fansince62 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Sorry, but he is an accurate passer and the FACTS bear that out. you mean the facts you avoid? you JC proponents are laughable and contemptible at one and the same time: you want to subject the rest of us to your slovenly low standards for what constitutes excellence. you remind me of the sorts who RELIED on the Bell Curve to get through undergraduate "rigors". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvtbred Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 you mean the facts you avoid? you JC proponents are laughable and contemptible at one and the same time: you want to subject the rest of us to your slovenly low standards for what constitutes excellence. you remind me of the sorts who RELIED on the Bell Curve to get through undergraduate "rigors". Not to mention the fact that he is ranked 17th in both DYAR and YAR plus 20th in DVOA. This is pretty much par for the course with Jason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJL Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 you mean the facts you avoid? you JC proponents are laughable and contemptible at one and the same time: you want to subject the rest of us to your slovenly low standards for what constitutes excellence. you remind me of the sorts who RELIED on the Bell Curve to get through undergraduate "rigors". and you want to subject us to your laughable fantasies about the Skins drafting some savior at QB when at the same time you act like the front office is a bunch of idiots. What's your draft philosophy "even a blind squirrel occasionally finds a nut?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommanderDOOM Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 but we've drafted bums for awhile now. Our 'nut' is due. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I don't believe that a reliable stat exists that would enable an intelligent ranking of NFL quarterbacks. However, using the won-lost record to rank them, the favored approach of the anti-Campbell extremists in this group, is surely the dumbest of the options. A comprehensive stat, like the NFL's QB rating is a brighter approach, however the DYAR stats of Football Outsiders is an even better comprehensive stat. Last year, Jason was ranked #16. This year, he's ranked #17 as of week 13. I use the DYAR to confirm what I see on the field. These rankings seem about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I don't believe that a reliable stat exists that would enable an intelligent ranking of NFL quarterbacks. However, using the won-lost record to rank them, the favored approach of the anti-Campbell extremists in this group, is surely the dumbest of the options.A comprehensive stat, like the NFL's QB rating is a brighter approach, however the DYAR stats of Football Outsiders is an even better comprehensive stat. Last year, Jason was ranked #16. This year, he's ranked #17 as of week 13. I use the DYAR to confirm what I see on the field. These rankings seem about right. I'd say that's pretty fair, but even then, does a #17 quarterback win the Super Bowl? (Unless he's Doug Williams, of course. See what I did there? #17? No?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 you mean the facts you avoid? you JC proponents are laughable and contemptible at one and the same time: you want to subject the rest of us to your slovenly low standards for what constitutes excellence. you remind me of the sorts who RELIED on the Bell Curve to get through undergraduate "rigors". If you want to pretend that he is the worst quarterback ever with no redeeming qualities whatsoever, go right ahead. Painting things in black and white terms makes my 5 year old nephew feel much better. PS - Do you really want to get into a pissing contest to see who has the better resume? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I'd say that's pretty fair, but even then, does a #17 quarterback win the Super Bowl? (Unless he's Doug Williams, of course. See what I did there? #17? No?) While we can both agree that the QB is the most important player on the field, and an upgrade there is a signficant upgrade to the team's performance, the core of our problem is -- just how much weight should we give the position? I think most fans and members of the media give QBs too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing. So, to answer your question: Sure, several average QBs have won Super Bowls. A couple of them are even in the HOF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 While we can both agree that the QB is the most important player on the field, and an upgrade there is a signficant upgrade to the team's performance, the core of our problem is -- just how much weight should we give the position? I think most fans and members of the media give QBs too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing.So, to answer your question: Sure, several average QBs have won Super Bowls. A couple of them are even in the HOF. I'm just talking about the quarterback position. I agree that it is the pinnacle of a team game, but I'm only addressing Campbell since it's a Campbell thread. And no average player is in the Hall. That's just silly. The best players play their best in the biggest games. Those average quarterbacks who won usually won based on a more concerted team effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 And no average player is in the Hall. That's just silly. Is it silly? The HOF is supposed to honor individual performers, but it has been criticized for years for its bias toward team accomplishments. Super Bowls are team accomplishments. Try proving that Terry Bradshaw was anything more than an average QB without mentioning the Super Bowls his team won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 the standards on this board have fallen so low from its inception that it boggles the mind. You go from a few thousand registered members who find the forum out of drive and interest with only a small perecentage even of them actively pariticpating, creating a comparatively tight discussion community, to over 80,000 members linked from an official NFL team's main webpage with more of a percentage type likely to just make noise about anything anytime, and it's part of the package. I think many of us still here see our share of good and bad out of the deal, not just good and not just bad. ES still has an awful lot of excellent football discussion on the front page almost very day. And, it can be humbling to resurrect some of those old gems of threads and still see the same types of stupid, just in smaller servings and briefer duration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Super Bowls are team accomplishments. Try proving that Terry Bradshaw was anything more than an average QB without mentioning the Super Bowls his team won. The Steelers don't win those 4 Lomardi's without him. Don't believe that? Noll tried to win without him by benching him in favor of Joe Gilliam and Terry Hanratty and couldn't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Is it silly? The HOF is supposed to honor individual performers, but it has been criticized for years for its bias toward team accomplishments.Super Bowls are team accomplishments. Try proving that Terry Bradshaw was anything more than an average QB without mentioning the Super Bowls his team won. I'll preface this by pointing out that you are one of my favorite and most respected posters, even when we disagree, which we do. However, you can't take away the ultimate achievement, FOUR of them, and then say to judge Bradshaw on the rest. I mean, you just can't do that. That's like saying, "Well, without Phelps's eight gold medals, he didn't do much in the previous Olympics." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST is my boy Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 They just said on 980 that they expect Campbell, and Cerrato to be back next season.......interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickclone Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 They just said on 980 that they expect Campbell, and Cerrato to be back next season.......interesting... Not happy about Cerrato, but I'm glad JC will be back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 They just said on 980 that they expect Campbell, and Cerrato to be back next season.......interesting... if that is true i will not be taking this team seriously next year whatsoever. truly a shame im gonna have to wait so long to watch potentially good football again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvtbred Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 if that is true i will not be taking this team seriously next year whatsoever. truly a shame im gonna have to wait so long to watch potentially good football again. ...and my boycott will unfortunately continue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST is my boy Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 if that is true i will not be taking this team seriously next year whatsoever. truly a shame im gonna have to wait so long to watch potentially good football again. Im fine with JC playing QB next season if they dont feel any of the QB's this year in the draft are any good. I mean why draft someone, who you dont think will be good? As long as they give Colt a shot in training camp to compete with him, I dont really see a problem. They said they expect Cerrato to have a "reduced role" and be back. Most likely meaning college scouting duties and such.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvtbred Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Im fine with JC playing QB next season if they dont feel any of the QB's this year in the draft are any good. I mean why draft someone, who you dont think will be good?As long as they give Colt a shot in training camp to compete with him, I dont really see a problem. They said they expect Cerrato to have a "reduced role" and be back. Most likely meaning college scouting duties and such.... There has been NO open comp in the last two preseasons so what makes you think they will have one next year? Could just be Colt, Todd and Jason again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST is my boy Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 There has been NO open comp in the last two preseasons so what makes you think they will have one next year? Could just be Colt, Todd and Jason again. No there hasnt, but I guess you can hope that they realize Jason is not a franchise QB and go ahead and make this thing a competition. We'll see what happens..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 No problem keeping Campbell as long as that open competition is there. However, who's he going to compete with? Brennan? Slim pickings. Vinny still being here as anything but head of college scouting = :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morpheusmeyers Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I don't believe that a reliable stat exists that would enable an intelligent ranking of NFL quarterbacks. However, using the won-lost record to rank them, the favored approach of the anti-Campbell extremists in this group, is surely the dumbest of the options. Are you suggesting that all anti Campbell posters are extremists, or just the ones that use the win-loss record to rank QB's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Are you suggesting that all anti Campbell posters are extremists, or just the ones that use the win-loss record to rank QB's? Some anti-Campbell posters are extremists (BLC), and then some of them are even more extreme. I'm thinking Shilsu, HailGreen28, and the like. Of course, it goes the other way, too. tr1, bubba, and Pasizzle are a little much on the pro-Campbell side. I'm 55/45 anti-Campbell, at least after these past three games. For reference, though, I was 95/5 pro-Campbell before this season started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 No problem keeping Campbell as long as that open competition is there.However, who's he going to compete with? Brennan? Slim pickings. Vinny still being here as anything but head of college scouting = :doh: I think we should try to re-sign Campbell to a short-term, low-value contract. I also think we should take an offensive tackle with our first pick and a quarterback with our second pick. There aren't any QBs worth taking with a top 5 pick and there should be a very good quarterback prospect available at the top of the second round. Then, let Campbell, the draftee, and Brennan battle it out for the starting spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I think we should try to re-sign Campbell to a short-term, low-value contract. I also think we should take an offensive tackle with our first pick and a quarterback with our second pick. There aren't any QBs worth taking with a top 5 pick and there should be a very good quarterback prospect available at the top of the second round. Then, let Campbell, the draftee, and Brennan battle it out for the starting spot. If that second-rounder were legitimate, then this scenario would work for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.