Perfect Game or not?

[USS Redskins]

Everyone knows the story... Detroit Pitcher Armando Galarraga should have pitched the 21st Perfect game in MLB history. The 1st base ump blew the call at first and later apologized after seeing the batter was out on a replay. Good for the ump for manning up.

Bud Selig refused to change the score card to award the perfect game to Galarraga... what do you think?

I belive that Selig blew it worse than the Ump - he should have reversed the call and given him the perfect game. It was obvious by the replay - it wasnt even close and the ump admitted he screwed up... so its an outrage that Selig didnt reverse the call - which is in his power to do. I read that Faye Vincent removed 50 no hitters from the history books during his days as commissioner for various reasons... This one is as obivous as they come and Selig just plain blew it.

[gbear]

This was better than most perfect games. Sometimes, it really is possible to be better than perfect. If you reverse the call, you make the game less magical than it was.

I posted this in the other thread:

Oddly enough, I think the blown call may have made this game immotal in a way not even a rare perfect game is made memmorably immortal.

Yes, you might be able to think back on the studying you did as a fan to name the 20 perfect games in the last 150 years. Each of them is a gem...but if you had to rank the great games pitched, I know the one in the world series is probably number 1 -Larson in 1956.

After that, on my list are the three games where the pitcher had the perfect game for 10 innings. The last one of those was in the 1960's.

Then you have this one where the pitcher really got 28 straight down. Of the 16 not mentioned above, would all of them have gotten the next guy too? Well, they weren't given a chance. 28 for 28 beats 27 for 27 in my book. In many ways, what the ump did made a one of 21 instances in 150 year span into an even rarer 1 of 3 instances in 150 years where a perfect game went for more than 27 outs.

This was the first time in more than 40 years of baseball where the pitcher was perfect for more than 27 outs. If you need a declaration to tell you what your eyes saw in order for you to enjoy it, I think you've missed some of the magic. If you are an O's fan, you know Meyer took the homerun and the heart of the series. We know what the books say, but in the minds and hearts of the fans...and isn't that what it is all about?

[Dan T.]

^ Good points.

The only thing against reversing the call is setting a precedent. It opens a can of worms for future pleas to reverse calls.

[Forehead]

Absolutely not on the call change, as much as it sucks. You change that call, and suddenly everyone wants to go back and change calls. Three games ago, the Nats got screwed on a check-swing third strike, the next pitch Lance Berkman drove the ball to left for the winning run in the 9th. Washington could start yelling that Berkman should be retroactively considered a strike out, the hit never happens, Capps gets the save, etc.

It's a dangerous precedent to set, and as unfortunate as it is, the call can't be changed.

[MattFancy]

I agree with Selig on this one. If you change this call, what's to stop other teams from wanting calls changed? Yes it would've have effected the outcome of the game, but I still don't think you change the call. Galarrage knows he threw a perfect game, the fans know it, his teammates know it, the umps know it, and we all know it. The only thing that doesn't recognize it are the record books.

[JimboDaMan]

I hate it for both the pitcher and the ump, and maybe this will be the spark for true instant replay in MLB, but I think Selig is correct here. The call was made, none of the other umps were able to overrule him, and he can't use IR. Other than the extremely awkward circumstances, its reall not a tough decision.

[PeterMP]

The games that Vincent "removed" weren't the result of changing a call on the field. They had "improperly" placed in the no hitter list, but they weren't at least 9 innings which is written into the rule book of what a no hitter is.

It isn't like they want back through the games and said, 'hey, this guy was called out and was really safe so there goes your no hitter.'

What they did was more like checking for clarical errors.

[hockeysc23]

Selig got it right. The human element of Umps is part of the game. You have to accept that unfortunately.

Sad for the pitcher, who btw handled this with amazing sportsmanship definitely a lesson for us all. But it was not a perfect game.

[USS Redskins]

I guess the point is that this was a PERFECT GAME - something that has happened only 20 times in the 130+ years of MLB Baseball. The guy worked his rear end off and the UMP blew it and blew it badly.

to PeterMP - the Ump "improperly" called the guy safe... if the comm can reverse improper things... fix this freaking thing!

Anyway - sucks for the pitcher he gets so screwed over twice, by the ump and the commish. This is why baseball blows nowadays.

[DixieFlatline]

I normally wouldn't support Selig changing a call. The only reason I would support this one is that it wouldn't change the outcome of the game. It was the last out in the 9th inning and he got the next batter out. The only thing that would change is the batter getting credit for a hit. The official scorers have time to change their logs 24 hours after a game, so taking away a hit wouldn't be unprecedented.

[hockeysc23]

I guess the point is that this was a PERFECT GAME - something that has happened only 20 times in the 130+ years of MLB Baseball. The guy worked his rear end off and the UMP blew it and blew it badly.

to PeterMP - the Ump "improperly" called the guy safe... if the comm can reverse improper things... fix this freaking thing!

Anyway - sucks for the pitcher he gets so screwed over twice, by the ump and the commish. This is why baseball blows nowadays.

The point is that is NOT a perfect game by the rules. The rules say the Umps call is right regardless of what the video camera says.

Maybe it's from umping baseball back in HS but mistakes get made sometimes but that has to be accepted by both teams. To eliminate the human error of reffing they need to play well enough and beyond so that it isn't such a close call.

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

**** umpires, they should install a system that can detect who is out and who is safe within 10 seconds. Have instant replays upstairs for close calls, I mean INSTANT. No challenge flags, no nothing, just be able to overrule umpire calls instantaniously. The only reason Umps should be on the field is to confirm easy calls.

Determine if that mother****er is out or safe with the superior technology that we have, I can't believe people would rather choose human error over what is right. You're giving these umpires and players nightmares, disputed calls create biases during the game, and even the season. It creates grudges.

I don't know why we're so scared of machines taking over the calls, is it because of the Terminator movies? Do we have too much pride as a species to let some electronics device tell us we're wrong? Sure, have the umps out there, but they don't have the last word. Swallow your pride, stop having a weener measuring contest with freaking machines for God's sakes...what's right is right.

If I had it my way, I'd even make a laser-electronic strike zone so none of those ****foots would ***** about balls and strikes. Stop slowing down the slowest game in the world. I mean ****!

Sorry, but if you are against the sport evolving then you're just being ignorant. Get with it. This game needs a big punch in the mouth, it's getting reckless and incredibly old. It is my favorite sport to play, easily, but changes need to be made.

The skill level is insane, and the traditionalism is bland. Weird Al probably based his Amish Paradise song off of it. This game needs an ice water bath. Wake up, smell the roses, the game is not television friendly on a massive scale...and that's the society we live in today. In order for the game to remain a mainstay, it has to accept the evolution of technology and the demand for consistent entertainment.

[pjfootballer]

The only thing that I would do is change it from a hit to an error. If you watch the replay, the ball beat the runner and the pitcher had the ball like a snowcone, then he let go of it and recaught it in one motion. That's the only reason I can think that Jim Joyce called him safe. It could be charged as an error on the pitcher and then he a least gets a no hitter which is still pretty special as opposed to the perfect game.

[MattFancy]

The only thing that I would do is change it from a hit to an error. If you watch the replay, the ball beat the runner and the pitcher had the ball like a snowcone, then he let go of it and recaught it in one motion. That's the only reason I can think that Jim Joyce called him safe. It could be charged as an error on the pitcher and then he a least gets a no hitter which is still pretty special as opposed to the perfect game.

That what some people thought, but Joyce's explanation was that he thought the runner beat the throw. It did appear that he may have bobbled it, but Joyce didn't see that.

The would've been avoided had Miguel Cabrera not fielded the ball. It was cleary the 2B's ball. Then when Cabrera did field it, he took an extra step or two before he threw the ball.

[IONTOP]

You know what would be crazy? If they reversed the call and the guy who was supposed to be the 27th out went on a 55 game hitting streak, would have been 56 if they hadn't reversed the call...

THAT would be funny

[TD_washingtonredskins]

That what some people thought, but Joyce's explanation was that he thought the runner beat the throw. It did appear that he may have bobbled it, but Joyce didn't see that.

The would've been avoided had Miguel Cabrera not fielded the ball. It was cleary the 2B's ball. Then when Cabrera did field it, he took an extra step or two before he threw the ball.

The runner was busting his ass down the line (inside the base path, actually). If he had just jogged, it would have been a perfect game. Funny how these things work out.

[Bubble Screen]

That what some people thought, but Joyce's explanation was that he thought the runner beat the throw. It did appear that he may have bobbled it, but Joyce didn't see that.

The would've been avoided had Miguel Cabrera not fielded the ball. It was cleary the 2B's ball. Then when Cabrera did field it, he took an extra step or two before he threw the ball.

He didn't bobble the throw. He snow-coned it. Those are two entirely different things. And no, the ruling shouldn't be changed. Sucks, but that's how it goes. I pretty much echo what Forehead posted.

[MattFancy]

He didn't bobble the throw. He snow-coned it. Those are two entirely different things. And no, the ruling shouldn't be changed. Sucks, but that's how it goes. I pretty much echo what Forehead posted.

I didn't think it was a bobble either, some are saying he did. But I do agree that is shouldn't be changed. Hey we can agree on something!

[Bang]

As far as i'm concerned it's a perfect game. I think Selig blew it by not reversing it, I think the "human element" of sports should be reserved to the players of the game. The game should be won or lost, records should be set and broken on the abilities of the players.

Mistakes by officials are not part of the human element of sports. Officials are there to make sure that the game is played fairly. That's it. And since that is the absolute essence of their participation, there should be every single effort made to make it as fair as possible, including using technology to insure that the game is decided by the players.

Sports are contests of skill. And the officials are not contestants. Therefore, every effort should be made to minimize their effect on the outcome of any play. By and large refs in all sports do a great job,, probably getting 95-98% of calls right. But if we can insure those last few % can also be right, I see no reason why it shouldn't be done.

Also, much respect to that umpire. He blew it and he knew it, and he manned up for it. He can't change it, but he can be a man about it and he has. Kudos to him for that. I can't blame him for the call, it was very close. Anyone could have seen it as safe in a bang-bang situation.

~Bang

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Also, much respect to that umpire. He blew it and he knew it, and he manned up for it. He can't change it, but he can be a man about it and he has. Kudos to him for that. I can't blame him for the call, it was very close. Anyone could have seen it as safe in a bang-bang situation.

~Bang

The other thing I loved about Joyce is that he wasn't afraid to make the call he thought was correct on the 27th out of a potential perfect game. I have to assume that, given the situation, it would be very easy to call the runner out on that play unless it was ridiculously obvious that he was safe. Joyce thought the guy was safe on a bang-bang play at first and had the fortitude to treat it just like any other play. That alone requires everyone's respect.

[Bang]

The other thing I loved about Joyce is that he wasn't afraid to make the call he thought was correct on the 27th out of a potential perfect game. I have to assume that, given the situation, it would be very easy to call the runner out on that play unless it was ridiculously obvious that he was safe. Joyce thought the guy was safe on a bang-bang play at first and had the fortitude to treat it just like any other play. That alone requires everyone's respect.

Definitely. All respect.

~Bang

[Bubble Screen]

This may not go down in the record books as a Perfect Game, but it will likely be remembered more than any other Perfect Game, outside of the one Larsen threw in the WS.

I was listening to the local sports radio host here yesterday. He said that he hadn't gotten one email this week about the one Halladay threw on Saturday. But he had gotten hundreds on the one the Tigers pitcher threw.

[MattFancy]

This may not go down in the record books as a Perfect Game, but it will likely be remembered more than any other Perfect Game, outside of the one Larsen threw in the WS.

I was listening to the local sports radio host here yesterday. He said that he hadn't gotten one email this week about the one Halladay threw on Saturday. But he had gotten hundreds on the one the Tigers pitcher threw.

I agree with that. Granted perfect games are rare, but we've seen 2 already this season and we've seen 3 in less than a year (Buehrle, Braden, and Halladay). But the Galarrage game will be talked about more than any of those. We all know what we saw and that was a perfect game. So just because it isn't in the record books, doesn't mean we won't know it happened.

[daveakl]

Let me ask this question:

In the perfect games thrown by Halladay and by Braden this year there were multiple third strike calls that were balls. Should those be reversed as well and the player given the walk breaking up the perfect game?

[codeorama]

As gbear said, the game will be one of the most famous ever, no need to reverse anything...

The way the the game was handled was amazing on all parts. The umpire did the right thing by owning up to his bad call and apologizing, what more can you ask. If umpires at the high school level did the same, it would be much nicer...