[Warhead36]

I'm watching the games. I'm watching him get pushed around, week in and week out by Tight Ends. I saw him today do absolutely nothing other than jump into the pile. I think he got a holding call.

The reverence he's held in by Redskins fans is a joke. Give Rocky McIntosh the same number of rushes I bet he's in the 8 sack neighborhood, too. At least Rocky isn't a complete liability in coverage and against the run, too.

Modern day Redskins fans, all about the big hits and the numbers. Kind of explains how guys like Ryan Clark escape notice, and guys like Laron Landry are hailed as guys to "build around" :ols:

And ftr, "plays like crap" is a bit of pushing at the edges to make a point. But you know that, seeing as how you've been reading my posts for 5 years.

Rocky is decent vs. the run but absolutely awful in coverage, much worse than any of our other LBs.

I do agree with you that Orakpo has holes in his game, but he's one of our most talented players and you have to give young guys time to grow. But that is the problem with much of our fanbase, we don't seem too keen on homegrowing talent.

And Landry is absolutely one of our building blocks the way he has played this year. Now of course right now he's hurt and who knows, maybe he declines next year but he was one of if not the best SSs in the NFL this year before he got hurt.

[bulldog]

Randy Moss hasn't done much since last year with NE.

Signing a 33 year old troublemaker is exactly the kind of move this team needs to AVOID making

That is what has gotten us to be the cellar dwellers in the NFC East.

Dallas is adding Dez Bryant and the Eagles are adding Jackson while the Redskins are signing Joey Galloway and Roydell Williams? :laugh:

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Best way I could phrase it... I would trade Orakpo for a first rounder, no question.

In the bigger overall picture, I wouldn't be opposed to that.

I just don't see how he fit's in a 34 scheme. WAY too lightweight to be an end, and all he offers at LB is a pass rush. Not that he's not got the potential to be an excellent pass rusher, but we can ill afford to carry someone so one dimensional when the rest of the players around him are as poor as they are.

All things considered, as much I like the kid, if someone offered a first or more I'd be hard pressed to say no.

Hail.

[Grinder]

Nothing means anwhere close to what a Franchise QB does. If you can rebuild around a stud like Luck, you do it.

Absolutely. It all starts at franchise QB.

Now if one is not available to us then by all means trade down and fill some holes...

[Rufus T Firefly]

Absolutely. It all starts at franchise QB.

Now if one is not available to us then by all means trade down and fill some holes...

Ditto.

[bulldog]

So, you would trade the #13 overall pick for say the #30 overall pick in 2011?

Yep, that's what we call getting value in trades :laugh:

How about coaching the talent to perform better? I know it's a new concept around Redskins Park, but it HAS worked in Pittsburgh, New England and New Orleans recently

[Hollywood1127]

the fact that we did pass on players like this is great. that means we are getting away from the garbage moves that has put this franchise in the state its in. your theory couldnt be farther from the truth!

Okay. So you you call the New York Jets signing Brett Favre in 2008 a bad move? He helped improved stats for them. Even made history stat improvements with his passing knowledge. The only garbage moves that we make are not signing O-Linemen which fell on our old GM. But I don't see anybody getting at him.

We are lucky we got McNabb, the way we did. He is here to stay. Get him some O-Line and WR's and we got a better offense.

[bulldog]

It was a great trade for the Packers. They already had a franchise quarterback Aaron Rodgers ready to play and got a #3 pick for then 39 year old QB that wore down at the end of the 2008 season and threw enough picks (as usual) to keep the Jets from going to the playoffs.

[tr1]

The 3-4 with this personnel is a disaster...don't take my word for it, look at our stats.

Orakpo suffers in this scheme because we don't have a legit NT.

This isn't rocket science.

But, hey, I thought we were in a rebuilding year?

What's all the fuss about?

I wasn't expecting any miracles. I like the McNabb acquisition. I liked our draft this spring.

It's time to calm down and take a breath.

Let's see what the o-line and d-line look like in next year's OTA's and decide if we're going in the right or wrong direction.

[DOOG]

Maybe I missed the point of the question. I dont get the impression they are in denial about this team. I'm still wondering about the Mcnabb deal, that would be my one complaint if there was one. Look, I really think we would be worse if we had previous coaches/GM. This team plays harder(yes Im saying that after this sorry ass loss) and seems more prepared. I think, as we seem to say a lot around here, we are in a holding pattern to see what happens in the next two to three years. I like the way the younger Shanahan calls plays, and look forward to seeing what he does when he has some playmakers. We have found some good young players this year, we find a few more over the next few, catch a few breaks and we will be in good shape.

[Brotherz]

Let's do what we can to get some picks. Trade Haynesworth, even if it's for a low pick. Trade down in the draft; there are so many holes to fill. We need young players and hopefully some of these guys can begin to step up. I also think we need a QB. I've always thought highly of McNabb, but he's been awful this year. THe lack of a running game and protection are contributing to McNabb's poor play, but as a whole he just looks bad. Awful picks, that fumble on the "slide," all of it.

I think this is by far the worst sin of this new regime. They completely destroyed the trade value of players on this team that did have value before they got here. Everyone.. . and I mean everyone knew that Andre Carter was going to bust out in the 3-4. How did we KNOW this? we already saw it! Only now he is older. To think for one minute that he was going to suddenly figure out how to play in space was absurdly naive when he utterly failed to do so when he was younger and more athletic in San Fran. He was coming off of an eleven sack season! Ok, we are switching to 3-4. Trade him to a 3-4 team who needs a pass rushing defensive end! What's he worth now? Nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Haynesworth? Same thing. Utter garbage is all we will get for him and why? HE TOLD US he wouldn't play in this system. We could have met with him, listened to him and traded him. Yea, we would have had to eat the money - so what? We are gonna eat it anyway! Only he will go on and be a pro bowler in a 4-3 somewhere next year and we will get a 7th round pick AND we pay for him anway!

Santana Moss probably had some trade value. Next year? Nope. Rocky Mcintosh probably had some value. Now? Nope. Dockery. Same thing. We HAD trade value for picks. We completely destroyed it. And for what? To go 5-11? To get into a pissing match with AH?? I can handle losing. But I can't handle losing for no reason. With no purpose. If we were 5-11 with a bunch of rookies and a stockpile of upcoming draft picks, I could have chalked all of this up to rebuilding. We wasted this year. Completely and totally wasted it and we are gonna get nothing in return.

[Rufus T Firefly]

It was a great trade for the Packers. They already had a franchise quarterback Aaron Rodgers ready to play and got a #3 pick for then 39 year old QB that wore down at the end of the 2008 season and threw enough picks (as usual) to keep the Jets from going to the playoffs.

Indeed. The only part of that whole thing that was bad was trying to talk Favre into retiring so they didn't have to trade him. They made the right call in going to Rodgers, they should have relished the idea of getting draft picks for Favre, but they tried to make him walk away. Bit of a chicken move, imo.

[KDawg]

This thread is seemingly made every week. And it gets more true every week.

[Brotherz]

The 3-4 with this personnel is a disaster...don't take my word for it, look at our stats.

Orakpo suffers in this scheme because we don't have a legit NT.

This isn't rocket science.

But, hey, I thought we were in a rebuilding year?

What's all the fuss about?

I wasn't expecting any miracles. I like the McNabb acquisition. I liked our draft this spring.

It's time to calm down and take a breath.

Let's see what the o-line and d-line look like in next year's OTA's and decide if we're going in the right or wrong direction.

What makes you think this is a rebuilding year besides the fact that you can't call it anything else when you go 5-11. We got OLDER this year Tr1! We traded draft picks for a 34 year old QB and had no lineman to protect him. We traded more draft picks for Jamaal Brown is who clearly damaged goods. We signed Willie Parker and Larry Johnson and passed on LT or drafting a running back. While we were at it, we passed on Antrelle Rolle in favor of Kareem Moore. We signed Kemo, Vonnie Holliday and Carriker. Unmitigated disasters. Old, unmitigated disasters.

We aren't in a rebuild year at all. After all, "the future is now".

[Morningside Skins]

I'm pretty sure Shanny and Allen are aware of this, its some Skins fans that aren't. Shanny and Haslett clearly do not have the players to fit their respective schemes because the guys we currently have on the roster are leftovers from the several schemes we have had in here over the past decade. Just like last off-season, a third of the guys currently on the roster will not be here come next season. Considering that McNabb has ZERO talent around him and runs for his life every single snap, I'm surprised he can get anything done. We have a good core of young players to build around on defense (Landry, D-Hall, Rak), but my god I don't see anyone worth keeping on O after Trent Williams other than Armstrong as a good #2 receiver and McNabb as a competent stopgap QB. Skins fans just need to accept the fact that the Snyderatto regime left Shanny and Allen one hell of a turd sandwich to clean up, and its going to take several off-seasons to do so. Personally, I think we need to bite the bullet and draft Luck or Newton in the first round (our #1 pick just might be low enough the way we are playing right now), then draft the BPA out of the remaining Lineman, Linebackers, Wide Receivers, Safeties, and Running Backs. Yeah, we have a lot of holes to fill on this roster...

Edit: And for those of you whining about how we passed over Terrel Owens and Randy Moss, do you think that having one of those two head cases on this team for a year would have saved our season? Last time I checked, they aren't that good in pass protection but they would probably do a better job at guard and center than who we have in their now.