Is this adultery?

[rincewind]

Yes, Rince. A wife doesn't have a choice to BE married while at the same time discussing the option of licking some other guy's nuts. It's not hard. She's not equal in that discussion. She either radically conforms or she goes. If she's no longer married she can do what she wants. If she wishes to remain married, she can't. A wife can't say, "Gosh, I love you, I want to stay married, but, you need to appreciate I need to have Tony bang me three times a week for it to work."

What's the matter with you people? The wife has no position other than, "Yes, indeed, I can not have intimate relations with OTHER men and stay married." That you think this is a discussion you have to pay attention to her point of view is so insane I can't begin to express how sad it is.

If you read all my posts you would see that i said i was using 'she' as a generic pronoun. NO WHERE to i even remotely advocate cheating or say that it is okay in the least. My point was women were sounding a little bit like property (i'm not even referring to just cheating, i mean overall). I found it quite telling however that in your above post you only refer to women not being allowed to cheat - see i can read things into your posts too.

[PleaseBlitz]

p.s. - you're starting to sound like Mass. You sure he didn't steal your account info?

Mass prefers artillery.

[Prosperity]

Mass prefers artillery.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

:notworthy

[DeanCollins]

If you're not kidding, then you're a ****ing a**hole, and I'm utterly embarrassed that you are a moderator on the Redskins message board. Is Dan Snyder paying you?!!

Are others not shocked by this? Please tell me you're joking. You are definitely advocating domestic abuse, and when you say "destroy" you seem to be advocating murder???!!!!!!

Even if you are joking, this is NOT something to joke about. Terrible. I feel sick to my stomach.

Bring it on. I eagerly await your reply, ****head.

Want to get away ? :laugh:

[Destino]

Want to get away ? :laugh:

:applause: :applause: :applause:

:laugh:

post of the week!

[Art]

Ummm ... are you serious? You honestly can't be. Cause if you are, then God Bless You. First of all, I'm not a girl. I'm a woman. I'm 26 years old and whether you meant to insult me by calling me a girl, I take it as an insult. In my short 26 years of life, I've seen more than most 26 year olds.

But back to this whole thing ... what in the hell are you talking about? It IS Tony's fault? I did not say that Tony is not at fault, but I do think that the majority of the anger should be directed at the married woman. The married woman is in a union and made a vow before God. The married woman is supposedly comitted to her husband. The other man has no committment to you, the married woman, etc.

So when does this whole "Man to Man" thing occur? Because when you're in high school and college, it seems to be perfectly acceptable to hook up with girls who are in relationships and what not.

And when in the world did I ever say that it was acceptable for a man to hit his wife? Do you not understand what I am saying? Violence in any shape or form is completely unnecessary and wrong. Violence is not needed.

Candace,

I'm offended your bothered being called a girl. Are you upset you offended me? My guess is no. Your guess should be I'm not all that upset I offended you. You are absolutely correct, the majority of anger should be directed at the woman in this case specifically. No one has said otherwise. Merely that in addition to addressing the situation with your wife, you must also do so, as a man, to the man who went after your wife. If you do not, that man will not stop no matter what your wife wishes. In fact, he'll probably be compelled to work harder having been so close to hitting it only to be denied at being discovered. In fact, he'll probably assume the discovery is the only thing that prevented it, so, he'll make efforts to finalize the deal.

Unless he's had a talking to and a sizing up by the person he most impacts by his actions. That being the man involved. Most guys won't bother after being confronted. It's not worth the hassle if they are simply looking to get some action. As for your concluding statement, I do not agree with you that violence is always unacceptable.

Violence is often highly acceptable and just. If I catch someone raping my wife or daughter, he will die, painfully and slow with seeming glee on my part. While I don't necessarily say we relive a time where a man's honor allowed duels, we certainly have to understand the rights of a father to protect his family. That may lead to violence. And that wouldn't be wrong. I know in society today it is hard to see someone object to the constant hammering that violence is wrong so I appreciate it's hard to see these words and process their meaning.

This doesn't mean you go straight to violence or take a violent course. Merely that you understand you are not impotent to lash out when someone willfully hurts you or someone you care about. That action can sometimes bring equality in a way nothing else can.

[Art]

No smiley after the last sentence??

I agree with you on the first part, that you should take the kids and the cash and leave her on her own. You really advocate going physical? You do that she calls the cops and your kids are left with her and your off to jail. Not a good move.

You weigh the consequences of your actions with the punishment society provides. You do this every day. The only reason you don't pound the guy who took your spot at the grocery store is because it's not worth it. The consequences are too great to escalate it over an additional four space walk. But, absolutely, going physical is inherently part of any equation in almost every aspect of life. I would "be out of town" when it went down, of course .

[rincewind]

Candace,

I'm offended your bothered being called a girl. Are you upset you offended me? My guess is no. Your guess should be I'm not all that upset I offended you. You are absolutely correct, the majority of anger should be directed at the woman in this case specifically. No one has said otherwise. Merely that in addition to addressing the situation with your wife, you must also do so, as a man, to the man who went after your wife. If you do not, that man will not stop no matter what your wife wishes. In fact, he'll probably be compelled to work harder having been so close to hitting it only to be denied at being discovered. In fact, he'll probably assume the discovery is the only thing that prevented it, so, he'll make efforts to finalize the deal.

Unless he's had a talking to and a sizing up by the person he most impacts by his actions. That being the man involved. Most guys won't bother after being confronted. It's not worth the hassle if they are simply looking to get some action. As for your concluding statement, I do not agree with you that violence is always unacceptable.

Sounds like you know a lot about what's going on inside the head of the 'other man' :paranoid:

[rincewind]

You weigh the consequences of your actions with the punishment society provides. You do this every day. The only reason you don't pound the guy who took your spot at the grocery store is because it's not worth it. The consequences are too great to escalate it over an additional four space walk. But, absolutely, going physical is inherently part of any equation in almost every aspect of life. I would "be out of town" when it went down, of course .

Sure hope you realize you're speaking for yourself. The reason I don't 'pound the guy' for taking my spot is because it is simply the wrong thing to do. Violence is not a solution but a conductor of more problems.

[DCsportsfan53]

Sounds like you know a lot about what's going on inside the head of the 'other man' :paranoid:

Agreed, like Candace said, it's entirely possible the wife told Tony that the marriage was ending anyways, that she about to file divorce, that he beat her, who knows what she said to him? That's why it's probably best to simply deal with the situation with the wife involved. If she agrees to stop talking to the guy then you can work on repairing the marriage. It's her responsibility to end things with Tony because it was her mistake to begin with, that is if she's interested in contiuning the marriage. If she doesn't agree to end things with the other man well, then you know it's already over.

[Art]

No, but has been more than hinted that you view physical abuse as a very real possibility - you think thats what makes shaky relationships work?

p.s. - you're starting to sound like Mass. You sure he didn't steal your account info?

Again, no. No where has it been suggested physical abuse makes shaky relationships work. It is simply false to say such has been hinted anywhere. Read exactly what I've said in every single post in this thread. No where has we advocated harming the wife and maintaining the relationship.

Getting physical with the guy going after your wife does work, though I've not had that worry in life. Getting physical with guys over any topic tends to work though . But, more, the ability to persuasively convince someone getting physical is pending is a greater skill. This is a far more positive skill to have as it relates to male interaction. It's less of benefit with women.

As I've said all along here, you confront the man. You make it clear it's over and absent over, there's a step you and he will take that ends the talking. You make sure your wife is clear it's over. That it may already be between the two of you, but, you're not negotiating the end of her infidelity. You're directing it. If she refuses, you probably got very lucky. She's then free to do as she wishes which she is not free to do while openly being married and WANTING to be married. It's really not a hard thing to process.

[DCsportsfan53]

Sure hope you realize you're speaking for yourself. The reason I don't 'pound the guy' for taking my spot is because it is simply the wrong thing to do. Violence is not a solution but a conductor of more problems.

Agreed again. Maybe I'm just not as angry a person but getting cut off in a grocery line of traffic or something of that nature does not stir in me even the slightest desire for violence. I hate to think what it would be like to walk around all day percieving slights and disses and constantly wanting to pound people.

[Art]

Translation.... Uhg. Me club girl, drag back to cave.:doh:

Translation: Honey, let me get you some rubbers so you can have some fun before you get home.

If demanding your wife remain faithful is being a cave man, blessed be the cave and terrible is the world outside.

[Destino]

Agreed, like Candace said, it's entirely possible the wife told Tony that the marriage was ending anyways, that she about to file divorce, that he beat her, who knows what she said to him? That's why it's probably best to simply deal with the situation with the wife involved. If she agrees to stop talking to the guy then you can work on repairing the marriage. It's her responsibility to end things with Tony because it was her mistake to begin with, that is if she's interested in contiuning the marriage. If she doesn't agree to end things with the other man well, then you know it's already over.

Isn't that even more reason to talk to Tony yourself and set the record straight? That way everyone will know where everyone stands. WTF is the big deal with talking to the scumbag? Explain this to me.

[CandaceM23]

Candace,

I'm offended your bothered being called a girl. Are you upset you offended me? My guess is no. Your guess should be I'm not all that upset I offended you. You are absolutely correct, the majority of anger should be directed at the woman in this case specifically. No one has said otherwise. Merely that in addition to addressing the situation with your wife, you must also do so, as a man, to the man who went after your wife. If you do not, that man will not stop no matter what your wife wishes. In fact, he'll probably be compelled to work harder having been so close to hitting it only to be denied at being discovered. In fact, he'll probably assume the discovery is the only thing that prevented it, so, he'll make efforts to finalize the deal.

Unless he's had a talking to and a sizing up by the person he most impacts by his actions. That being the man involved. Most guys won't bother after being confronted. It's not worth the hassle if they are simply looking to get some action. As for your concluding statement, I do not agree with you that violence is always unacceptable.

Violence is often highly acceptable and just. If I catch someone raping my wife or daughter, he will die, painfully and slow with seeming glee on my part. While I don't necessarily say we relive a time where a man's honor allowed duels, we certainly have to understand the rights of a father to protect his family. That may lead to violence. And that wouldn't be wrong. I know in society today it is hard to see someone object to the constant hammering that violence is wrong so I appreciate it's hard to see these words and process their meaning.

This doesn't mean you go straight to violence or take a violent course. Merely that you understand you are not impotent to lash out when someone willfully hurts you or someone you care about. That action can sometimes bring equality in a way nothing else can.

First of all, when have I insulted you? You began it by posting rubbish on this board ... this whole Caveman mentality makes me sick.

Second of all, if you want insults, here's one: You have the mentality of a boy, a child, who can do nothing other than fight others. You seem to be very well spoken, yet you're endorsing violence.

Come on everyone ... lets go beat our spouses and significant others just because we can!!! Just because they own a piece of us and we own a piece of them. That complete and total BS and you should know that.

Thank goodness that there are people in here who have level heads and who see that violence is not the answer.

The route that should be taken is to talk to the wife, give her the option of continuing to talk to Tony - or to walk away from the marriage. Thats it. No need to go toe to toe with Tony and see who's got the bigger balls.

You and I are going to disagree no matter what is said .... You're the caveman and you see me as the feeble woman who needs to be lead to water and needs to be told what to do. I on the other hand feel that you're a nitwit. I will refrain from going any further ...

And since when has violence been highly acceptable? Violence of any form - whether its spousal abuse, child abuse or a random butt kicking on the street is not acceptable and we have rules and laws against it. But hey ... I guess that the rules don't apply since violence is highly acceptable - and no one goes to jail or has charges pressed against them for assault.

[DCsportsfan53]

As I've said all along here, you confront the man. You make it clear it's over and absent over, there's a step you and he will take that ends the talking. You make sure your wife is clear it's over. That it may already be between the two of you, but, you're not negotiating the end of her infidelity. You're directing it. If she refuses, you probably got very lucky. She's then free to do as she wishes which she is not free to do while openly being married and WANTING to be married. It's really not a hard thing to process.

It's not over unless the wife wants it to be. That's her decision. If you don't like it, divorce her. It's not the husbands place to decide whether or not it's over between his wife and another man, he can only decide whether it's over between him and his wife.

[Jumbo]

I see four pages were added since I quickly typed this. Good luck, Brave.

Sorry you’re going through this, Brave. I can’t tell you how common this is today in marriage and family counseling, with the cell phone and internet contact making connecting to someone so much more accessible with much less effort of will. I rarely give advice on the internet, but I suggest you do your best through your hurt to hold on to your own self-respect tightly and set immediate rock-firm boundaries of having her call off her contact with this other guy, and preferably both of you do it together telling him why. There is surely some wisdom scattered throughout this thread, IMHO, and no doubt throughout your (or any) neighborhood, but seek a pro too on a matter this important. And I didn't read any post in here that I haven’t found as part of the worldview of someone, sometime, who has sat across from me in a counseling session.

Everybody has opinions and Their View, based on their perception of their relationship and those they "see" around them, so you'll get what people always get when they ask at the barber shop, laundromat, or message board regarding personal problems: a grab bag. If you’re like most of us humans, you’ll listen and consider them all, but in the end, you’ll be most attracted to the propositions that are closest to how you already think and respond, and those that make you uncomfortable and go against your grain will dissipate. After you do the no-nonsense initial damage control, talk to people who are really close to your life and hear what they “see” about your relationship, then talk to any one you know well, that you really respect, and reflect on what you want to do long-term (stay or go) but do it pronto.

Then ASAP, talk to a pro with good references. They will only be human too, but a competent professional has a fair chance of having all the life experience and common sense that anyone else may have developed, and can also offer a different degree and type of knowledge than can be very useful. Remember, along with opinions like the rest of us, that person also spent years studying these things at an additional level, and has dealt with many real-life experiences of seeing what works in different situations and what hasn’t. Such input should only be additive, not subtractive, and though they too will generally say things you may not want to hear, they will also be the first to remind you that this is your life, not theirs. Again, my best wishes for you, amigo.

[zoony]

Sure hope you realize you're speaking for yourself. The reason I don't 'pound the guy' for taking my spot is because it is simply the wrong thing to do. Violence is not a solution but a conductor of more problems.

Not sure how this got off track.

Art's first post, which I am 100% in agreement with, is that 'Tony' must be confronted. In a cool, calm, manner where you maintain eye contact and make it abundantly clear how you feel about him. Nobody said about hauling off and punching him.

I can't believe that if a man was :hump:ing your wife, you would only confront her. They are both guilty, they both need to be confronted.

Not advocating violence and not having a spine are not mutually exclusive. :2cents:

[TheSteve]

It's not over unless the wife wants it to be. That's her decision. If you don't like it, divorce her. It's not the husbands place to decide whether or not it's over between his wife and another man, he can only decide whether it's over between him and his wife.

That's what Art just said. Basically he stated that if your Wife refuses to acknowledge it's over then the marriage is over.

[DCsportsfan53]

Translation: Honey, let me get you some rubbers so you can have some fun before you get home.

If demanding your wife remain faithful is being a cave man, blessed be the cave and terrible is the world outside.

Again, it's not a demand, it's an agreement between two people. If she chooses not to be faithful then get rid of her. The idea that you're in control of whether or not she is "allowed" to cheat is ridiculous.

[SkinsNut73]

....what if Tony is bigger than you? and a black-belt?

...now you are not only out a wife, but you are in the hospital with a broken jaw/ribs/neck???

[rincewind]

Not sure how this got off track.

Art's first post, which I am 100% in agreement with, is that 'Tony' must be confronted. In a cool, calm, manner where you maintain eye contact and make it abundantly clear how you feel about him. Nobody said about hauling off and punching him.

I can't believe that if a man was :hump:ing your wife, you would only confront her. They are both guilty, they both need to be confronted.

Not advocating violence and not having a spine are not mutually exclusive. :2cents:

Two things - did you read the post i was answering? He said that people want to pound on others just for cutting them off and that the only thing stopping us are the consequences. WRONG.

two - no, i would not want to confront the other man. I already posted my stance about that early in this thread. Go back and read it at you leisure.

[Art]

If you're not kidding, then you're a ****ing a**hole, and I'm utterly embarrassed that you are a moderator on the Redskins message board. Is Dan Snyder paying you?!!

Are others not shocked by this? Please tell me you're joking. You are definitely advocating domestic abuse, and when you say "destroy" you seem to be advocating murder???!!!!!!

Even if you are joking, this is NOT something to joke about. Terrible. I feel sick to my stomach.

Bring it on. I eagerly await your reply, ****head.

I'm not sure what to tell you guy.

No, I'm not advocating domestic abuse. The most sacred promise in the world is that of a man and a woman who agree to marry. Violation of that promise may lead to a physical confrontation depending on the situation. I have no problem accepting that's part of the response to being violated -- especially in the way we're discussing here.

If that fits your definition of domestic violence, so be it. My definition might enclude the emotional destruction a person puts another through when they violate the other's trust in the way we're describing. Doing so repeatedly after promises not to is far greater than a punch to the face in terms of impact. I hope you know that.

If you don't, I don't know how to help you.

[DCsportsfan53]

That's what Art just said. Basically he stated that if your Wife refuses to acknowledge it's over then the marriage is over.

Right but he also said he would go to the other man and tell him it's over. It doesn't seem like that's his choice to make. Even if he does say that, they can still see each other if they feel like it. My point is, the husbands not in control of what his wife does. All he can do is trust her and take the appropriate action TOWARDS HER if she isn't faithful. Like was said before, you don't even know that guy, he doesn't owe you anything, he doesn't care about you and he didn't make any vows to you. She did. If she wants to continue the marriage, she'll take the intiative herself when confronted by her husband to end the extramarital relationship. If you have to do that for her, what the hell is the point in even trying?

[PleaseBlitz]

It's not over unless the wife wants it to be. That's her decision. If you don't like it, divorce her. It's not the husbands place to decide whether or not it's over between his wife and another man, he can only decide whether it's over between him and his wife.

The husband can make her actually MAKE that decision rather than having both the husband/father of her kids AND the man on the side.

So far, she hasnt had to make a choice with any consequences.